After A Year And A Half..

Timans

..Timans 360 has bitten the dust.

Playing a PES online match, Crashed, turned it off and back on again, 3 Red Lights.

Off and On again, Wouldn't get past the 360 intro screen,

Off an On again, read above.

Then, I got back into pes6, I just confirmed my team selection, Crashed -> Three Red Lights. Strangely enough, the exact same place as it crashed the first time.

Plug everything out, plug it back in. Same again.

Move the 360 from vertical to horizontal. Same again

Take out HDD, Same again.

It's out of Warranty, I'm in 5th year without a job. I won't have the cash to buy another for ages.

I had just bought Shenmue 2 to play on it as well.

Kimbot

There are threads here saying that they have extended the warrenty to 2 years. Ring MS and see what they can do for you!

Limerick Dude

That sucks man! Ive had mine for the same length of time as you if not more, i hope mine doesnt die either.

Ciaran500

Why does everyone feel the need to start a thread when their 360 dies?

kensutz

that's not necessarily the problem, I had one console with 3 red lights and took apart and no joy

Sandwich

Ciaran500 wrote:

Why does everyone feel the need to start a thread when their 360 dies?

Agree. Obits just should be sent to the newspapers as normal.

Timans

#Elites wrote:

i know i know, but most of the time it was, in one case the heatsink was totaly fooked :eek:

but only take it apart if MS tell you its fully out of warrenty.

afaik they might tell you they will fix it for 100€? but the xbox must not be opened;)

Yeah Elites, but I've heard that they're only refurb's and they just break again.

False Economy really.

Julez

Timans wrote:

..Timans 360 has bitten the dust.

Playing a PES online match, Crashed, turned it off and back on again, 3 Red Lights.

Off and On again, Wouldn't get past the 360 intro screen,

Off an On again, read above.

Then, I got back into pes6, I just confirmed my team selection, Crashed -> Three Red Lights. Strangely enough, the exact same place as it crashed the first time.

Plug everything out, plug it back in. Same again.

Move the 360 from vertical to horizontal. Same again

Take out HDD, Same again.

It's out of Warranty, I'm in 5th year without a job. I won't have the cash to buy another for ages.

I had just bought Shenmue 2 to play on it as well.

Happened to me to, microsoft will do nothing for free after a year, they don't care what year your in and how broke you are! Just been through all this myself, its a real kick in the balls! €120 to get repaired, Its like paying €120 for something you already had, on the plus side you get another year warrenty after repair!

mcgovern

Mine was repaired after a year for free, they never even mentioned charging me.

Karmafaerie

Guys if they ask you for money after year one, ask to speak to a supervisor.

All 360's, launch or not, now have a two year warranty.

Ronan

exactly, remember that the people in the MS call centre are on the whole(and I am not exagerating, I had a long drawn out episode with them) idiots. Seriously don't beleive them if they try to charge you and if needs be call the head office in the UK and log a formal complaint if they are rude to you.

Fnz

Ciaran500 wrote:

Why does everyone feel the need to start a thread when their 360 dies?

Regulars to gaming sites have probably heard enough of these (not hugely interesting) stories to last a console generation ... but some people are only just considering dipping their toe into the current gen and are still hungry for the information.

Microsoft claims that the failure rate is far below the consumer electronics industry average of 3-5% [Linky]. The number of people reporting their experience online does help get across the idea that perhaps MS are being somewhat conservative with their estimate.

That dubious claim would make me want to report a failed unit.

Timans

Just got off the phone to M$. They said my warranty is out but often in Ireland there is 2 year warranties. They said they're giving it to the supervisor to take a look at and will ring back tomorrow.

Gave me a reference number but tbh, I don't rate the chances of them ringing back.

Anyone had any experience with this? Should I ring tomorrow and give them the reference number or wait?

Mr. K

Ring tomorrow, keep ringing until they tell you what you want to hear. Mine was over a year old and they are repairing it for free.

savemejebus

totally agree with Mr. K, keep ringing, and ringing and ringing, and most importantly get names of people you deal with (alot of people become alot more helpful when they think their name will be passed up the foodchain if they're doing a bad job). Keep note of what they say, dates, times etc. and if you're getting nowhere then contact the ODCA and the ECC. They will back you, although it shouldn't come to that

Timans

I am tempted to just bring it back to gamestop as it will save me waiting and having to mess around with the shower of ****.

Although, they might be just as hard to deal with. It's all a bit of a joke really. Everything is so hazy with the whole system.

Is it 2 yr, is it not? bleh.

I'll ring again tomorrow if they haven't phones by 8pm.

Karmafaerie

Never wait for them to ring you.
In fact, never accept them telling you that they will ring you back.
I once waited 5 days for a call that was supposed to take 24 hours!!!:mad:

Afterwards, whenever MS have told me that a supervisor will "ring me back", I tell them that there's no need, as I'm not getting off the phone untill I speak to a supervisor.
It always works.
If they're being stubborn do as SaveMeJebus said and ask for their Name and ID no.
Threatening legal action also helps.

Timans

I have just been told by another one that I cannot get it for free and they have never fixed any out of warranty consoles for free.

I told them I know people who had them fixed. No joy.

Do I ask for supervisor then? Will they agree?

Julez

Timans wrote:

I have just been told by another one that I cannot get it for free and they have never fixed any out of warranty consoles for free.

I told them I know people who had them fixed. No joy.

Do I ask for supervisor then? Will they agree?

exact same thing happened to me, I've givin in and paid, never asked for supervisor tho!

Timans

Rang them again, Was more forceful. Nice-ish guy though tbf.

I asked for Supervisor multiple times but no joy, it is late though and they close at 10pm so I can understand.

He said I can expect a call from a supervisor tomorrow night though as they take a maximum of 48 hours and I was told yesterday I'd get the call.

If they don't ring tomorrow, I'm ringing and demanding I get to talk to a supervisor.

Gran Hermano

http://www.thewildrovers.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=3183&st=60&p=14485&#entry14485
Have a look at the link above

If you fail to get a satisfactory solution ask the call centre MANAGER
what name in MS you should put on your claim to the small claims court.
As far as I can see you'd have a bloody good case as a machine that costs the
price of the 360 should last for longer than yours has, therefore the machine is
not of suitable quality or fit for the purpose intended. I'd be surprised if a judge
would view it acceptable that you got less than 24 months for the price you paid..
and at €9 to file a case you've nothing to loose.
Plus it'll cost MS more than your €9 or the €120 repair fee to get their legal team
on the case - it'd make sense for them to sort out your problem ASAP

Timans

Thank you very much Gran Hermano!

I will be telling them that exact thing tomorrow night. I appreciate it fully.

Thanks to everyone who replied!

Gran Hermano

No problems Timans, from what I know Microsoft outsource their Support
to several different companies in Germany, Egypt and I think UK.
So depending on which centre you get (and it's pot luck and down to the
way they route calls) you may have different levels of difficulty but stick
to your guns as MS have publicly admitted twice they are extending warranties
for 360s in the US market, why should EMEA be different?

Do not wait for them to call you back, ring them straight away tomorrow.
Say the wait is unacceptable, be polite and firm. Take notes of all your calls,
time of calls, each persons name you talk to, ask them to spell it for you (tell
them you're documenting all your dealings with MS in case you are not satisfied
and choose to proceed with a court case) again be calm and polite and stress
that you want to give MS every chance to rectify the situation amicably before
you proceed to the small claims court.

Stress that paying €120 is not acceptable. They've already said they don't
know whether its a 1 or 2 year warranty, they are obviously flexible and internal
policies are not set in stone - you can capitalise on this.

Best of luck and let me know how you get on - promise me you won't cave in
and pay the €120!

PS: I'm not saying you haven't been polite in your dealings, you sound as if
you have - just dont give them any excuses and plus ranting does no one any
favours!


Jules : I've heard of people on avforums and on the forum in my last post getting
their €120 refunded after they paid... might be worth a shot!

Timans

Yeah, I'm not a very aggressive person by a long shot!

I am having a very hard time being assertive on the phone.

I actually said many times on the phone that "I am sorry, I'm not blaming YOU it's just I know people who have had their consoles refurb'd" and at the end of
the convo I said "sorry if I've come across horrible but I am just trying to sort this out"

I don't want to come across horrible as I know that will only damage my chances.

I will ring and basically read that post by Noel on the other forum. I don't know whether I'll be able to ask their name and stuff though! I might be able to make myself do that!

Gran Hermano

Timans, check your PMs

Julez

Timans wrote:

I am having a very hard time being assertive on the phone.

I actually said many times on the phone that "I am sorry, I'm not blaming YOU it's just I know people who have had their consoles refurb'd" and at the end of
the convo I said "sorry if I've come across horrible but I am just trying to sort this out"

I don't want to come across horrible as I know that will only damage my chances.

I'm the same, I work in sales and have to deal with returns and stuff, so I know how it is when you have someone coming along with a serious attitude problem, and sometimes it makes you just want to tell them to f*** off!

Vyse

I had the same issues with them. Basically they were looking for me to pay to have the console repaired and I wouldn't budge. Ended up fixing the thing myself and saving €120:D

nodger

Timans wrote:

Off and On again, Wouldn't get past the 360 intro screen,

Off an On again, read above.

This link gives more in-depth analysis of error codes:

http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=484726

Mine has been failing to boot (from a cold start) for the past couple of days. I've found that if I leave it switched on for 5-10 minutes, with the 3 red lights flashing, that I can then reboot it and it comes up fine. I'm assuming that it's just some bad solder that expands to correct itself once the box warms up.

In any case, I'm bringing it back to the nice people in Virgin this week. It's only 5 months old and they said they'd replace it for me if I have the receipt or a Visa statement showing the purchase. Good customer service!

Fnz

Gran Hermano wrote:

http://www.thewildrovers.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=3183&st=60&p=14485&#entry14485
Have a look at the link above

If you fail to get a satisfactory solution ask the call centre MANAGER
what name in MS you should put on your claim to the small claims court.
As far as I can see you'd have a bloody good case as a machine that costs the
price of the 360 should last for longer than yours has, therefore the machine is
not of suitable quality or fit for the purpose intended. I'd be surprised if a judge
would view it acceptable that you got less than 24 months for the price you paid..
and at €9 to file a case you've nothing to loose.
Plus it'll cost MS more than your €9 or the €120 repair fee to get their legal team
on the case - it'd make sense for them to sort out your problem ASAP

Very nice work Gran Hermano. The link doesn't seem to work though.

Gran Hermano

Strange, link was deffo working last night and I know that
Timans was able to read it as well...

Edited: working fine again now @ 9.59 am

Timans

Phoned twice tonight.

No luck, They will not put me through to a supervisor AT ALL.

I have said I know people who have been, said I'll just phone back (which I did, 5 mins later)

I won't be put through as they haven't got the "authority" to trasnfer me and I can expect the call in the next 48 hours (dé ja vu :rolleyes: )

Shall I just phone back and rant at the person instead of going to a supervisor?

Gran Hermano

Sorry to hear you're getting the run around Timans.. it really looks like it's
down to the luck of the draw as to which Support centre you get through to
and the type of person you talk to. (I'v heard dealing with the Egyptian
Call centre can be a complete mare compared to the German one)

Firstly, keep your calm.. as you've done so far !

Call back and and ask to speak to a supervisor/manager.
Ask them what their escalation policy is and ask what their
Service Level Agreement (SLA) is in resolving your problem.
How long is it since your first contact with them? Are you
waiting for an answer longer than the SLA?

You got to realise that they are working from a script
as to what they can say and do - you are dealing with the
lowest level of outsourced support!

Keep the chin up and dont give in yet!

Edited to add the following:
You'll know you're on the right track when the start offering you a discount on the
repair or free shipping.. keep insisting that you will lodge a small claims court case
and ask the person you are talking to to spell their name as you will be including
them and the conversation you are having as proof that not only did MS provide
you with an item of merchantable quality and fit for the purpose you purchased
for but they did not do everything in their power to help resolve your issue.
Hell if the go past that they go past their SLA you have further proof that
they failed in even trying to help you.

Play them at their game if it is a 48 hour SLA from the time you request to
speak to a supervisor.. call them at 48 hours and 1 minute.

Timans

Great News!

I got through again and recited the stuff about Director of Consumer Affairs etc etc and the one said she'd put me through to the supervisor. Only problem was that there was none available.

At least I know have ammo to always get through to the supervisor as I have been told I can be put through.

I am getting the egyptian every time by the looks of it. Although, they're not nasty, just stubborn!

I'm getting further and further each time though!

Gran Hermano

I really hate seeing big corporations giving end users the run around.....

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4753786&postcount=435
looks like the 1st level support peons in the outsourced call centres
can't do anything but stick to the script...

Timans

Ridiculous, isn't it?

I'm just about to phone up right now. Gonna give em more business terms!

Fnz

Timans wrote:

I'm just about to phone up right now. Gonna give em more business terms!

Yeah! Quote 'em business terms 'til they don't know what's what! :cool:

@ Gran Hermano - hmm.... that link works now for me too.

Timans

I just got off the phone with the supervisor.

I told them a million times about all the laws and they started to tell me that the system they have will not allow them to process the order for a repair unless I give them my cc details and it will instantly debit the card. It says to enter the details as soon as they enter this command.

I told them I knew people personally who got it done for free even after the warranty was up. (which is a partial lie as I only know them through here) and they said if I get them a serial number of that persons console and it checks out, they would have given me a free repair right there and then.

I kept saying I know and understand what they are saying but I know people who've had it done, And quite simply, I know my stuff. I am entitled to what I am entitled to. I ended the call with reinstating that I shall be taking the matter to the smalls claim court and they said that's fine.

They're not backing down. I am at a complete loss right now.

Gran Hermano

Sounds like they can't deviate off their script.. poxy peons!
I don't believe there is no one in the call centre who can over
authorise a free refurb.Tell them to put in their own corporate
credit card details and claim it back on expenses.

Timans you are not at a loss... you have given them ample opportunity
to resolve the issue and provide you the service/product you have paid for.
This will stand to you if you go to small claims court. Make sure you have a
log of all your calls - people you spoke to, number of calls and duration of calls.

Time to call their bluff and fight your corner.
Get your folks to have a look here and: to complete the online form
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/justice/courts-system/small_claims_court_application_form/

You have to realise the people you spoke to are not MS but
outsourcers/contractors.

Total up the full amout you have invested in your 360 (all hardware,
accessories and games, the bigger the figure the better)
and put this down as the cost of the 'product'.

From the above link:
"There is a fee of 9 euro for each application to the Small Claims Court."
Timans, that's all you stand to loose.

"It is important to include the amount for which you are claiming. If the claim is not disputed, you may get judgement without having to go to court. Bear in mind that you can normally only claim the amount for which you are directly out of pocket, in other words, the amount you paid for the faulty goods and/or any cost involved in having them repaired. It is therefore a good idea to keep all receipts and documentation to show what these amounts are."

I'd be totally shocked if an Irish court would see your investment in MS to
the guts of a grand should only last 18 months. MS probably won't even turn
up to fight their corner.

Timans

I unfortunately don't have a log.

I have phoned about 5/6 times so far. That last call was about 24minutes long.

I am really angry at the moment as I thought this would work, I don't know whether to try the same again tomorrow night or what?

Won't saying I knew people personally come back to haunt me? And also, I don't actually know all this for a fact, I haven't contacted the Director of Consumer Affairs. I am just taking that Noel's guys word.

Ugh, So complicated.

Gran Hermano

http://www.nca.ie/rights_your_rights.html
This is where the Noel chap on the other thread got his info from.
Call them tomorrow: 1890 432 432 and inform them of the full details.
Get their advice first hand.

Also call Microsoft on 1850 940 940
and ask them who in Microsoft Ireland you should name on your form
to the Small Claims Court. You might get a better result from someone
in Dublin and Microsoft itself.
They may have won the battle... doesn't mean you've lost the war.

0ubliette

Just buy a PS3. videotape yourself taking a slash on the xbox and setting fire to it, and email it to bill gates.

Ah i feel for ya tho, my xbox is going on the blink, and tob e honest rather than get the runaround like you are, i reckon when it dies ill just buy a core and put my hard drive into it and save the hassle :rolleyes:

Fnz

0ubliette wrote:

Ah i feel for ya tho, my xbox is going on the blink, and tob e honest rather than get the runaround like you are, i reckon when it dies ill just buy a core and put my hard drive into it and save the hassle :rolleyes:

... because MS deserve extra money as a direct result of selling shoddy hardware?

lee_baby_simms

I think my 360 is on the way out. Whenever i return to the dashboard from a game and the disc slows down i get a loud horrible grinding noise for a second. The discs are undamaged but it seems to be getting worse and recently test drive unlimited has started to crash displaying 'disc unreadable' as an error.

Anyone had this experience?

I wish it would just give up the ghost completely so i could get a replacement from gamestop.

Julez

Its not meant to be making that noise, if its still in warrenty bring it back now before it goes on you!!

Kanney

Im bricking it, getting an Xbox, heard so much about break downs.

brav

You'll only jinx yourself by worrying about it.

I have heard loads of people on forums etc who had the 3 red lights etc but Ive never actually met someone with the problem.

All pot luck id say and maybe a little to do with heat/airflow

lee_baby_simms

Julez wrote:

Its not meant to be making that noise, if its still in warrenty bring it back now before it goes on you!!

Yeah but i'm guessing that if the console actually works they won't replace it.

0ubliette

Fnz wrote:

... because MS deserve extra money as a direct result of selling shoddy hardware?

Its 120 quid for a refurb, and you have to go through the hassle timans is going through right now if try to fight it. Refurbs have a habit of breaking down just as easily...i would rather spend a bit extra and get a band new machine, at least that way if it breaks, i can just return it to the shop and get a new one

Julez

lee_baby_simms wrote:

Yeah but i'm guessing that if the console actually works they won't replace it.

Tell them its scratching your games then.

Fnz

0ubliette wrote:

Its 120 quid for a refurb, and you have to go through the hassle timans is going through right now if try to fight it. Refurbs have a habit of breaking down just as easily...i would rather spend a bit extra and get a band new machine, at least that way if it breaks, i can just return it to the shop and get a new one

Or free, if your willing to stand up for your rights as a consumer. Provided the unit has not been misused, I'd suggest giving the ODCA a call, telling them how much the Xbox 360 cost you and how long it has lasted - pointing out that there is a widely reported problem of the units failing due to overheating.

I'd imagine that they'd be willing to call the shop you bought it from if tell them you are unable to get the store to repair the unit - the seller, not the manufacturer, is always responsible to the consumer.

I reckon that it's reasonable to assume that a €400+ electronic item should last longer than 2 years to be considered "of merchantable quality" as required by the Sale of Goods Act.

Timans

Fnz wrote:

Or free, if your willing to stand up for your rights as a consumer. Provided the unit has not been misused, I'd suggest giving the ODCA a call, telling them how much the Xbox 360 cost you and how long it has lasted - pointing out that there is a widely reported problem of the units failing due to overheating.

I'd imagine that they'd be willing to call the shop you bought it from if tell them you are unable to get the store to repair the unit - the seller, not the manufacturer, is always responsible to the consumer.

I reckon that it's reasonable to assume that a €400+ electronic item should last longer than 2 years to be considered "of merchantable quality" as required by the Sale of Goods Act.

Exactly. The expected life span of the product has not been kept.

I told them all this but they are just not backing down!