New house wiring for satellite

HighWire

Im buying a new house and wondering whats the best way to get it prewired up for Satellite?
The area doesnt have cable so Satellite is the only option.

Im having tv points in all the bedrooms, sitting room and kitchen.

I dont want to have to move into my new house and have wires running down
the walls from the satellite.
Any ideas and tips will be greatly appreciated.

watty

Especiually as the Satellite is 22,500 miles away.

The Dish needs a Southeast wall, or view of the Southeast. It does not need to be high.


run 4 x CT100 cable from dish (or 16 if you want foreign sat too) to a central point and 2 x CT100 from each room with deep boxes to have cables with F-plugs on end screw into back of double ended F-Socket plates. A Satellite PVR needs two coax.

then you can have up to two PVRs or one PVR and 2 ordinary recievers, or a Quattro LNB on Dish and multiswitch and as many satellite receivers as you like.

Sam Radford

Can't find anyone supplying real CT100 any more. Is it still manufactured? I understood it was superseded by H109 but now that's gone and I have to use WC100 or WF100.

HighWire

For a second I didnt get that 22500 miles away ref, then I reread my post.
Brilliant. Can just see this super long cable going straight up from the house.


As for something being overhead, well that all was over my head a bit.

If I just print that out and give it to the electrician would they know
what it means?
They might just want to run a 1st fix on the cabling though.
Would the rest be hard to do yourself?

Sam Radford

Make darn certain that the electrician uses the correct cable. Also make sure he doesn't loop it from room to room like a ring main. I've seen them do that!

The rest is dead easy for me to do myself. Obviously can't speak for your DIY abilities.

HighWire

Im not too bad especially with wiring and techie stuff.
Though my wife would disagree when it comes to painting and other DIY.
Im ok if I have instructions on what to do.

cast_iron

Make sure the electrian runs at least 4 cables down to a single point (usually the main tv of the house). Run them out to the wall you plan to place the dish (so it can face SE) and leave enough to extend out to the dish when it goes up.

For most people, one cable to all the bedrooms will be fine. But as Watty said, best to run 2 to each - all to a central spot in the attic is probably best.

Be sure to install a phone point down beside the main tv point also.

Sam Radford

You might prefer to run the dish cables to the loft first, and then down to the main room, just in case you decide to install a Loft Box or some sort of distribution system. Also run two cables from the loft to every other room, as a minimum.

You might also like to consider running a phone line and a CAT5 line to every room. You might end up just using them for audio but who knows? I forgot to run the CAT5 cable for my ADSL router so I had a right faff-on installing it as an afterthought.

Do you have children? When my children were very young I ran a second doorbell upstairs so that their little friends could call for them without disturbing me!

Make sure you use satellite grade coax for the TV aerial and wall plates. Make sure the plates are fully shielded. Digital TV can be somewhat unforgiving. Skimp now and regret it later!

Tony

Sam Radford wrote:

Can't find anyone supplying real CT100 any more. Is it still manufactured? I understood it was superseded by H109 but now that's gone and I have to use WC100 or WF100.

H109 was just a similar spec from another manufacturer, the other cables you mentioned are fine , take a look here http://www.cai.org.uk/downloads/CAI%20Cable%20Benchmarking%20Scheme.pdf

Tony

HighWire wrote:

Any ideas and tips will be greatly appreciated.

I would avoid using an electrician at all if possible, why not get your satellite installer involved at this point, remember the electrician does not have to make it work so does not have the same motivation to do it right from the outset.

St Senan

HighWire wrote:

Any ideas and tips will be greatly appreciated.

Don't forget to put in surround sound cabling early on in the wiring stages as well

TheDriver

Used WF100, same stuff except harder to bend due to plastic inner core, got 100m for 50 euro last Sept.
Would agree with Tony, Electricians don't do sat cabling that well to be honest, get your installer that you can trust as some will just throw in the cabling they need for now and won't bother too much with rest for future proofing.

5h4mr0(k

Sam Radford wrote:

You might also like to consider running a phone line and a CAT5 line to every room. You might end up just using them for audio but who knows? I forgot to run the CAT5 cable for my ADSL router so I had a right faff-on installing it as an afterthought.

You'd just need the Cat5 to each point. You can run the phone over the same cable and sockets.
Run Cat5 everywhere for future proofing. Seem to be able to run everything over - I've even found a few television distribution systems (but they're a bit too pricey for me)

bauderline

scaller,

What sort of cabling should I put down for surround sound, I starting a new build in the next 6 months and had intended to run good quality speaker wire in some rooms as well as Cat5 and CT100 to nearly all rooms..

I this is a little OT but what good is Sat without sounds eg ?

best rgs, baud.

paddynead

Hi all sorry for jumping in on this thread, just got a little worried while reading it.:eek:
I am in the middle of a self build. To cut costs a friend was going to help with running the phone and TV cables, He is not up on all the latest tech and was planning on running coax around the house, but on reading this tread feel I should run Cat5, We will have a buzzer/intercom on the gate, Satellite, Broadband. And who knows what in the future?

What are the capabilities of Cat5 and what are the benefits of running it in to every room?
Any recommendations for what I should use?

mossym

cat5 is multistrand cable, normally used for networking, but is being used for a myriad of purposes, even speaker cable, although i shudder at the thought.

coax is basically 1 signal only, carrier and ground, so really of no use except for tv. If the limit of your friends knowledge runs to running coax only i think you should reconsider his services.

5h4mr0(k

mossym wrote:

cat5 is multistrand cable, normally used for networking, but is being used for a myriad of purposes, even speaker cable, although i shudder at the thought.

coax is basically 1 signal only, carrier and ground, so really of no use except for tv. If the limit of your friends knowledge runs to running cox only i think you should reconsider his services.

I think that you might want to edit that?!?!!?

paddynead

. If the limit of your friends knowledge runs to running cox only i think you should reconsider his services.[/QUOTE]

Yes I think you are correct.

Anybody know if there is a web site that would list the cables and there capabilities, so I could have a bit of knowledge when I call my electrician. I am a bit lost in this hi tech cable area.

Thanks

mossym

5h4mr0(k wrote:

I think that you might want to edit that?!?!!?

yeah cheers...unfortunately it's been quoted twice now so my typing mistake will go down in immortality

Sponge Bob

Its simple with a new house

1. back boxes in walls are double single or twin. Keep them away from electric cables, say 2 ft away .
2. put 2 twin backboxes in a corner of each room where you want data and sat
3. run 2 x cat 6 cables from central point in attic to 1 twin
4. run 2 x ct100 or equivalent sat cable from central point in attic to the other twin and run 1 x rg6 tv cable to that wtin too .

( you could try using one twin with 4 cables but its tight)

5. mark each cable as kit1 sit2 sitTV out2 etc...in the attic with masking tape .

now all internal cabling done bar attic

6. run minimum 4 x ct100 cables through attic and through wall to south east corner of house high up from the central point again. Ideally consider 8 -10 if you want more than astra but these are short runs . This is for a quattro feed .

7. run telephone cable from outside front to near where the cat 6 cables central point .

8. provide at least 2 x twin power sockets in the central point area, plan on a plywood sheet wall in attic central point to mount all this stuff neatly and bring cables through back, neatly .

9 leave 2m-3m of slack in attic for each cable to get it neatly around and through the plywood wall ..

In time you will then

1. install 1 x vantage multiswiitch or similar and plug all the sat feeds and drops into it .

2. install aerial and amps and connect rg6 cables for tv feeds

3. install 1 x ethernet switch and plug all cat6 cables into it.

but all the cables are there and marked . You may also distribute telephone/adsl bb to some cat 6 cables as required , these will not be plugged into ethernet switch but into telephone distribution.

the messy bit is installing the cables after its plastered , do it now . Thats how I have my house done with 4 sat viewing/tv points and another 8 tv points and catv gigabit ethernet

HighWire

Wow, that was some reading.
Thanks a million for all the responses.
Lots of ideas to take from.

mossym

cat6 would be nice, but cat5e will work jsut as well for the distances you'd be talking about in your normal house..

Sponge Bob

Twould mossy , get as high 'a cat' as you can but Cat5e was what I put in . Shame it 'possibly wont support 10Gb Ethernet though, just 1Gb is what I am stuck with

mossym

oh and i'd run 3 ct100 cables down to the main tv point,

2* sat feeds for potential sky+
1* return for rf out on sky+ box
1 cable for normal antenna(the rg6)

so 4 cables to your main tv point, i have 3 ct100 and 3 cat5e but i wish i'd run a 4th..2 is enough to everywhere else, i have a sperate 3 going to my home theatre room, but that's a long story

mossym

Sponge Bob wrote:

Twould mossy , get as high 'a cat' as you can but Cat5e was what I put in . Shame it 'possibly wont support 10Gb Ethernet though, just 1Gb is what I am stuck with

yeah, i've cat5e going to every room as well. Not worried though..1Gb? if i get to the point where a gigabit network is slowing thigns down i'll have spent so much on electronics rewiring the hosue will look like a pittance..

Sponge Bob

OK so Mossy.

At these main home entertainment nodes run 4 x CT100 and 1 x RG6 Tv Grade from attic like Mossy sez

Still 2 twin backboxes

4 x ct 100 or equivalent into 1 twin backbox
1 x RG6 TV cable and 2 x cat v cable into other twin backbox .

Use twin backboxes (take 2 single plates each) NOT a double backbox OK

Also remember you should have this assembly EACH side of chimney in sitting room IN CASE you want to change this room around ....ever.

Some would even install 3 entertainment nodes in sitting room corners , 3 x double power sockets too .

A tv viewing/phone node or office node in spare bedroom is per my original post.

FINALLY. In a a MASTER or SECOND bedroom you should mount the TV/SAT cables and POWER points up the wall about 2 foot from the ceiling.

Then you do not have wires streeling up the wall from the skirting and the wallmount 26" LCD with sat receiver cable tied the bracket will hide the lot

also consider security cams outside (if required ) and putting them through the Multiswitch so you can view the local badgers shagging at dawn as you lie in bed ...what what

thats all my advice now.

Antenna

Tony wrote:

I would avoid using an electrician at all if

yes, I know an individual who had a house extension done, and his electrician friend had ran 'RG59' cable to the TV point (very lossy)

Sponge Bob

electricians always run rg59 or RG6 UNLESS you do it yourself . Not future proof at all at all.

Tony

I'd actually avoid using rg6 at all as you most likely will buy a roll of ct100, not much point in buying a roll rg6 just for one run

thekooman

might be in the wrong place but when everyone is on the subject...

also consider security cams outside (if required ) and putting them through the Multiswitch so you can view the local badgers shagging at dawn as you lie in bed ...what what

what wiring is needed for these?
power (3core)
ct100
cat5 (in case you ever went to IP cameras!).

mossym

Sponge Bob wrote:

electricians always run rg59 or RG6 UNLESS you do it yourself . Not future proof at all at all.

yup, thats what my sparky did even though i told him to wait till i got him the ct100. Ended up pulling the orignal stuff and replacing with ct100..luckily enough he was sound about it

Tony

mossym wrote:

luckily enough he was sound about it

who cares whether he's sound about it or not, should have paid attention to your instructions.

mossym

well wasn't a direct labor, we bought off of builder. So in essence he wasn't working for me and was doing me a favor. Her also ran cat5e all over the house for me, as well as hdmi, component and vga cables to the ceiling for my projector. Given i didn't pay any more for this i'm not complaining.

Sponge Bob

thekooman wrote:

might be in the wrong place but when everyone is on the subject..

only me

what wiring is needed for these?
power (3core)

no, they are powered over the data

ct100
cat5 (in case you ever went to IP cameras!).

both actually, IP cameras use power over ethernet ( 2 of the 4 pairs in a Cat v cable) but you may need a different sort of cat v cable for power over ethernet .

normal cat v is UTP (unshielded) but Power over ethernet may require STP (shielded) or FTP (each pair is shielded) read this

Ring ADT security and ask what they recommend as you will be getting an alarm and cameras off them

HighWire

Was talking with the sparks last week
Hes using RG6u coax to all tv points
Reckon I might just tell him to run ct100.
Im sure he's bought a shed load of rg6,
but its my house he's wiring.

Anyone know where I can buy ct100 in Dublin?

Cheers lads.

mossym

this is worth putting your foot down on, even if he doesn't like the idea of pulling the rg6 and rerunning the ct100 i'd make him do it..

hell if they both fit leave them both there. i know my guy ran rg6, even though i told him not to run anything until i gave him the ct100...he ended up pulling the rg6 and having to rerun the ct100.

got mine in limerick though, so sorry can't help ya

Sponge Bob

this is ****ing typical , assholes

CT100 ( or an equivalent like PF100 in B and Q and also H109 cable ) is MUCH better than cheapo rg6

ask the sparks would he recommend 1.5mm core copper for a ring main if he does not understand the difference, he will say no, he has to use higher capacity 2.5mm core for a ring main.

same with ct100 vs rg6

HighWire

mossym wrote:

this is worth putting your foot down on, even if he doesn't like the idea of pulling the rg6 and rerunning the ct100 i'd make him do it..

Im in the fortunate position that he hasnt run anything yet.
So it shouldnt bother him one way or the other.

Tony

HighWire wrote:

Anyone know where I can buy ct100 in Dublin?

Cheers lads.

Take a look at the supplier sticky

HighWire

He's never heard of CT100.

He was just running RG6 for normal TV points.

HighWire

Is there a wiring needs calculator somewhere to figure out how much cable you need? Im going to source the cable, but Im trying to figure out how much I'll need.

HighWire

Hmmmmm now that I think about it would it just be easier to get
someone in to install everything for me?

pjq

This is a great thread as I'm building an extension along the back of the house which will allow me access to all the existing TV points , and I'm going to replace 30 yrs of make-shift cables . There are just a few points that I'm still not clear on ;

1. I understand what I need for Sat cables FTA ( have 28E, 19E & 13E quads + 4 diseq boxes ), but I also need cable for terrestrial RTE . I pick up from two transmitters ( Mt Leinster and Suir Valley) , do I bring the cables to the diplexer and then connect to the six distribution cables ? I’ll put in CT100 , will this “future proof” me when digital terrestrial comes ? Should I be looking at a Multiswitch to bring Sat and Terrestrial together in one cable ?
2. Can I put my Eircom BB box (netopia) in the attic and distribute it to all rooms via CAT5 cable ? Will I need a separate phone cable or can the phone share the CAT5 with BB?
3. I plan to push all the SAT, TV and CAT5 cables through a buried duct , will they interfere with one-another ? Would it be a problem if they ran parallel to an Elect. cable ? Somebody referred to keeping elect. cables / sockets 2ft from the other cables ?


PJQ

5h4mr0(k

pjq wrote:

T
2. Can I put my Eircom BB box (netopia) in the attic and distribute it to all rooms via CAT5 cable ? Will I need a separate phone cable or can the phone share the CAT5 with BB?
3. I plan to push all the SAT, TV and CAT5 cables through a buried duct , will they interfere with one-another ? Would it be a problem if they ran parallel to an Elect. cable ? Somebody referred to keeping elect. cables / sockets 2ft from the other cables ?

2. Yes. The phone can run over the same cable. The phone connector (RJ11) will fit in nicely to the network connection (RJ45). You'll need to have a patch panel. You can then decide if a socket will be for phone or data.

3. For cat5 you should avoid running with electrical cables as they can cause interference. (Use cat5e cable).

pjq

Today 12:44
HighWire Is there a wiring needs calculator somewhere to figure out how much cable you need? Im going to source the cable, but Im trying to figure out how much I'll need.

I can't help with the calculator bit , but I thought of getting 250m of CT100 at Dönberg http://www.donberg.ie/descript/2/27637r.htm , after I have layed it out , I'll then decide if I need an extra 100m or not as their delivery charges are only €6-. But if you need to do it all on one day this won't work .
PJQ

Tony

Thats a good deal on the cable, very close to what I pay trade.

cast_iron

pjq wrote:

1. I understand what I need for Sat cables FTA ( have 28E, 19E & 13E quads + 4 diseq boxes ), but I also need cable for terrestrial RTE . I pick up from two transmitters ( Mt Leinster and Suir Valley) , do I bring the cables to the diplexer and then connect to the six distribution cables ? I’ll put in CT100 , will this “future proof” me when digital terrestrial comes ? Should I be looking at a Multiswitch to bring Sat and Terrestrial together in one cable ?

The 2 aerials will go into a diplexer, then fed into the house (attic usually) on one cable, and distributed around to all the rooms.
CT100 will be fine for digital terrestrial.
I wouldn't favour the multiswitch to combine the aerial and satelite.

pjq wrote:

3. I plan to push all the SAT, TV and CAT5 cables through a buried duct , will they interfere with one-another ? Would it be a problem if they ran parallel to an Elect. cable ? Somebody referred to keeping elect. cables / sockets 2ft from the other cables ?

I wouldn't expect any problems if you use decent cable (CT100).

Tony

cast_iron wrote:

I wouldn't favour the multiswitch to combine the aerial and satelite.

.

Why so?

cast_iron

Tony wrote:

Why so?

Personally, when given the choice, I like to keep the aerial signal on its own coax - separate form the satellite. I just don't like combining them, then splitting them up again at the receiving end - too much unnecessary electronics.

When combining 2 aerial signals from different transmitters and with different strengths, a good clean end signal isn't always guaranteed, and shoving it through various diplexers, etc. won't help matters.

byte

cast_iron wrote:

Personally, when given the choice, I like to keep the aerial signal on its own coax - separate form the satellite. I just don't like combining them, then splitting them up again at the receiving end - too much unnecessary electronics.

When combining 2 aerial signals from different transmitters and with different strengths, a good clean end signal isn't always guaranteed, and shoving it through various diplexers, etc. won't help matters.

I agree. If at all possible, I'd recommend running the satellite and terrestrial o seperate downleads.

Tony

Your point is well made but I've never encountered problems using a multiswitch, I think they are a very neat solution.

cast_iron wrote:

Personally, when given the choice, I like to keep the aerial signal on its own coax - separate form the satellite. I just don't like combining them, then splitting them up again at the receiving end - too much unnecessary electronics.

When combining 2 aerial signals from different transmitters and with different strengths, a good clean end signal isn't always guaranteed, and shoving it through various diplexers, etc. won't help matters.