Crossfit. My experiences so far

The Shane

We have from time to time seen a couple a posters come onto the forum and ask general fitness advice only to be give the stock answer of check out crossfit for all your fitness needs. And by and large that is pretty good advice.

I was given that advice by FiannaGym a while back (I reckon back in 2004) and while I read some of the articles and echoed the advice to anyone who asked me about fitness I wasn’t really a convert. Since Christmas just gone I have stuck as rigidly to the WODs as is possible to do without completely giving up your life. In this regard I would say that I get in about 80% of the WODs (or variations) and still manage to train and see people.

I say manage to train but I am sitting her typing because my back is in knots after an intense deadlifting WOD and I’m skipping training in favour of a hot pack and writing about training.

So what was I doing before? I was doing a predominantly powerlifting workout with occasional bursts of cardio and additional pull ups and the odd strongman routine (tyre flipping being my favourite).

What Am I doing now? Mostly the WODs. I don’t like to run and consequently sub in other similarly themed work outs for running – rowing, cycling or skipping. I’ll do the shorter distances when they are in the amalgamated workouts but generally try to avoid running as it messes with my fallen arches. I’m trying at the moment to follow the WODs a month in arrears, as I found staying up to date was hard and left no flexibility to plan.

How has this impacted on my fitness? Hard to say, I’ve goals of getting a bit bigger which seem to be going to plan, but I wasn’t trying for this before and as such there is no hard and fast comparison. Before Christmas I was trying to set a new bench press record, and with crossfit I’ve all but discarded the bench press as an exercise. So as you might imagine my lifts have gone down there. Not as much as you might imagine though. The increased shoulder work (a lot of shoulder work) and dip work have really brought my upper body strength to a different place. Dare I call it “functional”? I have a better handstand, increased core stability (I also took up Pilates), and more powerful legs. Flexibility is improved and I have more strength at odd angles.

Any summary of my sports performance would be vain or bashful so I will omit it but with the notes that I seem to be generally regarded as strong and manage to last and keep a certain pace at the ends of a class.

All that aside, the most important factoring crossfit is that I enjoy it. More than you can imagine. With the month laid out ahead of me, I see workouts that repeat frequently and strive to set new and better times. I like the swings between what seems pure cardio to intense one rep max lifting. From ultra endurance workouts (one such night had 90 reps by bodyweight bench press, all but discarded) to crazy mixes of all of the above. I start getting anxious days in advance of some workouts – Cindy is my favourite, not to leave out Fran.

It is this that I think really sells the crossfit methodology to me. Some times I have to modify a WOD but the community of people (despite being staunch right wing nuts) are ever helpful and never tire of answering the same questions. On top of that the average crossfit workout takes me no more than 45mins. I like that. Who wouldn’t?

All in all, I can’t imagine a scenario where I would go back to regular three sets of 8 to 12 reps over four exercises and some crunches at the end. Anyone who does is just kidding themselves.

Shane, The.

PeakOutput

The Shane wrote:

All in all, I can’t imagine a scenario where I would go back to regular three sets of 8 to 12 reps over four exercises and some crunches at the end. Anyone who does is just kidding themselves.

Shane, The.

that would be me then any links on where to get more info on this???

Colm_OReilly

www.crossfit.com

There's a host of other sites around that offer crossfit style workouts and crossfit prep workouts as well

eoghan.geraghty

I for one can vouch for shanes increased strength in grappling/wrestling since new year.
I've had to resort to using technique lately, dammit:mad:

Colm_OReilly

eoghan.geraghty wrote:

I for one can vouch for shanes increased strength in grappling/wrestling since new year.
I've had to resort to using technique lately, dammit:mad:

Careful man, that's a slippery slope!

HammerHeadGym

Go Shane.

Fran FTW!!

cavedave

I tried it there for a few weeks before cracking a rib. Even at the "do half the weight on the half the workouts you know how to do" scheme I was working it seemed really good. I thought it would be useful not to do it alone as you do get to a point where having some reason not to stop would be good.

I find the right wingedness of crossfit pretty strange. I wonder is there a connection between being really into fitness and self reliance? There does seem to be a connection between outdoor activity people and libertarianism. Presumably because if you want to do stupid dangerous things you must accept other people have the right to do stupid dangerous things as well.
I do not think martial arts have the same homogenous political compasses though.

MrO

Hi Folks,
Just wondering does *using* the crossfit programme involve just adhering to the daily recommendations or is there more to it than that. I've had a look at the site and thats what it appears to be?

Thanks!

Dragan

I don't really care about the political orientation of anyone, especially the Glassmans. They are putting qualtiy information out there for free. That’s says a lot in my book.

What a lot of people fail to realise about the WOD's is that they are all designed to run into each. There really is a bigger picture in mind there. You will end up seeing similar movements and systems of reps and excercises coming up, and will notice and increase in workload and ability as time goes on. It's a horribly clevel way to get people to actually do stuff that benefits them as opposed to doing what they WANT to do.

For the average person who wants to be healthier, and for the MMA fighter who wants to be better I cannot recommend it enough.

Like The Shane said…..you'll be stronger at odd angles. I have yet to see a fight Bench Press mid fight.

Colm_OReilly

I'd like to comment on this fully when I get the time, in the meantime, I'll put forward my thoughts on the right wingedness of crossfit.

Crossfit was designed, to the best of my knowledge, by militia personnel. As such the mentality and culture (Boo Yah Master Chief) would have been transported into Crossfit.

Semper Fi,
Colm

Dragan

Colm_OReilly wrote:

Semper Fi

I actual read up about the origins of that last week. Very interesting stuff!

columok

Shane having seen some pics on bebo you're looking scary strong. (bebo being the ultimate proof on strength)

Dragan wrote:

I have yet to see a fight Bench Press mid fight.

Jeez, how have you been escaping mount recently.

Dragan

columok wrote:

Jeez, how have you been escaping mount recently.

Sorry Colum,

i simply meant that the bench implies a perfectly prone body, stable bar with equal weight distribution and very specific chain of muscles being fired.....oh yeah, and it's not trying to punch you in the face.

From a dynamic effort perspective, ANYTHING done with a resisting opponent will bear very little resemblance to a stationary lift.

How often have you maxed out on the bench then slide your hips out? :eek:

columok

I should clarify. I was joking about the usual first day strongman mount escape of bench press into being armbarred. They generally gas out trying to constantly bench press you off them.

How often have you maxed out on the bench then slide your hips out?

Like every time. I often do bench 300 lbs then work some shrimps while keeping the bar steady. Fvck yeah!

spiral

Shane what would you recommend for a beginner starting off on Crossfit is there a core set of exercises you can use and sub for those you cant do ?

Dragan

columok wrote:

I should clarify. I was joking about the usual........

Ah, sorry dude. Had a funeral over the weekend and it seems to have switched my sense of humour to "off".

Dragan

spiral wrote:

Shane what would you recommend for a beginner starting off on Crossfit is there a core set of exercises you can use and sub for those you cant do ?

If you go to www.crossfit.com and go to the FAQ it's all covered in there.

spiral

k cheers dragan

David Jones

Cindy is my favourite, not to leave out Fran

Lets not forget Linda (my personal favourite)

"Linda"
10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1 reps of the triplet:
Deadlift: 1 1/2 body weight
Bench press: body weight
Clean: 3/4 body weight

and "Nasty Girls" , two absolute nightmares.

"Nasty Girls"

3 rounds for time of:
50 Squats
7 Muscle-ups
135 pound Hang power cleans, 10 reps



Crossfit stuff is superb although you would want a fairly solid knowledge of the main lifts so as not to injure yourself. There are video demos on the site if you arent sure of what something is but definitely be careful if you havent done a particular lift before.

Khannie

I tried doing it for a while (I'd say about 6 weeks)....but nights that I was going to MT I was just too bollixed to start into another workout, so I considered my MT class to be the workout for that day. I found it hard to sub some of the exercises with my limited set of kit (free weights, a bench, a bag, chin bar and skipping rope) but if you use your imagination that's usually sufficient.

I've been seriously considering starting it again, though with baby, it's hard to guarantee a solid free hour in the evenings.

While I was doing it, I definitely noticed a rapid improvement in fitness and core strength.

Roper

Whats with the lack of work on the beach muscles? Hammer curls ftw!

The Shane

True. It does neglect the all important beach posing muscles in favour of functional strength. That raises the issue of what is functional strength - in terms of beach wear. Olympic lifting is probably not that functional.


I sometimes have to skip some of the workouts that demand a couple of bars and many of the WODs are built around the shape of crossfit HQ. This means that where the rack is next to pull up bars in CFHQ they are not in the gym you might be using. I'm either in my garage or hercs (get some odd looks sprinting from olympic lift to pull up and what not). You just have to suck it up and try your best to accomodate the workout but if you can't, find a similarly themed workout.

As for getting started, they recommend that you work the basic mechanics of the exercises for a while. This will only really apply to the olympic lifts for most people, actually, deadlift too, there is some appalling deadlift form out there and the crossfit journal has had a couple of articles on how and why to do this properly (it's okay to use your back - a conversation I had with one of those health and safety know-it-alls in work).

I recommend working the exercises and routines you can, adapting the ones you can't in terms of intensity and number and working the technique purely on ones that you don't have the skills for yet. If you are only starting crossfit, then chances are you'll be wiped for a few days after the first intense set you get.

As for the politics, I am like Dragan hugely appreciative of the effort, quality and input of the Glassmans. They are providing the finest online fitness resource nearly completely gratis. The political scape isn't even one of pro-bush, it just has a very right wing current to it. Some of it, and this is the individual not the movement are just crazy, I found a picture of an american eagle giving the "middle claw" over the backdrop of the american flag. The tagline read "Jihad This!". People like that who own guns terrify me.

Shane, The

Colm_OReilly

Who are the Glassmans?

Guns are cool!

How does crossfit prepare an athlete who is trying to peak for competition?

What about in season/off season athletes, like rowers or rugby players, how would the WoD's fit in then?

Or is it a case of crossfit delivers fitness, and sport, being different than fitness, requires different exercise?

Colm
-Curious

The Shane

Who are the Glassmans?

Greg and Lauren Glassman are the founders of crossfit.

Guns are cool!

Yes they are. But should not be left in the hands of zealots with a warped world view.

How does crossfit prepare an athlete who is trying to peak for competition?

Crossfit is predominantly orientated towards fitness for the now. In that respect it is not great for peaking. Bearing that in mind peaking itself is simply focusing on the desired attributes and getting steadily better at them. Most athletes could make a decent estimate at what goals they could hit if they pushed themselves for a given timeframe. In that that respect I think a modified crossfit workout is your best bet. While many olympic lifters use it you can bet that theya re focusing most of their energies on olympic lifts. There are several websites with sport specific WODs. At the moment I feel like the general is the best for me.

What about in season/off season athletes, like rowers or rugby players, how would the WoD's fit in then?

In terms of off season athletes I think staying in great shape with the general fitness work etc and then tapering with some sport specific focusing, then maintenance for the season duration. The crossfit journal covers the training routines for basketball teams and baseball teams recently.

Or is it a case of crossfit delivers fitness, and sport, being different than fitness, requires different exercise?

Yes. But see answer above.


Shane, The

Valmont

Dragan wrote:

How often have you maxed out on the bench then slide your hips out? :eek:

Now there's an interesting workout, haha:D

Dragan

Some excellent answers out of The Shane about Crossfit there, but I just wanted to add one or two things about Crossfit and peaking for a competition or whatever.

As The Shane said, the general Crossfit program and following the WOD's will develop a "fitness now" trainee who can run, jump, lift and throw to a great capacity. They will not be world class in ALL those aspects, someone who trains predominantly lifting will out lift them, running will out run them etc but they will be "well rounded" to use an MMA phrase. Even more so than that, their anaerobic and metabolic condition will be off the charts. There recover times minimal and there ability to generate work load in a short space of time extremely high.

One of the greatest strengths of the Crossfit program in general is that it forces the trainee beyond comfort levels and shows that there is really nothing to fear from pushing yourself to the point of extreme fatigue. You WILL recover from a short burst high intensity workout, no matter how bad you feel at the time. I have found that Crossfit develops a mental strength in trainee's that few other programs can.

Now then, with regard to Crossfit and peaking for an event, that’s a tad more complicated. The person would need to have a great understanding of the program itself, and also a birdseye and impartial view of the rest of there training and performance. That’s why people have coaches and trainers, people who can stay unemotionally invovled to a degree and make you work or rest as needed. The main joy of Crossfit is the scaling, you can make things harder or easier depending on your needs. As such, I could take some bench mark WOD's and slowly scale them up over a 7 week period, each time calling for a slightly greater output of energy and effort. As such, we could peak and athlete's conditioning by adding Crossfit with the correct scaling into there plan.

In order for it to work effectively though it would be recommend that the fighter have been training WOD's for a minimum of 2 months before hand to ensure they are used to the demands of it. Otherwise you could easily lead to over training, as could incorrect scaling which would cost your fighter big time.

A final note on peaking would be that the idea is to be able to STOP the week before and allow the body to recover and in effect GROW and DEVELOP into it's new found capacity for work and you can easily train to a point where this would be difficult to do and you would simply be tired. In short, while the general Crossfit Program will create fitness now, with a degree of understanding in the program and human performance you can adapt it for peaking cycles very effectively.

Colm_OReilly

Thanks Dragan,

A few more inquiries:

1) Dragan's feelings on in season/off season training with crossfit. Obviously in our sports we're peaking but power based sports like rowing and rugby compete once a week/fortnight.

2) Balancing crossfit with skill development training, what sort of balance is ideal? You can assume the athlete has 6 free hours a week and sufficient recovery time.

3) Crossfit juniors? For the promising young athletes, what up with that?

Cheers,
Colm
-Planning for the future

Dragan

Colm_OReilly wrote:

1) Dragan's feelings on in season/off season training with crossfit. Obviously in our sports we're peaking but power based sports like rowing and rugby compete once a week/fortnight.

The joy of sports like rowing/rugby etc is the off season. That’s where the major gains are made. All you need is 8 to 12 weeks off season with sufficent rest before ( about 7 to 14 days from the end of season, once you have no injuries ) and after ( I would say about 7 to 10 days from the last heavy training day, keeping light training going every 2 to 3 days, flexibility and cardio training as well , lots of physio work etc ) and you can make massive changes to speed, power out put and work in some sport specific training. It's a blanket statement but I can't think of any sport that would not benefit from a nice strong posterior chain ( the current "in" fad in training but for sports it works ) and you can easily add to the strenght of this in 8 to 12 weeks with the right program, rest and nutrition.

Crossfit would work in this regard but to be honest I would not have people doing it solely…..i would place a far greater emphasis on sports specific training, and no better way to do that that train the sport itself!!! Sports specific should simply mean breaking the sport down to it's component pieces and working on improving them, then bringing it all together on the pitch/in the boat, on the road, where ever you happen to compete.

Lets take rugby as an example. You need to work all the skills and techniques of the game, work on plays, work on positioning etc. You also needs your players to be carrying out ROLE SPECIFIC training. If someone runs fast, and is playing a position to maximise that you have them working sprints. You want them to be FAST. If someone is in the front row of the scrum you want them to have power and a high force output, you don't have them emphasising sprint work overall.

You can easily work in Crossfit style routines to work on endurance and recovery, rugby is a start/stop game for speedy recover after maximal output is vital to a teams success. Rowing is more awkward, you need power, strenght and endurance, you need to keep that output up over a long and painful distance but the benefits are still there is crossfit style, scaling workouts and dropping rest periods as the weeks progress.

In short, my feelings is that crossfit would be beneficial, but should really be a smaller part in the training for sports like these. A coach should looks at his team, evaluate weaknesses and use short term training plans to rectify them. You should never see an entire team training the same way unless they all carry out EXACTLY the same function. A difference in function should mean a difference in training.

ON SEASON they should then simply maintain the power, endurance they have developed. But part of the joy is that simply playing a match will do this, light training after, then a heavy training day, a light training day and then match day. Once again mid season individual weaknesses need to be worked on as best as they can but it's really all about maintain health and match fitness. The games/events are hard enough.

Colm_OReilly wrote:

2) Balancing crossfit with skill development training, what sort of balance is ideal? You can assume the athlete has 6 free hours a week and sufficient recovery time.

If an athelte ( lets argue the case of a fighter ) has 6 free hours a week that he could possible train and recover from then I would question his training. If time is there that they can train and has sufficent recovery then it should be used. I would also argue the point that Crossfit could be considered to be skill development. Endurance, recovery and maximising output and workload are all skills, the mental fortitude developed by a gut wrenching WOD is a skill, in a way.

Regardless of that and without trying to make too many blanket statements I would think that some short time, high energy output WOD's would be of benefit when factored into almost any training program, but I would ( and any decent coach would do this without thinking about it ) need to see the exact structure of the trainee's training cycle before adding anything in.

If I had my way though I would have them doing a lot of technique based work if they had 6 free hours. You can amp up someones conditiong and fitness with about 2 hours hard work a week over a short period. These are simple muscle and organ functions and your body will improve very dramatically if you train it right and feed it and rest it well. All technique based actions are victims of the CNS…..and working on that can be more difficult and more strenuous and is why most people mess up. The see throwing a punch as being a muscle action, when it’s not. Your CNS is firing a certain chain, making it more efficent at firing that chain makes you faster and stronger, not having big muscles.

Once again the abilities of the individual come into play here, if they have good conditiong but poor technique then the emphasis lies there, and obviously there is another side to that coin. In the case of a fighter you need to be able to go at 100% for anywhere up to 15 to 25 mins. Lets call it a max of 30 mins with rest times between rounds. As such, that really all you need to do in a Crossfit style workout to know your endurance is where you need it to be. If you can do something like Shark Bait for 30 mins then your sorted. There is an argument that there is always more you can do with regard to output but that needs to be built up slowly. If someone can fo Fight Gone Bad really well then you make one segment harder for them, then another, then another over time and build up output that way. You don't double the effort on everything straight away!

I'm kind of waffling now but I guess I'm just trying to get the point across that there are two many individual factors with regard to different trainees to just say "25% Crossfit, 75% Technique" or something similar.

I can try and come up with a decent sample program for anyone that wants it who would like to show me there current routines, diets and recovery?

Colm_OReilly wrote:

3) Crossfit juniors? For the promising young athletes, what up with that?

It's a must in my opinion. Build up that big base of fitness and mentality when they are young and your giving them a great base to work off regardless of what sport they go into in the future.

mickoo

I would not recommend 1 training system for everybody as everybody has different goals, abilities, and not everybody recovers the same-Age, Sex and nutrition will all come into play here, i will not pretend to be an expert on this system as i have only read this thread! But it does not seem to be very good for rest and recovery and this in turn can lead to burn out and injuries short and long term, Maybe mma fighters could use some parts of the system that will be more specific to there sport. Just an opinion as i have only judged this by what i read on this thread-:cool:

Dragan

mickoo wrote:

But it does not seem to be very good for rest and recovery and this in turn can lead to burn out and injuries short and long term

Hey Mickoo, just wondering what you mean by "good" for rest and recovery and also how you came to that conclusion based on reading this thread?

Cheers.

mickoo

Dragan wrote:

Hey Mickoo, just wondering what you mean by "good" for rest and recovery and also how you came to that conclusion based on reading this thread?

Cheers.

I came to the conclusion because im hearing a lot about intesive training and nothing about proper rest times-The more intense the exercise the more recovery is needed, The best programs usually are devised to factor in recovery rates of different muscles-For example-Arms recover very quick from exercise, maybe 1-2 days. Legs recover much slower and is more like 5-6 days recovery, These are basic guidelines as im not basing it on any given workout or individual.. I already explained that i dont know the system well enough yet to give any major input, Can you explain the rest and recovery for this system keeping in mind MMA athletes probably train intensely most day's? Cheers.

Colm_OReilly

Dragan,

Nice!:D

On children/adolescents: are there crossfit junior sites out there. What sort of modifications would be made, how would you get them exercising? Would they be doing miniature WoD's 2x a week, or would you have them work on pilates first, then basic exercises in isolation, then a modified WoD?

I'm trying to develop some promising kids and my aims are:

1. Instill an intrinsic love of exercise
2. get them exercising with the right mentality and form. Right mentality being that it's pleasurable first and foremost, not a chore. Then it's competitive and they want but push themselves. But also it's just a component of their life, not their life in and of itself.
3. Develop them as athletes for mma/sub wrestling with an aim/springboard for high level competition

Let me clarify this position a bit more. I'm not out to force them into competition or MMA as a serious career. I want them to be at their very best and if they want to, they're as best prepared as they can be to make a shot at competitive endeavours.

Mickoo,
May I ask what's your exercise/mma knowledge base? I'm curious because it seems to be because rest wasn't mentioned you assumed it wasn't considered.

Thanks all,
Colm

mickoo

Colm_OReilly wrote:

Mickoo,
May I ask what's your exercise/mma knowledge base? I'm curious because it seems to be because rest wasn't mentioned you assumed it wasn't considered.

Thanks all,
Colm

Im a personal trainer and train MMA and bjj-i've done various martial arts but just train now as a hobbie, i never said it was a bad system but just brought up a valid point which i would be interested in hearing the answer as its 1 of the most important aspects of fitness. Why is everyone so defensive on this forum? I never said anyon

mickoo

Colm_OReilly wrote:

Mickoo,
May I ask what's your exercise/mma knowledge base? I'm curious because it seems to be because rest wasn't mentioned you assumed it wasn't considered.

Thanks all,
Colm

Im a personal trainer and train MMA and bjj-i've done various martial arts but just train now as a hobbie, i never said it was a bad system but just brought up a valid point which i would be interested in hearing the answer as its 1 of the most important aspects of fitness. Why is everyone so defensive on this forum? I believe a training programme should be designed differently to suit each individual, thats why most systems fail before they start.

Colm_OReilly

Why is everyone so defensive on this forum?

All statements starting with "why" tend to provoke feelings of hostility and justification (defensiveness) so the tendency on the behave of the listener is to presume the feelings are the same of the questioner.

In this case, it was one of curiosity. I know Dragan and The Shane, and I'm interested in their perspective. I didn't register you straight away, so I wanted to see what your level of knowledge/experience was, so I could better interact with you.

mickoo

Sorry-in defensive mode at the minute..:D its this dam self defense page!!!

spiral

Ok inspired by this thread I had a look at the workouts on crossfit to see if there was anything I thought I might even have a chance of doing.

Angie
100 pull ups, push ups, sit ups, squats.

I managed this in 26:36.. I only got as far as 40 proper pullups then I did assisted and jumpups 40 and 20 respectively .

I also did it wrong . Supposed to complete the pullups first then pushups then situps then squats etc.\
I didnt read it properly and mixed and matched to try and give myself a break from the pullups which were killing me. I did make a personal record of 7 dead hang pullups in a row up from 1 about 6 months ago though:D .
Anyways next time will probably be worse but I'll do it correctly.

Pushups situps squats were all fine but that might be different next time after doing all the pullups first.

Anyways well worth doing and something to improve on.

Dragan

mickoo wrote:

The more intense the exercise the more recovery is needed, The best programs usually are devised to factor in recovery rates of different muscles-For example-Arms recover very quick from exercise, maybe 1-2 days. Legs recover much slower and is more like 5-6 days recovery,

Hey Mickoo,

i see exactly where you are coming from and it really boils down to the ever famous Total Body Training VS Body part split training routine.

In my opinion, and it should be noted this is ONLY my opinion, Total Body Training is better for 99% of people out there. The main limitation on peoples physical development is there ability to recover, and there ability to handle the elements of recovery. As such, if you put someone on a Body Part Split trianing routine i have no doubt that they may become bigger and stronger.....it is bound to happen given the stimulus involved, but i feel that the time can be better used to not only improve size, strenght and lean body mass, but also as a way to keep trainee's lean and cardiovascularly fit by doing Total Body Training routines and Crossfit.

The mechanics of recovery with Crossfit are basic.... your not hammering your muscle tissue to the point of extreme tears in order to stimulate hypertrophy....to many people get caught up in muscular recovery when it comes to training. Too many people are doing programs that don't suit them and look the same day in, day out...afraid to do cardio because it "eats muscle".

I did Crossfit steadily for a 2 and a half month period. I was already quite large muscularly at that point and i lost none of my mass. What i did lose was adipose and what i gained was a higher level of fitness and increase cardio vascular recovery and also strenght. So, i was leaner, stronger, fitter, healthier and dare i say just a little bit more mentally strong that when i started. I was following the WOD's as per the crossfit homepage and despite being absolutely shattered at the end of each workout and sure i would have some Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness i was always eager to do the next days workout. It eventually got the point that i had such a degree of energy and vitality that the rest days became more of a chore!!!

I firmly believe from my own experience that Crossfit, in conjunction with a proper diet that suits the individual trainees endocrine system and the required sleep for that person will do wonderous things for anyone.

There is no need for 4 or 5 days rest between bodyparts on Crossfit, we're not aiming for hypertrophy here, we are not inflicting that level of damage on mucsle tissue.

Lets use a workout that i did on Tuesday as an example. You may notice in my sig i develop a Workout of the Week for the fitness board and we all do it and post our times and efforts. Well, this weeks was called "The Grind" and consisted of :

As many rounds as possible in 20 mins of,
5 Power Cleans with 60kilos
10 Push Ups
15 Sit Ups
20 Hindu Squats

I those 20 mins i did 9 rounds, so thats 45 Power Cleans, 90 Push Ups, 135 Sit Ups and 180 Hindu Squats. All in 90 Mins.

After that i took about 10 mins for the queazy feeling in my gut to go away and i did deadlifts, working up to 205kilos for a single, and then i did Push Press, singles, working up to 85 kilos.

I woke up yesterday and despite some slight DOMS i felt fantastic but it was rest day so no workout for me.

I am not looking to produce hypertrophy results right now, i am looking to develop near maximal strenght even when fatigued. BUT, i guarantee a large degree of muscular development for anyone who does Crossfit, because you body will adapt to the stresses of the program, and those stresses will constantly change.

Colm,

I would like to have a bit of a think on your questions and will post shortly if thats okay??

Dragan

CrossfitKidz!!

Right Colm,

With regard to sites for kids look at http://crossfitkidsmagazine.blogspot.com/ for some excellent ideas on what to do with kids and WOD's.

In my own personally opinion the WOD's in the general Crossfit program are not designed for kids, but it is not that hard to come up with programs for them. You can just look back through the above site and find LOADS of different things for different age groups. The important thing about training kids is that you need to treat it like fun and like a game. Because that's what kids do!

People seem to want to wrap kids in plastic and bubble wrap and leave them under the bed until they are 18 and send them out into the world. People will normally forget that kids have more energy, better flexibility, better strenght to bodyweight ratio and far more interest in being active that most adults.

I remember when I was about 10 to 12 I would go down to my father shed and grab ropes, metal pipes, big rocks and tires and set up course and do them endlessly. The amount of energy I had when I was younger amazes me now!!! At about 16 I progressed to "proper" weightlifting and despite the cries from the uneducated I didn't stop growing at 5 foot 5 inches and 150 lbs. I think a lot of what I did then has added to the 240 lbs that on my frame right now!

I really could not say how much I wish I could go back in time and make myself start the Olympic and Powerlifts early, and also to keep working on my flexibility throughout my teenage years!.

Obviously if you have the time do work it into the kids classes you can start of with a nice dynamic warm up, then work on one specific movement or part of a movement, like a clean, snatch, deadlift, kipping chins etc. After that I would have them do a WOD that invovles that movement…. The same way as you drill a technique and then hope to see people trying for it later in a live sparring situation.

The most important part to me would be keeping records and making things fun, so that kids WANT to do more. They will enjoy improving there times and the sense of team work and comraderie that comes from cheering on someone elses efforts and having them do the same for yours. Looking back on it me and my friends were doing Crossfit as kids long before it existed, because it just felt NATURAL! It's funny how often times kids do things instinctively that adults need to drill! I'm sure you have seen this many times when training them.

Anyway, in short, if I had the opportuinity to help some kids with there fitness etc I would do so in the following order!

1) Dynamic Warm Up
2) Flexibility work
3) Drilling a movement
4) Kids WOD
5) rest of class

I would also ensure that they knew they could work on stuff at home if they felt up to it, especially flexibility work. I would also ensure there parents were aware of the correct nutrition principles.

Once again I just want to re-iterate that I am NOT a personnal trainer or a coach. Well, not yet. I am just a self taught person so everything above is purely the opinion of a lay man!!!

Colm_OReilly

Dragan,

Cheers for the link, I'll check that out. Right now our agoge has ridiculously fit kids, but they're looking to get better and stronger. They're all around 10+ so they're treated like adults with some minor modifications. I find at that age, the more responsibility you give them the better they respond.

OUr warm up at the moment. Running for 2-3 minutes with whacky races (commando crawls, running on the knees, crab walks, duck walks) interspersed. Then partner drills.
1. hold your partner in a reverse bear hug and run backwards the length of the mats
2. wheelborrow races.
3. jockey back races
4. double leg shoot, stand up and run the length of the mats
5. fireman carries the lenght of the mats.
6. shrimping
7. over unders (jump over your opp, shoot through his legs) x5

We've just started doing fianna's as well. Ahru ahRU AHRU!

Gonna spend some time on that site over the long weekend.

Colm

Dragan

I really like that Warm Up Colm!!!!

I hope you don't mind but i hope to plan a few GPP sessions in the park soon and might just rob it, as it reads like great fun!!!

Oh yeah, and get your kids doing the Oly lifts and variants, obviously not with massive weight, just sticks or broom handles....getting the technique down NOW will make it SO much easier for them to do it when they are older....and the technique will transfer over to lots of things in MMA.

Colm_OReilly

I've seen my snatch technique, there is NO WAY I'm showing them my Olympic lifts!

Will get The Shane out to show them.

The Shane

Wednesday. Have the broom handles ready.

In terms of kids and dealing with groups I find that Crossfit provide a lot of good workouts at the end of the Crossfit Journal - generally aimed at groups of military officers and teams working together.

In a recent article in the CFJ they stated that the best way to train for fitness is to treat it as sport. Competition is the greatest motivator and a workout which allows at least some of everybodys talents to shine through while pushing their weak areas is the best way to exercise a group.


It's hard to give the kids a specially "regimented" routine especially at this time of year. I believe that going out in the evening and playing the kind of rough football you see on greens around the country is far better than any program you will assign.

As for the education of form and technique, a lot of stock is put in it, at times too much. Most lifts are not that hard, even with the olympic lifts it comes down to just doing more of them once you've hit a standard. For kids to learn this I'd teach overhead squats and deadlifts as gospel and then every now and again throw in an instructional on the full lift. Sort of like teaching guard recovery, show them guard and tell them to recover it.

It will really come down to the kid and what he/she enjoys.

Mickoo - the crossfit prescription is three days on, one day off. I sometimes feel too wrecked for the WOD or have something else on but that is the essential rest structure. In terms of traditional advice, much of it is irrelevant or untrue and is slowly being debunked. I keep citing the Crossfit Journal (everyone should subscribe), but they did a series of articles tearing apart traditional conceived notions of BMI, Bodyfat and VO2 max as indicators of fitness, very interesting stuff. Read the FAQs and some of the posts on the getting started forum. I can't recommend it enough.

Shane, The

Roper

I would agree with Shane there that the best sort of fitness for kids is playing the game (whatever that is). If, like in Colm's and my own club they're getting that huge variety of physical diversity that MMA training provides, I wouldn't be too quick to start letting conditioning impinge on my class time. After all, how many times do you see these kids per week? Twice or 3 times if you're lucky.

Supposing, however, I wanted to do a dedicated kids conditioning session, I would use the Crossfit model or something close to it. Why?
1) Its more fun than, uh oh, "traditional" models of strength training. Do 20 push ups, now do 20 more, then do some squats, okay we're done" or worse again "okay you misbehaved, do 20 push ups". It adds more variety and ergo more enjoyment
2) Its competitive. Like or no, and a lot of people don't like to admit this when it comes to kids, competitiveness breeds improvement. Last summer during a summer camp I started recording times for the warm up games we were doing. It got so every time they came in they were asking what time they had to beat. They got extra enjoyment, did the games and drills faster and with more intensity, and got out of it a sense of achievment. Competition rocks, even when its just beat your own time.
3) The variety involved in the workouts offers fitness across a broader range, which I think in an age where we value kids having a choice and a variety of things to choose from, can only be good for their future.

Colm_OReilly

Roper,

I checked out www.crossfitkids.com and it seems solid enough. More investigation is necessary but they've a cfk journal that I think I might subscribe to. They have workouts designed for each age/level so you step it up as you progress.

Aru!Aru!Aru!
Colm