Chances of Approval,

e0in

hi all im new to the whole gun licensing scene and i'm looking into getting my own shotgun. I'm wondering what are my chances of getting approved for a license on a Remington 870 or similiar, Im almost 20, a member of the Defence Forces and about to join a club. i would be intending to use it for target and clay pigeon shooting with a bit of game shooting also, Would i be wasting my time applying? from what ive read of the law on it and the procedures for the most part its at the discretion of the gardai so thats why im asking,
Any feedback will be much appreciated,

Trojan911

e0in wrote:

Would i be wasting my time applying?

Not at all.

e0in wrote:

from what ive read of the law on it and the procedures for the most part its at the discretion of the gardai so thats why im asking

You apply, if you fit the criteria you get a licence, if you don't then no licence.

Attend your local Garda Station and speak to the Firearms Licencing Officer. Bring your club membership & valid/current I.D. and a cheque for €25 (made payable to "The Superintendent") He/She will instruct you on the procedure and then you wait. Bear in mind if you are successful you will have to cough up more in july for the renewal period and that might be a different system then...

Hope that helps


TJ911...

bullets

My FO took Cash from me (Paid only After Licence was granted)
as long as you got the correct change.

~B

dimebag249

Hey e0in. I'm only a little older than you and got my licence for my first gun without any problems. Once they can tell you're sincere about it you shouldn't have any hassle. I got the Remington 870 too, great choice, very versatile, you won't regret it. I got the Express, if you do the same I suggest you get the synthetic as the laminate stocks are pretty poor. Best of luck with it anyway.

J.R.

Hi,
I used a Remington 870 left - handed for 23 years - great gun, no problems. Two points to consider are:
1. some clay-pigeon clubs frown upon pump action shotguns and may not permit their use.
2. To fire at two clays in succession one needs to be quite familiar and fast with the action of a pump action. There is a 'knack'. When mastered many U.S. shooters claim a pump action is quicker than a semi-auto. I don't know how familiar you are with the action but it can take some practice to master it.
If more info required on quick successive shots just ask.

Vegeta

how much is a new 870

baikal have a semi-auto which is meant to be very reliable and wont break the bank

Hezz700

The 870 might not be the best choice for clay busting but if your heart is set on a remy, take a look at the 11-87 semi auto, its an excellent tool:cool: . The SPS model is particularly nice to my mind. you can get extended mags which would be useful for practical shotgunning and the like.

Personnally i use a Beretta AL391 Black synt and the SPS is the only thing i could ever see replacing it.

Hezz

Umiq88

Whats your price range

For a semi imo theres only two to consider

Gas - Beretta AL931
Mechanical - Benelli Super 90

Have the super 90 and they're fantastic will take huge amounts of abuse and easy to clean theres very little to go wrong with them.

Hezz700

psittacosis wrote:

Have the super 90 and they're fantastic will take huge amounts of abuse and easy to clean theres very little to go wrong with them.

Nice piece alright:cool: what did yours cost if ya don't mind me askin?

Umiq88

1000 some guy bought it from the dealer for 1700 and was never able to get a license and i got bought it off him for that was pretty pleased about it.

Best semi i ever shot bar maybe my old double browning but i can strip it in the field without any tools which is a big bonus

Vegeta

yup i got a benelli super black eagle 2, class gun. It really is benelli or beretta if you want an all round semi for life

Clare gunner

If you like being kicked by a horse all day,go Benelli:D
If you like a gun that shoots just as good if not better and INMHO outlasts Benelli in the reliability dept, is easier to accessorise and get parts for stick with Remington:D

dimebag249

All due respect to all you guys, and ye're all no doubt more experienced and knowledgeable than me, but IGNORE THEM ALL E0IN!! Go for the Remmy, a pump is no disadvantage WHATSOEVER for clays or anything else, more reliable than any auto, more versatile, and less than half the price of most. Paid E550 for mine, can be had for less. There's a lot of snobbery around guns in this country, but some of us have small budgets, and my pump will shoot as good as any crazily priced Benelli or Beretta, even if I can't!!! Also Clare gunner makes a very good point about modifying and accessorising the 870.

Vegeta

dimebag249 wrote:

All due respect to all you guys, and ye're all no doubt more experienced and knowledgeable than me, but IGNORE THEM ALL E0IN!! Go for the Remmy, a pump is no disadvantage WHATSOEVER for clays or anything else, more reliable than any auto, more versatile, and less than half the price of most. Paid E550 for mine, can be had for less. There's a lot of snobbery around guns in this country, but some of us have small budgets, and my pump will shoot as good as any crazily priced Benelli or Beretta, even if I can't!!! Also Clare gunner makes a very good point about modifying and accessorising the 870.

If pumps were indeed better than semi-auto surely they'd be more popular though.

Clare gunner

Depends on which side of the pond you are on. In the US the pump next to the double barrel is the most pouplar seller in shotguns.
Here in Ireland we have a conflict of tradition,we are influenced strongly bu the UK shooting traditions,so some of us tend to frown on the "Confounded Yank contraptions."Yet us non hidebound folks go more for semi autos than pumps. I grew up shooting both,and I can safely say,when the chips are down,I would go the pump over a semi.
It is true,if you are good and practised with a pump ,you can shoot just as fast as a semi.Not to say the semis dont have their advantage,but I just find them a slight bit more finicky than a pump,which can make or ruin a shooting day.

Vegeta

Clare gunner wrote:

It is true,if you are good and practised with a pump ,you can shoot just as fast as a semi.Not to say the semis dont have their advantage,but I just find them a slight bit more finicky than a pump,which can make or ruin a shooting day.

I agree for equal money i.e buying a new pump for 600 euro and a semi for 600 euro, I might buy the pump because it will work everytime, the cheap semi may let you down with light loads

but if buying once for life and your budget is towards the higher end I cannot fault the beretta Xtremea2. Had one for 2 years and put in probably 3000 rounds if not more. Never once did I have a cycle failure. Not once. That is perfection. (yes I changed to a benelli but it is an experiment as the benelli fits like a glove and handles even better plus my brother still has his Xtremea2)

semi-auto=pull trigger + pull trigger + pull trigger

pump action = pull trigger + pump + pull trigger + pump etc

While this may be as fast as a semi it is not as simple. if reliable i think a semi auto is a better platform than the pump.

its not snobbery, if I was on a tighter budget a pump would be a realistic option but its hardly my fault I am young, save my money for my hobby, have nothing better to spend it on and buy quality semi-autos.

e0in

Aye i see where everyones coming from i must look into the alternatives I just assumed i'd get an 870 as ive always liked it and heard good things about it, i may go for it just down to cost i hadnt really intended on spending more than 1000, and even less if i could, lol pretty much as little as i could for a decent gun was my plan

Vegeta

e0in wrote:

lol pretty much as little as i could for a decent gun was my plan

Then get the 870, it is a great gun for the money and if you had your heart set on one all the better. Its nice to get information from differing opinions though, unless they wreck your head of course and just confuse.

If you are looking for a budget gun which is a 100% reliable get the 870. If you have more money to spend and want a slightly better gun then think about a beretta semi.

Dr Strange

Hi,

personally I don't shoot shotgun but I saw this little video on the Beretta Xtrema2 with low rcoil. It is a semi-automatic and quite impressive:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6750458630308006678&q=shotgun

Best,
Preusse

dimebag249

Vegeta wrote:

If pumps were indeed better than semi-auto surely they'd be more popular though.

The remington 870 is the most popular shotgun in the world. Ever. (Something like 8 million sold, I believe)

Vegeta wrote:

but if buying once for life and your budget is towards the higher end I cannot fault the beretta Xtremea2. .

I'd spend the money on 4 870's!!! Or at least one good pump, and spend the change on ten thousand rounds of ammo. Actually i don't even know how much the Beretta costs, but I'm sure it's enough for several good guns. Also sorry if these quotes don't work, I'm new to this and I'm just cuttin and pastin here. Here's a smiley .

Clare gunner

Or if you want to be really on a tight budget get a Mossberg 500 or better still the Mossberg 590[which is the milspec versionj].It has a round /life count of somthing like 800,000 +rounds.Which is close on the 870 Remmy,but somwhat cheaper,[and some say cruder,until they see the Maverick line,a cheaper version of Mossberg].It comes in 6 or 8 shot,and doesnt have as much accessories as Remmy.The only thing I dont like on them is the plastic foregrip,it doesnt fit right in my big hands.Yet the wooden foregrip fits me better.Mossberg makes the barrels for Remmy as well.

For a 1000 quid,you would get a Rem1100,3.5in mag,and a bit of custom work on the trigger,gas mech and a mag extn if you wanted it. or a spare barrel in the package.

If you want just ugly ,but totally reliable in a semi get a Saiga12. It is bascially a AK that has been inflated to handle 12ga ammo.Semi only ,with a 2,8 or 10 round mag.It will work everytime.
Dont get me wrong the Breatta are fine guns,but I feel somwhat "delicate" for really rough,ugly shooting.

Vegeta

dimebag249 wrote:

The remington 870 is the most popular shotgun in the world. Ever. (Something like 8 million sold, I believe)

Think its 6 or so the remington website says anyway, but I meant in Ireland anyway.

I'd spend the money on 4 870's!!! Or at least one good pump, and spend the change on ten thousand rounds of ammo. Actually i don't even know how much the Beretta costs, but I'm sure it's enough for several good guns. Also sorry if these quotes don't work, I'm new to this and I'm just cuttin and pastin here. Here's a smiley .

Why are you so quick to write off the semi-autos

I think I know wo you are (I think I work with your brother) so we should meet up and you can try my benelli

dimebag249

Clare gunner do you know of any place in Ireland that'd sell a good magazine extension for the 870? Maybe the Wilson (Scattergun tech.) or Choate? I've tried desperately to get one on-line, but no-one will ship here, and they end up going for ridiculous prices on e-bay? I bid on a factory one that ended up going for around 180 dollars! :eek:

Vegeta I'm just a Remington/pump fan-boy, and think that they're underrated in this country due to culture/tradition/snobbery (which I'm not accusing you of). Yeah I guessed your identity from the Logun air rifle and Benelli/Beretta guages. Also the gamertag.

Clare gunner

Try choate themselves. www.choate.com.Thats where I got mine from.No problem shipping 3 years ago.
Scattergun is nice but overpriced IMO. Other lot is www.firequest.com

180 dollars :eek: indeed!Was it made from titanium tungsten:D ?

Vegeta

dimebag249 wrote:

Vegeta I'm just a Remington/pump fan-boy, and think that they're underrated in this country due to culture/tradition/snobbery (which I'm not accusing you of). Yeah I guessed your identity from the Logun air rifle and Benelli/Beretta guages. Also the gamertag.

We should definitely meet up for a few clays. Was just talking to your bro and he's well up for it.

Went clay shooting myself saturday and after all my talk about expensive semi-auots my benelli let me down with the 28gram loads, sickened. What was worse, my brother had his beretta (the gun I had up until 2 weeks ago) and it again proved its dominance, flawless. Not one jam in 100 rounds.

I went home and got a few 30 and 35gram cartridges and fired a good few of them through the benelli. Hopefully over time it will take the 28grams aswell. My brother had the original super black eagle before and it took a few 100 rounds for that gun to settle

If it doesn't become more reliable then back to beretta for me.

But no I am not a snob of pumps. They do a job and do it very well but i prefer using semi-autos that does not mean i look down on pumps. So when asked which to get I'd say semi-auto due to personal preference.

dimebag249

Thanks a lot Clare gunner!! Yeah those Choate ones are no doubt as good as the Scatterguns. I saw another Scattergun one go for the better part of 200 bucks because it was a 'rare' ten round one.

Yeah Vegeta when I heard you got rid of your Beretta I was thinking WTF; if I had one of those it would be a case of the old 'From my cold dead hands'. When I read that the Benelli M4 doesn't work in Iraq, it put me off them. 'Military' guns aren't always the best way to go, but working well under seriously adverse conditions in a desert or jungle is a pretty good determinant of a firearms reliability. My clay trap gave up the ghost but if we get if fixed you'd be more than welcome to come over, there's always a few of us shooting at home at the weekend.

Vegeta

dimebag249 wrote:

Yeah Vegeta when I heard you got rid of your Beretta I was thinking WTF; if I had one of those it would be a case of the old 'From my cold dead hands'. When I read that the Benelli M4 doesn't work in Iraq, it put me off them. 'Military' guns aren't always the best way to go, but working well under seriously adverse conditions in a desert or jungle is a pretty good determinant of a firearms reliability. My clay trap gave up the ghost but if we get if fixed you'd be more than welcome to come over, there's always a few of us shooting at home at the weekend.

yeah the beretta was a sweet gun but the benelli fits me better so i said i'd give it a go. i'll keep it for the season and if it frees up over the year i'll keep it, if not back to Xtremea2 i go

I have a little trap anyway so when your bro is back from japan we'll go for few clays, should be a laugh anyway

Clare gunner

When I read that the Benelli M4 doesn't work in Iraq, it put me off them. 'Military' guns aren't always the best way to go, but working well under seriously adverse conditions in a desert or jungle is a pretty good determinant of a firearms reliability.

Just reading an article on this very problem.It is down to the "moon dust" micro fine dust that gets into everything out in Iraq and Afghanistan.You cannot use any lube whatsoever apart from cleaning with compressed air at least 6 times a day.Thats why Remmys and Mossbergs,or the Benelli pump/semi are very prized possesions out there.:D

veg,
If it is any consolation the Remmy 1100 can be persnickty with 28 gm load as well.Change to high brass loads,it sorted mine out .;)

Vegeta

Clare gunner wrote:

veg,
If it is any consolation the Remmy 1100 can be persnickty with 28 gm load as well.Change to high brass loads,it sorted mine out .;)

any brand recommendations?

i will definitely be trying that, thanks CG. I'd like to think when i shoot clays its my marksmanship not the 36 gram loads in the air

recipio

If you are determined to get a semi-auto that's fine but be aware most clay clubs will frown on one . It's a safety issue - a broken gun gives instant assurance that the gun is safe.

Clare gunner

Try Remmy high brass or Winchester if still made or got.Failing that the old standby Eley.
Re the semiauto saftey thing;you can get a safe breech flag.A Red flag on a 12ga plastic plug,insert after shooting,or the elcheapo method; when you are carrying the semi ,lock back the slide and keep your hand on the battery lever. Clay clubs frowning them is nowadays just plain old snobbery!!! They are no more or less safer or sporting than a O/U:mad:

Sparks

I dunno CG. Doesn't sound like snobbery to me. I don't have as much experience with shotguns as I do with rifles, but I've used semi's, pumps and O/Us and the O/U was the easiest to tell whether or not it was able to fire - it was just "is the gun broken open?" rather than "Is there a little red thing dangling down over there".

It's the same with .22's - with a bolt action you just see if the bolt's open, but with a 10/22, it's not so immediately visible.

That's not to say that a shotgun with a breech flag is less safe, just that it's more obvious to everyone if it's broken.

Just my €0.02...

Vegeta

another cheap method is just putting an oily rag in there with loads of it visible to anyone walking past

Vegeta

Sparks wrote:

I dunno CG. Doesn't sound like snobbery to me.

in the clay shooting scene it does exist, i don't know what excuse they use (safety, sporting) but it does exist

Sparks

Vegeta wrote:

in the clay shooting scene it does exist, i don't know what excuse they use (safety, sporting) but it does exist

Oh, I'm not saying snobbery doesn't exist Veg, it's rife throughout shooting from every group towards every other group, it's just that what CG was describing actually sounded like a legitimate position to be taking with rational reasoning behind it.

Which isn't to say that such positions have been taken for reasons other than the rational ones throughout our sport, but that's just life.

Clare gunner

Agree with you Sparks on checkablity of saftey on the DB front.But a pump can be checked just as quick,by seeing if the slide is fully racked back,as then the firing mech and hammer is totally jammed by the battery.Another reason the old exposed hammer Winchester 1897 was so pouplar you could see wether the hammer was in a cocked or safe position at a glance. Semis ,so long as the chamber is empty,it is safe,as all it will do is go into battery on an empty chamber.The chamber flags BTW are pretty big like 20ins,sort of like the Remove before Takeoff flags on fighter jets.

Ultimately on this saftey issue.Do we have any stats local or international that shows the semi/pump Vs DBBL being involved in more shooting accidents?I mean both types of guns are used in practical shotgun shooting,and that is a more dynamic sport than claybusting ever will be,and yet we should hear of accidents even then despite the rigiours training involved.
I still belive it is the snobbery aspect with the belif in the clay and hunting world of the unfair and dubious advantage in clay shooting of the 3rd shot.
In the game field a 3rd shot is an advantage if you have an injured bird that you need to finish off quickly.This love /hate of the semi has been knocking around for a century now,and proably will for another 100 years.