points for speeding???

famagusta

i was driving down the M8 yestarday doing around 135km/hr. there was a really low sun in my eyes so i didnt see a garda car and guy with speed camera till late. i immediately slowed down but it was probably too late. there was at least 4 or 5 other cars speeding too.
anyway my question is whats the story, do they just take your number if you were speeding? and send the points in the post? or do you think i got away with it?

thanks.

copacetic

you prob got away with it, if it was just a gun they need to pull you in to give you the points and show you the speed afaik. It is only with cameras that you get it in the post..

famagusta

oh right, thanks. i wonder why they didn't decide to chase anyone though, maybe they were just waiting for someone doing rediculious speed

bazz26

Really depends which of the speeding cars they had the gun pointed at too to get a reading. It might have been one of the other cars and you got lucky.

antodeco

Plus 135Kph - 10% from speedometer = 121.5Kph. Thats more that likely what you were clocked at, so I doubt anything will happen.

Do gardai/garda cars have a camera in them, or is it only Gatso's that can get you?

irlrobins

I think the Guards have mobile camera guns as well. So they don't always need to pull you in.

antodeco

irlrobins wrote:

I think the Guards have mobile camera guns as well. So they don't always need to pull you in.

Ah F#ck!!!

copacetic

irlrobins wrote:

I think the Guards have mobile camera guns as well. So they don't always need to pull you in.

I'm pretty sure the only mobile ones are the vans, the need to setup the cameras. You can't just tack a camera on to a radar gun...

antodeco

daveym wrote:

I'm pretty sure the only mobile ones are the vans, the need to setup the cameras. You can't just tack a camera on to a radar gun...

True, it has to pass legislation first! Plus, bluetac = higher taxes!!

Lex Luthor

antodeco wrote:

Plus 135Kph - 10% from speedometer = 121.5Kph. Thats more that likely what you were clocked at, so I doubt anything will happen.

never heard so much rubbish in my life

135kph = 135kph

Its over the limit so if you were clocked by a camera, then the OP was done and will get fined plus points

antodeco

Lex Luthor wrote:

never heard so much rubbish in my life

135kph = 135kph

Its over the limit so if you were clocked by a camera, then the OP was done and will get fined plus points

Most speedometers have a 10% discrepancy at high speeds.
Also, radar guns have a 10% discrepancy also (hence the calibration tests required every 6 months)

bo-bo

the garda who had the speed gun prob just used discretion - most do

Alun

Lex Luthor wrote:

never heard so much rubbish in my life

135kph = 135kph

Never heard so much rubbish in my life. Have you got a 100% accurate calibrated speedo? No, I didn't think so. And don't bring up the old "but it's digital!" argument, please.

Oh, and its km/h not kph

Lex Luthor

"I'm sorry Garda but my speedo was reading 132km/h so you can't nick me"

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

timmywex

the gardai have to pull you over there and then if using the gun, the only way you get a letter in the post is if it is a van on top of a bridge or something, otherwise they must persuit, and there are ways and means of getting off the letter in the post if you know how to

I.S.T.

They usually only pull people who are doing a lot more than the speed limit. I was talking to a guard and he said when doing speed checks in a 80kmh zone for example, they will only pull cars doing more than 100.

timmywex

yeh, they generally only go for the people who really break the limit cause they pose the biggest risk

11.3 SECONDS

timmywex wrote:

yeh, they generally only go for the people who really break the limit cause they pose the biggest risk

I understand your point but you must also be having a laugh.

Spend some time watching the guardians of the peace in action on the N11 / Stilorgan Road around UCD.

Yes, if you are over the limit you are over the limit and there is no argument about it. However, if you look at most of what they stop on the N11 it looks more like an exercise in playing the numbers game and creating the impression that something useful is being done as distinct from nailing the dangerous bastards who really need to be sorted out.....

_Kaiser_

There was one camped out on the N7 yesterday evening too (arm out the window with the speedgun and camped out at the bottom of the hill on one of the widest, better surfaced sections of course!! :rolleyes:), but whilst I wasn't speeding anyway, a car in the oncoming lane warned me anyway with the old flash of the headlights, which I of course did as well for other cars after passing the sneaky fecker.

Nice to see there's still some courtesy out there though!

maidhc

I got stopped for driving slowly last night.

I stopped outside a pub on the way home from the cinema, and got a bag of chips from the chipper next door. Ate them; got back into the car, and drove off. Up the street I was looking at a house for sale and was doing about 15mph max. I suspect I also drove at the wrong side of the road for a bit as there were a few craters of potholes there.

A guy in an unmarked forrester came up pretty quickly behind me, and I indicated to the left to let him pass. He pulled up along side me and asked if was OK, and that my driving was erratic. I told him I was fine, and I was just ambling home, and offered to be brethalysed.

He said i sounded sober, and drove off a bit disgusted without even getting out of the car.

Lex Luthor

timmywex wrote:

yeh, they generally only go for the people who really break the limit cause they pose the biggest risk

and if you believe that $hite, then you're a bigger mug.
obviously the garda that said that to you is a lazy git, but that philosophy does not apply to all of them.

Go ahead and see if your 10% limit will get you off time & time again. Its an urban myth and sooner or later you will get caught speeding even if you think you are entitled to go 9% faster than the limit.

The OP is having a laugh with the excuse that the only reason they were caught is that the sun was in their eyes and they didn't see the garda car...well tough. It wasn't hindering your vision to allow you to see that you were doing 15km/h over the speed limit

faceman

antodeco wrote:

Most speedometers have a 10% discrepancy at high speeds.

Its not 10%. All speedos must show your speed a few mph (approx 3mph ususally) more than you are actually doing. I cant remember where i read it, will have a look for it.

faceman

Eh, i just found myself to be wrong too actually!

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=1265&vf=1

Alun

faceman wrote:

Its not 10%. All speedos must show your speed a few mph (approx 3mph ususally) more than you are actually doing. I cant remember where i read it, will have a look for it.

The regulations are all about the maximum allowable difference. There's an EU regulation EEC 75/443 that stipulates that ...

a) the indicated speed must never be less than the actual speed

and

b) the difference must be less than or equal to (true speed / 10) + 4 km/h.

So, for a true speed of 120 km/h the difference between indicated and true speed must be less than or equal to 16 km/h, i.e an indicated 136 km/h, or at 50 km/h the maximum allowable difference would be 9 km/h.

However, all manufacturers add in some level of percentage over-reading so as not to fall foul of condition a). On my car, a Ford, I've determined that to be about 5%, but others appear to be higher than that. In any case, a long as it doesn't fall outside the bounds set by condition b) they're OK, and fully legal.

Seth Brundle

the displayed and actual speed differences are maximums - not definites.
To suggest that its possible to drive up to a displayed 135km/h and yet still be within the limits is misleading.

As for driving over the limit with the sun in your eyes - well that is just pure stupid! If you cannot see all 'hazards' in front of you then you are driving too fast.

JHMEG

And tyre pressures and wheels sizes also impact on speedo accuracy.

My current car's speedo says 120km/h when I am doing 110, but is more accurate at lower speeds.

One of my previous cars was out by 5mph at all speeds.

Both with stock wheels and properly inflated tyres.

The only yokes that can have cameras are vans and boxes on poles. Lads on the side of the road don't have cameras... they take off after you and pull you in.

Seth Brundle

Incorrect JHMEG - there *are* a few 'side of the road' units out there that have cameras! From my source, they tend to be located in the Louth and Laois areas but do move around.

JHMEG

kbannon wrote:

Incorrect JHMEG - there *are* a few 'side of the road' units out there that have cameras! From my source, they tend to be located in the Louth and Laois areas but do move around.

Fair enough.. I'm talking about personal experiences and the experiences of people I know.

DonJose

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Nice to see there's still some courtesy out there though!

Courtesy my ass, speeders are breaking the law, no if's or but's about it. Would you show to the same courtesy after passing through a drink/drive checkpoint!!!

BostonB

Seemingly some guards will rigidly enforce the limit depending on their mood. So if you are over the limit at all, you're running the odds of which guard you get. Used to be if you were a few mph over they'd let you away with it, as everyone even the most law abiding will make a mistake at some point. These days they seem to making a point of applying the law more rigidly.

What I don't get is how the Guards can't get the people who race through estates and such at 2 and 3 times the limit and do so pretty much everywhere so consistently that everyone in the area knows the car.

Stark

JHMEG wrote:

The only yokes that can have cameras are vans and boxes on poles. Lads on the side of the road don't have cameras... they take off after you and pull you in.

I was driving down the N3 towards the Blanchardstown roundabout the other day and there were gardaí stationed on a bridge overlooking the road. One of the them was writing stuff on a notepad while the other was flashing traffic with a camera. Not sure if I was one of the ones they flashed; I was doing 55mph in the 50mph section that the time

BostonB

Stark wrote:

I was driving down the N3 towards the Blanchardstown roundabout the other day and there were gardaí stationed on a bridge overlooking the road. One of the them was writing stuff on a notepad while the other was flashing traffic with a camera. Not sure if I was one of the ones they flashed; I was doing 55mph in the 50mph section that the time

Normally moves at 5mph along that stretch.

Hobbes

They don't have to stop you on the road to charge you. Have a look through the forum you will find posts of people getting the fine in the mail for speeding where they were never stopped.

Also the 10% thing, depends really on the gun. More recent guns are way more accurate then the analog radar guns.

And I hope they charge you. If you were speeding and your sun was in your eyes so you couldn't see ahead you were a bigger danger to others.

Lex Luthor

kbannon wrote:

the displayed and actual speed differences are maximums - not definites.
To suggest that its possible to drive up to a displayed 135km/h and yet still be within the limits is misleading.

As for driving over the limit with the sun in your eyes - well that is just pure stupid! If you cannot see all 'hazards' in front of you then you are driving too fast.

DonJose wrote:

Courtesy my ass, speeders are breaking the law, no if's or but's about it. Would you show to the same courtesy after passing through a drink/drive checkpoint!!!

and so speak a few voices of reason

rebel.ranter

I have checked the Ford Focus in work speedo with a GPS and at 100 km/h it is reading approx. 5km/h faster than the GPS reading. The GPS is fairly accurate for speed measurement, in fact it's more accurate for this than giving your exact location. Did the same with a Toyota Land Cruiser found similar results. Tried an 19996 AMG C36 & a few BMWs and they seem to be very accurate between 30mph & 65mph, the accuracy is a bit off outside this range.
I agree that it is irresponsible to drive into the blinding sun at excessive speed, you might as well drive with your eyes closed. People need to remember that a speed limit is not a target, it's a limit. The limit is really only valid when the conditions allow as well. So heavy rain, a bright sunset, ice & snow will all override that limit IMO.
I remember seeing a RTE news story about the Gardai getting mobile cameras last year or the year before. All the gear including printers etc. were fitted in the back of a Ford Mondeo Estate. The camera came out on a tripod. Not sure how widespread they were going to be used or if they went ahead with the rollout of these.

edit: just to add I have been guilty of speeding in the past, I got 3 tickets pre-penalty points & now I always try to stay within the limits especially in the lower speed zones. Hence the GPS tests etc. I would have to agree with the flashing of other motorists for indicating the revenure generating speed traps.

_Kaiser_

DonJose wrote:

Courtesy my ass, speeders are breaking the law, no if's or but's about it. Would you show to the same courtesy after passing through a drink/drive checkpoint!!!

Well drink/driving is a different kettle of fish (no excuses there!), but yes, if I pass a cop that's parked up in a purely revenue-oriented spot (wide, straight road, lots of visibility, 100km/h zone etc) with his speedgun, then I will "warn" oncoming traffic as the trap has nothing to do with safety, and everything to do with easy-money and stats generation that'll look good in the upcoming election!

Have to say the whole holier-than-thou attitude that certain posters here (automatically) come out with when certain topics are discussed wears a bit thin... no doubt you've NEVER found yourself a few kph over the limit eh? :rolleyes:

rebel.ranter wrote:

I have checked the Ford Focus in work speedo with a GPS and at 100 km/h it is reading approx. 5km/h faster than the GPS reading.

Ditto my Passat. When driving at an indicated 120km/h, the GPS reads about 112 or so. The variance really seems to start at about 80kph - below that it's fairly accurate (although, while 60km/h is dead on, 50km/h indicated seems to be about 3/4km/h over).

Lex Luthor

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Have to say the whole holier-than-thou attitude that certain posters here (automatically) come out with when certain topics are discussed wears a bit thin... no doubt you've NEVER found yourself a few kph over the limit eh? :rolleyes:

we've all done it, but it doesn't mean its right. I've been caught doing a few mph over the limit and regardless of what excuse I gave, when it boils down to it, I was over the limit.

stipey

rebel.ranter wrote:

Tried an 19996 AMG C36

What are the cars of the future like?

What do they run on?

... sorry.... couldn't resist

jameshayes

The worst is on the M50 southbound, it's 120Kmh(before the roadwork’s started) until you get to Firhouse and it drops to 100kmh!!! The road gets better right at the spot where the speed limit drops!

cpoh1

Lex Luthor wrote:

we've all done it, but it doesn't mean its right. I've been caught doing a few mph over the limit and regardless of what excuse I gave, when it boils down to it, I was over the limit.

The phrase "people in glass houses shouldnt throw stones" springs to mind here :rolleyes:

As an aside my car reads around 10% over on my speedo too, my gsm reads 119kph at a speedo reading of 133kph. So to the OP there's a fair chance you were barely over the limit and the gardai are usually as reasonable bunch and wouldnt do you unless you were 10kph over.

Rew

AFAIK the cameras on tripods can photo you the hand held guns they have to pull you over. Makes sense as there is no way you would get the tripod down and in to the car in any sort of resoanable time.

I met a guy with a tripod one on the back road between Confee and Maynooth last week but I was well under (i think). Ill check with somone in traffic to clarify anyway.

My speedo also reads over what im actually doing by 5kmph or so.

Lex Luthor

cpoh1 wrote:

The phrase "people in glass houses shouldnt throw stones" springs to mind here :rolleyes:

I'm not throwing stones, I'm simply pointing out that if your speedo states you are over the limit, then you must be. Even the OP has admitted to that.

If people want to speed, then they take the risk of getting caught, I've done it and been caught but never used the excuse that I thaught I was ok because maybe my speedo might be reading 10% faster than I was travelling.

Whoever suggested that you would be ok to go 10% over the limit, I'd like to know if they ever got caught speeding and tried on that excuse with the garda in question? Can't see if they got very far

Alun

Lex Luthor wrote:

I'm simply pointing out that if your speedo states you are over the limit, then you must be.

Have you actually been following the rest of the thread at all? Speedos are not accurate and all of them deliberately overread .. FACT. Therefore your statement *may* not always be correct depending on how much over the limit your speedo is reading. Understand now?

BrianD3

Rew wrote:

AFAIK the cameras on tripods can photo you the hand held guns they have to pull you over. Makes sense as there is no way you would get the tripod down and in to the car in any sort of resoanable time.

The vast majority of tripod mounted laser guns don't have cameras and the guns themselves are the same as the handheld ones. It may be the case that the Gardai don't have any tripod mounted laser guns + cameras.

However as kbannon says there may be manned speed traps in the Louth/Meath division that can take a picture. I believe this equipment is pretty bulky and tends to be used on motorway overbridges looking down on the traffic below. In which case it may as well be a covert trap because most driver will not spot it anyway and will just get a letter in the post if caught.

edit: there are a few Ford Galaxy Garda cars about. I haven't gotten a close look at these but I thought I saw some fairly bulky equipment in the back of one. It's possible that these have recording equipment meaning that speeders don't have to be pulled over at the time of the offence.

Hobbes

Kaiser2000 wrote:

no doubt you've NEVER found yourself a few kph over the limit eh? :rolleyes:

Not for more then 1-2 seconds and then its normally it's under 5kph before I bring it back down. We can compare points if you want. I have none, never been stopped except at Tax checkpoints. I am not a perfect driver but I keep it well within the limit so if I do fuk up I don't end up killing someone.

But I see daily fricken idiots on the road. I've seen a motorcycle get creamed by a van that didn't indicate while the bike was speeding. I've seen numerous crashes. Not as bad as a year ago but still around 1 a week.

So no sorry. No sympathy from me for someone who might get caught who was intentionally over the limit.

Lex Luthor

Alun wrote:

Have you actually been following the rest of the thread at all?

no

FX Meister

Lex Luthor wrote:

never heard so much rubbish in my life

135kph = 135kph

So if my speedo breaks and it gets stuck on 80kph at all times then when I pull in and stop I'm still doing 80kph by your logic.:rolleyes: Most speedos are out. FACT. Drive your car and keep it at 60kph for a full km, mulitply the time taken to drive the km by 60 and you should get 60. FACT. You won't. FACT
So are you now going to try telling us that your odometer is wrong but your speedo is still bang on? :rolleyes:

_Kaiser_

Hobbes wrote:

Not for more then 1-2 seconds and then its normally it's under 5kph before I bring it back down. We can compare points if you want. I have none, never been stopped except at Tax checkpoints.

Me neither, nor do I habitually speed as you seem to be inferring, however I do have a big problem with cops camped out on motorways, or at the bottom of hills on national routes, where the purpose is obviously to appear to be doing something (and generate revenue and stats), without actually tackling the real problems/dangers on the roads.

For example: if they were really serious about preventing drink driving, all they have to do is sit outside the pubs at closing time (particularly country pubs), and catch the idiots who stumble out to the car? Course not.. too many politicians have interests in/own pubs you see.

Or how about putting speed traps on secondary routes (or where the fatal accidents ACTUALLY happen?) Nope, and why (and you have to appreciate the irony really) - because they reckon it's too DANGEROUS to have cars/cops camped out on these roads. :rolleyes:

I am not a perfect driver but I keep it well within the limit so if I do fuk up I don't end up killing someone.

It's not speed that kills.. it's INAPPROPRIATE speed. I know stretches of road that are posted as 80 or 100 km/h for example, but doing even 60 would be crazy, so going by the posted limit just isn't enough I'm afraid.

I'm not saying we should have a German Autobahn style system with no upper limits, but there is a lot of new road out there that have stupidly low limits, while at the same time (as I've just mentioned), there's a lot of poor roads out there with limits that are posted way too high.

So no sorry. No sympathy from me for someone who might get caught who was intentionally over the limit.

I agree if they are something like 20km/h+ over, or doing 80km/h through towns etc (basically blatantly flouting the law regardless of the posted limit or road/weather conditions), but cops doing people for being a few km/h over, or people coming on here with an aforementioned holier-than-thou attitude is a completely different story.

At the end of the day, a large part of the problem is the varying quality of enforcement, which lead to the "it depends what cop you get" scenarios, as well as the varying quality of Gardai themselves (both from an attitude/ego and training perspective - it seems Templemore doesn't create em all equally).

Another big issue is the Irish "ah sure it'll be grand" attitude, and the fact that all to often it's about being SEEN to do something, rather than ACTUALLY doing anything (or perhaps more accurately, doing anything CONSTRUCTIVE and with "joined up thinking" - to quote one of the more recent media/political phrases).

A whole shake up of the road management system is needed from design and implementation, to ongoing maintenance, to the setting of limits appropriate to the conditions, and ultimately to the enforcement aspects of the situation. Until all that happens though, I can't see the situation improving (and it's likely to get worse with the forthcoming privately-operated speed cameras, but we shall see).

Anyway.. I've rambled on long enough so I'll be quiet now!

alfie

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Or how about putting speed traps on secondary routes (or where the fatal accidents ACTUALLY happen?) Nope, and why (and you have to appreciate the irony really) - because they reckon it's too DANGEROUS to have cars/cops camped out on these roads. :rolleyes:

A Garda and fireman were killed on one of these roads. Is that not justification enough not to be out doing speed traps on these roads??

Seth Brundle

Alun wrote:

Speedos are not accurate and all of them deliberately overread .. FACT. Therefore your statement *may* not always be correct depending on how much over the limit your speedo is reading. Understand now?

You are assuming that all speedos definitley over-read. You cannot make that assumption! Some will be exact! If you assume that speedos will always over-read then eventually you will end up driving a car at what you presume to be within the limit but be in fact be well over the limit.

FX Meister wrote:

Most speedos are out. FACT. Drive your car and keep it at 60kph for a full km, mulitply the time taken to drive the km by 60 and you should get 60. FACT. You won't. FACT
So are you now going to try telling us that your odometer is wrong but your speedo is still bang on? :rolleyes:

The word in bold is the weak point of your argument!
edit: how can you exactly tell that you have travelled 1km?

_Kaiser_

alfie wrote:

A Garda and fireman were killed on one of these roads. Is that not justification enough not to be out doing speed traps on these roads??

Actually I'd argue that if anything, it's MORE of a reason to be policing these roads.