Greatest Irish Fighter

ROCKMAN

Just finished that great thread Top 5 Fighters

So i was thinking who were the greatest Irish Fighters of all time???

To make the thread lets have answers in both Professional and Amateur game..


PS I am not on Boards long so if this thread was done before i apologise in advance

buck65

No. 1 Barry Mc Guigan
No. 2 Steve Collins
No. 3 Wayne Mc Cullough
No. 4 Mick Dowling


John Duddy and Bernard Dunne will hopefully fulfill their promise.
Honourable mention Eamon Magee - who could forget his fight with Ricky Hatton, Mike Mc Tigue also.

megadodge

Off the top of my head, Jimmy McClarnin, Dave 'Boy' McAuley, Rinty Monaghan and (amateur) Michael Carruth (Olympic gold, World bronze) Fred Tiedt (Olympic silver, but was robbed) would have to be in the mix with all of the above. There's a few others but I don't have the time at the moment.

cowzerp

barry mcguigan
steve collins
ray close
sam storey
bernard dunne-amateur record awsome

walshb

There's only one candidate in the amateurs and that's Carruth.
Olympic champion, it does not get better than that.
He also won 7 or so Senior titles in 3 different weights.

The pro's are tougher to select, but Barry is my pick

dlofnep

McGuigan
Collins
MCullough

kanibus

Tommy Loughran:D

Best Irish American anyway!

Big Ears

One of our forgotten greats is Nonpareil Jack Dempsey(the man who the Manassa Mauler derived his name from) . He held a claim to the World Lightweight title and was dominant Middleweight champion of the World in the 1880's . He also unsuccesfully challenged for the World Welterweight title . Nonpareil unlike Loughran actually was Irish(born in Kildare) and died from TB at the young age of 32 . Some sources claim his original winning of the World Middleweight title was actually for the World Welterweight title(both boxers did make Welterweight) . Records from the time are quite sketchy and you won't see anywhere near his complete record on boxrec or other places .
Many considered him p4p #1 of his time .

Other Irish fighters that deserve a mention Peter Maher(Galway) and Paddy Ryan(Thurles) were heavyweight champions of the world . Neither were great and both fought in a time when a certain amount of wrestling was allowed . Both were destroyed easily when they met the true top class fighters(Bob Fitzsimmons and John.L.Sullivan) .
Tom Sharkey also was heavyweight champ , although of much better quality . However the way he won the title is infamous and undeserved . Bob Fitzsimmons knocked him out but referee Wyatt Earp ruled it an illegal blow and awarded the fight to Sharkey(as Earp had a vested interest on the bout) Fitzsimmons and his corner men were livid with Earp and were furiously protesting with him till he pulled a pistol on them ! . Due to the controversial nature of the bout and the return of undefeated champ James J Corbett , Fitzsimmons and Corbett fought for the title and Sharkey could not defend it . Sharkey was from Dundalk .

Mike McTigue(Clare) was a very good Light Heavyweight champ and defended against Loughran twice .

George Gardiner(Clare)was Light-heavyweight champ and a contender at Middleweight .

Spike Sullivan was World Lightweight and Light-Welterweight champion .

Jimmy Gardiner(Clare) held a claim to the World Welterweight title .

Jack McAuliffe(Cork) was a great Lightweight champion and retired undefeated .

Dave Sullivan(Cork) World featherweight champion .

Johnny Caldwell(Belfast) , World and European Bantamweight champ , beaten by the legendary Eder Jofre .

Ike 'Spider' Weir(Bangor) World Featherweight champion .

As you can seewe have a proud tradition of champions , but most of them seemd to fade away after 1905 and they have been few and far between since the 1930's . Even Irish Americans don't have the same influence anymore .

I have left out irish champions already mentioned aswell as some of the Irish champions from north of the border as I know less about them .

dlofnep

big ears, you're a walking encylopedia. lol

henryb

Mike tysons dad was irish, an irish construction worker ,
his surname was kirkpatrick. Its something Tyson never
cared to talk about, believe it or not. He went under his
mothers maiden name. If ya think about the names
Michael Gerald, there about as irish as ya can get.:D
Also muhamad Ali 's grandad was from clare.
Does that count.???
I suppose if they were footballers it would.:D

kanibus

Even if Tyson was 1/2 Irish he would still not be the greatest irish fighter!

henryb

kanibus wrote:

Even if Tyson was 1/2 Irish he would still not be the greatest irish fighter!

And which irish fighters would you rate ahead of him?

cowzerp

Exactly what i was thinking!
Maybe mcbride, he beat tyson!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

kanibus

henryb wrote:

And which irish fighters would you rate ahead of him?

Tommy Loughran

nacho libre

I was going to say James Braddock but Tommy Loughran beat him;).

That recent film about Braddock is excellent.

henryb

kanibus wrote:

Tommy Loughran

loughran was born in the states and anyway his only real
succes was at light heavy.
Tyson at his peak would in my opinion would have destroyed
him. No question!

henryb

nacho libre wrote:

I was going to say James Braddock but Tommy Loughran beat him;).

That recent film about Braddock is excellent.

bradock could hardly cut it at light heavyweight and beat a poor
max baer to become heavyweight champ, lost half as many
fights as he won ,so could you please explain how you
think he could have lived with tyson at his best
And correct me if im wrong, but wasnt he born in the states as well?

nacho libre

henryb wrote:

bradock could hardly cut it at light heavyweight and beat a poor
max baer to become heavyweight champ, lost half as many
fights as he won ,so could you please explain how you
think he could have lived with tyson at his best
And correct me if im wrong, but wasnt he born in the states as well?

yes i'm aware he was born in the states and the fact Tyson would have knocked him out. I was posting it in jest really. The best irish boxer ever for me is Barry Mc Guigan.

henryb

nacho libre wrote:

yes i'm aware he was born in the states and the fact Tyson would have knocked him out. I was posting in it jest really. The best irish boxer ever for me is Barry Mc Guigan.

Sorry mate, i get a bit defensive when it comes to tyson :rolleyes:

Big Ears

Just remembered one of the champions I left out , Eamon Loughran , WBO Welterweight champ from 1993-1996 .

henryb

Dont know an awful lot about Rinty Monagan myself,
but im surprised he hasnt got a mention.
Born in belfast and was undisputed flyweight champ
in 1949!

Big Ears

henryb wrote:

Dont know an awful lot about Rinty Monagan myself,
but im surprised he hasnt got a mention.
Born in belfast and was undisputed flyweight champ
in 1949!

Rinty got a mention in the third post , that's why I left him out . He used to sing 'when Irish eyes are smiling' after his victories and from what ive heard he was a great fighter . Probably top 5 all-time greatest Irish fighter(genuine Irish no Irish Americans that is) or at least top 10 .

kanibus

henryb wrote:

loughran was born in the states and anyway his only real
succes was at light heavy.
Tyson at his peak would in my opinion would have destroyed
him. No question!

Yeah and prime 4 prime Loughran>Tyson
Im not talkin about Loughran vs Tyson at Heavyweight you ****ing idiot:mad: Im talking all time rankings..how come you never said that when peole were sayin McGuigan is the greatest Irish fighter??

because im sure "Tyson at his peak would in my opinion would have destroyed
him. No question!":p

ROCKMAN

My thread is all about opinions, For me McGuigan and Collins have been the greatest Irish Pro's for the last thirty years,
The old time fighters, the likes of Rinty Monagen, Paddy Ryan , Jack McAuliffe etc their records/ achievements speak for themselves.
But I am making my decision on the fighters I have actually seen.

As for the Amateurs Carruth, Bernard Dunne and Neil Gough are the top three. I know Gough may surprise a few but is record and time in the game at all levels up to senior make him a worthy candidate.

Ps..
Big Ears WOW I bow and applaud your knowledge.:D

henryb

kanibus wrote:

Yeah and prime 4 prime Loughran>Tyson
Im not talkin about Loughran vs Tyson at Heavyweight you ****ing idiot:mad: Im talking all time rankings..how come you never said that when peole were sayin McGuigan is the greatest Irish fighter??

because im sure "Tyson at his peak would in my opinion would have destroyed
him. No question!":p

so could ya please tell me why you would "rank" loughran higher
than tyson in ANY division?
The reason i didnt mention mcguigan or any other non heavyweight
is for obvious reasons!!!
If you look your facts up properly you'll see loughran
once fought for the heavyweight title.
Any way were all entitled to our opinion but i think the
name calling is a bit out of order to be honest

henryb

Just thought of another one you could maybe add to
the list, Charlie nash from Derry!
Represented his country in the 72 olympics, but
was beaten by the eventual winner.
He went on to become the european lightweight champion
and went on to fight jim watt for the world title,
i think around 1980 or there abouts, because i remember
watching it with my dad. Watt beat him and was no mean
boxer himself.
Nash might not go down as the greatest irish fighter but
i just thought he deserved a mention, and also i know he's heavily
involved in the amateur game up in Derry!

hoooooooot

mcguigan for me

sligobhoy67

1. Vinny Feeney

nah - really heres my latest top ten (well I posted it on irish-boxing.com about last August but little has changed!). To be honest its not a great top 10 - Eamonn Magee is average, I've taken Wayne Mc out as I wouldnt like to see him fight again, McBride hasnt capitalised on a good win over a finished Tyson, Corcoran showed a lack of power in his last fight, Magee was totally jaded in his last fight and O'Hara will never even win a Euro belt never mind a true world title IMO

My top 10 is


1..John Duddy
2.Bernard Dunne
3. Matthew Macklin
4.Damaen Kelly
5.Neil Sinclair
6.James Moore
7.Brian Magee
8.Kevin McBride
9.Andy Lee
10.Eamon Magee


I would like to have Jim Rock on the list as he is very solid domestically, Michael Gomez/Armstrongs head is gone totally, I think I am right forgetting about the likeable Clancy brother who are based in Boston unless some of our Mass. posters know better, McCloskey is not ready yet, none of the 3 Hyland brothers are ready to be on the list, Andy Murray is close but doesnt make the list either but will do at some stage and fan favourite Robbie Murray deserves a mention but cant get on the list due to inactivity.

Big Ears

Damaen Kelly is retired now , shame really . He was brutally robbed against the Italian Simeone Maludrottu for the European title(in N.Ireland :eek: ) having thoroughly outboxed him and in the rematch he was doing okay until getting caught in the third and was stopped .

What really affected Kelly in his career was the lack of a S.Flyweight division in Europe , once he outgrew Flyweight he had to move on to Bantamweight . Although he won the IBO S.Flyweight crown off Jason Booth Sky announced soon afterwards that they would only accept genuine world title fights when it involves a 'world title' so this put to bed any hopes Kelly had of fighting at S.Flyweight . Which is a shame really as if he was to come back to boxing(which he obviously won't) he could still make S.Flyweight fine and he was simply too small to ever really be a Bantamweight .

walshb

Big Ears wrote:

Damaen Kelly is retired now , shame really . He was brutally robbed against the Italian Simeone Maludrottu for the European title(in N.Ireland :eek: ) having thoroughly outboxed him and in the rematch he was doing okay until getting caught in the third and was stopped .

What really affected Kelly in his career was the lack of a S.Flyweight division in Europe , once he outgrew Flyweight he had to move on to Bantamweight . Although he won the IBO S.Flyweight crown off Jason Booth Sky announced soon afterwards that they would only accept genuine world title fights when it involves a 'world title' so this put to bed any hopes Kelly had of fighting at S.Flyweight . Which is a shame really as if he was to come back to boxing(which he obviously won't) he could still make S.Flyweight fine and he was simply too small to ever really be a Bantamweight .

I don't think he was too small. He was 5 feet6/7 which is perfect for Bantam. He just did not hit near hard enough in the pro's to be a real threat

Big Ears

walshb wrote:

I don't think he was too small. He was 5 feet6/7 which is perfect for Bantam. He just did not hit near hard enough in the pro's to be a real threat

Kelly was 5'3 1/2 - 5'4 , But yes you are correct that he didn't hit anywhere near hard enough to be a real threat .