What would you do in this situation?

slipss

Ok well I was reading the thread about piercing babies ears there and it got me thinking about something that happened there three weeks ago. I was in supervalue and walking up and down the isles looking for a jar of coffee and there was this woman about 30 with a baby in a pram. The girl was about a year old or something and she was screaming crying, so I was looking over and I seen the kid pull a pink ribbon/bobbin thing out of her hair, and then she stopped crying. So the woman turned around and twisted the girls hair back up and put it back in her hair and told her to leave it and the kid started crying again and pulled it back out. This happened again twice more. I could tell that the ribbon was obviously pulling her hair and hurting her because of the way her mother was twisting her hair up. So the woman went to twist the girls hair back up and put the ribbon back on again.

So I figured maybe the woman didn't realise that it was pulling the girls hair so I turned around to her and completely politely said "here, excuse me, I think its pulling her hair, you might be putting it on too tight", and the woman looked at me like I was a piece of dirt and said "don't you talk to me like that you little scumbag, mind your own business". So I said "here she obviously doesn't want the ribbon in her hair, it's hurting her". So she says "how dare you tell me how to look after my daughter" and she went and put it back in the kids hair again and the kid started crying again and went to pull it back out. So the woman pulled the kids hands away. So I just stared at her half in shock and shook my head. So when the woman turned away from the crying kid and started looking at the groceries and things again, the kid pulled it out again. So before the woman could pick it up and put it back in her hair yet again I grabbed it off the ground and threw it under one of the shelves.

So now the woman starts calling me a scumbag and a skobie all sorts of crap so I told her she should be reported to child services, and it went back and forth for a minute, then a security gaurd heard us arguing and came over. The woman told him I tried to steal something out of her handbag, and he grabbed me by the arm and said he was calling the gardai. Now I would have waited for the gardai to come and hoped the cctv captured what happened but the woman was well dressed and well spoken and I was on bail so it was clear who the gardai would believe and not wanting to spend the next few months in Cloverhill, I pushed the security gaurd off me and shaped my body like I was prepared to hit him (i wouldn't have actually hit him of course) so he'd back off and I left the shop. So thats the story.

Anyways I was just wondering what other people would have done in the situation. The woman repeatedly putting the ribbon in the girls hair even though it was hurting her. Would you say something? Afterwards I wasn't sure if I just made the situation worse of if maybe the woman might think twice before hurting her kid just to put a pretty ribbon in her hair again. And if there are any parents of small kids reading this, how would you react if you were in the womans place, would you take offense to someone saying what I said? and how would you react?

Red Hand

I think it was a pretty bad idea to take the ribbon and throw it away like that.

I think causiing a fuss may be a good thing, if she learns from that situation not to do that to her child again. I might've raised the security guard's attention, alright, and explained to him what was happening.

Ruu_Old

Would have had a polite word at first but that is where I would have ended it and not thrown away the ribbon, even though your intentions were good.

InFront

If i were on bail I wouldn't go pulling ribbons out of a kid's hair in a supermarket!:)

In any event I probably wouldn't even have said anything to her, perhaps just give the impression I found the baby's crying very annoying, and then the mother might do what was needed. Some people can't be reasoned with, so instead of telling them they are wrong, you need to show them by demonstrating that their behaviour is unacceptable.

embee

slipss wrote:

Ok well I was reading the thread about piercing babies ears there and it got me thinking about something that happened there three weeks ago. I was in supervalue and walking up and down the isles looking for a jar of coffee and there was this woman about 30 with a baby in a pram. The girl was about a year old or something and she was screaming crying, so I was looking over and I seen the kid pull a pink ribbon/bobbin thing out of her hair, and then she stopped crying. So the woman turned around and twisted the girls hair back up and put it back in her hair and told her to leave it and the kid started crying again and pulled it back out. This happened again twice more. I could tell that the ribbon was obviously pulling her hair and hurting her because of the way her mother was twisting her hair up. So the woman went to twist the girls hair back up and put the ribbon back on again.

So I figured maybe the woman didn't realise that it was pulling the girls hair so I turned around to her and completely politely said "here, excuse me, I think its pulling her hair, you might be putting it on too tight", and the woman looked at me like I was a piece of dirt and said "don't you talk to me like that you little scumbag, mind your own business". So I said "here she obviously doesn't want the ribbon in her hair, it's hurting her". So she says "how dare you tell me how to look after my daughter" and she went and put it back in the kids hair again and the kid started crying again and went to pull it back out. So the woman pulled the kids hands away. So I just stared at her half in shock and shook my head. So when the woman turned away from the crying kid and started looking at the groceries and things again, the kid pulled it out again. So before the woman could pick it up and put it back in her hair yet again I grabbed it off the ground and threw it under one of the shelves.

So now the woman starts calling me a scumbag and a skobie all sorts of crap so I told her she should be reported to child services, and it went back and forth for a minute, then a security gaurd heard us arguing and came over. The woman told him I tried to steal something out of her handbag, and he grabbed me by the arm and said he was calling the gardai. Now I would have waited for the gardai to come and hoped the cctv captured what happened but the woman was well dressed and well spoken and I was on bail so it was clear who the gardai would believe and not wanting to spend the next few months in Cloverhill, I pushed the security gaurd off me and shaped my body like I was prepared to hit him (i wouldn't have actually hit him of course) so he'd back off and I left the shop. So thats the story.

Anyways I was just wondering what other people would have done in the situation. The woman repeatedly putting the ribbon in the girls hair even though it was hurting her. Would you say something? Afterwards I wasn't sure if I just made the situation worse of if maybe the woman might think twice before hurting her kid just to put a pretty ribbon in her hair again. And if there are any parents of small kids reading this, how would you react if you were in the womans place, would you take offense to someone saying what I said? and how would you react?

I have an 11 month old daughter, and she screeches blue murder when I put a hat on her. A hat. Its not a tight hat, its a little pink beanie hat thats nice and stretchy. And yet, she will scream the house down when I put it on her. Then, its the "game" - pull the hat off, throw it on the ground, watch Mammy pick the hat up, let her put the hat back on, start screeching, pull the hat off etc etc etc. You have no way of knowing why the child was crying. You shouldn't make an assumption based on what you think you are seeing. 1 year olds are known to do things like this - my daughter has plenty of these screeching episodes/temper tantrums. She is screeching because she doesn't appreciate that I'm the boss. She gets told off for turning on and off the television constantly. Again, that doesn't hurt her but she'll screech and kick up a fuss (which is ignored until she realises she isn't going to provoke a reaction). I really don't think it was your place to start telling her what her child was feeling, and you shouldn't have kept on at it once she had snapped back at you initially (that really was your queue to just walk away). Okay, so she was a nasty individual, making up lies about you trying to steal from her handbag, but you shouldn't have said a thing. It isn't your place to. If she had been openly smacking the child or dragging her around by the arm or whatever, fair enough, but she was tying her childs hair up. Thats it. It may or may not have been hurting the kid, but thats not your call.

I know, from personal experience, that if someone turned and said something like that to me, I'd be pretty annoyed by it. I don't think I'd turn around and start calling the person a scumbag and a skobie etc., but I'd tell them to mind their own.

seamus

^^
What embee said. You had no idea why the child was screaming, and chose to assume it yourself. If the child was easily able to remove the ribbon, it can't have been that tight.

You should have minded your own business. Personally if someone in a supermarket attempted to "confiscate" my property or that of a member of my family, I'd probably make up stuff to have them kicked out too.

Linford

I doubt very much the ribbon was hurting the child and the child was acting up the same way my 11 month old daughter does when someone tries to clean her face or put a hat on her head.

Mind your own business in future and you are lucky it wasn't my property that you tried to confiscate!!

connundrum

InFront wrote:

If I were on bail I wouldn't go pulling ribbons out of a kid's hair in a supermarket!:)

QFT! CCTV Cameras will probably identify you if the woman wanted to persue you.

When I was a kid I went through a period (3-4 months) of not wanting to wear shoes. Now obviously I had to wear shoes. Like Embee said, the mother obviously knows best and I doubt if she'd intentionally try to hurt her child just for the sake of her feckin ribbon. Maybe the kid is just a brat? Who knows?!

User45701

Your next best course is to go after "your one"
try to sue her for defacement of your name or something simmilar.

petes

I'd mind my own business.

r3nu4l

slipss, I wonder would you have picked up the ribbon and thrown it away if it had been the childs father and he was six foot seven, well muscled, weighing in at 16 stone or more and had tattoos saying "kill" and "you" on his knuckles? I doubt it!

It was none of your business and you should have stayed out of it. As many others have said you don't know why the kid was crying, kids do this kind of thing all the time. Perhaps, just perhaps, if you were concerned, a quiet word was fine, after that you've done your bit.

Mrs_Doyle

I was with you, right up until you threw the ribbon away and got into a slagging match with the child's mother.

You let it go too far and you still made no difference. The woman will continue to do what she wants with the child's hairs. I'm afraid you got all hot and bothered over something you can't change.

dSTAR

Mate if it was my daughter you put your hand on it would be a very different scenario. I would have taken you outside and beaten you solidly.

No offence.

User45701

dSTAR wrote:

Mate if it was my daughter you put your hand on it would be a very different scenario. I would have taken you outside and beaten you solidly.

No offence.

Maybe that is what he wanted?

you beat him and then he gets money out of you in court?

connundrum

User45701 wrote:

Maybe that is what he wanted?

you beat him and then he gets money out of you in court?

Except it wasn't DStar, it was a mother. And the OP made moves to attack the security guard (even if he didn't actually do it). So I don't see how that situation would prevail.

DamoKen

dSTAR wrote:

Mate if it was my daughter you put your hand on it would be a very different scenario. I would have taken you outside and beaten you solidly.

No offence.

why don't you read the post properly before jumping in fists first???

slipss wrote:

So before the woman could pick it up and put it back in her hair yet again I grabbed it off the ground and threw it under one of the shelves.

digitally-yours

does Violence solve anything !!!!!

come on grow up Violence never solved anything Violence breeds voilence !

dSTAR wrote:

Mate if it was my daughter you put your hand on it would be a very different scenario. I would have taken you outside and beaten you solidly.

No offence.

manonthemoon

You should have just just punched hert and abscounded with the child

Dan133269

embee wrote:

She is screeching because she doesn't appreciate that I'm the boss.

That's just a terrible attitude towards parenting in my opinion, yes you are the "boss" of your child in a sense, but using that sentence as an explanation when you want to do something to your child that he/she doesn't want is inexcusable.

for example, "she is screeching because she doesn't realize she'll be cold without a hat" would have been so much better, do you see what I'm saying?

It's parents who have that mentality towards everything their children do and rule their children without an inch of leniency that ruin their children lives and are in turn hated by them when they grow up. I'm not saying you are like this, but it is that type of mentality that is generally found in bad parents.

connundrum

Dan133269 wrote:

That's just a terrible attitude towards parenting in my opinion, yes you are the "boss" of your child in a sense, but using that sentence as an explanation when you want to do something to your child that he/she doesn't want is inexcusable.

for example, "she is screeching because she doesn't realize she'll be cold without a hat" would have been so much better, do you see what I'm saying?

It's parents who have that mentality towards everything their children do and rule their children without an inch of leniency that ruin their children lives and are in turn hated by them when they grow up. I'm not saying you are like this, but it is that type of mentality that is generally found in bad parents.

Mincing words tbh, you knew exactly what she meant.

My mother used to tell me all the time that she was the boss and whatever she said went. She was the boss and that whatever she said usually was adhered to. Bad parenting me hole.

flanger20002003

It's a toughie...yeah the mother might have been hurting the child slightly, but as Embee pointed out, it could just be the child is in that 'phase'. I did a child psychology module in college last year, apparently kids start showing defiance around the ages of 7 to 12 months as a way to show their own control of their arms (throwing rattles out of prams, for example). We've all seen parents whose methods we'd like to question, but tbh it's not really our place to do that. I'm not surprised she reacted as she did, many posters seem to share a similar opinion. Sometimes you're just better off biting your tongue.

Dan133269

connundrum wrote:

My mother used to tell me all the time that she was the boss and whatever she said went. She was the boss and that whatever she said usually was adhered to. Bad parenting me hole.

great point.

Cake Fiend

Dan133269 wrote:

for example, "she is screeching because she doesn't realize she'll be cold without a hat" would have been so much better, do you see what I'm saying?

I agree - the way this was put, it sounded like the girl was being used as a large doll. WTF are you doing putting the hat on her over and over if she keeps screaming and taking it off? Badly phrased post maybe.

ferdi

god i hate the sound of babies crying (who dosnt) but i have found a cure! listen up:

this only works when the reason for the childs crying is boldness/wanting attention....

start mimicing the childs sounds, match the tone (obviously u wont match the pitch) but try and do it in unison with the child....

after a couple of seconds the adults around u will look like this: :mad:

but the child will look like this: (not crying)

it actually works! have tried it on buses and in supermarkets.

when i was a baby and started acting up in a shiop or in mass etc, my mother would just remove me/bring me outside and give me the 'STFU' look, usually worked too

User45701

Actually the single best way to deal with babies and lowed and annoying children is to simply face the owner and say quite loudly and clearly
"Silence the child or send it away"
it has never once failed me in fact once or twice the problem has actually left the pub and on a bus they tend to move up or downstairs wherever you are not.

connundrum

Dan133269 wrote:

great point.

Isn't it

event

User45701 wrote:

Actually the single best way to deal with babies and lowed and annoying children is to simply face the owner and say quite loudly and clearly
"Silence the child or send it away"
it has never once failed me in fact once or twice the problem has actually left the pub and on a bus they tend to move up or downstairs wherever you are not.

are ye serious?

if you said that to me i know what id tell ye

Ruu_Old

User45701 wrote:

Actually the single best way to deal with babies and lowed and annoying children is to simply face the owner and say quite loudly and clearly
"Silence the child or send it away"
it has never once failed me in fact once or twice the problem has actually left the pub and on a bus they tend to move up or downstairs wherever you are not.

Well I'd kick the schtuffin' out a ya and I'm not a violent person at all!

ferdi

event wrote:

are ye serious?

if you said that to me i know what id tell ye

what would you tell him?
"my child is a princess and its perfectLY acceptable for her to scream and roar and wreck everyones heads because shes my little darling and how dare you suggest that i attempt to stop her annoying this entire bus!"

i'm presuming it would be beyond you to say: "yeah look, i'm really sorry, she has been acting up all day"

Sangre

You should have punched the mother in the ovaries, right in babymakers.

kmick

Ha ha this is hilarious. You should have left the child and the mother fight it out. The mother was not really hurting the child in any serious way. Why did you feel the need to ge involved? My sister (4+) used to have a hsterical fit every morning before school cause she didnt want to wear socks. Yet my mother had to put on her socks every day. Next time get your brennans bread and go home and watch Oprah.

User45701

event wrote:

are ye serious?

if you said that to me i know what id tell ye

Ruu wrote:

Well I'd kick the schtuffin' out a ya and I'm not a violent person at all!

Care full now! Down with this sort of thing!

It may sound a bit harsh but its worse for us to have to hear your child scream you have probbley built up some sort of immunity to its noise.
So when i do say that to people it is a win win situtation to me either
1. Ive pissed you off like your child has pissed me off so im happy
or
2.You get so pissed off you attack me

anyway it doesn't matter i have a question
Could a parent of a child be charged if the child's voice rises above the legal limit?

event

ferdi wrote:

what would you tell him?
"my child is a princess and its perfectLY acceptable for her to scream and roar and wreck everyones heads because shes my little darling and how dare you suggest that i attempt to stop her annoying this entire bus!"

i'm presuming it would be beyond you to say: "yeah look, i'm really sorry, she has been acting up all day"

i tell him to shut his fecking mouth

Kids make noise, its a fact of life. Guess what, when you were a kid you cried sometimes. An amazingly, if you have kids, they'll cry too.

If someone's MP3 player or phone is too loud, would you tell tehm to turn it down?

User45701 wrote:

Care full now! Down with this sort of thing!

It may sound a bit harsh but its worse for us to have to hear your child scream you have probbley built up some sort of immunity to its noise.
So when i do say that to people it is a win win situtation to me either
1. Ive pissed you off like your child has pissed me off so im happy
or
2.You get so pissed off you attack me

anyway it doesn't matter i have a question
Could a parent of a child be charged if the child's voice rises above the legal limit?

christ you're petty. Are you 7?

tell me, what is the legal limit for a childs voice?

ScumLord

"Silence the child or send it away"

If you'd known she was going to be such a **** you could have reported her first. "There's some woman beating up a child down one of the isles, thing is I know for a fact that's not her child. Anyway must dash"

I would have just ignored the whole situation.

admiralofthefleet

i wouldnt have said a thing, it would be none of my business

crybaby

you should make a complaint against the security guard by the way, if you hadnt broken out of his grip and had waited for the Gardai to arrive you could have sued the security company for wrongful arrest but make the complaint anyway

in regards to the situation you really probably shouldnt have invovled yourself in the first place although you meant well, the kid was probably just being rebellious and you were a bit out of order yourself throwing the ribbon under the shelf

Mate if it was my daughter you put your hand on it would be a very different scenario. I would have taken you outside and beaten you solidly.

No offence.

try reading the post before you launch in to show us all your brand of macho love for your daughter

User45701

event wrote:

christ you're petty. Are you 7?

tell me, what is the legal limit for a childs voice?

The legal limit would be the same as the limit for music or a TV. i dont know how many decibels it is tho.

as for the petty comment - no im not petty, i just do not want to listed to *THAT* noise when i am trying to relax if you want to relax or go do something and you have bsby(s) or kid(s) leave them with a baby sitter or relax at home with the kids. no reason you should ruin my enjoyment because you have a child.

00112984

My two year old nephew hates wearing socks. When my sister dresses him, he takes off his shoes and socks and then puts the shoes on his sockless feet. He can't walk around like this because his feet will get cold and there's a chance his delicate little footies could chaff without socks. We, as adults, know this. He, as a child, doesn't and screams bloody murder when his socks are put back on.

OP- you behaved like a cream cracker.

Unpossible

00112984 wrote:

OP- you behaved like a cream cracker.

square and brittle?

embee

Cake Fiend wrote:

I agree - the way this was put, it sounded like the girl was being used as a large doll. WTF are you doing putting the hat on her over and over if she keeps screaming and taking it off? Badly phrased post maybe.

Yes, of course... my daughter was being used as a large doll :rolleyes:

Why would you reckon a parent would persist in trying to put a hat on their child in the middle of winter? I couldn't even hazard a guess :rolleyes:

Anyways, in terms of my comment that I'm my daughters "boss", well, yes, I am, in the sense that I'm her parent, and its my job to teach her a whole myriad of things. Its my job to teach her to respect grown ups and other children, that she can't get what she wants all of the time, that bad behaviour won't be rewarded. If a child grows up with a sense that their parents are pandering to them, catering to their every whim, tantrum and defiant phase, it really doesn't auger well for their future.

Children aren't born with a sense of right or wrong. It has to be taught to them. Yes, I refer to myself as the "boss" as I am her primary caregiver, and it is me that she will look to to test limits, boundaries, and for guidance and reassurance.

As another poster said - "Bad parenting me hole".

dSTAR

Ruu wrote:

Well I'd kick the schtuffin' out a ya and I'm not a violent person at all!

Thanks for that Ruu. Neither am I.

I will reiterate for those who misunderstood. I am a passive person and pretty relaxed parent. Fortunately I have never been in such a situation. But if someone did confront me in public about how I was parenting my child I would have told the person to politely go away.

If they pushed the issue I would have probably raised my voice and given them fair warning to leave. If they persisted (as in this instance) and went as far as putting his hand on my daughters head I would have seen that as a threatening act and would have responded accordingly. I certainly would not have stood there screaming waiting around for security guards or cops to arrive.

Be real. This guy admitted he was on bail for a committing a crime. How many situations have there been where kids have been touched (inappropriately) or lured away to their deaths by nut cases?

Here is a recent example.

Bet ya half the hand wringers here who took my post completely wrong don't even have kids preferring to spout their self righteous opinions on how to look after kids.

Fraggle Rocks

dSTAR wrote:

Thanks for that Ruu. Neither am I.

I will reiterate for those who misunderstood. I am a passive person and pretty relaxed parent. Fortunately I have never been in such a situation. But if someone did confront me in public about how I was parenting my child I would have told the person to politely go away.

If they pushed the issue I would have probably raised my voice and given them fair warning to leave. If they persisted (as in this instance) and went as far as putting his hand on my daughters head I would have seen that as a threatening act and would have responded accordingly. I certainly would have stood there screaming waiting around for security guards or cops to arrive.

Be real. This guy admitted he was on bail for a committing a crime. How many situations have there been where kids have been touched (inappropriately) or lured away to their deaths by nut cases?

Here is a recent example.

Bet ya half the hand wringers here who took my post completely wrong don't even have kids preferring to spout their self righteous opinions on how to look after kids.

He didn't touch the child. As has been pointed out already.

dSTAR

Fraggle Rocks wrote:

He didn't touch the child. As has been pointed out already.

And your point is?

embee

dSTAR wrote:

Bet ya half the hand wringers here who took my post completely wrong don't even have kids preferring to spout their self righteous opinions on how to look after kids.

Amen to that.

dSTAR

I was starting to think I was in New Zealand with all the bleating!

Irregardless of whether he put his hand on the child or not I think it may have been wiser not to become involved in the first place. She could just as easily turn around and say he was harassing her.

I think he was seriously misguided in his actions and could have easily landed himself in the hole.

Paligulus

In my humble opinion there is a big difference between making your child wear a hat or socks and making them wear a ribbon. I just dont see how making a kid wear a ribbon is acting in their best interest...

Guess_Who

Paligulus wrote:

I just dont see how making a kid wear a ribbon is acting in their best interest...

Depends on the child's hair. The ribbon could have been keeping it out of her eyes. At the end of the day most parents aren't going to go out of their way to upset their children for no good reason, but children have tantrums, always have done and always will do. It wasn't the OP's place to get involved especially not to the point of kicking the ribbon under a shelf.

dSTAR

dSTAR wrote:

And your point is?

You've mentioned twice how you'd react if someone put their hands near your daughter's head, but he didn't, he took the ribbon from the ground. He wasn't anywhere near the child.


OP: that was out of order - the way to get a point across is not to steal a ribbon and throw it away when the person is already not listening to you.
And as has been said, children to seem to scream a lot anyway whether in pain or not...

connundrum

Paligulus wrote:

I just dont see how making a kid wear a ribbon is acting in their best interest...

Sigh. Maybe it was to hold the hair out of the kid's eyes, maybe it was to make the kid look smart/clean. Who knows why the ribbon was there.

The point is that the mother obviously wanted the ribbon there, and her being the person charged with the child's care, she should have the choice as to what she puts in the child's hair - as long as its not acid/rats/explosives.

Holy God. I was made wear a tie for my 1st communion, how the hell was that in my best interest?? It doesn't matter, I still wore it.

slipss

Ok thanks for the replies, I did post the thread looking for advice on how to aproach a situation like this in the future, and its much appreciated. I probably shouldn't have threw the ribbon away, that was probably a step too far.

Just a few things. Firstly dSTAR, like has been pointed out to you by a few people I didn't pull the ribbon out of the kids hair myself or come anywhere within four feet of the kid, I just flicked it under a shelf from the ground.

Secondly, again to dSTAR, I said I was on bail, not that I commited a crime. You are granted bail when accused of a crime before you are tried and found innocent or guilty, just thought I'd point that out.

Thirdly, R3nu4l, yes of course I would have still said something if it had of been a 16 stone 7ft tattoo bearing nutcase looking bloke. I would have been far quicker to say something if I saw someone like that doing something that I thought was hurting a baby, and I wouldn't have broached the subjest as politley as I initially did with the woman. If your trying to suggest I only said something because I felt if it came to blows I could beat the woman in a fight, I seriously worry about how your thought process works.

Also it was the way the woman was putting the ribbon in the kids hair that made me think it was hurting her. I except maybe the kid could have just been thowing a tantrum, but she wasn't just gently re-tieing the kids hair back up, she was really twisting her hair up tight to the extent that the skin around the kids hair line was being pulled up, and she was being rougher and rougher with the girl everytime she redid it. Having said that I will take onboard what everyone said in future.

Siogfinsceal

connundrum wrote:

QFT! CCTV Cameras will probably identify you if the woman wanted to persue you.

When I was a kid I went through a period (3-4 months) of not wanting to wear shoes. Now obviously I had to wear shoes. Like Embee said, the mother obviously knows best and I doubt if she'd intentionally try to hurt her child just for the sake of her feckin ribbon. Maybe the kid is just a brat? Who knows?!

lol me too! used to hate shoes. Id scream blue murder if I was made wear them. i was such a horrible child my mum used to dread bringing me into shops as id cause such a scene. she couldnt buy me shoes for ages as I used to kick teh shop assistance in the shoe shop