Dumbed Down Ireland

dSTAR

This is a poll to determine if you think the general population is becoming more dumbed down. It appears to me that a growing number of people are quite happy to lead lives which don't really challenge their intellects, question the status quo and are happy to be spoon fed a diet of watered down news, Hollywood schlock and general junk culture.

What do you think?

connundrum

A poll? How do you use a bleedin poll? Feck off, back to Judge Judy with me

And for the record, I really think that we are evolving. What was smart 10 years ago is generally not considered to be smart now. We generally know what we need to get by with and thats about it.

For all the % more that are attending college now, I think we are becoming dumber. I blame the media, but then I blame ourselves for allowing the media to get to such a powerful position. Its my fault tbh.

Sorry

scojones

dSTAR wrote:

This is a poll to determine if you think the general population is becoming more dumbed down. It appears to me that a growing number of people are quite happy to lead lives which don't really challenge their intellects, question the status quo and are happy to be spoon fed a diet of watered down news, Hollywood schlock and general junk culture.

What do you think?

"General public". Enough said tbh.

People are idiots. They always have been, and they always will be.

Heyes

Most of the population are just incrediable lazy rather than dumb.

FlutterinBantam

Agreed!!!

One of the side effects of the Celtic cat...plenty of work,no need to bust yer buns doing second and third level education,your heroes will obviously be those revolting people from the various reality shows currently on,the local wag who knows the social welfare scams,and the smart covey who drives a beemer without any visible means of support;)

You will hardly be tuning into University Challenge or The Challenge of an Emerging Islam on BBC2;)

Nalz

can you repeat the question?

scojones

Generalisations ftw. But just look at the ratings on TV. Most people watch "Corrie" and Eastenders, but what choice do they have? Lets say all you have is poverty 1 - 4, nothing really intellectual shown on these channels is there? Then again, if you watch TV all day everyday you're probably as thick as the wall anyway.

Society in general is a disaster. You can't walk down the street without bumping into a bunch of 15 or 16 year old scum bags roaming the streets with nothing better to do. All of the skangers are multiplying far too quickly because they can't figure out how birth control works, or are just too ignorant to care. People don't care anymore. How often do you walk down the street and totally avoid eye contact with that homeless guy in front of you?

Plissken1

sjones wrote:

Generalisations ftw. But just look at the ratings on TV. Most people watch "Corrie" and Eastenders, but what choice do they have? Lets say all you have is poverty 1 - 4, nothing really intellectual shown on these channels is there? Then again, if you watch TV all day everyday you're probably as thick as the wall anyway.

Society in general is a disaster. You can't walk down the street without bumping into a bunch of 15 or 16 year old scum bags roaming the streets with nothing better to do. All of the skangers are multiplying far too quickly because they can't figure out how birth control works, or are just too ignorant to care. People don't care anymore. How often do you walk down the street and totally avoid eye contact with that homeless guy in front of you?

You should come over and see where I live, checkout our fine selection of trailer trash, they are everywhere you look now, you cannot escape them. This is just one example of what goes on in this area, Its the same every week. You see the foreign workers from Intel, they always come down along the river taking pictures of the old buildings like the Church and the Millhouse, which are steeped in history, when at the same time you have the Irish coming down and drinking 'dutch gold' and eating 'snack boxes', then chucking it all on the ground and leaving. And there are no slums around here, these are middle class people who act like Irelands answer to Wayne and Waynette, and they do seem to be multiplying. They even have babies wearing tracksuits now.

GreeBo

Plissken1 wrote:

They even have babies wearing tracksuits now.

Sounds better than the pajamas I see around town on a Saturday

Pherekydes

sjones wrote:

Most people watch "Corrie" and Eastenders...

More generalisations! :rolleyes:

sjones wrote:

...but what choice do they have?

Anything else.

Don1

General public = moronic. (we haven't completely evolved away from the animal yet!!)
More going to college yes, but level of qualifications coming down. (in terms of dificulty not recognition)
Even the Leaving Cert, the big hoo haa that really means very little is being slowly dumbed down. Take a look at a higher level Maths or Physics paper from the last few years then go back around ten years. No comparison.

scojones

Slow coach wrote:

More generalisations! :rolleyes:

Rolleyes, the cheek of you! The thread is about the general public, of course it's going to be filled with generalisations.

Slow coach wrote:

Anything else.

Re-read my post and go past the first two sentences please. Hopefully you'll see the point I was making. Kind of ironic.

User45701

i don't like the part about pop culture celebs and all that i have no interest in music or popular culture or big brother or what the becams are doing ect. to me its quite sad that your own life is so pathetic that you find yourself obsessed with two people who would probbley just tell you to go get them a drink.

Me i would agree with the dumbed down because i don't test my intellect much but i have no interest in the ****e you mentioned in reference to ireland being dumbed down

Trode

'Becoming' dumber? Since when? At what point exactly was our intellectual golden age where the majority of the population sat around discussing Sartre over a rousing game of chess, before it was ruined by soap operas and Big Brother?
FWIW no, we, as a people, as a species, are smarter than we were 5 years ago, 10 years ago, 20, 50, 100, 1000. Just because a lot of people like something you don't doesn't make them stupid and you smart.

Tar.Aldarion

Ah dumb people discussing themselves in a dumb way. Apt.

Caliden

The younger bebo generation and their text speak. It's just depressing, I won't go off on a 'back in my day' rant but I'm definately glad I'm not growing up in this day and age.

astrofool

dumbed down since this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKBCCDOUS9U

kmick

I agree with a lot of the ponts. I think one indicator of the extent of the dumbing down is the RTE 9 O'Clock news. It is so dumb now. They have to fill 30 minutes every night and the days it is a slow news day it is painful. Instead of doing a report on some international issue they have a reporter live from the doorstep of some minor accident. For example last week an old woman got knocked down by a bus. Sad and Tragic but not big news. They had a guy live there talking to a woman of 80 and she is saying 'oh yeah I looked out the window and the gardai were there, the main bus man was there, the firebrigade was there, and there were loads of people around and I said to Mary and Josie there must be something happening across the road'.

Now I know you cant make a silk purse out of a pigs ear so why show that crap. If there is no news finish the news early and and stick in a Reeling in the years or something.

Also the the apporach they take is show it to them, tell them about it, show it to them again is idiotic i.e. Headlines at top, main body of story, headlines at bottom. So you hear the same story 3 times in 25 minutes. Are we morons? Do we have the attention span of budgies? Maybe we do but don't cater for the lowest common denominator. Finally the inserts from Charlie Bird (Chief News Correspndent no less) are becoming more and more bizarre and infantile. He did a clip about speeding where he went up and down the N11 and everyone was speeding. It went on for 10 minutes with him saying 'and that car is speeding', 'and that car is speeding', 'and that car is doing 75'. TV3 started it but RTE are on the road to passing them out. They can do big budget moronic. TV3 only do small budget moronic.

Miss Fluff

I find the acceptance of "text speak" in everyday correspondence to be dumbing down of the worst order. Now illiterate proles who can't read and write to start with have an excuse.:rolleyes:

ScumLord

The likes of the mirror, the sun and other rags along the same lines have been turning Irish people into an angry mob that will start regurgitating dumbass opinions at the drop of a hat. I don't think anyone capable of speaking to more than 1000 people at one time has a clue what their talking about they just want to say something that allot of stupid people will agree with.

Cake Fiend

Miss Fluff wrote:

Now illiterate prols who can't read and write to start with have an excuse.:rolleyes:

Want to have another read of that? :rolleyes:

Sarky

You're all shaved apes as far as I'm concerned. Poorly shaved, at that.

*swirls brandy while sneering over the hounds asleep at the fireplace*

Miss Fluff

Cake Fiend wrote:

Want to have another read of that? :rolleyes:

ROFL, just did

Pappa-eat-peach

Depends on what you mean by dumbing down, OP.

130 years ago many people went to music-halls and other "bawdy" entertainents, and found them amusing whereas others didn't lower themselves- today that might be comparable to some listening/watching pop-musicians and others who seek out...Mongolian throat warblers as entertainent.:)

Its all a matter of taste and outlook. Some people are just more curious/discerning, or maybe even elitest for the point of being elitest.:)

csk

When someone like that Chantelle one off whatever no brain reality TV show has a book out and more than two people have bought said book, then we really have to look at where we are heading as a society.

nesf

People are as dumb today as they were 20 years ago. The only real difference is that with reality TV, Joe Duffy and After Hours it's much harder to ignore them.

Coileach dearg

dSTAR wrote:

This is a poll to determine if you think the general population is becoming more dumbed down. It appears to me that a growing number of people are quite happy to lead lives which don't really challenge their intellects, question the status quo and are happy to be spoon fed a diet of watered down news, Hollywood schlock and general junk culture.

What do you think?

I recall a post from you some time back giving reasons why you don't want to move back to Ireland, am I right? Is this in some way related to it or a rant by you making you feel better about moving abroad, No offense by the way.
If people are stupid enough to be fed "watered down news" then that's their problem.
How would you compare dumbed down Ireland to dumbed down Australia for example? You will have a percentage of the population wherever you go who subscribe to this "Hollywood Schlock and general junk culture". In my opinion everyone has ambition no matter what level of intellect they have.
To summarise my point it's not just Ireland that has this problem, it also exists in Australia.

InFront

Don1 wrote:

Even the Leaving Cert, the big hoo haa that really means very little is being slowly dumbed down. Take a look at a higher level Maths or Physics paper from the last few years then go back around ten years. No comparison.

I agree. I, and am not the only one, have no problem in saying that I got more than what I worked for in my leaving cert. I think standards have undoubtedly fallen in education. The statistics seem to reflect this trend.
It isn't limited to second level either, I was very surprised to hear recently of someone who was ahead of me in school and has recently graduated with a first class honours degree from an irish IT. This person failed this subject area for the leaving cert, barely secured the points for the course, and certainly was not a diligent student during his time there. Is our educational system losing its credibility?

There is an extremely careless attitude prevalent in this country with regard to funding and supporting postgraduate education in key areas like science, engineering and medicine. Not only will this have economic and social implications, but the fact that the majority of students are expected to be satisfied with an undergraduate degree without having research and postgraduates interests stimulated is very disappointing.

RTE, in terms of its educational output seems to perform very poorly also, particularly when you compare it to the likes of the BBC. Our national broadcaster shows more interest in promoting the likes of ridiculous soap operas like Fair City and cheap, worthless, American imports instead of producing anything of edicational, cultural or scientific merit.

There is an absence of logic and common sense in the administrative machinery of the country that is somehow being reflected in the day to day lives of the people: Road mortalities, waste generation and subsequent realisations about the state of our environment, attitudes to our education, ability to distinguish between reliable media and unreliable media - these are all hallmarks of a society that would seem to be dumbing down.

dSTAR

Pappa-eat-peach wrote:

Depends on what you mean by dumbing down, OP.

I am talking about people who flaunt their dumbness and make out it is funny. For example when someone says or does something stupid and it is brushed aside or made into some kind of Simpsons style jibe.

Text speak in forums is another that really gets to me. I can understand it being used sparingly in a txt(!) message but using as a replacement for everyday English is beyond my patience level.

Teenage girls trying to look and sound like Paris Hilton (a paragon of Western civilisation!)

And many more examples of dumb behaviour too numerous to mention...

Coileach dearg wrote:

I recall a post from you some time back giving reasons why you don't want to move back to Ireland, am I right? Is this in some way related to it or a rant by you making you feel better about moving abroad, No offense by the way...

Good try but there is definitely no relation between the two. I have been a member of these Boards since 2005 and have on occasions launched the odd rant or two. I have also been entertained, brought to tears and educated by some of the longstanding members of boards. Lately I have noticed a kind of moronic element creeping in. Maybe it has always been there but I am only noticing it now. So I suppose that was what prompted it.

Coileach dearg wrote:

How would you compare dumbed down Ireland to dumbed down Australia for example?

In my opinion I would say that Australia is being dumbed down much more rapidly than Ireland but not quite at the speed of America. Someone mentioned the evening news. I find that to be a good barometer of the general level of awareness of the general public. I find it is pandering to the lowest common denominator more and more. It is not even the news stories they cover but want they DON'T cover which is more of a concern.

When I lived in the States I was stunned by the evening news. While the worst human rights abuses where being committed by American troops abroad and in the meantime corporate America was changing laws which would effect the lives of millions worldwide (all without the knowledge of the public) they were showing news reports of cats being rescued out of trees or mindless social commentators prattling about what Jennifer Anniston wore at the Golden Globes.

What gets to me is that if you express a different opinion you are automatically categorized as being a troublemaker, radical, greenie or lone voice in the forest.

Is anyone else with me on this or should I just go back to watching The Real World on MTV (empty TV)?

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

dSTAR wrote:

This is a poll to determine if you think the general population is becoming more dumbed down.

What do you think?

i may be one of those because that sentence "becoming more dumbed down" isn't part of the English I took in school. In fact i cant find that word "dumbed" anywhere on the inter-net either.

is the OP first post a victim of its own poll?

Heinrich

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

i may be one of those because that sentence "becoming more dumbed down" isn't part of the English I took in school. In fact i cant find that word "dumbed" anywhere on the inter-net either.

is the OP first post a victim of its own poll?

Look harder the next time.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dumbed

dumb (dŭm) Pronunciation Key
adj. dumb·er, dumb·est


Lacking the power of speech. Used of animals and inanimate objects.
Often Offensive Incapable of using speech; mute. Used of humans. See Usage Note at mute.
Temporarily speechless, as with shock or fear: I was dumb with disbelief.
Unwilling to speak; taciturn.
Not expressed or articulated in sounds or words: dumb resentment.
Nautical Not self-propelling.
Conspicuously unintelligent; stupid: dumb officials; a dumb decision.
Unintentional; haphazard: dumb luck.

tr.v. dumbed, dumb·ing, dumbs
To make silent or dumb.

Phrasal Verb(s):
dumb down/up Slang
To rewrite for a less educated or less sophisticated audience.

[Middle English, from Old English.]

dumb'ly adv., dumb'ness n.

Our Living Language : In ordinary spoken English, a sentence such as He is dumb will be interpreted to mean "He is stupid" rather than "He lacks the power of speech." "Lacking the power of speech" is, however, the original sense of the word, but it has been eclipsed by the meaning "stupid." For this change in meaning, it appears that the Germans are responsible. German has a similar and related word dumm that means "stupid," and over time, as a result of the waves of German immigrants to the United States, it has come to influence the meaning of English dumb. This is one of dozens of marks left by German on American English. Some words, like kindergarten, dachshund, and schnapps still have a German feel or are associated to some extent with Germany, but others, like bum, cookbook, fresh (in the meaning "impertinent"), rifle, and noodle have become so thoroughly Americanized their German origins may surprise some.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

Heinrich wrote:

Look harder the next time.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dumbed

erm you forgot to mention that this source is from the American Heritage Dictionary. Sure they even spell things wrong.:D
isn't that exactly what the original post is all about,

dSTAR wrote:

and are happy to be spoon fed a diet of watered down news, Hollywood schlock and general junk culture.

try put "dumbed" into a little unknown dictionary like "the Oxford Dictionary"
oh look what it says
"Sorry, there were no results for your search.":D

Pherekydes

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

erm you forgot to mention that this source is from the American Heritage Dictionary. Sure they even spell things wrong.:D
isn't that exactly what the original post is all about,


try put "dumbed" into a little unknown dictionary like "the Oxford Dictionary"
oh look what it says
"Sorry, there were no results for your search.":D

From the Oxford English Dictionary (which surely carries more weight than the mere Oxford Dictionary):

People have been complaining about entertainment being 'dumbed down' since 1933.

Not only are they using the word in an article, but it is in a reference to 1933.

http://www.oed.com/newsletters/2001-09/think.html

nesf

Slow coach wrote:

From the Oxford English Dictionary (which surely carries more weight than the mere Oxford Dictionary):



Not only are they using the word in an article, but it is in a reference to 1933.

http://www.oed.com/newsletters/2001-09/think.html

I have dumbed down being referenced to middle 20th century and dumb (as in idiotic) being from middle english.

MikeHoncho

Whats all this crack smokin talk about dumbed down news. This is no new thing. People have always read dumbed down news. The General population have always been submitted to this. 50 years ago you probably didnt know or care what was going on outside your backwater part of the world anyway. We now live in an age where information is at our finger tips the whole time and we can now see how the media changes things. But for once in the last couple 100 years we have the opportunity to ignore the mass media and find our own sources. This thing we call the Interweb in its purest form allows the rapid transfer of information between peiople all over the globe (How does this dumb us down?).

As far as text speak goes why doesnt one of you invent a time machine and send a collection of your posts back to an 18th Centuary English scholar and have them grade your grammar. Dont get me wrong it wrecks my head but hey if it makes things quicker for these kids let them at it. Language, culture, fashion all change and evolve over time this is human nature and the nature of the world we live in. I bet you all like Rock and Roll... well guess what Rock and Roll was considered to indicate the dumming down of culture in the 50's. I cant count the amount of times I have heard a Rock musician being called a genius over the last 30 years, things change.

My point is that we arent getting dumber. People just seem to like dumb s**t. Who is to say in 150 years time they wont be reading the DaVinci code in school;) And studying the productions of tiesto in music class.:D

DonkeyStyle \o/

I voted 'BOOBIES!!1'. (I think )

Sarky wrote:

You're all shaved apes as far as I'm concerned.

I want my monkey hair back, Ireland is far too cold.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

Slow coach wrote:

From the Oxford English Dictionary (which surely carries more weight than the mere Oxford Dictionary):



Not only are they using the word in an article, but it is in a reference to 1933.

http://www.oed.com/newsletters/2001-09/think.html

forgive me, i would have presumed that most people would have known what i meant when i said "oxford dictionary" but i suppose i shouldn't presume the level of understanding in some people.
but again i apologise if you were confused.

still cant find the word "dumbed" in the " Oxford English Dictionary "

yes plenty of articles on the use of the phrase "dumbed down" but again if you read my post, i am looking for the word "dumbed" in the Oxford English Dictionary. Its not in it.
I think that this is what the OP is on about, using phrases like "dumbed down" and other phrases in the article you cited for the less stimulated among us.

sorry is you were confused about the difference between the word "dumbed" and the common usage of the phrase "dumbed down" for TV.

Archeron

I think this guy sums it up better than we can. He may not be Irish, but its certainly indicative (of something)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE8EZVpjR84

InFront

He is Irish! He works in Tesco in Rathmines, I saw.

adonis

i dont think there is an accepted corpus of words in english like there is in french... thats really the beauty of english isnt it? so arguing over the location of a word in a certain dictionary is a tad futile.

I also don't think that txtspk is that much of a problem, maybe its just the evolution of our language.. Im sure people spoke different and wrote differently 50 to 100 years ago. Its just a popular <i>bette noire</i> for people these days which in itself is laziness, try and focus on something different and original...

Of course people are dumbed down its easy now to be lazy, its just a challenge for the most people that they choose not to accept.

Jumpy

User45701 wrote:

i don't like the part about pop culture celebs and all that i have no interest in music or popular culture or big brother or what the becams are doing ect. to me its quite sad that your own life is so pathetic that you find yourself obsessed with two people who would probbley just tell you to go get them a drink.

Me i would agree with the dumbed down because i don't test my intellect much but i have no interest in the ****e you mentioned in reference to ireland being dumbed down

Oh wow, *looks at thread title* just wow.

Sleepy

Yup, we've sent everyone to college and reduced the caliber of the education provided there in an attempt to make ourselves seem smarter, we're all addicted to mindless entertainment, we've made celebrities out of morons and generally seem to celebrate (or elect!) those who have no intelligence, education or culture.

Pherekydes

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

forgive me, i would have presumed that most people would have known what i meant when i said "oxford dictionary" but i suppose i shouldn't presume the level of understanding in some people.

Most people would know what is meant by the phrase 'dumbed down', too. 'presumed' isn't in my OED, and neither are 'lazed' or 'pondered'. Can you spot why? Then maybe you can work out why 'dumbed' isn't in there, either.

nesf

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

still cant find the word "dumbed" in the " Oxford English Dictionary "

When I put it into the Shorter OED on my desktop it returns with the verb dumb:

3. verb trans. & intrans. dumb down, simplify or reduce the intellectual content of (written or broadcast material, etc.), esp. in order to appeal to a mass audience. colloq. (orig. US). M20.

With the literary example given as:

P. Bronson Having to translate his work into dumbed-down metaphors for the shiny-shoe set.

Other than that, you could have 'dumbed' as in 'having been made silent or dumb in the past' or something similar from the above. Similar to gawked the word 'dumbed' doesn't need it's own entry in the dictionary as its sole meaning is as the past tense of the verb dumb. It is a colloquialism alright when used in the phrase 'dumb down' or 'dumbed down', so maybe that's what you are complaining about, but if you expect better on AH...

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

Slow coach wrote:

Then maybe you can work out why 'dumbed' isn't in there, either.

oh i understand the phrase 'dumbed down' that was never in dispute.

what i said, and i'm glad that you finally agree ( took slightly more post that i thought it would) is that the word 'dumbed' is not in the English dictionary.

ntlbell

Irony:

A bunch of morons on what is commonly known as one of the more moronic forums on boards discussing how "dumbed down" the youth of the country is today.

Classic.

nesf

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

what i said, and i'm glad that you finally agree ( took slightly more post that i thought it would) is that the word 'dumbed' is not in the English dictionary.

Eh, why would the past tense of a verb be in an English dictionary if it didn't have another usage?

Cake Fiend

nesf wrote:

People are as dumb today as they were 20 years ago. The only real difference is that with reality TV, Joe Duffy and After Hours it's much harder to ignore them.

It's also much easier for them to get away with it. Your man who was talking about taking the safety labels off everything had the right idea.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

still cant find the word "dumbed" in the " Oxford English Dictionary "

The English language is not defined by the contents of the Oxford English Dictionary. It's the other way around, in fact.

adonis

i dunno if dumb is actually a verb.
it might be in the passive tense but definitely not in the past.
i think dumb is an adjective, therefore in theory there can be no past tense...
ahhhhh the beauty of english

nesf

adonis wrote:

i dunno if dumb is actually a verb.
it might be in the passive tense but definitely not in the past.
i think dumb is an adjective, therefore in theory there can be no past tense...
ahhhhh the beauty of english

It's listed as a verb in the OED, so yeah it's used as a verb sometimes. 'To dumb' as in 'to make silent or dumb'.

Civilian_Target

Sleepy wrote:

Yup, we've sent everyone to college and reduced the caliber of the education provided there in an attempt to make ourselves seem smarter, we're all addicted to mindless entertainment, we've made celebrities out of morons and generally seem to celebrate (or elect!) those who have no intelligence, education or culture.

I agree. I read a research paper from the University of Illinois today that mathematically over-convoluted a simple issue and then continued to reach a conclusion in mathematical terms that was intuitively obvious, should the system have just been expained in simple terms.

What a waste of good DARPA funding...