Tolls forcing trucks back into towns in Cork

Victor

layke wrote:

Sure the new Motorway has been paid for by our taxes already.

So? Taxes were also spent on the Dublin Port Tunnel and it is tolled.

Its not a double tax, its a user charge.

Seth Brundle

dubhthach wrote:

There will be two, one at Cappletaggle on Galway to Ballinasloe section (which i've heard will be classified Motorway -- NRA road designers are in office downstairs) and the current one on the M4 Kilcock-Kinegad section.

my bad!

spacetweek

Number of tolls:
M1 - 1
M3 - 2
M4/6 - 2
M7/N7 - 2
M8/N8 - 2
N9 - 0 , yay!
N11 - 0, yay!

Chris_533976

Waterford City bypass

Tho its N25, its close enough to the N9 to cause toll issues for the N9-ers

Capt'n Midnight

spacetweek wrote:

Number of tolls:
M1 - 1
M3 - 2
M4/6 - 2
M7/N7 - 2
M8/N8 - 2
N9 - 0 , yay!
N11 - 0, yay!

you forget the M9
that's almost 4 more miles of motorway that isn't tolled

Victor

The M9 will have a toll, somewhere mid-route.

mike65

Was at Watergrasshil today and they have blocked off the turn into the village/old N8 at the roundabout at the top of the slip road, forcing vehicles to use the cock-eyed flyover by-pass arrangment.

Mike.

corktina

[
They did, its called the M8.

quite right it is NOW part of the M8 and it has been stolen from the village and given to the toll road people.....

penexpers

I really don't understand what people's issue with paying tolls is - it's the de facto standard in alot of European countries (France, Spain, Italy etc..) and in some countries where charging isn't standard, the roads have fallen into a bad state of repair (England).

dubhthach

Chris_533976 wrote:

Good Tell them to reclassify the whole of the N6 to M6.

And tell them enough of this interurban rubbish, build the rest of the N18 now.

According to the "City Turbine" (*cough* Tribune) last Friday, Brian Cohen is to announce in 6weeks or so plans to "front load" the road infastructure in Galway, namely the N18 dual carriageway, N17 dual carriageway (to Tuam) and the Galway Outer Bypass.

Supposdly the local FF TD's have been busy pushing such a scheme, it smells of electioneering to me, but hey if it's true it means these schemes are to be push forward by two years to start construction in 2008 instead of 2010.

MICKEYG

penexpers wrote:

I really don't understand what people's issue with paying tolls is - it's the de facto standard in alot of European countries (France, Spain, Italy etc..) and in some countries where charging isn't standard, the roads have fallen into a bad state of repair (England).

The problem is two fold

1. The collection method is extremely inefficient forcing users to slow down, fumble for change and then accelerate back up again

2. They are unfair. Some roads are tolled and others are not. All roads cost money to build and maintain. Why should some people pay and others not? For example, I can drive from Bray to past Portlaoise without paying a toll whereas someone driving from Cork to Mitchelstown has to pay (a more extreme example would be Blanchardstown to Lucan (which I imagine a lot of trucks do a lot)).

The best way is to have no tolls but higher fuel taxes. These taxes would pay for the building and upkeep of ALL roads. That way people will pay for what they use and people with more efficient cars will pay less (an effective green tax). The key here is that the taxes are ring fenced and that road tax itself is abolished (another extremely inefficient way of raising tax)

penexpers

MICKEYG wrote:

The problem is two fold

1. The collection method is extremely inefficient forcing users to slow down, fumble for change and then accelerate back up again

2. They are unfair. Some roads are tolled and others are not. All roads cost money to build and maintain. Why should some people pay and others not? For example, I can drive from Bray to past Portlaoise without paying a toll whereas someone driving from Cork to Mitchelstown has to pay (a more extreme example would be Blanchardstown to Lucan (which I imagine a lot of trucks do a lot)).

The best way is to have no tolls but higher fuel taxes. These taxes would pay for the building and upkeep of ALL roads. That way people will pay for what they use and people with more efficient cars will pay less (an effective green tax). The key here is that the taxes are ring fenced and that road tax itself is abolished (another extremely inefficient way of raising tax)

Ah both good points up there. Do most toll booths not have an Easypass-style option too? I know the M1 one does.

Point 2 is an interesting one. I was under the impression that where a toll is charged, it's due to the extra costs of building part of the road i.e the west link bridge on the M50 or the bridge near Drogheda on the M1. I know in France that the tolls can vary depending on a number of factors.

Good point about the tax too, that's something I'd be in favour of.

dowlingm

There should be a national easypass system. 407ETR north of Toronto has no fare gates. No transponder and you get a bill in the post off your licence plate photo but the one off bill charge is higher obviously. Pay gates increase emissions because of queueing cars.

Zoney

dowlingm wrote:

There should be a national easypass system.

Hey, if we need money for roads we could even do something crazy for a nationwide centralised scheme; like collect taxes and duties on purchases of petrol! We could even tax car purchases!

Wait a minute...

mike65

Its like the By-pass never happened.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionA.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionB.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionC.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionD.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionE.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/mike65/watergrasshilldiversionF.jpg

Mike.

Capt'n Midnight

There is a bridge like that in Japan, they built it after a ferry sank. It's safer but the toll is so high everyone uses the ferry. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akashi_Kaikyo_Bridge

Before the Akashi-Kaikyo Bridge was built, ferries carried passengers back and forth across the Akashi Strait in Japan. This dangerous waterway often experiences severe storms, and in 1955, two ferries sank in the strait during a storm, killing 168 children. The ensuing shock and public outrage convinced the Japanese government to draw up plans for a suspension bridge to cross the strait. The original plan was for a mixed railway-road bridge but when the bridge was begun in April 1986 it was restricted to road only, with six lanes.
...
The central span is 1991 metres, with the two other sections each 960 metres (3,150 ft). The bridge is 3911 metres long overall. The central span was originally only 1990 metres but was stretched by a further metre in the Kobe earthquake on January 17, 1995. It was designed on a two-hinged stiffening girder system, allowing it to withstand 286 kilometres per hour (178 mph) winds, earthquakes measuring up to 8.5 on the Richter scale, and harsh sea currents.
...
The bridge can expand up to two meters in one day.

The total cost is estimated at ¥ 500 billion (≈USD 5 billion). This cost is expected to be defrayed by charging commuters a toll to cross the bridge. However, the toll is so high (2,300 Yen or 20US$) that, ironically, very few drivers actually use the expensive bridge, preferring instead to use the slower-but-cheaper ferries.