How long have you been veggie?

Nature Boy

Just a poll to see how long people have been veggie, I know a few people who used to be veggie for a long time and gave it up.

Any people here who've given up being veggie and why?

feelthegrease

ive only been a veggie since the summer, but i spent a long time building up to it...for about a year until i finally stopped eating meat i was thinking about it, and making veggie meals several times a week...and i cant see myself going back, although i do have friends who were vegetarians for years and have started eating fish. but i never liked fish anyway

Nature Boy

I can never understand the thing about fish. Why do people only eat fish but not any other animal?

Blub2k4

There was a myth about that fish don't feel pain, dunno where it came from, possibly fishermen like meself trying to convince themselves that if fish were put back after catching that no harm was done.

I have heard people say that don't think pain in a creature who memory lasts 4 seconds is that signifigant.
I think anyone eating less meat is a good thing.

Oobie

18 years and counting! Never liked fish either.

Nature Boy

Has anyone noticed any health problems after going veggie? That question's especially for peolpe who have been veggie for a while.

Oh and in case it's not obvious, vegans are included in the "How long have you been veggie" poll!

Tar.Aldarion

Moonbaby wrote:

I have heard people say that don't think pain in a creature who memory lasts 4 seconds is that signifigant.

Then again, I believe they thought it was 3 seconds, and well it is a complete fallacy.
In fact, fish are even said to eavesdrop on each other in studies.

Just a poll to see how long people have been veggie

A few years, the problem I had becoming one was the only food I truly like is meat. One day i just flat gave it up and said I would stop eating it and either starve or eat foods I don't like.

I can never understand the thing about fish. Why do people only eat fish but not any other animal?

Also, because of health benefits, people believe that fish are a super-animal or something. Because of the breaking down of some chemicals in them though, there are some better alternatives.
Fish is certainly more healthy that eating way to much red meat.

There was a myth about that fish don't feel pain, dunno where it came from, possibly fishermen like meself trying to convince themselves that if fish were put back after catching that no harm was done.

I remember some quote about somebody that thought this, caught a fish, and from then on became vegetarian, it's a bit of an odd myth to have around.

nando

Veggie for 12 years now.

Had always felt bad eating animals but actually originally stopped eating meat to annoy my mother when I was 11. Thought about it lots then and decided I would keep it up for better reasons, especially since I had no problems with it.

I've never had any health problems because of it and my iron levels are always high when I go to donate blood. My dad likes to blame any minor illness I may have on my lack of meat though.

I don't eat fish but those of my veggie friends who do, say it is because they are veggie based on the animal's quality of life, and therefore have no problem eating sea fish since they are free before being caught.

Dr.Louis

Been a veggie all my life- almost 18 years now! Never been to the doctor in my life- and no, not because im stubborn, because I've never needed to lol!

rockbeer

Nature Boy wrote:

I can never understand the thing about fish. Why do people only eat fish but not any other animal?

FWIW, I eat wild fish but no other flesh... because I won't eat any animal that was farmed, nor any animal that I'm not prepared to hunt, kill and prepare myself. I don't believe it's inherently wrong to kill for food, but I do have a major problem with modern animal farming.

By the way, I don't call myself a vegetarian. Never understood how people can call themselves vegetarians and then say "Oh but I do eat fish".

Nature Boy

rockbeer wrote:

Never understood how people can call themselves vegetarians and then say "Oh but I do eat fish"

I don't know why, but that drives me insane, especially after i became veggie. It seems as though people just don't know what a vegetarian is. I think non-vegetarians who call themselves vegetarian give proper vegetarians a bad name. Everone always asks me if i eat fish (and sometimes chicken!) even if i've told them 50 bloody times! simply because they're confused about what a vegetarian actually is!

Conar

Nature Boy wrote:

I don't know why, but that drives me insane, especially after i became veggie. It seems as though people just don't know what a vegetarian is. I think non-vegetarians who call themselves vegetarian give proper vegetarians a bad name. Everone always asks me if i eat fish (and sometimes chicken!) even if i've told them 50 bloody times! simply because they're confused about what a vegetarian actually is!

I call myself vegetarian all the time because pescatarian just isn't understood.
Its also because its easier to tell my daughter to tell peoples parents etc that she is vegetarian. That way they don't get confused and give her chicken or sausages at parties etc.

I was born into a vegetarian family but I started eating meat when I was 20ish for a year or 2 then settled down to pescatarianism. I just hated eating out and being limitted to the single veggie dish as was often the case.

My family, not so much me as I don't look after myself very well, are extremely healthy and always have been. Vegetarianism definitely works well for them.

***EDIT***
Just out of interest, do vegetarians here eat eggs?
That question will probably annoy some people but I had to ask.

Tar.Aldarion

It varies from person to person.
If you eat eggs and dairy you are an ovo-lacto vegetarian.
Ovo being the egg eating part and lacto the dairy.
I eat eggs but they have to be from somewhere I know.
None of this caged stuff...

Oobie

Like Nando, I never had any health problems and my iron levels are always high when I donate blood. Fish eating people are kown as pseudo-vegetarians according to vegsoc.ie because they don't understand the concept of vegetarianism.

Nature Boy

I hate the words "pescetarian" and "pseudo-vegetarian" and "semi-vegetarian" and "pesco-vegetarian" and so on cos they're just plays on the word vegetarian.

If they really want to have a word for themselves it should be a completely different word.

Tar.Aldarion

Pescetarian is a different word.

Nature Boy

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

Pescetarian is a different word.

I mean one that doesn't sound like vegetarian

sweet-rasmus

Nature Boy wrote:

Everone always asks me if i eat fish (and sometimes chicken!) even if i've told them 50 bloody times! simply because they're confused about what a vegetarian actually is!

when will people ever learn?! i find them to be the most annoying questions ever!

rockbeer

Oobie wrote:

Fish eating people are kown as pseudo-vegetarians according to vegsoc.ie because they don't understand the concept of vegetarianism.

Can't log on to vegsoc.ie - '502 Bad gateway' - so I may be taking their bizarre-sounding statement about 'the concept of vegetarianism' out of context... Did you mean vegetarian.ie?

But that sort of thing makes me laugh. Didn't realize that vegsoc.ie were the authority on what vegetarianism is. I always thought it might mean different things to different people, and that people might have different reasons for being veggie. Obviously I was wrong and will defer to their superior knowledge.

Actually I hate this whole ideas of labels. Vegetarian, vegan, fruitarian, why does it matter what you call yourself? Every time you eat something it's a choice. I try to make good choices most of the time, but I'm not going to kill myself for not always making the perfect choice.

Nature Boy

rockbeer wrote:

Actually I hate this whole ideas of labels. Vegetarian, vegan, fruitarian, why does it matter what you call yourself? Every time you eat something it's a choice. I try to make good choices most of the time, but I'm not going to kill myself for not always making the perfect choice.

I don't think anyone has a problem with people choosing what they want to eat. The point is that some people associate themselves with the incorrect "label".

I call myself vegetarian because my diet just so happens to fit the definition of the word vegetarian, which can be found in any dictionary, encyclopedia, website etc, not just vegsoc.ie!!

Peanut

rockbeer wrote:

...
Actually I hate this whole ideas of labels. Vegetarian, vegan, fruitarian, why does it matter what you call yourself? Every time you eat something it's a choice. I try to make good choices most of the time, but I'm not going to kill myself for not always making the perfect choice.

Kindof agree with you there but we need labels as practical groupings for stuff... so if we see 'vegetarian' on a menu or something, then we can have some sort of consensual definition as to what that is.

rockbeer

Nature Boy wrote:

I don't think anyone has a problem with people choosing what they want to eat. The point is that some people associate themselves with the incorrect "label".

I call myself vegetarian because my diet just so happens to fit the definition of the word vegetarian, which can be found in any dictionary, encyclopedia, website etc, not just vegsoc.ie!!

As I noted in an earlier post, I don't describe myself as a vegetarian because I eat fish from time to time, and to me vegetarianism is a flesh-free diet. However, IMHO, the point is that other people don't always see it the same way, and it's impossible to say precisely what the label means.

It's not as black and white as you imagine. There really isn't a single, simple, unambiguous definition of the word vegetarian. Dictionaries are full of grey areas. For example, the Britannica states '(a diet) consisting wholly of vegetables, fruits, and sometimes eggs or dairy products'. Similarly, from the Oxford Compact: 'a person who abstains from eating meat, and sometimes also fish, eggs and dairy products.'

Sometimes? When exactly?? Who determines what's acceptable??? And so the semantic arguments begin.

This is why I don't like the whole labelling thing.

On a tangent, the whole 'why fish?' thing is quite interesting. Historically, the essential nature of fish has often been regarded as being very different to that of land-dwelling animals. These beliefs usually had no biological foundation, but they have become deeply ingrained into our culture. The cathars and other gnostic christians ate no meat, but were happy to eat fish as they believed that they reproduced asexually. Completely misguided from a modern perspective, but the perception of fish as somehow 'different' persists.

Nature Boy

rockbeer wrote:

it's impossible to say precisely what the label means.

It's not as black and white as you imagine. There really isn't a single, simple, unambiguous definition of the word vegetarian.

That oxford compact definition is too weak. But I think it can be agreed that in general, the definition of the word vegetarian is that it's a flesh free diet (at its most basic).

I don't think there's a point in one person having a definition and another having a different definition, because what's the point in using the word if everyone has a different meaning for it?

rockbeer

Nature Boy wrote:

I don't think there's a point in one person having a definition and another having a different definition, because what's the point in using the word if everyone has a different meaning for it?

My point exactly. What's the point in using the word...

That's the nature of words; they're imprecise and their meanings evolve over time as a reflection of useage. They're only symbols after all, which leaves them open to interpretation. That's fine for creative writing and general conversation, while disciplines where precision matters e.g. sciences and technologies tend to create their own terms with very specific meanings, often misunderstood and misused by the rest of us, but properly understood by those who need to work with them.

But when it comes to labelling people, I think you're looking for the impossible. How can you hope to achieve a definition that everyone agrees on? Who decides what is the correct definition? The millions of 'fish-eating vegetarians' out there certainly wouldn't agree with either you or me. Absolute definitions require universal acceptance, and that just isn't going to happen. There isn't a 'word authority' who decides these things: the meaning of words is determined by useage. And very often, by prejudice.

Even before I started eating fish again I pretty much stopped calling myself a vegetarian. I got completely fed up with people leaping to their own misguided conclusions about my beliefs and my attitude towards them. Funny how hostile and defensive some meat-eaters can get when you mention that you're a veggie

Tar.Aldarion

yeah sometimes it goes like: Vegetarian huh? YOU THINK YOU ARE BTTER THAN ME.
Me: Well, from that response, yeah...

(:


I prefered when we were called pythagoreans, and I want that name back.

Nature Boy

rockbeer wrote:

My point exactly. What's the point in using the word...

That's the nature of words; they're imprecise and their meanings evolve over time as a reflection of useage. They're only symbols after all, which leaves them open to interpretation. That's fine for creative writing and general conversation, while disciplines where precision matters e.g. sciences and technologies tend to create their own terms with very specific meanings, often misunderstood and misused by the rest of us, but properly understood by those who need to work with them.

But when it comes to labelling people, I think you're looking for the impossible. How can you hope to achieve a definition that everyone agrees on? Who decides what is the correct definition? The millions of 'fish-eating vegetarians' out there certainly wouldn't agree with either you or me. Absolute definitions require universal acceptance, and that just isn't going to happen. There isn't a 'word authority' who decides these things: the meaning of words is determined by useage. And very often, by prejudice.

Good point, I suppose if enough people want to include fish eaters as vegetarians then that's what'll happen.

But to avoid the confusion we all have to deal with, i think there should be two seperate words.

rockbeer

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

yeah sometimes it goes like: Vegetarian huh? YOU THINK YOU ARE BTTER THAN ME.

Exactly. And often followed in short order by the accusations of hipocrisy and inconsistency. AREN'T THOSE LEATHER SHOES YOU'RE WEARING?

As though the only alternative to absolute moral purity and cleansing the world of all ills was to partake fully in it's destruction.

I must have forgotten signing the form where I promised to justify all my choices to any meat eater who happens along with a chip on his or her shoulder.

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

I prefered when we were called pythagoreans, and I want that name back.

Yeah that's a good one. Demands to be taken much more seriously than 'vegetarian' IMHO. And because nobody thinks they know what it means, they'd be much less likely to jump to conclusions

Peanut

rockbeer wrote:

...I must have forgotten signing the form where I promised to justify all my choices to any meat eater who happens along with a chip on his or her shoulder.

lol :rolleyes:

...Surprised at the number of people answering 16-20 in the survey, I would have thought most of the responses would be for the lower ranges.

Mentalmiss

rockbeer wrote:

Exactly. And often followed in short order by the accusations of hipocrisy and inconsistency. AREN'T THOSE LEATHER SHOES YOU'RE WEARING?

The reply is "Yes but I do not intend to eat any shoes today"

Tar.Aldarion

Dear simu once asked me by mistake, when enquiring about my vegtarianism on a lovely rainy Galway afternoon, '...and do you eat leather shoes?'
Much laughing.

Mentalmiss

Peanut wrote:

lol :rolleyes:

...Surprised at the number of people answering 16-20 in the survey, I would have thought most of the responses would be for the lower ranges.

I responded as 20+ but only because there is no 30+

Piste

rockbeer wrote:

I must have forgotten signing the form where I promised to justify all my choices to any meat eater who happens along with a chip on his or her shoulder.

Yeah I hate having to justify my vegetarianism to people, because they always want a big debate on it, which I don't want. Usually I just say "I don't like meat" (such a lie!) because no-one can argue with that.

Tar.Aldarion

...but it tastes so good?

Piste

It does

Tar.Aldarion

So I hear.

Do poeple here celebrate their anniversary of becoming a vegetarian, or is that just me?

AuntieAoife

I'm 13 years and counting. My Dad has a brother with a farm and once I copped where my nice lamb dinners were coming from that was the end of my meat eating days!

Once met a girl in Glasgow who told me she was also veggie. A few days later we were out at dinner and she ordered carbonara (sp?). I mentioned it and and she told me she ate white meat, and pork is pale enough to qualify!

Backtoblack

rockbeer wrote:

My point exactly. What's the point in using the word...

That's the nature of words; they're imprecise and their meanings evolve over time as a reflection of useage. They're only symbols after all, which leaves them open to interpretation. That's fine for creative writing and general conversation, while disciplines where precision matters e.g. sciences and technologies tend to create their own terms with very specific meanings, often misunderstood and misused by the rest of us, but properly understood by those who need to work with them.

But when it comes to labelling people, I think you're looking for the impossible. How can you hope to achieve a definition that everyone agrees on? Who decides what is the correct definition? The millions of 'fish-eating vegetarians' out there certainly wouldn't agree with either you or me. Absolute definitions require universal acceptance, and that just isn't going to happen. There isn't a 'word authority' who decides these things: the meaning of words is determined by useage. And very often, by prejudice.

Even before I started eating fish again I pretty much stopped calling myself a vegetarian. I got completely fed up with people leaping to their own misguided conclusions about my beliefs and my attitude towards them. Funny how hostile and defensive some meat-eaters can get when you mention that you're a veggie

I've mentioned this on another thread but a fish eating vegetarian should actually be calling themselves a pescetarian. IMO its unfair to true vegetarian to accept the term vegetarian if you do eat fish because you are not in fact a true vegetarian (look at the dictionary). I am a pescetarian, end of story.
Its fooking annoying though, that people don't know the 2 classifications because I am always having to explain the term - often to mixed reactions -one person told me not to bother people with such terms - like the mere mortals would not understand - ffs!
Anyway. A fish eater is not a vegetarian to the truest meaning of the word.

I gave up meat a year ago (only. boo me!!!!!! ) and when i did, i started as a pescetarian because i thought it may be easier for me to begin with. It is a bloody good start at least - and I am proud of my resolution.
I eat fish, not too often now. But perhaps in the future i will decide to pledge to full vegetarianism.. and its quite possible that i shall! But for the mean time I am a pescetarian.

thank you for listening.
here's the link(dictionary):
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pescetarian
here's the link (Encyclopedia)
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Pesco/pollo_vegetarianism

Please do take the time to have a quick glance!

nervous_twitch

4 years.

I havent noticed it for the most part, only on the occasional venture out with my family to some establishment which has been kind enough to privilege us a vegetable stir-fry/curry :rolleyes: I tend to eat a lot of Indian now, just for the range.

I don't eat fish. I do eat eggs, but not battery eggs.

MagnumForce

Why is there no "All my life" option?

I hate the question "Why are you a vegetarian?" I got fed up of explaining and now I just say "I was born that way...and so were you, I just kept doing it."

I also hate the question "Do you eat fish?" Of course I don't eat ****ing fish! Im a vegetarian! ahhh!! I don't get this whole "But fish isn't meat" thing, It's the living tissue of a living breathing animal, what else is it?!

Also what annoys me is the lack of vegetarian options in some restaurants, it really is quite annoying to go to a restaurant and realise that there is nothing there you can eat.

Funny story actually, Once when I was about 9 or something, I was at a friends birthday party in McDonalds, and I ordered a Veggie burger, and after much discussion i thought it was settled, imagine my suprise when the orders came and I opened my "veggie burger" to find that they had just given me a Big Mac with the burger taken out, with meat juices still present and accounted for. God I hate McDonalds.

viggi-tea

11-15 years option for me.

bohsman

Ive been a vegetarian 99% of my life, no interest in eating meat, never liked it when I tried it. Technically Im a Pesci whateveryouwanttocallit but damned if Im explaining that term wherever I go, I eat fish fairly regularly, basically I eat what I want and dont follow any rules telling me what I can and cant eat. I dont care about the killing of animals etc and when I was growing up the health aspect never really came into it either bar not making chocolate mousse because of salmonella.

Getting the ham pulled out of a ham and cheese sandwich made hours earlier down the country is the most annoying thing for me. Apologies for making it harder for real vegetarians to explain that they dont eat fish but meh.

Nature Boy

bohsman wrote:

Technically Im a Pesci whateveryouwanttocallit but damned if Im explaining that term wherever I go

People are always going to ask questions anyway so you might as well explain your diet when they ask you. It's not that hard: "I eat no animal flesh except for fish"

Esmereldina

Hey all! I'm relatively new to boards and only discovered the veggie forum
today I'm been a vegetarian for almost 4 years. For about half a year after that I did eat fish but then I gave it up too.
Regarding the reasons that people often see fish as a special case when it comes to giving up meat... Kurt Cobain also said that 'It's ok to eat fish, cause they don't have any feelings'... He lied of, course Finding Nemo was a real eye opener there...

samhain's son

I was veggie for about 3 years then gave in for about six and then back when the foot and mouth crisis happened I realised I couldn't eat meat so is that about 5 years ago? However I had a baby and started eating fish while I was breastfeeding and still do occasionally especially if eating out as sometimes there just isn't anything else on the menu.

I loved the taste of meat and sometimes I have dreams that I have had a steak but when I wake up I picture a cow or a pig in my head and I know I couldn't eat him or her. Sometimes when I we are out and the smell hits me I imagine how I would feel if someone took one of my children for food and my longing goes away.

So I didn't vote in the poll because I am not a vegetarian but will be again soon I hope.

Oh I forgot to post I've been veggie for 16 years, I don't exactly remeber my start date as I drifted into it but i was in 4th class.

inverted_world

Nature Boy wrote:

People are always going to ask questions anyway so you might as well explain your diet when they ask you. It's not that hard: "I eat no animal flesh except for fish"

I really don't understand why you are getting so wound up about this. I know a few pescetarians who call themselves veggie and it doesn't bother me at all. I'm veggie because it's a healthier diet, and most pescetarians are because of health too, not because killing animals is wrong. They do live a mostly vegetarian diet, I know very few pescetarians who eat fish more than once a week, if even. In fact, pescetarians apparently live longer than vegetarians. It's not up to you to worry about what other people's dietary beliefs are.
Sure, I know vegetarians who eat jelly, marshmallows, and gummy bears. It doesn't matter. It's not giving anyone a bad name, so lighten up!

Tar.Aldarion

Those people you mention are not vegetarian, that is not what the word means.
He is getting wound up because it is misrepresenting what he is, because of other poeple.
It also leads to being asked, 'Do you eat fish?' five million times.
People can't seem to tell that a fish is not different from an animal in any sort of great respect.

'In fact, pescetarians apparently live longer than vegetarians.'

Some links please?

Whilst throwing about these facts...
There are also studies that show that the smarter you are the more likely you will become vegetarian.

inverted_world

I read it in a report in a newspaper a couple of months ago, the Irish Times I think, and I can't find a link.

The attitude I'm getting off some people in this forum is quite elitist. People can eat what they want, without others looking down on them or getting their knickers in a twist over what they decide to call themselves. It's not those who might eat a bit of fish on a regular occasion but prefer to be called vegetarian who are "misrepresenting" us full time veggies, but but the ones who mouth off about what someone should and shouldn't eat. This is nearly as bad as telling a meat eater that their diet is wrong! It's not a religion!

People are not so thick that they don't know what vegetarian is, believe it or not.
The only time I've been asked such questions has been when someone else is cooking for me, and I'd rather be asked than them wrongly assume. A vegetarian menu is very unlikely to include fish, so I don't see how some vegetarians giving themselves a little bit of leeway is affecting you or anyone else.

Peanut

inverted_world wrote:

People are not so thick that they don't know what vegetarian is, believe it or not.

uhhh I beg to differ!!!
Really how many times have I been asked do i eat fish/chicken/dairy whatever.. I've lost track!

It's in everyone's best interest not to fudge around terms, and it's not really some elitist thing, in fact I feel it's the opposite - people will sometimes say they are veggie when they are not in order to try to have some cool social karma type attitude. This is usually with females as well, as a guy saying it is more likely to be disparaged for his lack of manliness!

Anyway, the main reason this annoys me, is, as you say, that vegetarianism is not a hugely difficult concept to grasp, but lots of people don't. Not that I'd really expect them to if they are not interested in it themselves, but confusing the issue only makes things worse. It's a bit like saying you are a Catholic but with a bit of Islam thrown in!

rockbeer

What's really weird about this whole discussion over what is and what isn't veggie is the need for strict rules and definitions some people seem to have. Fish might be 'obviously' not veggie to many people, but there are many more vague areas. Once you start nit picking there's no end to it - even the 'flesh or not' viewpoint has holes in it because the world isn't simple enough to be easily labelled for our convenience. To whit: do all you serious veggies know what the e numbers on processed foods mean? Do you know or care that Guinness and many other beers aren't veggie? Are fish scales actually flesh, or are they an acceptable animal derivative? Do you always ask what's gone into stuff (e.g. soup) in restaurants? Do you know for sure that your baked goods don't contain gelatine? Are you bothered that calves die to support the dairy industry? Drinking milk and eating cheese are as tied up with cow-death as actually eating the flesh...

I've been 'mostly veggie' for over 20 years and I've never met a veggie or vegan who doesn't allow themselves some exceptions that seem acceptable to them. Total purity is an impossible dream, the pursuit of which is by its very nature elitist because, in the minds of people who think in those terms, it always comes down to the superiority of those making what are peceived to be the greatest sacrifices. Which is just crap.

Personally I can't see there's any difference between inadvertently eating gelatine - or drinking beer-finings - and consciously eating fish (or anything else for that matter) occasionally. Ignorance is no defence, and arguably it's worse than making an informed choice. To me it's not about purity, it's about awareness, and about manifesting that awareness as often as reasonably possible without becoming some kind of flag waving obsessive. No matter how pure you are, you aren't going to change the world by your choices. So just find a level you're happy with, get on with it, and let others do the same without letting their inconsistencies get to you.

It's easy to accuse others of hypocrisy and inconsistency, but at the end of the day you're only answerable to yourself for the degree of ethics and health-consciousness you exercise in your dietary choices. Why get so hot and bothered about other people's choices?

One more question. If I don't eat meat for twenty years, then have a big juicy steak, how long do I have to be meat free for before I can call myself a veggie again? Somebody must have a simple answer, surely.