Thinking about creatine

PeadarofAodh

I'm 12 and a half stone, 6ft 5" and I'm getting very into my rowing at this stage. What I need to do is bulk up both in size and weight. Although I'm finding I'm increasing my muscle mass very slowly, it's no longer possible for me to go to the gym as often because of the increase in my rowing training- I'm therefore thinking about using creatine.

I have a few concerns: 1)Does it affect your fitness levels at all?
2)Should I start on it slowly?
3)Are there any cheap creatine products people can
recommend as I'm on a student's budget?
Thanks for any help

rubadub

PeadarofAodh wrote:

I have a few concerns: 1)Does it affect your fitness levels at all?
2)Should I start on it slowly?
3)Are there any cheap creatine products people can
recommend as I'm on a student's budget?
Thanks for any help

There are plenty of webpages going very indepth to answer 1 & 2. Try www.exrx.net for starters on everything to do with training.

Creatine is cheap, and so is protein from www.bulkpowders.co.uk

Postage is the same up to a large weight, you may want to go splits with your team-mates.

Exar Khun

This might help but take it with a pinch of salt as this site is also a dedicated supplement supersite. http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/gastelu8.htm

t-ha

PeadarofAodh wrote:

I'm 12 and a half stone, 6ft 5"

Many people who have tall & skinny frames respond well to low workout volumes and LOTS of food, so don't assume that your lower workout volume will put a stop to your gains. The important thing is to eat plenty of food, and particularly to get in carbs and protein when you're rowing so you don't lose muscle.

Creatine isn't all that for most people when it comes to gaining, though it may help with your rowing training. If you want to add muscle, eat more food.

PeadarofAodh

"If you want to add muscle, eat more food."

At this stage I think I've got that into my head- I eat a large volume of food with plenty of protein and carbs. The thing is I do a huge amount of cardiovascular training so I was asking about creatine because I thought I could perhaps do with a supplement to help me gain muscle.

slicus ricus

PeadarofAodh wrote:

"If you want to add muscle, eat more food."

At this stage I think I've got that into my head- I eat a large volume of food with plenty of protein and carbs. The thing is I do a huge amount of cardiovascular training so I was asking about creatine because I thought I could perhaps do with a supplement to help me gain muscle.

I agree with T-Ha on this (see above quote). Creatine is a good supplement to your diet - the key word being supplement. Eating appropriate quantities of the right foods is the most important thing - Creatine will add to this. There seems to be this perception that if you take creatine, you'll get huge - this simply isnt the case, as creatine is just a dietary supplement.

If you do supplement with Creatine, I would suggest either Kre Alkaline or Creatine Ethyll Ester. I would not reccomend Creatine Monohydrate due to low absorption rates.

PeadarofAodh

Thanks for the suggestions, is there anywhere you could recommend for good prices?

I do realise that weight gain comes with good eating, it's just that I was gaining slow enough before I started my new fitness regime and I think that a supplement would help me in the right direction. I'm not looking for immediate, monstrous gain- I just need to have put on a decent amount of weight before the race season kicks in.

slicus ricus

PeadarofAodh wrote:

Thanks for the suggestions, is there anywhere you could recommend for good prices?

I do realise that weight gain comes with good eating, it's just that I was gaining slow enough before I started my new fitness regime and I think that a supplement would help me in the right direction. I'm not looking for immediate, monstrous gain- I just need to have put on a decent amount of weight before the race season kicks in.

The only place I know of that does Kre Alkaline is Nutrition Connection on Caple St nd it is fairly cheap - think its bout E30 for a couple of months supply. You can buy Creatine Ethyll Ester in most supp store around dublin - its a bit more expensive.

Do you supplement with Protein or take a post-workout shake? Nutrition X are making a new Post Workout supplement called RAM, which is very good and very reasonably priced - it doesnt have Creatine in it though. You can get RAM in Jon's store in Phibsoboro - if you PM him, im sure he'd be happy to give you directions.

PeadarofAodh

Thanks a lot for the help Ricus.

Unfortunately I don't really have the funds to accomodate creatine on top of protein supplements so I figure seeing as I already have a very high protein intake it'd be more worth my while investing in creatine. I used to take whey protein but never really noticed any significant difference in recovery time so I stopped using it.

walt0r

This creatine is dangerous craic. Make sure you research it well before you cross over to the dark side. I've heard it can leave you with infertile or with deformed children.
On a more serious note, I don't like creatine. Although I found some strength and size gains (sorta bloated) over the few weeks I used it, I didn't like the fact it gave me acne. And it WAS definitely the creatine that did it because I cycled it 3-4x now and each time I flare up when on it. A shame really, as I have heaps of weight gainers/powders with high doses of creatine which are now worth damn all to me so I should just give them away.

mloc

walt0r wrote:

I didn't like the fact it gave me acne. And it WAS definitely the creatine that did it

Was it pure creatine powder or a creatine-based supplement (e.g. celltech) that caused this problem?

Anyway, on topic, I know a few rowers of all abilities, and being honest, most of the less experienced ones (e.g. less than 5-10 years in the sport) do not eat enough to build muscle. As a rower you will well know that increased muscle mass leads to higher power ratio, and is neccessary along with improvement in techinique.

At 12 and a half stone and training seriously (I'm using my knowledge of the training undertaken by the UCD mens inter crew as a guideline), the amount of calories you need is going to be about 4000 a day. On top of this, you will also need about 175 grams of protein a day. The calorific demands placed on your body by such a huge volume of cardiovascular training means in order to remain in a state of positive calorie balance, you need to eat an absolute **** load of food. 4000 calories a day is just a starting point.

Being honest, until you get the basic food right, forget about creatine. It won't be a huge benefit.

davyjose

Creatine is great for recovery, and am sure it would help with training, however it does not contain calories. The only way you can gain size and weight is by intaking more cals than you burn. A ration of 60:40/Carbs:Protein should do the job.

gymrabbit

PeadarofAodh wrote:

I'm 12 and a half stone, 6ft 5" and I'm getting very into my rowing at this stage.

**** rowing and join the boxing club man. what college are you in?

t-ha

PeadarofAodh wrote:

"If you want to add muscle, eat more food."

At this stage I think I've got that into my head- I eat a large volume of food with plenty of protein and carbs. The thing is I do a huge amount of cardiovascular training so I was asking about creatine because I thought I could perhaps do with a supplement to help me gain muscle.

Creatine is used to supply muscles with energy, it is not involved in building them in the first place. For that you need protein & the right conditions for protein synthesis and uptake (mainly insulin release - at rest this is mostly governed by what you eat).

It can help you to recover from exercise faster so you can get back into the gym sooner, thereby increasing your workout volume and helping you gain (assuming you're eating enough) - not much help if you can't make it to the gym as much nowdays. Just trying to save you cash man - I would invest in a carb/protein drink you can take while rowing to offset the damage that that can do to gains & generally increase my calorie intake before buying creatine.

PeadarofAodh

See I reckon I'm eating enough, I just find it so so difficult to calculate accurately my total calorie intake for a day. How should I go about this? Shall I post up what I've eaten today for example and see what you all think? And I've tried a few times to calculate what my protein intake adds up to but I can never work it out!

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

PeadarofAodh

I don't really have a "Workout Day" diet seeing as I have training 5 days a week and go to the gym on the off days as well as on 1 or 2 of my training days. An average day would usually resemble this though:

Breakfast: Large bowl of muesli with soya milk, 3/4 slices of bacon, 2 slices brown bread, a grapefruit and a banana

Lunch: 2 chicken breasts, 2 slices white/brown bread, cheese, leftovers (for example today I had a medium serving of fish pie) and a piece of fruit

Dinner: Meat dish with 2/3 vegetables, salad, dessert

Evening snack: 100g mixed nuts, maybe some leftovers

Any suggestions?

Dragan

BCAA's?

slicus ricus

PeadarofAodh wrote:

I don't really have a "Workout Day" diet seeing as I have training 5 days a week and go to the gym on the off days as well as on 1 or 2 of my training days. An average day would usually resemble this though:

Breakfast: Large bowl of muesli with soya milk, 3/4 slices of bacon, 2 slices brown bread, a grapefruit and a banana

Lunch: 2 chicken breasts, 2 slices white/brown bread, cheese, leftovers (for example today I had a medium serving of fish pie) and a piece of fruit

Dinner: Meat dish with 2/3 vegetables, salad, dessert

Evening snack: 100g mixed nuts, maybe some leftovers

Any suggestions?

Thats only 4 meals - you should add another 2. Maybe, you would be better off spreading the two chicken fillets you eat in one meal over 2 meals. Then, if you add another meal in as well, that would bring you up to 6 meals. A protein shake would be sufficient to replace a meal as well, particularly after your training (make sure you get carbs in as well after training!).

The best way to do it is to get protein into you every 2.5 - 3 hours, as that way it will be absorbed and will aid continuous recovery and therefore, growth.

t-ha

PeadarofAodh wrote:

Any suggestions?

Breakfast: Large bowl of muesli with soya milk, 3/4 slices of bacon, 2 slices brown bread, a grapefruit and a banana

Elevenses: Large bowl of muesli with soya milk, 3/4 slices of bacon, 2 slices brown bread, a grapefruit and a banana

Lunch: 2 chicken breasts, 2 slices white/brown bread, cheese, leftovers (for example today I had a medium serving of fish pie) and a piece of fruit

Afternoon: 2 chicken breasts, 2 slices white/brown bread, cheese, leftovers (for example today I had a medium serving of fish pie) and a piece of fruit

Dinner: Meat dish with 2/3 vegetables, salad, dessert

Evening snack: 100g mixed nuts, maybe some leftovers, two packets of jaffa cakes covered in cream.



Ha ha, ok I'm kidding (sort of) but you get the idea, make a concerted effort to eat more than you're doing now. Don't worry about exact calories, like Daveirl said, just eat alot & if you get fat too fast (unlikely) then tone it down.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

davyjose

Yeah I think the general gist is to get more Protein/Carbs into you rather than Creatine, so perhaps rather than spending your money on that you could buy Protein shake mixes (something like Maximuscle Cyclone or Promax) and have one after training as that extra meal.

mloc

davyjose wrote:

something like Maximuscle Cyclone or Promax

Don't buy Maximuscle. Seriously. Just don't. There's a million and one reasons why not to, I'll let others explain if necessary.

A weight gainer powder might be a good idea, are you perchance in UCD?

PeadarofAodh

Yeah I'm in UCD. So you're saying a weight-gainer powder would benefit me more than say creatine? Are there any you can recommend?

Thanks for all the help guys

mloc

You didn't perchance ask a member of the men's inter 8 crew about this while on a run recently?

Yeah, I'd say go for a good weightgainer. If you add it to your current eating regime, or even increase the amount of eating your doing AND add the weightgainer, you'll definately see an increase in muscle mass. Something like ON serious mass or similar would do the trick. As for where to get it, theres a guy here who runs a shop in town (can't remember his username, sorry!) or possibly send a PM to easygainer who sells a wide range of stuff, and is also conveniently in UCD a lot.

PeadarofAodh

I've sent Easygainer a PM so I'll see what he comes up with.

I might well have asked one of the inter crew, I asked JH as well but he didn't really have much advice to give apart from keep going to the gym. I'm guessing you're in the boat club then?