Use Daytime Dipped Lights ....It could save your life!

Silvera

Regular visitors to this forum will know that I have long being an advocate of using dipped headlights during daytime hours for safety reasons (read my sig below!)

At this time of year with overcast conditions, shorter daytime hours, etc it is even more important to be seen when driving.

(I emphasis 'to be seen' as some drivers seem to think that they only need to turn on their dipped lights when they can't see where they are going! :rolleyes:)

I am still amazed by the amount of drivers out their who steadfastly refuse to turn on their lights in poor driving conditions ....or drive on their 'candlelights' (sidelights)!

In EU countries it is illegal to drive on sidelights, and also, most european countries insist that all drivers use daytime dipped lights from October to March each year.

The fact that most EU countries have these laws should tell Irish people that using dipped lights is a good idea!

AFAIK, so far only Mayo county council has 'gotten their act together' to encourage this safety-enhancing measure. They have erected a permanent sign on the road to Achill Island advocating that drivers 'USE DAYTIME DIPPED LIGHTS'.

And don't forget - Using Daytime Dipped Lights will reduce you chances of being in an accident by 36% !! (Advanced Driving Course Fact)

tech

Hi there

I've been on the road for over 6 years now coving over 55,000 miles a year and always drive in Dimmed head lights, also accident free so far so good

touch wood

Silvera

tech wrote:

Hi there

I've been on the road for over 6 years now coving over 55,000 miles a year and always drive in Dimmed head lights, also accident free so far so good

touch wood

It's a pity that more Irish drivers don't have your streetwise approach!


I believe that in the next 5-10 years all vehicles will have permanent dipped driving lights.....and we will look back in disbelief that we ever drove around without our lights switched on!

apeking

Not trying to be smart but what are your Daytime Dipped Lights, i have 3 settings on my lights,

1st is just crappy lights i turn on when its just dull,

2nd are what i use when driving at night on well light roads

3rd i use on back roads and where there is no street lights

So are u saying use 1st or 2nd??

CrowdedHouse

I think cars should be wired so it's not possible to drive with only sidelights.

jesus_thats_gre

Do the same myself. Picked up the habit from when I used to visit family in Finland.

_Kaiser_

I'm with Sivera on this. As I've also mentioned before I drive with the dipped lighs on regardless of time of day or weather. The point is to be seen by other drivers at a distance - especially if your car is black/silver.

Seth Brundle

apeking wrote:

Not trying to be smart but what are your Daytime Dipped Lights, i have 3 settings on my lights,

1st is just crappy lights i turn on when its just dull,

2nd are what i use when driving at night on well light roads

3rd i use on back roads and where there is no street lights

So are u saying use 1st or 2nd??

1 = side lights
2 = dipped lights
3 = full beam

I believe that he is referring to number 2 but number is an option.

I recall that last time this was discussed and a number of bikers find that having all cars use DRLs would make them less visible.

Redrocket

I agree with silvera, i drive most of the time with dipped headlights on, except on the motorway when not in traffic (and in the day). thats for mpg reasons. i find when in town just before dusk is when dipped headlights are most useful..
cars without dipped headlights at this time are much more difficult to see.
and the emphasis really is on visibility, so that other drivers can see you because you have your dipped heads on

mike65

The EU are looking into making this manditory right now (ie expect legistation in about 5 years!).

Mike.

nialler

all the time, set the computer to turn on the lights the moment the car is started. Just look on the roads next time, which is more visible, car with lights on car without.

Capt'n Midnight

why not make us all drive orange cars

have there been any studies done on effects on pedestrians and cyclists who are hidden by this amount of light ?

mike65

Which are you more likely to hit in poor conditions?

Mike.

Silvera

nialler wrote:

all the time, set the computer to turn on the lights the moment the car is started. Just look on the roads next time, which is more visible, car with lights on car without.

As a matter of interest .....
What sort of car do you drive?

Thats part of the problem, Irish drivers don't think about things that could improve their safety on the roads, like seeing that using their lights will make them more visible and therefore improve their own safety - and that of others - on our roads!

Case in point, last Wednesday evening I was exiting from a side road. I looked both ways a couple of times and then drove onto the main road. As I straightened up my car I saw a van coming towards me. The conditions were good but he was driving in the shadow of the hedge which made him difficult to see. (For the record, he was a long way up the road .....and yes my eyesight is fine! )

It just struck me that it would have been much easier to see him sooner had he switched on his dipped lights!

AMurphy

My wagon, old and all as it may be has automatic headlights, so I never switch them off ( they are permanently set to dipped and on), they come on with the engine and go off with the engine shutoff and door open.
Unfortunately there is a little flaw in the logic block that controls this activity.... so I have had the blasted thing drain the battery several (about 5) times in the last few years and leave me stranded... so I invested in a set of jumper cables which now reside in the boot.
Change the bulbs every 2 years or so.
I just wish I could set the heads to ON and leave the side and tail lights off.

J_R

Hi,

I always drive on dipped. Permanently leave my main light switch on a setting which have the lights come on automatically when doors unlocked, go off 30 seconds after ignition key removed and car locked.

However there is one situation where dipped lights can be dangerous. That is, where you are on the main road approaching a junction and there is a car waiting to emerge.

If the road you are on has an uneven surface, your lights will rise and fall. The car driver waiting to emerge may read this that you are flashing at him to proceed.

Happened to me once. Just as I approached the car driver gave me a "Thank You" wave and drove out in front. Managed to stop in time - Just.

Driving school in England few years ago was not so lucky. Learner drove out in front of a Volvo which was approaching at high speed.

So, if running on dipped lights watch out for emerging traffic.

ninty9er

I'd say there's more a case for gettikng manufacturers to dump lightswitches altogether and just have engine electronic triggered DRL than getting some of the twits on our roads to light up

Töpher

First thing I do after turning on the ignition is turn on dipped beams. Force of habit.

Del2005

I've said this before and some other people have said it aswell but DRLs for cars is very bad for other road users ie Motorbikes, bicycles and pedestrians. What happens now is that most bikers use DRLs and they are more visable then cars but when all cars are using DRLs then car drivers won't see anyone else, which they rarely do anyway.

As people have said, cars pull out in front of them now and they are in cars! So how is a more vunerable road user supposed to stay alive if all a car driver does is look for 2 big lights and not 1 small one or none at all on a bicycle/pedestrian? See the link below from MAG Ireland

http://www.magireland.org/actplan.htm

Daytime Running Lights
Goal: To prevent DRL being implemented in Ireland.
The proposal by the A.C.E.A. (Association of European Automobile Manufacturers in English) to include the installation of “hard-wired” daytime running lights (DRL) as a concession to safety has been rejected by the E.U. committee conducting the inquiry. The committee decided that there was insufficient evidence to suggest that DRL contributed anything to safety and took into account the F.E.M.A report which suggested that the introduction of DRL would actually pose a hazard to motorcyclists and other vulnerable road users such as cyclists and pedestrians.
I have received a letter from Commissioner de Palacio indicating that the representations made by MAG Ireland and other motorcyclists’ organisations were influential in the decision to commission a study into the effects of DRL on all road users and on the relative conspicuity of motorcyclists & cyclists. The Commissioner thanked us for our contribution to the debate on this issue.
I have written to Commissioner de Palacio welcoming this study and offering any assistance we might be able to give regarding same.
Some proposed amendments to the Road Traffic Bill, 2001 currently under debate have included the introduction of DRL in the Winter months. I have contacted Deputy Denis Naughten who has made the proposal to advise him of the negative effect such a measure would have on road safety.

dahamsta

The suggestion that cars using DRLs will makes bikers less visible is just plain nonsense. They'll simply make cars more visible, which is the entire point.

Furthermore, did the EU committeeeeeee responsible even read their own report? According to the previous poster, they're saying that DRLs don't contribute to better safety, but actually they do, but if everyone uses them they won't again. Sure and begorrah. :rolleyes:

adam

Silvera

I understand where bikers are coming from, but on balance - with all the road deaths in Ireland each year - using DRL's is a simple and effective way of saving lives.

Motorbikers and cyclists must play their part also, for example - making themselves more conspicous by wearing a high-viz jacket/vest.

DRL's have proven themselves in Sweden, Finland etc since the 1960's. It's time we caught up in Ireland!

Re Cars pulling out from side roads - I have noticed that cars are LESS likely to pull out in front of me during the daytime when I have my dipped lights on!

Right_Side

A lot of times when I drive with dipped headlights on during the day other drivers actually flash me! For example, on Christmas Day last year I was flashed three times on a 15 minute trip! Must have been a load of occassional drivers out or something... thinking they were doing me a favour :rolleyes:

FX Meister

stevenk wrote:

I agree with silvera, i drive most of the time with dipped headlights on, except

Really? How much extra do you get per gallon? Six metres? Do you also use your tea bags twice?


edit: next time I edit a thread of yours, Im throwing in a ban!

dahamsta

Right_Side wrote:

A lot of times when I drive with dipped headlights on during the day other drivers actually flash me! For example, on Christmas Day last year I was flashed three times on a 15 minute trip! Must have been a load of occassional drivers out or something... thinking they were doing me a favour :rolleyes:

This is definitely lessening these days. I used to get flashed nearly daily in the past, these days I actually wonder why people are flashing when they do, it's so rare.

adam

Del2005

dahamsta wrote:

The suggestion that cars using DRLs will makes bikers less visible is just plain nonsense. They'll simply make cars more visible, which is the entire point.

Yes and what happens if cars become more VISABLE? People will pay even less attention when looking as if they don't see a highly VISABLE car they'll pull out in front of less visable road users. As for High vise vests etc most bikers do use these and DRLs and cars STILL pull out in front of them. So if people where trained properly this wouldn't be an issue as they would be thought to look out for vunerable road users and not rely on manufactures fitting DRLs to cars to make up for peoples lack of attention when driving.

DRL's have proven themselves in Sweden, Finland etc since the 1960's. It's time we caught up in Ireland!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't these countries dark for 6 months of the year? And very few people will ride bikes on frozen roads, so there isn't as much of a conflict.

Squirrel

I only started driving about 6 months ago and I've gotten into the habit of starting the car and turning on the lights.

ArphaRima

I do use the DRL theory myself, and always drive with dipped beams to keep myself visible, though I would be slow to support legislature for it.

Environmentally speaking it would contribute a substantial amount of pollution to the atmosphere. There is no such thing as free energy. They are powered by your engine, which runs on fossil fuel. Its a tiny amount, but if its mandatory EU-wide, it becomes significant.

Redrocket

FX Meister: it just so happens i like weak tea and will use the bag as many times as i want

alias no.9

I'm with the DRL people. I've been doing as long as I've been driving. I still don't get the bikers arguement. You're either seen or you're not. People seeing other cars or bikes in addition to you makes no difference, it doesn't make you disappear from somebodies view, the human brain can process the info, but both bikes and cars will be seen at greater distances when they use DRL's compared to not using them.

franksm

I use these Hella Daytime Running Lights (DRLs) on my '5

http://www.tagfahrlicht.de/EN/index.html

They're pretty good, 16w bulbs, and sit nice & discrete in the radiator intake.

On any other car I'm in, I used dipped beams - have done so since day one.

Not to diverge too much from the topic but I had occasion to drive in the early hours on the N7 and M1 at the weekend - the number of cars with foglamps on was REALLY appalling. I know we're used to it, and it's been talked to death here, but every second car had its rear fogs on, and every car with front fogs fitted had them switched on. Made it really painful to drive. I can only think that people think they're safer at night with fogs on (and don't give a sh!t really about blinding anyone else).

Fey!

I'm with the DRL group, too. The only problem with cars is the ones that only have one side working.

As for motorcyclists, I don't see a problem - as long as the light is working it should be seen by anyone.

Cyclists are my pet problem; even on the darkest of nights I meet them in black clothes in poorly lit areas with no lights or reflective clothing. Have these people got a deathwish?

netwhizkid

Oh my god, this is the stupidest idea ever, Oh yes having your lights on in the day is such a good PC idea, lets in future have two men walking in front with red flags while driving no faster than 5MPH.

Driving with daytime lights is dangerous in normal conditions, I regularly get blinded by those bluey/white spearmint type lights during the day, I find Punto's to be the worst culprits. It is dangerous and I regularly flash those who blind me. Switch em of people it will benefit the environment and show you are a driver with at least some competency.

kippy

Not trying to be smart but what are your Daytime Dipped Lights, i have 3 settings on my lights,

1st is just crappy lights i turn on when its just dull,

2nd are what i use when driving at night on well light roads

3rd i use on back roads and where there is no street lights

So are u saying use 1st or 2nd??

You shouldn't be on the road mate if you dont know what your lights are and when they should be used.

Oh my god, this is the stupidest idea ever, Oh yes having your lights on in the day is such a good PC idea, lets in future have two men walking in front with red flags while driving no faster than 5MPH.

Driving with daytime lights is dangerous in normal conditions, I regularly get blinded by those bluey/white spearmint type lights during the day, I find Punto's to be the worst culprits. It is dangerous and I regularly flash those who blind me. Switch em of people it will benefit the environment and show you are a driver with at least some competency.

I agree, there are a lot of muppets out there with stupid coloured lights, and those that dont actually use their lights dipped, but on full beams.
I think these coloured lights should be banned,maybe they are already, I dont know.
However driving at all times on dipped normal lights should be something we all do.
Cars are more visable. The arguments for using dipped lights at all times far outweigh the arguments against.
Kippy

dahamsta

I can honestly say that in over 15 years of driving, I've never once been blinded by dipped headlights or even foglights during the day.

adam

Rew

I always drive with mine on as well. Over taking a week or so ago I nearly didn't see a an on coming silver car with no lights, but I could clearly see the car a good bit behind it with their lights on.

Iv never been blined by a car during the day, once or twice people have had their fulls on I assume by accident.

whizkid if your being blinded during the day id hate to get ina car with you at night!!

dubstub

I was driving in Italy about a month ago and my first impressions (besides the dangerous tailgating and regularly being cut-up) were how great it was that everyone had their dips on during the day, made a huge difference to the visibility of other drivers.
I found out afterwards that it has recently been introduced as law there for all motorways and outside urban areas to keep lights on at all times. It also looks like the EU will be moving to make this compulsory:

http://verify.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2401786,00.html

prospect

On a clear day I drive with my side lights on, which are quite bright actually.
Dusk and dawn or adverse weather conditions I will go up to dipped beams.

Personally I think dipped beams on a bright sunny summer afternoon is a waste of time.

alias no.9

netwhizkid wrote:

Oh my god, this is the stupidest idea ever, Oh yes having your lights on in the day is such a good PC idea, lets in future have two men walking in front with red flags while driving no faster than 5MPH.

Driving with daytime lights is dangerous in normal conditions, I regularly get blinded by those bluey/white spearmint type lights during the day, I find Punto's to be the worst culprits. It is dangerous and I regularly flash those who blind me. Switch em of people it will benefit the environment and show you are a driver with at least some competency.

Dipped headlights simply aren't bright enough to blind you during the day.

mike65

Agreed, though I DO agree about those crappy Punto lights which scroll through the colour spectrum when bouncing over undulating surfaces.

Mike.

Squirrel

franksm wrote:

I use these Hella Daytime Running Lights (DRLs) on my '5

http://www.tagfahrlicht.de/EN/index.html

They're pretty good, 16w bulbs, and sit nice & discrete in the radiator intake.

On any other car I'm in, I used dipped beams - have done so since day one.

Not to diverge too much from the topic but I had occasion to drive in the early hours on the N7 and M1 at the weekend - the number of cars with foglamps on was REALLY appalling. I know we're used to it, and it's been talked to death here, but every second car had its rear fogs on, and every car with front fogs fitted had them switched on. Made it really painful to drive. I can only think that people think they're safer at night with fogs on (and don't give a sh!t really about blinding anyone else).

I don't like people driving with front fogs on either, but some are driving lights, not fogs. Not all auxillary front lights are fogs. This isn't aimed at you, but there are a lot of people who seem to think so.

Sandwich

What is the purpose of sidelights anyway?
Is it just me, or have they been getting dimmer over the years, to be virtually useless now. I seem to remember reading somewhere that by law they are limited to a % brightness of your dippeds.

Stark

I think they're to be used when you're parked in a poorly lit area so that other cars will see you.

netwhizkid

I have never been blinded by daytime dipped lights, however when you get lights of a different spectrum ala Punto and full lights on during the day it is harsh on the eyes. Funnily enough I drive perfectly at night and even when the moron on the other side don't dip in time my sight still stays ok. Punto lights during the day = Camera Flash affect. I am shortsighted with Myopia so I guess there is a little bit of weakness in my sight but still I find my sight perfect to drive with.

Stark

netwhizkid wrote:

I am shortsighted with Myopia so I guess there is a little bit of weakness in my sight but still I find my sight perfect to drive with.

Well yes your sight should be perfect to drive with if you're wearing glasses.

Capt'n Midnight

Sandwich wrote:

What is the purpose of sidelights anyway?
Is it just me, or have they been getting dimmer over the years, to be virtually useless now. I seem to remember reading somewhere that by law they are limited to a % brightness of your dippeds.

No they have not been getting dimmer.
Head lights have been getting brighter,
- by increased wattage
- more efficient bulbs - side lights aren't halogens
- bluer - this I really hate since it's so harsh

saobh_ie

I only use my dips during lighting up hours or where enviromental conditions limit visiblity. Rain, fog, smoke... If another car driver doesn't see me coming because I haven't got my lights on I don't really think they should be driving.

I also believe the widespread use of DRL's are detrimental to the safety of other road users, pedestrians, cyclists and motorcyclists. Cars do not need DRL's to be seen.

As for DRL's making it easier for cars to be seen by the pedestrians and cyclists, the car driver should really be looking out for them instead.

It also adds to this whole, 'I've got my dipped lights on and I'm driving at the speed limit I'm safe me', culture we've got going.

The bikers DRL thing, a bike with no light amongst cars with no lights is effectivally invisible to a large percentage of road users, the bike puts on its headlight your average road user with all the intelligence of a moth is drawn to the light. If everybody drives around all day with thier lights on poof, the bikes invisible again. But it doesn't really matter a jot because the biker should be riding as if he's invisible anyway. Hell, some motorcyclists still get swept up when thier blue lights and sierns are going.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

CrowdedHouse wrote:

I think cars should be wired so it's not possible to drive with only sidelights.

welcome to the world of Saab and Volvo

kippy

I only use my dips during lighting up hours or where enviromental conditions limit visiblity. Rain, fog, smoke... If another car driver doesn't see me coming because I haven't got my lights on I don't really think they should be driving.

I also believe the widespread use of DRL's are detrimental to the safety of other road users, pedestrians, cyclists and motorcyclists. Cars do not need DRL's to be seen.

As for DRL's making it easier for cars to be seen by the pedestrians and cyclists, the car driver should really be looking out for them instead.

It also adds to this whole, 'I've got my dipped lights on and I'm driving at the speed limit I'm safe me', culture we've got going.

The bikers DRL thing, a bike with no light amongst cars with no lights is effectivally invisible to a large percentage of road users, the bike puts on its headlight your average road user with all the intelligence of a moth is drawn to the light. If everybody drives around all day with thier lights on poof, the bikes invisible again. But it doesn't really matter a jot because the biker should be riding as if he's invisible anyway. Hell, some motorcyclists still get swept up when thier blue lights and sierns are going.

Thats just a bit "shortsighted".
Yesterday evening while going home from work, around 17:30 in pretty dull conditions, the amount of cars going round without dipped lights on was huge.
These cars were "a lot" less visible than those with the dipped lights on. I am not saying you couldnt see them but they werent as easy to spot. I dont care how good your eyesight is, but cars with dipped lights are easier to see in the distance at any time.
Now, who is going to determine if the conditions are bad enough for the drivers to use dipped lights? What is the rule/law for this? Is bad visibility to one person the same as bad visibility to another? I thought it was conditions for dipped lights but these didnt. Now, if it were the law to have dipped lights on during daylight hours then this "grey area" wouldnt be so grey anymore.

Even without that, cars with lights on ar far easier to spot. I dont know what you are taking about with your culture thing but if you have your dipped lights on and you are driving within the speed limit you are a darn sight safer that a driver breaking the speed limit on a dangerous road in dull conditions with no lights on.
Kippy

prospect

Meant to say,

My megane has a feature where the dipped beams come on autmatically at a certain level of 'darkness'! Even driving through tunnels, and multistory carparks, the lights come on themselves, and then go off when it brightens up again. A feature like this on all cars would make more sense to me than permanent DRLs.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

anything that makes one more visible on the road must be a good idea

Garth

Always drive with lights on, a habit picked up in Canada where they have DRLs on all cars.

It vastly improves visibility, not only that but if a biker wants to improve their visibility and all car drivers have their lights on, a reflective jacket will be a lot more visible than it was when nobody had lights on.