Greatest hurler ever..?

youthacademy

Hey,
I'm a clare man, and jus hearing of the great seanie mcmahons departure from the inter county setup, it put the question in my head, who is the greatest. christy ring(cork)? christy heffernan(KK)? dj(KK)? Lohan(CE)(in his day)?
whats your opinion??

monosharp

youthacademy wrote:

Hey,
I'm a clare man, and jus hearing of the great seanie mcmahons departure from the inter county setup, it put the question in my head, who is the greatest. christy ring(cork)? christy heffernan(KK)? dj(KK)? Lohan(CE)(in his day)?
whats your opinion??

Christy will probably take it in most peoples opinions.

Greatest team would be more contentious. The Tipp team of the 60's is generally accepted as the greatest ever.

Flukey

Ring or Heffernan?

In my time I suppose I'd have to say DJ, but there are many others, too many to mention.

Kojak

Ring would probably get my vote. Carey was more of an opportunist, IMO.

cruiserweight

what about Nicky Rackard?

the manglator

The best player I've seen (going back to about '92) is Brian Corcoran. Definitely think he deserves to be ranked alongside DJ in modern times.

He won hurler of the year in '92 when he was just out of minor. Unfortunately Cork weren't too successful for most of the 1990's so he won't get the recognition he deserves for being the best player in the country for that period.
All along he was one of the few dual players in the country, reaching an All-Ireland final.

When he got hurler of the year again in '99 he was actually not playing as well as he was for most of the 90s!!

And to add to his fantastic career, making his comeback at full-forward and winning 2 All-Irelands shows just how immense a player he has been.

How Whelehan got in the Team of the Millenium ahead of him is beyond me!!!! :mad:

hawker

I cannot comment about Ring or Rackard as I am under 40. Most of the people over a certain age (like the persons who picked Ring or Rackard) nearly always seem to choose Ring. Those lucky enough to have seen him play in the flesh have no doubts.

By all accounts I was unfortunate not to to witness Ring at his peak. My choice would be DJ Carey. By far the best hurler of my generation even though most Cork men cannot admit it.

chubba1984

Mick Mackey, Jimmy Doyle, Eddie Keher, Lory Meagher, Christy Ring

youthacademy

alot of being "the greatest" is about being at the right place at the right time as mentioned above in corcorans case. personally a think hes an exceptional hurler but not in the catogary of the greatest as we did not see him for a few years during his absense.
jimmy doyle was certainly worth a mention. i was also a fond admirer of pat hartigan of limerick in the 70's

REBEL CORK

hawker wrote:

I cannot comment about Ring or Rackard as I am under 40. Most of the people over a certain age (like the persons who picked Ring or Rackard) nearly always seem to choose Ring. Those lucky enough to have seen him play in the flesh have no doubts.

By all accounts I was unfortunate not to to witness Ring at his peak. My choice would be DJ Carey. By far the best hurler of my generation even though most Cork men cannot admit it.

Kept scoreless in 3 out of four finals played against Cork is why alot of cork people won't admit it and with that record could you blame us (not doubting he a was fantastic hurler though).

Brian whealan best hurler i've seen of my generation with Tommy walsh already at such a young age becoming a great admirer of mine.

As regards to the greatest ever, Jimmy Doyle, John Doyle, Ned Power, Buggy, all said Ring, so il bow to their supierior knowledge considering they've seen all the generations of hurlers from then til now.

Inniscarraman

the manglator wrote:

The best player I've seen (going back to about '92) is Brian Corcoran. Definitely think he deserves to be ranked alongside DJ in modern times.

He won hurler of the year in '92 when he was just out of minor. Unfortunately Cork weren't too successful for most of the 1990's so he won't get the recognition he deserves for being the best player in the country for that period.
All along he was one of the few dual players in the country, reaching an All-Ireland final.

When he got hurler of the year again in '99 he was actually not playing as well as he was for most of the 90s!!

And to add to his fantastic career, making his comeback at full-forward and winning 2 All-Irelands shows just how immense a player he has been.

How Whelehan got in the Team of the Millenium ahead of him is beyond me!!!! :mad:

Absolutely right about the great man from Caherlag. He would have to be in the shake-up for the best that I have ever seen and I saw all the greats going back to Ring in 1960 for the Glen against Muskerry on an atrocious day in Coachford.

Brian Corcoran was the Cork team from 94 to 98. He simply won every ball that came within 25 metres of him. Yet, because Cork failed to progress beyond the 1st round in Munster in each of these years the all star selectors ignored him.

I have never seen a player dominate a game to the extent that Brian did in those years. Every time he put on the Cork jersey, he was the best man on the field by some distance.

It really was a pity that he opted, or should I say was pressurised, to play football. That decision clearly took its toll on Brian.

I agree with you that in 99 he did not play as well as he had played for the previous six years yet was selected hurler of the year for the second time.

Recently some one picked the best Cork hurling team of something like the last 40 years and left Brain off it. We forget so very easily. I think we now remember Brian as a forward which is a great injustice to Cork's greatest defender.

Up the Blues

thirdmantackle

Brian Whelehan is a legend - for county and club. that final where he was ill and they moved him to full forward and he scored 1-5 was unbelieveable

Skillwise, DJ Carey was probably ahead of almost all other players

I've heard people say Ring was a very dirty and cynical player

This thread should be - best hurler you have ever seen play?

monosharp

the manglator wrote:

How Whelehan got in the Team of the Millenium ahead of him is beyond me!!!! :mad:

........

How you could even suggest that Corcoran could be compared to Brian Whelehan shows how little you know.

monosharp

REBEL CORK wrote:

Kept scoreless in 3 out of four finals played against Cork is why alot of cork people won't admit it and with that record could you blame us (not doubting he a was fantastic hurler though).

Brian whealan best hurler i've seen of my generation with Tommy walsh already at such a young age becoming a great admirer of mine.

As regards to the greatest ever, Jimmy Doyle, John Doyle, Ned Power, Buggy, all said Ring, so il bow to their supierior knowledge considering they've seen all the generations of hurlers from then til now.

Agree with you 100% on DJ.

On Brian, he was an unnatural talent. Fully deserving of his place on the team of the millenium.

On Tommy Walsh. What can i say that anyone whose ever watched the lad play doesn't know ? If he keeps it up hes going to go down as the best all-rounder ever.

As regards the greatest ever, at the moment Ring is undisputed but theres 2 young lads that are going to give him a serious run for his money. Henry Shefflin and Eoin Kelly both have the potential to surpass Ring and i wouldn't be surprised if they do.

CrowdedHouse

thirdmantackle wrote:

Brian Whelehan is a legend - for county and club. that final where he was ill and they moved him to full forward and he scored 1-5 was unbelieveable

Of the players I've seen personally I have to agree - and that's coming from a Tipp man :eek:

Honourable mention for DJ,Nicky English,John Fenton

Inniscarraman

monosharp wrote:

........

How you could even suggest that Corcoran could be compared to Brian Whelehan shows how little you know.

You are so correct. Brian Whelehan was a fine player - technically excellent but, as Dumphy would say, not a great player. On the other hand, Brian Corcoran was a great player. Great palyers dominate games and opponents. Corcoran did just that - time and time again. Undoubtedly, Brian Whelehan was a fine player and I would not wish to reflect adversely on him in any way.
Bye the way, one of the great players that I saw was Des Foley (RIP) of Dublin. An absolutely class act in both hurling and football - won Railway cup medals in both codes and played in Ireland finals in both codes.

il gatto

I'm from Sligo, so my opinion doesn't really count, but I think DJ Carey was the most exciting player to watch, as he just did things nobody else would think of. Second would be Joe Cooney for his competitiveness and consistancy. Third, Nicky English for the same reasons. Fourth is Henry Shefflin, because the man keeps scoring (most of the time), and fifth, Davey Fitzgerald, for never giving up. Ever. Honourable mentions to Jamesie O'Connor, John Power, Joe Deane and Brian Corcoran.

hawkwing

hawker wrote: »

I cannot comment about Ring or Rackard as I am under 40. Most of the people over a certain age (like the persons who picked Ring or Rackard) nearly always seem to choose Ring. Those lucky enough to have seen him play in the flesh have no doubts.

By all accounts I was unfortunate not to to witness Ring at his peak. My choice would be DJ Carey. By far the best hurler of my generation even though most Cork men cannot admit it.

I think it has to be Donal óg Cusack myself.

bullpost

I think if Ken mcGrath played for Kilkenny or Cork he'd be a contender. Hes practically carried Waterford single-handedly on so many occasions.

future_plans

I'd be inclined to agree with you there. Not old enough to remember Ring, Mackey and co. Joe Cooney was a bit of a legend, Brian Whelehan certainly, Tommy Walsh def needs a mention (he defies the laws of science a few times a year), Joe Canning I think might rise to that level, if Brian Corcoran hadn't played through an awful decade for Cork, he'd be there - somebody mentioned Lohan earlier...took me by surprise a bit. Great back certainly, but not in the all time greatest player league.

sickpuppy

Brendan Lynkskey who voted for DJ STEPS Carey?
needs head examined.He takes about 10 steps with ball in hand an
never got penalised.

ParkRunner

My granduncle Artie Foley of Wexford! Best keeper anyway!

junkster12345

if the award was for passion then you would have to give it to john mullane for the " I LOVE WATERFORD TEARS" !!!!!

aidan24326

With all these votes for the likes of Christy Ring and Nicky Rackard I'm presuming there's been a sudden influx of pensioners posting on boards. No point in voting for a player you've barely seen or only heard stories about.

In my lifetime of watching (I'm 31 so I can go back to early eighties) the best I've seen were, in no particular order:

1.Jimmy Barry Murphy (super hurler and great footballer aswell)
2.Joe Cooney (fantastic first touch and control. a real artist)
3.Henry Shefflin (has it all)
4.DJ Carey (some will say he's overrated, but there's no denying he had a touch of magic when on song)
5.Brian Whelehan (probably the best all-round player of his era)

If I had to single out one, Whelehan might get the nod, as he could play anywhere and be equally brilliant in any position. Moved to full forward in 98 final and shot 1-6.

FatherTed

I can remember as far back as the mid 70's, so I can remember a little of Eddie Keher who was great. Others... Ray Cummins, Jimmy Barry Murphy, John Connolly, Pat Hartigan, Pat Delaney(offaly), Eamon Creegan, John Fenton, Joe Cooney, Nickey English, Brian Whelehan, Brian Corcoran, DJ Carey, Henry Shefflin. All greats in their own right.

Zzippy

hawkwing wrote: »

I think it has to be Donal óg Cusack myself.

I really hope you're just having a laugh!

I'm not old enough to have seen Ring, Mackey, Rackard, Foley et al, have to live on tales passed down by the oul' lad. As a Corkman he was always biased towards Ring, but I know he also thought Des Foley was one of the best he had ever seen.
Of the hurlers I've seen, for sheer class, physique and hurling ability its Brian Whelehan. Close second is Brian Corcoran.
Honourable mentions to DJ, Henry Shefflin, Tommy Walsh, John Fenton, Eugene Coughlan, Tony Browne. The only current player I could see being regarded as an all-time great in the future is Walshe, if he improves any more he will be the best player of this generation.

DAC

i'd agree on all thats been sain about Brian Corcoran, Brain Lohan in his pomp was excellent, but for having the heart of a lion in adversity I'd pick Ciarian Carey of Limerick somewhere on my greatest team - he mightn't be the classiest hurler but he was a force of nature.

2Scoops

It's nearly impossible to compare players from different eras. The level of skill, and being skillful quickly, has changed utterly. Most of the players from the 80s and earlier, at their best, would not have lived with today's best in a simple 15 vs. 15 game. You could argue that they could have trained to modern standards and then would be the best, but that's the modh coinniollach.

The best player ever has played within the last 20 years and he's from Kilkenny.

2Scoops

hawkwing wrote: »

I think it has to be Donal óg Cusack myself.

FFS, he's not even the best goalie!

in2urcorners

Brian Corcoran and Ken McGrath would be on about the same level, dominating matches from CB all their careers but not being part of hugely successful teams tarnished them a bit. Ciaran Carey and Seanie Mc the same although they weren't anywhere near as good hurlers as the two mentioned previously.

IMO Shefflin, Tommy W. and Cha are all better hurlers than DJ was, this coming from a Cork man yes but it's no slur on KK as these 3 I think have the potential to dominate hurling for the forseeable future:(.

Honourable mention to John Troy who was unreal on his day,and my favourite hurler growing up(times were bad, had to look outside the county), imagine if he'd taken the game as seriously as Whelahan did?

Too many others to mention, let's hope this year unearths a few more for us to discuss in 10 years time. Step forward Joe Canning???

mollybird

in my time id have to say joe deane (Deano Cork), Dan Shanahan (Dan the Man Waterford) and i hate to say it but Henry Shefflin (kilkenny). god that was hard to say. now i have to wash my mouth out. sorry despise the cats. what can i say im a rebel fan!!

2Scoops

mollybird wrote: »

in my time id have to say joe deane (Deano Cork), Dan Shanahan (Dan the Man Waterford) and i hate to say it but Henry Shefflin (kilkenny). god that was hard to say. now i have to wash my mouth out. sorry despise the cats. what can i say im a rebel fan!!

A Kilkenny-hating Cork fan that lives in... Louth! God love ya!

JHMEG

Paul Flynn. A mercurial genius.

MrJoeSoap

Of the current crop...

Tommy Walsh, probably the best all-round defensive hurler of the past twenty years. Absolute legend.

Ken McGrath, without the physical presence of "The Rock" he does every bit as good a job. One of the most committed, passionate and influential players going. Can stick points over from 70 yards and catch balls with looking.

Henry Shefflin, will go on to become mentioned in the same breath as Ring and Keher. Impossible to compare and contrast but both incredible in their own right. Best player in the game today, hope this injury won't slow him down.

Honorable mentions to Sean Og and The Rock. Give Cha ten years and he'll be one of the greats as well.

blackbelt

Have to go with DJ Carey myself although Corcoran has a claim to it too.I think James 'Cha' FitzGerald and Henry Shefflin are the best hurlers in the present era.

On a side note,I think Ronan Fallon is good enough to make any of the big intercounty teams like Cork and Waterford and Tipp.If he was able to play for them,I'd say he'd flourish given the quality players he could play with.

Marse

Have to say, I think Shefflin is as good as anyone I’ve ever seen..
I never seen a ring play, but did see plenty of Dj and the man is/was a legend.

Bogger77

Don't think I could give Henry Shefflin my vote.
In last years (2006) Leinster Club match against Birr, he refused to give a couple of kids* autographs, before the match. Other players such as Cha, had no problems signing.
While he might be a good player, it's things like that that that makes a great player.

Players such as DJ, etc, realize that the fans are reason for the sport existing.

*(dressed in KK colours, even)

flonge

Bogger77 wrote: »

Players such as DJ, etc, realize that the fans are reason for the sport existing.

*(dressed in KK colours, even)

I would have to give my vote to Henry Shefflin, he is such a skillful player.Although the outlook for him this year isnt looking good.
Players who get cruciated ligaments dont often come back as good as they were before they got the injury.

I disagree with the DJ Carey comment..A friend of mine asked him for his autograph for her daughter who was a avid kilkenny supporter one day,he was completely ignorant towards her and was extremely rude.
He is not as nice as he comes across on television.

kraggy

Joe Cooney for me.

Wasn't as fast a runner or as deadly, accurate shot as DJ but changed games from further out. Playmaker. Able to take a score or 2 too.

His control of the ball was unreal.

Legend.

Bogger77

flonge wrote: »

I would have to give my vote to Henry Shefflin, he is such a skillful player.Although the outlook for him this year isnt looking good.
Players who get cruciated ligaments dont often come back as good as they were before they got the injury.

I disagree with the DJ Carey comment..A friend of mine asked him for his autograph for her daughter who was a avid kilkenny supporter one day,he was completely ignorant towards her and was extremely rude.
He is not as nice as he comes across on television.

Have only met DJ once, so I can't comment.

Nicest player I've had pleasure of meeting, other than my own county mates, would have been Ollie Baker. After the Offaly-clare All-Ireland semi reply in Thurles, on his way back to his car, ran into a bunch of Offaly people and wished them the best, this was less than 30minutes after losing to them.

Awesomo-4000

in my time, it has to be henry shefflin. he is a class act, very entertaining. Give the likes of Cha and tommy walsh time and they will definately be among the greats.

hunter164

You know dublin have had some quality players over the years but just because the team around them wasn't as strong they didn't win many things and didn't get the merits they deserved

MrJoeSoap

hunter164 wrote: »

You know dublin have had some quality players over the years but just because the team around them wasn't as strong they didn't win many things and didn't get the merits they deserved

Names please...

aidan24326

The way Joe Canning is headed it looks like he may be talked about in these sort of discussions in years to come. An awesome talent. A whopping 1-16 for LIT the other day, including 4 points from sideline cuts. Incredible. Has anyone ever scored four sideline cuts in a game before? It can't have happened too often. He is quite possibly the best I've ever seen at that particular skill, often driving the ball up to 80 yards from the ground, and accurately. You have to imagine he'd be a savage golfer with a skill like that.

MrJoeSoap

aidan24326 wrote: »

The way Joe Canning is headed it looks like he may be talked about in these sort of discussions in years to come. An awesome talent. A whopping 1-16 for LIT the other day, including 4 points from sideline cuts. Incredible. Has anyone ever scored four sideline cuts in a game before? It can't have happened too often. He is quite possibly the best I've ever seen at that particular skill, often driving the ball up to 80 yards from the ground, and accurately. You have to imagine he'd be a savage golfer with a skill like that.

Unbelievable performance against WIT on Saturday, he almost single handedly kept them in it through 90 minutes of hurling. One of the best performances I've seen in years.

Did you see Powers save? Incredible stuff. That game was a joy to watch.

An Citeog

MrJoeSoap wrote: »

Unbelievable performance against WIT on Saturday, he almost single handedly kept them in it through 90 minutes of hurling. One of the best performances I've seen in years.

Did you see Powers save? Incredible stuff. That game was a joy to watch.

He seems to be carrying a fair bit of extra weight aswell. Savage hurler though who seems to be taking things at his own pace rather than being rushed into playing senior for Galway.

megadodge

Bogger77 wrote: »

Don't think I could give Henry Shefflin my vote.
In last years (2006) Leinster Club match against Birr, he refused to give a couple of kids* autographs, before the match. Other players such as Cha, had no problems signing.
While he might be a good player, it's things like that that that makes a great player.

Players such as DJ, etc, realize that the fans are reason for the sport existing.

*(dressed in KK colours, even)

I'm about as anti-Kilkenny as you'll get, but that is a completely illogical and pointless statement.

How the hell is signing/not signing an autograph BEFORE a game a deciding factor in what a player can or can't do on a pitch ?

What a player does/did on the pitch is what we're talking about here, not how nice they were !

MrJoeSoap

Bogger77 wrote: »

Don't think I could give Henry Shefflin my vote.
In last years (2006) Leinster Club match against Birr, he refused to give a couple of kids* autographs, before the match. Other players such as Cha, had no problems signing.
While he might be a good player, it's things like that that that makes a great player.

Players such as DJ, etc, realize that the fans are reason for the sport existing.

*(dressed in KK colours, even)

megadodge wrote: »

I'm about as anti-Kilkenny as you'll get, but that is a completely illogical and pointless statement.

How the hell is signing/not signing an autograph BEFORE a game a deciding factor in what a player can or can't do on a pitch ?

What a player does/did on the pitch is what we're talking about here, not how nice they were !

A friend of mine was telling me a story of a kid on his road who wrote to Shefflin saying how he was his hero and so on, and Shefflin phoned the kid to ask him if he wanted to come down to Kilkenny for the day and meet him and hit a few sliotars.

Bogger77

MrJoeSoap wrote: »

A friend of mine was telling me a story of a kid on his road who wrote to Shefflin saying how he was his hero and so on, and Shefflin phoned the kid to ask him if he wanted to come down to Kilkenny for the day and meet him and hit a few sliotars.

i'll repeat.
With my own eyes, I say him tell kids to go away and refused to sign a programme.

a good hurler plays good hurling on the pitch, a great hurler is someone whose a good role model on and off the pitch.

And to me, ignoring your fans, when they're after travelling up to Portlaoise on a cold, wintry day, just to see you and your team play, is not being a good role model.

Players who get drunk, commit assualt (both on and off the pitch, I'm thinking of a certain former galway intercounty freetaker), drunk driver, etc. that bar's them from being great hurlers.

megadodge

Well I'll repeat also - what you're saying is completely illogical !!

How does what he does OFF the pitch jump him from 'good' to 'great' or visa versa ?
The thread is not about who the nicest hurler of all time is !!
It's about the hurling ability and achievments ON THE PITCH of the hurler concerned.

OJ Simpson is one of, if not the greatest running back in American Football history irrespective of what he did off the field.

MrJoeSoap

Bogger77 wrote: »

i'll repeat.
With my own eyes, I say him tell kids to go away and refused to sign a programme.

a good hurler plays good hurling on the pitch, a great hurler is someone whose a good role model on and off the pitch.

And to me, ignoring your fans, when they're after travelling up to Portlaoise on a cold, wintry day, just to see you and your team play, is not being a good role model.

Players who get drunk, commit assualt (both on and off the pitch, I'm thinking of a certain former galway intercounty freetaker), drunk driver, etc. that bar's them from being great hurlers.

Roy Keane was a god-awful footballer so.