Krav maga 2 day course

buck65

Hi group , new to this , I see from previous posts that alot of people have taken the Krav Maga course with Patrick Cumiskey. I am booked into the next 2 day course and would like to know the timetable and any experiences people have had recently or if anyone used any of the techniques taught?
I am a green belt in TKD and am using this course to work on some of my weaknesses that are not regularly covered in TKD
Cheers

Giant_Killer

The KM course with Patrick is well worth doing.
I did the 2day course afew months back and took so much away from it, saying that, without ongoing training in KM i feel most of it can fly by the waist.
I plan on going back and doing the 2hour class weekly to bone up on everything.

I don't think i've met anyone who wasn't happy with the course. Patrick is a great teacher and sound bloke.
As far as i remember its, 9am to 5:30pm with an hour break around lunchtime.

Heard their new gym in bow lane is pretty small and can get a little tight.

All in all, Krav Maga is the only way to go for street defence.

Millionaire

I would cancel immediate and go to www.kravmaga.ie instead... I am a qualified KM instrcutor and I qualified in Israel.... I am also a 4th dan black kickboxer and curretly am thai boxing full time in thailand.

Cumiskey is teaching a water down BS version which is not real KM, and he is only in it for the money. you will NOT learn to defen yourself in 2 days.

There is no sparring either. and he was afraid to spar me in front of the other students, as he knew what would happen. the guy is not even in shape.

Aidan in www.kravmaga.ie does sparring, and alot of cumiskey top instructors have gone over there, plus he brings over top international experts like lee morrison, and mick coup.

if you want a week end of Tae Bo, and BS stories about self defence for an expensive price,,,sure go ahead..... but personally I think its a rip off and a fraud.

plus I see his web link has been removed from the International KM Fed web site www.krav-maga.com which means the KM Israelis are copping on to his tricks.

personally you would be better taking up thai boxing....costs about 6 euro a class and you will really learn how to fight and defend yourself.

I spent 3 years in Kmireland before I realised it was a con job, and no one could fight their way out of a paper bag.

I got taken for alot of money over there too, for "advanced training" which me and others never got.l

Stay away is my advice

Giant_Killer

Funny, cause he said the same thing about kravmaga.ie!

buck65

Thanks for your post.
The cost of the course is €195 which to me isn't too expensive - about €12 per hour. I do value your opinion and I'm not naive enough to believe I will be anything beyond basic level after the course, but to me this is a start.
As I mentioned earlier I "study(is this correct?)" Taekwondo ITF but as most know it is predominantly a kicking and punching art, and although if I was ever in an uncomfortable position I feel confident enough that I could do damage Like yourself I would love to be a more rounded fighter - locks , throws etc- and I thought this would be a start. Very interested to see that you're training in Thailand - respect to that. Would love to hear more about your training routines diet etc. - the world of martial arts and warriors is fascinating to me.

Giant_Killer

I came from a kickboxing background when I did the KM weekend and the hardest part of the course for me was no punching with closed fists! you use palm shots.
+ I had to keep my feet on the ground, no high kicks or any kicks for that matter.

Try, cqcireland.com
They run something along the lines of KM.

Millionaire

Giant_Killer wrote:

Funny, cause he said the same thing about kravmaga.ie!

No I did not say that about www.kravmaga.ie I am in regular contact with Aidan the chief instructor there, and I am invited to train there when I return from thailand, and also if you look at the Mick Coup seminar post I posted last week...you will see i recommended www.kravmaga.ie as he is teaching proper KM, and not making a money racket out of it.

if you feel you can defend yourself after a weekend, cool....try sparring with some fighters.... and see how you get one...boxers, kickboxers, thai, MMA...take your pick?

Baggio...

Hmm.... weekend courses eh?:rolleyes:

I'd listen to Mill if I were you.

The Bored One

Giant_Killer wrote:

All in all, Krav Maga is the only way to go for street defence.

Not really. Seeing as it was originally designed military use, its primary focus would be stunning the opponent, or creating distance long enough for you to shoot him. Due to the fact that few women will carry an assault rifler in their dainty little handbag, its not exactly an effective option.
Then you have the legal repurcussions of using high offence techniques that would show up in a style like that. Should you injure your attacker seriously, the fact that you have had training will be held against you, normally using the arguement that you should have been able to use your training to disable your opponent without hurting them.
We all know that not hurting them is a very unlikely outcome, but simply put the more damage you do the more the prosecution will gleefully rape you.

Its wierd but true, alot of what is taught as the best things to do in self defence, work out as some of the worst things you can do for self-preservation.

Millionaire

look....I am a KM Instructor...

KM is a good system....if trained properly..... for example it got punches, knees, elbows...the most effective live fights I have seen with these techniques is Muay Thai...so there for KM strikes should be trained the same way.... with plenty of sparring. along with all the other KM stuff.

I was able to get in and do a few rounds of boxing yesterday with a provincial thai boxing champ.... now I am not say I would have beaten him...but I gave as good as I got... and that is because I train my punches properly.

KM is not all "open palm strikes" if you bother to check out David Kahns KM book of the DVDs from kravmaga.com you will find all the basic boxing punches there...

Also another fact is most girls 18 - 21 ish do 2 - 3 year years in the army and they carry assult rifles...either M16 or Galil rifles 24 x7 when doing service. I have seen 18 year old chicks out buying britney spear Cds...with m16a hanging off their jeans on a saturday afternoon in local Israeli shopping mall.

I like KM if trained proper...ala www.geoffthompson.com.....

a weekend hitting a few pads will not give you much SD skills...thats for sure.

The Bored One

Millionaire wrote:

look....I am a KM Instructor...

KM is a good system....if trained properly..... for example it got punches, knees, elbows...the most effective live fights I have seen with these techniques is Muay Thai...so there for KM strikes should be trained the same way.... with plenty of sparring. along with all the other KM stuff.

I was able to get in and do a few rounds of boxing yesterday with a provincial thai boxing champ.... now I am not say I would have beaten him...but I gave as good as I got... and that is because I train my punches properly.

KM is not all "open palm strikes" if you bother to check out David Kahns KM book of the DVDs from kravmaga.com you will find all the basic boxing punches there...

Also another fact is most girls 18 - 21 ish do 2 - 3 year years in the army and they carry assult rifles...either M16 or Galil rifles 24 x7 when doing service. I have seen 18 year old chicks out buying britney spear Cds...with m16a hanging off their jeans on a saturday afternoon in local Israeli shopping mall.

I like KM if trained proper...ala www.geoffthompson.com.....

a weekend hitting a few pads will not give you much SD skills...thats for sure.

What I was referring to by assault rifle comment is that the original focus of the style (ie military use), may not best be suited for civilian self defence in Ireland. While most Irish girls seem only to willing to scratch eyes and, they are very fortunately for us all suffering a deficit in the assault rifle department. God, could you imagine that?

john kavanagh

buck65 wrote:

Like yourself I would love to be a more rounded fighter - locks , throws etc- and I thought this would be a start.

hello there buck. good luck with the course. just a quick offer of my services seen as you are looking to learn some locks. throws etc and i know a bit about them. i'd like to offer you a free 1-2-1 class with my good self in that area. you can call me on 0876876641 or pm me here to arrange it

good luck with whatever you decide to do

jk

Roper

Take the offer buck, its not too often someone of John's stature offers a freebie!!!!:D

Morse

john kavanagh wrote:

hello there buck. good luck with the course. just a quick offer of my services seen as you are looking to learn some locks. throws etc and i know a bit about them. i'd like to offer you a free 1-2-1 class with my good self in that area. you can call me on 0876876641 or pm me here to arrange it

good luck with whatever you decide to do

jk

Well OP, it doesn't get much better than that.

Btw, where are you?.

Millionaire

Yes....as a KM man....but who trainers proper.... I had a free 1 on 1 with John too, and to have a hour with the top BJJ in Ireland is amazing.

John K skills is amazing, a great teacher, and a very nice chap too! (I may not agree with all he says and him to me too, but if I was in Ireland, I would be training there....also Paddy Clint, my 1st Muay Thai instructor is based over there too, and Paddy is the best of the best in teach thai in Ireland).

The weekend KMIreland Gods teaching will really help you kick Johns ass on the freebie! ;-)

WizZard

I've taken the weekend course with Aidan (www.kravmaga.ie)
Overall I found it excellent, but you do need to keep up the sparring, and regular training to even think about using it for SD.

Millionaire

WizZard wrote:

I've taken the weekend course with Aidan (www.kravmaga.ie)
Overall I found it excellent, but you do need to keep up the sparring, and regular training to even think about using it for SD.

yes true..Aidan told me he had alot of sparring starting...anyway he is a kickboxing back ground like I have, and we share the same instructor roots...and let me tell ya those roots involved...pretty hard sparring!

mulls

There is basic Krav Maga Seminar given by IKMF Global Training Team Instructor Amnon Darsa from Israel on 18th November. The Seminar is on in Drumcondra and hosted by Aidan Carroll...... there is more detail on www.kravmaga.ie

Millionaire

mulls wrote:

There is basic Krav Maga Seminar given by IKMF Global Training Team Instructor Amnon Darsa from Israel on 18th November. The Seminar is on in Drumcondra and hosted by Aidan Carroll...... there is more detail on www.kravmaga.ie

Is Patrick Cumiskey going? :eek:

arybvtcw0eolkf

mulls wrote:

There is basic Krav Maga Seminar given by IKMF Global Training Team Instructor Amnon Darsa from Israel on 18th November. The Seminar is on in Drumcondra and hosted by Aidan Carroll...... there is more detail on www.kravmaga.ie

Thats a terrible hard site to view. Any chance you could cut & paste the info in here please.

yomchi

Aidan knows his stuff, he is currently an apprentice instructor under Lee Morrison. I hope to be one myself coming into the new year.
Probably going off on a huge tangent, but my political beliefs hold me back from attending anything got to do with the Israely military or any part thereof - but thats just me!
I would recommend trainging with Aidan, what he's learning off Lee Morrison is top class

arybvtcw0eolkf

Jon wrote:

Probably going off on a huge tangent, but my political beliefs hold me back from attending anything got to do with the Israely military or any part thereof - but thats just me!

Ohhhhh, I'd love a discussion on that one, wrong forum

monkey tennis

Jon wrote:

my political beliefs hold me back from attending anything got to do with the Israely military or any part thereof

That's a bit silly IMO. It's like not training in karate because you disagree with Japanese military/political agenda. Also, I'm fairly certain neither Patrick Cumiskey nor Millionaire are members of the Israeli miltary.

yomchi

monkey tennis wrote:

That's a bit silly IMO. It's like not training in karate because you disagree with Japanese military/political agenda. Also, I'm fairly certain neither Patrick Cumiskey nor Millionaire are members of the Israeli miltary.

I didn't intend on this going off on a tangent as I said.

Firstly Monkey you are entitled to your opinion.

Why you compare Japanese Military political agenda to Israel's political agenda/war crimes of recent weeks is daft.

Also why you state that either Patrick Cumisky or my good man millionaire have nothing to do with the Israely military is bizarre - as I didn't say they did.

Krava Maga seminars are run by in many cases Israely Army personel - I won't attend them. Simple. As I said it's just my beliefs which I am entitled to and I don't intend on getting into a debate on it - as has been already stated its the wrong forum.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Jon wrote:

Krava Maga seminars are run by in many cases Israely Army personel - I won't attend them. Simple. As I said it's just my beliefs which I am entitled to and I don't intend on getting into a debate on it - as has been already stated its the wrong forum.

So would you compete against an Israeli athlete, considering the vast majority will be ex-IDF or indeed reserve personnel?.

I'm just thinking of the Iranian judoka at the last Athens olympics, Arash Miresmaeili, who at first refused to fight an Israeli player then later turned coward (under threat of punishment) and binged pre-weigh in and didn't make the weight.

Personally I think its wrong to bring your politics into martial arts.

Just for the record. I competed against the IDF in Wingate University, Natanya, Israel on December 7th 2000 and didn't find one who wasn't extremly friendly and inviting. Not one expressed any sort of political agenda, indeed they were fantastic hosts.

Millionaire

Jeeze look up the road, to many innocents killed in the North by Birtish Forces in the past 30 years. (not to get into a political row, but it is fact British Forces/RUC killed many innocent people). (shoot to kill policy, Stalker Report, Bloody Sunday, Dublin/Monaghan Bombings etc)

Now would that prevent you from training with someone from England, or someone who even some one who is Irish who served with the Brit army?

My kickboxing teacher for many years was in the british army years ago, and is from Dublin, and a friend, and I came from a very pro IRA area on the border as a teen in the late 80s. In fact I could take you to where I came from today, and point you who was the Sniper, or who put the bomb in canary warf. and I made no difference me who, what, or which armies and political beliefs any trainers nor training partners have or had. In fact as of today I have no political beliefs of any extreme....have n,t got the time nor interest!!!!

Who indeed training with someone who was in the IRA or is in SF???? Or entering a kickboxing competition in the North where and compete with lads who would be from the Shankill Road, and probably would know UVF/UDA people???

I think its best to leave the politics out of MA training.

I would not agree with recent Israeli Military actions, however I trained in Netanya with many Israeli Special Forces Lads, Regular Soldiers (90% under 40 are in the army anyway, and have to do a month a year at least of active service), and even a lad in the SinBeth which is Israelis counter part to Mossad only they do internal work. and I found everyone to me super nice to me, and helped me train well.

Take people as you find them, and leave the politics out of it.

and Train Hard! forget the BS!

arybvtcw0eolkf

Excellent reply Millionaire..

Like you I've trained in Netanya (as stated above). And found the guys to be first class hosts.

The photo here is me (tall with the shaved head) with some 'friends' in Wingate, Natanya 2001. (sorry for the bad quality).

Millionaire

cool photo....what army is the camo uniform from???

Israelis is olive green like lad in middle?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Millionaire wrote:

cool photo....what army is the camo uniform from???

Israelis is olive green like lad in middle?

The DPM is the current Irish army uniform. I was serving with UNIFIL in Lebanon.

I'v included a clearer photo of the uniform. Again its poor quality as I didn't have a digi cam back then and just scanned these from 5x7 pix.

This is me in Lebanon, near the Israeli/Lebanese border.

Like many I've done some KM with the IDF but that was back in 2000/01 and haven't touched it since. It was more demo/seminar stuff really and I've never followed it up since.

Millionaire

cool photo!

Yeah I heard when In Netanya, I was there a month, sometimes Irish Troops did R n R there.

Had some strange experiences there, like up dancing with a group of lads and ladys on a dance floor in some disco bar, and some were on service, which means they had their assault rifles with them, even though all were on there beer, and some Israeli captain, giving me his gun to "mind" while he danced with a girl. 80s was dancing around hand bags, in Israel its dancing arounf M16 and Galil Rifles, on the dance floor.


The Krav is good if trained properly. I noticed the American KM people on their updated DVDs, have added in Muay Thai alive pad man training, with pad man attack back, and also BJJ too.

I think if I was to get involved with KM again, I d hook up with the Americam KM Assoc....they seem more progressive and real in the training.

yomchi

Millionaire wrote:

Jeeze look up the road, to many innocents killed in the North by Birtish Forces in the past 30 years. (not to get into a political row, but it is fact British Forces/RUC killed many innocent people). (shoot to kill policy, Stalker Report, Bloody Sunday, Dublin/Monaghan Bombings etc)

Now would that prevent you from training with someone from England, or someone who even some one who is Irish who served with the Brit army?

My kickboxing teacher for many years was in the british army years ago, and is from Dublin, and a friend, and I came from a very pro IRA area on the border as a teen in the late 80s. In fact I could take you to where I came from today, and point you who was the Sniper, or who put the bomb in canary warf. and I made no difference me who, what, or which armies and political beliefs any trainers nor training partners have or had. In fact as of today I have no political beliefs of any extreme....have n,t got the time nor interest!!!!

Who indeed training with someone who was in the IRA or is in SF???? Or entering a kickboxing competition in the North where and compete with lads who would be from the Shankill Road, and probably would know UVF/UDA people???

I think its best to leave the politics out of MA training.

I would not agree with recent Israeli Military actions, however I trained in Netanya with many Israeli Special Forces Lads, Regular Soldiers (90% under 40 are in the army anyway, and have to do a month a year at least of active service), and even a lad in the SinBeth which is Israelis counter part to Mossad only they do internal work. and I found everyone to me super nice to me, and helped me train well.

Take people as you find them, and leave the politics out of it.

and Train Hard! forget the BS!

Hey Mill,

I don't want to get into a whole political debate, I will if you want!

You come from a Republican Area, canary wharf and the sniper can be only one area:) . I come from a long line of Republican activists in my family. I have my father, uncles and Grand father all locked up. Its funny, I've actually played ball with mr sniper! A good friend of mine and a gentleman, of course its no secret since there was a book written about most of them

You make good points, however these are just my beliefs mate. Especially regarding Israel's recent trips into the Leb. Not forgetting that most right thinking political leaders called war crimes. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against your everday Israeli.

Im waiting on someone to throw North Korea in my face as Im a member of the ITF! However... its the ITF based in Canada.. phew

TBH im not going to make a big hoo haa about it. Its best its just forgotten and we get on with talking about fun stuff!

Millionaire

aye, thats about it on with the fun stuff.

No despite enjoying my KM time, I would not be supportive of wrecking a country and killed over 1000 innocent people, over 2 kidnapped soldiers. ; - )

Still treat people as ya find them one on one!

Its kinda of funny, back in the 80s when I started MA which was down on the border area, our club HQ was in Dundalk, and transpired later many of the senior belts were INLA, (when it was more together in 80s), no provies, yet within the same kickboxing org, there were clubs from the Shankill Road, whom I am sure had lads on other side of fence. All met at tournaments and seminars. but the green side always held events in corssmaglen, which meant the shankill road had to travel there, and they hosted their tournies in the shankill, so everyone was always complaining about the locations of the events. Still all got on well, well within the MA world anyway!

Yep, don't come too far from that area myself! ;-) anyway hush hush M16 might be lurking on the board!

arybvtcw0eolkf

Millionaire wrote:

aye, thats about it on with the fun stuff.

No despite enjoying my KM time, I would not be supportive of wrecking a country and killed over 1000 innocent people, over 2 kidnapped soldiers. ; - )

It was never about two kidnapped IDF soldiers. It was about the continued shelling of the Galilee since Israel compiled with UN resolutions 425 & 426 in March 2000 and fully withdrew from Lebanon.

Anyway the Irish Defence Forces is currently changing its 'unarmed combat' syllabus to KM!. Thats all I can say about that one at the moment!.

Millionaire

so long as its real KM the IDF is doing then thats good!

I trained in Israel with some Polish Military guy, one guy and he is amazing at real KM, is a Captain in Polish Army, and trains all the special units in KM, plus he is a medical doctor too!

The polish army guys who did the course in Netanya in KM with me, were very intense about it, back home they trained 3 hours a night 5 or 6 days a week or more if they could!

look at www.krav-maga.pl to get an idea.....some of site is english with some good photos etc

buck65

so Millionaire would you still recommend KM ahead of say BJJ for self defence?
As I practice TKD I feel Bjj might be too much to take on at this stage as both are sport based arts. Bought the David Kahn KM book and to be honest alot of the punches kicks and blocks recommended by him we also practice in TKD so maybe they might be more compatible?
I feel KM might be good as pure self defence based MA, I get enough sport and tradition out of TKD what do you think?

Millionaire

I trained with David in Israel, top guy etc....

I refer to his book too, very similar strikes to boxing, muay thai, and combatives..as in punch, kick, elbow, knee and a few other bits and bobs.

Its how you train them that matters....if your doing them up and down the floor into the air.....not very effective....if for example your training them, Muay Thai style with a pad man who hits back, and then you spar....very effective.

I think SD personally more strike orientated, however we must have skills of sorts in all ranges, and I am weak on ground so I am going in next few weeks to be starting a few private lessons in grappling, sub, and bjj, to get the basics down. not saying I am going to jump in with the Gracies, but I ll get the basics down over next few years.

for SD you cannot beat a good bang in the jaw! thats what I concentrate on most of the time, these days!

yomchi

Millionaire wrote:

aye, thats about it on with the fun stuff.

No despite enjoying my KM time, I would not be supportive of wrecking a country and killed over 1000 innocent people, over 2 kidnapped soldiers. ; - )

Still treat people as ya find them one on one!

Its kinda of funny, back in the 80s when I started MA which was down on the border area, our club HQ was in Dundalk, and transpired later many of the senior belts were INLA, (when it was more together in 80s), no provies, yet within the same kickboxing org, there were clubs from the Shankill Road, whom I am sure had lads on other side of fence. All met at tournaments and seminars. but the green side always held events in corssmaglen, which meant the shankill road had to travel there, and they hosted their tournies in the shankill, so everyone was always complaining about the locations of the events. Still all got on well, well within the MA world anyway!

Yep, don't come too far from that area myself! ;-) anyway hush hush M16 might be lurking on the board!

Its a small world!

Don't mind MI6 its Mossad that worries me now

pma-ire

Mairt wrote:

Anyway the Irish Defence Forces is currently changing its 'unarmed combat' syllabus to KM!. Thats all I can say about that one at the moment!.

The Irish Army have been training in there own unarmed combat for years now!! It was spearheaded by two Cork guys (one Judo and one TKD) and really I don't think that KM is anything amazing or anything any MA'ist with a bit of a mixed back round could'int come up with themselves? Once they have a bit of sense

It's a mixed range training style which is a good thing though!!

arybvtcw0eolkf

pma-ire wrote:

The Irish Army have been training in there own unarmed combat for years now!! It was spearheaded by two Cork guys (one Judo and one TKD) and really I don't think that KM is anything amazing or anything any MA'ist with a bit of a mixed back round could'int come up with themselves? Once they have a bit of sense

It's a mixed range training style which is a good thing though!!

Actually it was Judo and a Karate style (can't remember which, although I know the chap). Because I'm an active serving member I can't go into detail regarding the new syllabus here, and besides I have it third hand.

Either way, I think its going to be pretty ineffective without on going training, which in the Irish defence forces given its operational committment both at home and abroad will never happen.

Millionaire

As someone who want through a big "cycle" with KM, and SD stuff, and sort of ended up back where I started a few years later. Rating punches and combatives strikes (which are more or less punches anyway) as number 1, with the Geoff Thompson Fence and line up stuff.

KM is a good system, as I parrot , if trained correct!

However, KM has been made out of be God Like, some how...especially in Ireland for some reason!.

I do regard highly Aidan at www.kravmaga.ie he is holding an "animal day" soon. now thats getting the real deal...and I could do with a bit of that myself!

I have been very re enlightened re reading Geoff Thompsons "Watch my Back" after a few years through this whole SD thing, and in that book read it AND reading between the lines, there is alot of RBSD information, and fact on what really happens out there and how to deal with it! its scary too!

pma-ire

Mairt wrote:

Actually it was Judo and a Karate style (can't remember which, although I know the chap). Because I'm an active serving member I can't go into detail regarding the new syllabus here, and besides I have it third hand.

Sorry one of them was a 3rd Dan in the TKD assoication I was with!!

The Judo guy used to work in the same nightclub as me for about 4 years!!

Maybe there was a guy from Karate that was involved also? But I did'int know of him?

The stand up looked more like Muay Thai than Karate or TKD in anycase

Baggio...

Hey all,

Just while were talking about KM. It's always fascinated me how it's become so popular over here. After Millionaire's comments I'd like really to see how it's trained properly (i.e., in Israel by the right people). But I can't help thinking that from some of the demos I've seen over here, I've not been too impressed.

Most of the demos that I have seen involve "specific defenses" and the lack of a pre-emptive strike - Making KM a defensive art, and as we all know that defense is not a good strategy. Plus, executing a specific defense will not work under adrenal stress (O.K. you can make it work in a Dojo - but try it against a flurry of punches).

One demo I saw a year or two ago involved a women being attacked by a burly instructor (on TV - don't know the guys name tbh). He had her pinned.... and Hey presto! she dispatched him with ease using a a very silly technique, and the 200lb man literally flew off her. Again this brings up a point which Roper mentioned "giving people a false sense of security". In my opinion there is no way a woman of that size could get a guy like that off with that type of useless technique. So what's going on?? Are people being sold this and believing that it will work? To me any how that's a pretty scary thought and a tad irresponsible.

But I'd be interested to hear from other guys who've trained in it address the "specific defense" or lack of "pre-emption" concept.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not slagging off KM at all. If Gerry says that it's a good art if trained properly, then that's good enough for me (and if he says that Aiden guy is good - I'd well believe it).

But is it being trained properly over here? Or is it just for the $$$?

Millionaire

The one big criticism I have of KM, is that there can be a "one step sparring" approch to training, and that is all that is relyed upon.

Now this is important, for teaching the moves etc....but it must go beyond this, to a real attack (alive as some say, spar it etc).

As in " Defence against a Slash Knife attack " , there is a specific defence to this, attacker slashes with knife, defender does move 1, move 2 , move 3.

Now in real life if someone is slashing a knife at you....I just do not think it would work that easy!!!!

In Israel as I saw it trained, there was alive, training, and sparring in all ranges (including ALOT of ground work/clinch)....remember founder of KM ImI Lictehnfeld....was a champion wrestler and boxer!

I have seen some real crap demos of KM on the web, that made me embarrassed to sat I did KM! Now I do Muay Thai with a KM/Combatives as an addition!

Baggio...

Millionaire wrote:

Now I do Muay Thai with a KM/Combatives as an addition!

Hey Mill,

That's sounds very reasonable.

So what are the fundamental differences be between KM and Combatives? Does proper KM have some advantages over CQC? And if so what would they be?

I guess I'll always be a tad weary of anything that has specific defenses (and American Kenpo is extremely guilty of this). Because I know that they wont work in a real situation.

Cheers,

R.

Millionaire

I think Combatives as we know it, Lee Morrisson, Mick Coup, Geoff T, is alot more effective than KM, say Lees stuff as I know it best...its trained more for the street and more alive, and in Israel they did little of the mindset pre post fight stuff.

Also a minor point, but some KM places make you wear karate gi bottoms, and we trained in israel in bare feet as we were on a matted training room. That really annoyed me!

Some of the lads on there, said KM demos on the web looked like Kenpo.

Baggio...

Millionaire wrote:

Lees stuff as I know it best...its trained more for the street and more alive, and in Israel they did little of the mindset pre post fight stuff.

Hey Ger,

I really like Lee's stuff too. Is KM Aiden going to be running Urban Combatives over hear at some point?

Millionaire wrote:

Some of the lads on there, said KM demos on the web looked like Kenpo.

Funny I thought they looked kinda similar too, when I saw some demos a while ago.

Cheers,

R.

Millionaire

I think KM Aiden yes, is more or less doing Urban Combatives stuff right now, as he is doing instructor program under Lee.

Drop Aiden an email!

If I was at home, I would be over there training for sure, based on some of the stuff I hear!

Baggio...

Millionaire wrote:

Drop Aiden an email!

I must do that... Cheers Ger:) .

R.

arybvtcw0eolkf

pma-ire wrote:

Sorry one of them was a 3rd Dan in the TKD assoication I was with!!

The Judo guy used to work in the same nightclub as me for about 4 years!!

Maybe there was a guy from Karate that was involved also? But I did'int know of him?

The stand up looked more like Muay Thai than Karate or TKD in anycase

I'm not saying you were wrong, I was just passing along the latest information I'd gotten.

I was looking for the chap in work to ask him more on it for you. If I get updated I'll PM you. I don't want to post it here.

I'll never be trained in on any new syllabus as my time left is limited. I've 21yrs done now and at retirement age :eek:

yomchi

Millionaire wrote:

I think KM Aiden yes, is more or less doing Urban Combatives stuff right now, as he is doing instructor program under Lee.

Drop Aiden an email!

If I was at home, I would be over there training for sure, based on some of the stuff I hear!

Hey Mill,

Yeh Aidan and myself will be falling under Lee, Aidan is already started. We have a private training session with Lee organised after the November 25 seminar. Should be great

pma-ire

Mairt wrote:

I'm not saying you were wrong, I was just passing along the latest information I'd gotten.

I was looking for the chap in work to ask him more on it for you. If I get updated I'll PM you. I don't want to post it here.

I'll never be trained in on any new syllabus as my time left is limited. I've 21yrs done now and at retirement age :eek:

no sweat man

i'm not really bothered by it