Football has gone to the dogs.

Culchie

Whilst watching 2 more terrible matches on the TV yesterday I have to say Football as a spectacle is being killed off.

If you coached a team of under 12's and seen 26 of them at any one time within 10 metres of the ball, you'd accuse them of 'bunching babies' and roar at them to 'spread out'.

This truly is turning into 'Puke Football' now.

Galway in 1998 under O'Mahony were the last 'football' team to win Sam and how refreshing it was to see football played properly.... and it was winning football.

Football a la 2006 has gone to the Dogs.

Sherifu

i have to agree.
i was in pearse stadium watching galway and westmeath.
the amount of bunching in midfield was desperate.
i long for the way galway used to play in 98.
i really hope the games get better this year.
it's terrible stuff to watch.

Dapos

You can blame armagh, tyrone for this relelation. The donegal /fermanagh match (first half anyway, cause i didn't watch 2nd half) was awful to watch. But this sort of fooball when played proper is unfortunatly very effective. This is why more and more teams adapt it. I think it's awful to watch a player being smoothered by 3/4 players, until ball is lost.

Nalced_irl

Dapos wrote:

You can blame armagh, tyrone for this relelation. The donegal /fermanagh match (first half anyway, cause i didn't watch 2nd half) was awful to watch. But this sort of fooball when played proper is unfortunatly very effective. This is why more and more teams adapt it. I think it's awful to watch a player being smoothered by 3/4 players, until ball is lost.

I would agree that football is going downhill but i think you have to blame the referees more than Armagh/Tyrone. As you say, it is an extremely effective form of football but alot of the blanket defense style is also illegal. The referees seem to be letting teams away with bunching around a player and holding him down until he eventually looses the ball or plays it on the ground but if its working and refs dont seem to spot that not 1 of the 3 players around him are even attempting to play the ball why not continue it? While we dont want football to be non contact or too stop/start, there is a line which i think has been long passed by this style.

Culchie

Dapos wrote:

You can blame armagh, tyrone for this relelation. The donegal /fermanagh match (first half anyway, cause i didn't watch 2nd half) was awful to watch. But this sort of fooball when played proper is unfortunatly very effective. This is why more and more teams adapt it. I think it's awful to watch a player being smoothered by 3/4 players, until ball is lost.

I'm not laying the blame at any particular counties door, because at this stage it's more important that the issue is addressed quickly rather than seek scapegoats. The pioneers of these tactics spotted loopholes and weaknesses in the rulebook and also the Football status quo and exploited it, fair dues to them.
All I know is this people are not going to pay €25 a head, or €60-€80 per family to watch this drivel much longer.

Coaching staff of X county should be able to counteract the tactics of Y county. There seems to be a real lack of coaching talent within the GAA, plenty of Motivators and Fitness Experts and Head Doctors, but very few tacticians.

The rules also should be changed to protect the man who goes to field the ball, he can't get up of his knees because there is 4 or 5 around him, and it's not physical possible to stand up in a straight line form a prone position, you need space, not a knee in the head as a prize for winning the ball.

I don't like the 'mark idea' of Aussie Rules as it stops the play, but something has to be done to protect the fielder.

Shirt Pulling, Standing on hands when a player is down, it's terrible.

Don't get my wrong, I love a big hit, and a physical game of football, but not this crap that is on at the moment.

yop

Spot on Culchie, I too am not sick of it, crap games week in week out, Sats match with Galway and WMeath was brutal, I know the conditions did not help but it was cat, and then again yesterday the same crap was played again.

All teams want to do now is spoil games, 3rd man tackles are happening all the time and it more of a case of all out defence.

The quality of teams and football is worrying, there really is not 1 good team there this year in any province. If 1 team can get it together at all then it could be the easist won All-Ireland in decades

thirdmantackle

only two handpasses in a row in Gaelic football, that would force teams to kick the ball into their forwards good and early

also two referees should be used for Senior Championship games to ensure no foul play is let go unpunished

sure a lot of the counties are now coached on how to win frees... Tyrone (esp Canavan) started it a few years back, now everyone is doing it

DUB

It's not been a vintage championship so far that's for sure. Mind you the Louth v Tyrone match earlier in the year was great. A lot of defensive tactics going about which dont help, but neither does a gale force wind. A lot of matches this summer have had foul weather or is that my imagination?

I do think GAA match commentators go on and on and on about a match being bad or of poor quality. Fermanagh v Donegal was poor stuff alright but you don't need the commentator telling you as much after every stray pass. No other sport does this. Take Cork City v Red Star last week, there was one intentional shot on target all game, the rest of it was rubbish, but the commentary just said Red Star were slightly disappointing and did a professional job.

Hopefully things will pick up but we've had some exceptional football championships recently, hopefully a team that plays attacking football will come good this summer and people will stop flooding midfield.

Kojak

thirdmantackle wrote:

only two handpasses in a row in Gaelic football, that would force teams to kick the ball into their forwards good and early

Some good ideas there, however I thought Mayo brought up something like this a few years ago but were shot down. I believe it related to the handpass and why it should be the fist that is used and not this palming action.


If it was 2 hand-passes (punches, not what is happening at the moment) then kick along with a concept from Basketball that once you pass the half-way line you cannot go back into your own half.

If these rules were to be implemented then I think that football would be a lot easier on the eyes. The matches this weekend, especially on Sunday, were sickening (from a neutral spectators point of view).

GreenDoor

Nalced_irl wrote:

I would agree that football is going downhill but i think you have to blame the referees

I disagree. The referees have an impossible task. It's impossible because there are no proper tackle rules. This is the problem with football. There is too much messing and too many frees.

Nalced_irl

GreenDoor wrote:

I disagree. The referees have an impossible task. It's impossible because there are no proper tackle rules. This is the problem with football. There is too much messing and too many frees.

Good point actually. My main concern tho is this new negitive defensive strategy which turns every game into a messy and rough game. I suppose it is more down to the rulebook. It is something that needs to be sorted tho. I think the only way to battle it is to make a rule where only 1 man can tackle any 1 person, however that does run the risk of turning it into a non contact type sport. I think there definately is a counter strategy out there that needs to be found also. I mean, if there are 3 men tackling 1 guy, with fast passing, there are 2 free men somewhere but it doesnt seem to be that easy.

news for you

i might be the only one but i think tyrone are quite an attractive team :eek:

Nalced_irl

news for you wrote:

i might be the only one but i think tyrone are quite an attractive team :eek:

I think they can be but always revert to the most negative style possible against big teams. When they play a skillful fast game, they can be great to watch but unfortunately that doesnt happen too often.

DUB

There is always going to be frees when lads go into tackle as it's so shady an area you always think the free against your team is the wrong decision. ... or is that just me? ... I don't mind that happening so much now and again

What we saw in the Donegal v Fermanagh game is defenders deliberaly foul their man instead of letting the player beat them fair and square. Thats what annoys me. I think the sin bin was implemented all wrong. Instead of binning everyone who gets a yellow, If a team is constantly fouling, as you see from time to time, then the ref should warn the team captain that any more deliberate fouls and he'll bin someone for ten minutes. Very often a free isnt seen as enough of a draw back and is therefore preferable to give away then letting your man clean through. Also think a binning for violent conduct, we see lads get yellows all the time when they lose the rag as the ref dosent want to send them off and ruin the game. 10 in the bin would work fine for this situation.

I don't like the idea of handpassing being banned or limited, teams that do well all need to be able to mix their play, too much hand passing gets you into trouble anyway. The games on Sunday were both derbys played in a gale, which i think had as much to do with the poor standard as anything.

I agree that Tyrone play some great attacking football. Just so long as they're not playing Armagh or Derry!

DUB

Do ye not agree that GAA matches are judged by a much tougher standard then any other sport. You don't hear soccer commentators bitch and moan about every dour 0-0 or 1-0 as if the sport is gone to the dogs. Loads of soccer matches are poor enough but people still watch week in week out hoping for a classic. I'd say Laois people are happy enough with the result at the weekend, same goes for Donegal.

Lone Wolf

Culchie wrote:

Coaching staff of X county should be able to counteract the tactics of Y county. There seems to be a real lack of coaching talent within the GAA, plenty of Motivators and Fitness Experts and Head Doctors, but very few tacticians.

I have to agree total with you culchie, I played underage county football up to U-21s with a certain county I'm not going to name. For the final two years of U-21s the county senior manager was our manager. We were possibly the fitest team in the country, we had the confidence that we could win the all Ireland. We had played all championship with a blanket style defence but when the final came after 5 minutes it was clear to all that we needed to change tacticals and switch a couple of positions but the manager just sat there watching it fall apart.

This can be seen today all to often when managers refuse to make the changes necessary or just play the good old catch and kick style.

DUB

Getting the ball in fast into space out wide or directly into a targetman seems to be the tactic a couple of teams are going to use to try and counteract the swarm defence, it'll be interesting to see how the game develops over the next couple of years. short handpassing works right into the defensive tactic, so somethings got to give.

Culchie

DUB wrote:

Getting the ball in fast into space out wide or directly into a targetman seems to be the tactic a couple of teams are going to use to try and counteract the swarm defence, it'll be interesting to see how the game develops over the next couple of years. short handpassing works right into the defensive tactic, so somethings got to give.

I certainly hope so.

I personally think that if points from outside the '45 were worth 2 points (a la basketball scoring), it would certainly mean some more direct play and therefore legitimate marking of men rather than space.
Defenders would also not like to be caught in possession too near their goal, so will use a foot pass for distance trying to find men as well.

That should spread out the game a bit.

squire1

Although it pains me to say it but I think Laois have the best looking game at the moment. It's a good mix of ball carrying, short pass (when required) and kicking into sapce. It's Mickos way of playing and has been for a long time now. I'm not saying they will win anything with it, just that it's fairly good to watch skilfull players using their skills.

I must say though that I do not see the problem with the "blanket defence" as it is called. If the opposing team want to carry or short pass the ball up the field, what are you meant to do, let them run past you? Once it's done within the laws of the game it can be very effective if ugly.

Kildare used it to great effect in '98. They did not conceed more that 10 scores in any game until the AI final, where they came across a team that was playing a brand of catch and kick football that isolated defenders. I remember after that final that certain "purist" GAA correspndants were saying how great it was to have direct football styles win an AI and that the future of GAA was safe. How wrong they were.

Speaking of Referees, has anyone noticed this year that they are copping onto the oldest trick in the book of the player in possession pulling down his marker by grabbing his arm? I've seen a number of refs this year give free outs in this situation which I never seen before. It always used to amaze me that 70,000 people in Croke Park could see it happening but the ref could not.

kevmy

Nearly every team now plays with a two man full forward line 'to create space' i'd like to see a team revert back to the classic three man. This would stop some bunching at midfield as the third forward nearly always goes to midfield and the back follows him. Most defences are set up for this and expect only two inside forwards so they only have two man markers. A third man inside will catch out some of the very poor corner backs in the game and give more scores. Armagh kinda play this sometimes and when they do are unbeatable. Kerry played it against Longford and it gave them a three goal head start. If the midfield needs help from kickouts let a half forward drop back for the opposition kickout and a half forward go forward for your own kickouts.
A more direct style from the half backs onwards is needed not just looking for the short handpass but keeping an eye on the long ball also. Wouldn't agree with banning handpasses as there are to many technical fouls as it is. But something should be done about a guy who catchs the ball and then is surrounded on his way down. I don't know what though.

UnitedIrishman

Coaching staff of X county should be able to counteract the tactics of Y county. There seems to be a real lack of coaching talent within the GAA, plenty of Motivators and Fitness Experts and Head Doctors, but very few tacticians.

Spot on. One of the best tacticians and all round managers is sitting commentating for RTE every sunday - Martin Carney. I've had him as a manager for all of my school life and I must say his footballing brain is superb. The amount of knowledge we got from him is uncountable. Our school was quite lucky in that sense, we have both TJ Kilgannon and Martin Carney as mentors.

What he always taught us was that the deifinition of a hand-pass is a pass to get you out of trouble. Then you use kick passing to deliver. Another thing was that you should never worry about the opposition. If you worrying about the opposition (i.e watching tapes of players etc) then you are putting doubts into your mind. If you have belief that you will beat the other side, you will. Simple, simple things. But in the scheme of things they are massive.

jacool

Everything here is from a not-serious fan of the GAA, but a fan of sports.
The main problem with the GAA is that they don't apply their own rules so the fix for the current 'crisis' which is a change in rules, cannot occur in the environment where the rules aren't being enforced. The rule change I would go for is that it should be 'one handball, then one kick' just like the soloing is supposed to be at the moment.
Here are a few example rules that are never enforced
1. The solo run. Every Saturday or Sunday I see basketball impersonations where people try to control the ball by successive bounces. Even though they are not moving the rule still stands.
2. The re-start. Only two players should be within 10 metres of the ball. Well we all know what really happens.
3. Free kicks. The ball should travel 10 metres from the free, but see the amount of quick tap frees that all go unpunished.
4. Encroachment. There should not be anybody on the pitch not allowed on by the referee. I see a player got sent off yesterday for fighting with a water carrier. This is madness, and a dangerous precedent. If they want water breaks then fine, in this heat especially, but if this is not controlled anyone could step on at a vital time in a game, by 'accident' !!
My other two bug bears are
1 A big one as I bet on these matches, is the accuracy of score giving. When Dublin scored a point against Offaly that wasn't given I went nuts as I was betting on how much Dublin would win by. I wouldn't have been happy if they hadn't beaten the handicap. Some Donegal 'scores' on Saturday went over the top of the posts, and how can they be judged accurately ? It looks like guesswork at best. Scoring is the basis of the game, get it right !!
2. The third man tackle. Vicious, dangerous, and largely undetected. Maybe a second referee is required, off pitch and with an audio link to the man in the middle who can't see everything.
Overall football will have to change to a more open, fluid game, otherwise attendances will dwindle and we will go back to saying that here is a game for failed hurlers ! (Sort of) rant over .

DUB

I hate the idea of a one kick and one hand pass rule. It'd lead to a lot of aimless balls punted wellystyle up the park. So what if the game has become more possession based. Anyone who is a fan of soccer can't have a problem with that.

In my opinion, while football throws up the odd howler of a match and when it's bad it is bad but for all it's faults Gaelic football still throws out far more exciting matches more often then any other sport I can think of.

I think to curb teams fouling again and again, which is the most common cause of a poor match, the ref should be given the power to warn a team captain that if his team keeps fouling they he will send a man to the bin for ten minutes. Some teams systematically foul rather then let the man though. All you have to do is stop fouling being advantagious. It was far to much giving the bin for every yellow, only the GAA could mess up the sin bin like we did.

DUB

jacool wrote:

Overall football will have to change to a more open, fluid game, otherwise attendances will dwindle and we will go back to saying that here is a game for failed hurlers ! (Sort of) rant over .

Attendances are as big or bigger then they ever were, the league attendances were down a bit, possibly, but if they sorted out the league structure that'd change.

A lot of the so called problems aren't new. Ulster who some would say has the worst problem with serial fouling scrappy matches often has the best attendances.

Oh and three yellow in the championship and you should miss a match.

theCzar

What about Dublin? As a dub, I obviously think they're great to watch but what about neutrals (if there any neutrals when it comes to Dublin!).

To my mind, Dubs are playing fast paced, attacking football, combination of some hand passes to earn some space followed by kick passing to the forwards, lots of movement in the forwards, who are good at beating players (a bit accuracy at times is all they're missing!).

Or am I just totally deluded!?

Collie D

Uusally I would agree with that, Czar, but yesterday's second half was terrible. If I was at home watching on TV and that was any other team bar Dublin I'd have been reaching for the remote. I have switched off quite a few games this year, is it a bad year for footbal or have RTE just picked the wrong games? Of course, IF Dublin do go all the way this year, the usual begrudgers will be out saying ah you only won it cos it was a ****e Chamionship. Somebody else mentioned 0-0 games in soccer, it's not all about the number of goals/points scored, the best game in the world cup imo was the Italy-Germany semifinal which was 0-0 until Italy scored two in the last minute.

theCzar

Gah, I work a night shift, on a boat, in the North Sea, so yesterday was the first Dub game I missed. Went to bed around 2pm and didn't sleep much! Worried Caffo's new new Dublin would turn into old new Dublin!

Further, I get back home on the 1st of september, weekend after Semi. I'm cracking up!

Collie D

theCzar wrote:

Further, I get back home on the 1st of september, weekend after Semi. I'm cracking up!

Can I have your ticket, so?

kaimera

*cough* todays game with Laois v Mayo *cough*

Gone to the dogs my arse.

*some* games yes, but saying that football in general is bad..no.

Lemlin

Wasn't really a great game of football Kaimera. It was enjoyable to watch but, as pointed out at half time, it didn't have near the intensity of the quarter finals of some years. For example, Armagh vs. Kerry a week ago or Dublin vs. Tyrone last year. There weren't many hard tackles going in and too many of the players didn't look like they were willing to put it all on the line to win.

The Dublin Westmeath game yesterday was just a farce. I kept switching over to Back To The Future III because it was more interesting. After Mossy Quinn got the goal it was over as a contest. Friends of mine left at half time.

E@gle.

Lemlin wrote:

The Dublin Westmeath game yesterday was just a farce. I kept switching over to Back To The Future III because it was more interesting. After Mossy Quinn got the goal it was over as a contest. Friends of mine left at half time.

i was there myself worst match ever watching the ads on the big screen was more enjoyable. left just after half time.

Culchie

Lemlin wrote:

Wasn't really a great game of football Kaimera. It was enjoyable to watch but, as pointed out at half time, it didn't have near the intensity of the quarter finals of some years. For example, Armagh vs. Kerry a week ago or Dublin vs. Tyrone last year. There weren't many hard tackles going in and too many of the players didn't look like they were willing to put it all on the line to win.

The Dublin Westmeath game yesterday was just a farce. I kept switching over to Back To The Future III because it was more interesting. After Mossy Quinn got the goal it was over as a contest. Friends of mine left at half time.

I was at then match so missed these comments, but heard about them tonight after a few 'apres match bevvies'

So..........because two teams decided to go out and play football, play the ball, not the man, there is a problem ???

Confused ....

megadodge

While a number of recent football games have not exactly set the pulses racing, I would have to agree very strongly with 'DUB' here in saying that the commentators/analysts are ridiculously harsh in their criticism at times and that by definition every game cannot be a classic. This then has a knock-on effect on the watching public.

Isn't it amazing that Michael O'Muircheartaigh always seems to get the exciting games and poor Ger Canning ALL the boring ones !!

As Michael says "commentate on what you see, not what you'd like to see".

I'm probably older than most of the posters here and I can remember every other 'crisis' that football has had down through the years.
In the 70's it was "that handpassing has the game ruined".
In the early 80's it was "that Kerry team have the game ruined".
In the late 80's it was "those dirty Meath bast*rds have the game ruined".
In the early 90's it was "this Ulster dominance is ruining the game".
In the early 00's it's "this negative dirty Ulster handpassing defensive game has the game ruined".

They were all wrong !
The game is not ruined and will continue to produce more non-classic games than classics just as it always has.

Once 10 years or so pass, people (as is their wont) start looking back with rose-tinted glasses and the very games they were criticising are lauded compared to "the rubbish served up today".

Well I want to say (and I'd love to tell Spillane this to his face) that the WORST GAME OF FOOTBALL I EVER SAW was the 1975 AIF between Kerry and Dublin. Two teams supposedly full of legends and yet there was only one man out of the entire two teams that realised kicking to your own teammates was actually a good idea. Ironically like every other culchie I hated him at the time, but he was class - Brian Mullins. Every other player just hoofed the ball anywhere and more often than not it went to the opposition.
It was diorreah inducing stuff.

Football has NOT got worse and if you watch All-Ireland Gold on TG4 (which in fairness only shows the best games of yesteryear) and compared this year's Kerry/Armagh, Tyrone/Louth last year's AIF etc. they will match up very favourably.

On TV controversy/talking points/volatile characters/negativity etc. all add up to better ratings and as a result those with a vested interest are only going to encourage same. Think Dunphy. Then his discipile Spillane. Then George Hook. Get the picture ?

Nalced_irl

E@gle. wrote:

i was there myself worst match ever watching the ads on the big screen was more enjoyable. left just after half time.

It was an awful match really. I stayed till the end but not exactly because of the games outstanding quality. The Mayo/Laois game wasnt much better but at least it was a contest. Hopefully the replay will be a good one.

A bit disappointing as this is my last trip to Croker this year. Im gonna be arriving in Australia on the day of the Semi's. Have a place already sorted to watch the game tho so at least ill get to see it. Should be a good atmosphere there as there is alot of Irish and im sure alot of Dublin/Mayo/Laois fans.

Lemlin

Culchie wrote:

I was at then match so missed these comments, but heard about them tonight after a few 'apres match bevvies'

So..........because two teams decided to go out and play football, play the ball, not the man, there is a problem ???

Confused ....

No, not at all. Two teams don't have to play the man. But it would be interesting to see a bit of intensity. For example, look at McDonald, strolling around the pitch like he's David Beckham. Do you think he'd get away with that on the Armagh or Kerry teams?

Fact is, as O'Rourke said, the game was entertaining but it was two teams of limited ability running around like a pack of schoolkids at times. You didn't see either set of players fighting (and I mean with passion, not fists) as if losing this match was the end of their season. It was played at a very pedestrian pace TBH.

Sherifu

i'd prefer to watch 10 laois v mayo games than watch 1 game with armagh or kerry slogging it out tbh.
that's my personal preference, call me crazy but i like to see open passing football and how can you say they weren't both going for it?

Culchie

Lemlin wrote:

No, not at all. Two teams don't have to play the man. But it would be interesting to see a bit of intensity. For example, look at McDonald, strolling around the pitch like he's David Beckham. Do you think he'd get away with that on the Armagh or Kerry teams?

Surely that is Laois's problem? What is Ciaran McDonald supposed to do?

"Hey Lads, I'm all alone here, hang on a second while I get myself marked by 5 or 6 of the Laois backs, then pass it to me" ????:rolleyes:

and another thing .... Ciaran McDonald is one of the toughest nuts around, he is well able to mix it with the best of them.
He also was the once decent player Mayo had against Kerry in 2004, so again, you just keeping digging holes and throwing yourself down them.

Anyways Lemlin, as usual you're starting a little flame war for your own amusement, by 'stirring things up a little bit'.

Never mind, one day the Lemlins will arise !

UnitedIrishman

Lemlin wrote:

No, not at all. Two teams don't have to play the man. But it would be interesting to see a bit of intensity. For example, look at McDonald, strolling around the pitch like he's David Beckham. Do you think he'd get away with that on the Armagh or Kerry teams?

Back to sleep Lemlin. He was playing as a withdrawn corner forward. It wasn't his man strolling through our half back line. Just because he may have been the one in the camera shot at the time means nothing. Ger Brady and Billi Joe were lazy as hell when Laois had the ball. There were a lot worse than Ciaran Mc out there on Sunday.He's also the most talented footballer we've had in decades. 99.9% of the time he finds a Mayo player with the ball. That'll do for me.

DUB

megadodge wrote:

While a number of recent football games have not exactly set the pulses racing, I would have to agree very strongly with 'DUB' here in saying that the commentators/analysts are ridiculously harsh in their criticism at times and that by definition every game cannot be a classic. This then has a knock-on effect on the watching public.

Isn't it amazing that Michael O'Muircheartaigh always seems to get the exciting games and poor Ger Canning ALL the boring ones !!

As Michael says "commentate on what you see, not what you'd like to see".

I'm probably older than most of the posters here and I can remember every other 'crisis' that football has had down through the years.
In the 70's it was "that handpassing has the game ruined".
In the early 80's it was "that Kerry team have the game ruined".
In the late 80's it was "those dirty Meath bast*rds have the game ruined".
In the early 90's it was "this Ulster dominance is ruining the game".
In the early 00's it's "this negative dirty Ulster handpassing defensive game has the game ruined".

They were all wrong !
The game is not ruined and will continue to produce more non-classic games than classics just as it always has.

Once 10 years or so pass, people (as is their wont) start looking back with rose-tinted glasses and the very games they were criticising are lauded compared to "the rubbish served up today".

Well I want to say (and I'd love to tell Spillane this to his face) that the WORST GAME OF FOOTBALL I EVER SAW was the 1975 AIF between Kerry and Dublin. Two teams supposedly full of legends and yet there was only one man out of the entire two teams that realised kicking to your own teammates was actually a good idea. Ironically like every other culchie I hated him at the time, but he was class - Brian Mullins. Every other player just hoofed the ball anywhere and more often than not it went to the opposition.
It was diorreah inducing stuff.

Football has NOT got worse and if you watch All-Ireland Gold on TG4 (which in fairness only shows the best games of yesteryear) and compared this year's Kerry/Armagh, Tyrone/Louth last year's AIF etc. they will match up very favourably.

On TV controversy/talking points/volatile characters/negativity etc. all add up to better ratings and as a result those with a vested interest are only going to encourage same. Think Dunphy. Then his discipile Spillane. Then George Hook. Get the picture ?

Excellent post, agree 100%, people seem to think every game has to be a classic or it's rubbish. Just because Andy Grey tells you that the West Brom v Blackburn match is facinating dosent mean it actually is. The Vast majority of premiership matches are foregone conclusions and very often dull-dour affairs, yet you'll never hear Sky pundits lambasting the standards of the game. Arsnil went 49 games unbeaten, if that happened in Hurling there'd be teeth gnashing all over the gaff. I don't want RTÉ to hype every single match up but less negativity would be very welcome.

Lemlin

UnitedIrishman wrote:

Back to sleep Lemlin. He was playing as a withdrawn corner forward. It wasn't his man strolling through our half back line. Just because he may have been the one in the camera shot at the time means nothing. Ger Brady and Billi Joe were lazy as hell when Laois had the ball. There were a lot worse than Ciaran Mc out there on Sunday.He's also the most talented footballer we've had in decades. 99.9% of the time he finds a Mayo player with the ball. That'll do for me.

Doesn't matter if it was his man or not. That's irrelevant. He should be picking up the man nearest to him or at least attempting to put pressure on him. McDonald may be a wonderful footballer but he's far too much of a primamadonna.

He wouldn't get away with that craic on the Kerry or Armagh teams and Mayo should expect better from him too. Standing there with his hands on his hips while the opposition attack is not acceptable and Mayo will win nothing while they've players acting like that.

Waylander

Lemlin wrote:

Doesn't matter if it was his man or not. That's irrelevant. He should be picking up the man nearest to him or at least attempting to put pressure on him. McDonald may be a wonderful footballer but he's far too much of a primamadonna.

He wouldn't get away with that craic on the Kerry or Armagh teams and Mayo should expect better from him too. Standing there with his hands on his hips while the opposition attack is not acceptable and Mayo will win nothing while they've players acting like that.

What is a primamadonna?

jank

Football has gone to the dogs because coaches and manager realise that if you get 15 fit guys and 2 or 3 decent forwards then you can have a good go at winning any game. It reminds me of Rubgy league sometimes.

Ah if only hurling was more popular. With hurling to become really good at it you have to play if for years begining at underage level. With football well One good pre-season and if you can kick a ball then your sorted to play some level of it.

The Rooster

jank wrote:

Football has gone to the dogs because coaches and manager realise that if you get 15 fit guys and 2 or 3 decent forwards then you can have a good go at winning any game. It reminds me of Rubgy league sometimes.

Someone who either doesnt watch football or doesnt watch rugby league!

You should ring up the Westmeath County Board straight away to tell them you have this cunning plan that will enable them to "have a good go at winning any game". Not to mention the dozen or more (plenty more probably) counties who aren't as good as Westmeath.

kincsem

I do not watch GAA but last weekend I was in a house where the Dublin V Westmeath match was on so I watched it.

I know all who post here are GAA fans, and at any adverse comment the usual reaction is to attack.

The match was no-contest. Dublin were much better.

What disappointed me, and always does when I watch GAA football, was the continuous fouling of players playing football. The referee waves cards (is there a black card now?), but then it is play on as usual. I saw a player deliberately kicking another player (two instances, one by each side). In any other sport the culprit would be sent off (no sin bin).

Some would say it is a man's game, that it is all part and parcel of the game, all those old cliches. But what I see is a game that has little football and a lot of unpunished fouling. It is not enjoyable to watch.

My other impression is with fifteen a side it is easy to crowd players. If there was smaller team numbers there would be more football.

Waylander

I think maybe Kincsem you have been watching some of the wrong games. The Kerry Armagh game of a couple of weeks ago would have been a better choice for you. Personally, I love that GAA has a more physical side to it, I think soccer has become an almost non contact sport now. Dont get me wrong, I am a soccer fan, but I just think it has gone to far to reduce the physical aspect of the game. I do not think GAA is any worse then rugby, where it is not uncommon to see people getting away with stamping and the likes, it is difficult for the refs to catch everything.

Regarding the 15 a side, it should be borne in mind that a GAA pitch is considerably bigger then a soccer pitch. I do not really agree with the original poster on this thread, I think he was partly venting frustration after a weekend of poor games, and they were all awful games that weekend. Since then we had a quality Kerry Armagh game, and an exciting Laois v Mayo game.

DUB

Spot on Waylander.

I'm a fan of all team sports but if you watch a random game of soccer as a neutral it can very quickly get boring. The world cup for example was littered with matches going 180 minutes without a goal, serious soccer heads find that sort of thing entertaining but i found it dull as ditchwater.

I find rugby almost impossible to watch unless i support one of the teams, there are very often punch ups involving more then two players but the commentators just laugh it off as handbags. The same thing happens in a GAA match and it's all over the papers.

Tyrone being knocked out so early has probably harmed the standard of the championship this year as has the early meeting of Armagh and Kerry but thems the breaks in a knockout system.

jank

You should ring up the Westmeath County Board straight away to tell them you have this cunning plan that will enable them to "have a good go at winning any game". Not to mention the dozen or more (plenty more probably) counties who aren't as good as Westmeath.

I didnt say its a winning formula. But how else can you explain the reason why the skills in football have gone backwards recently. The emphasis is on Stamina and Strength and having 12 men behind the ball. Skill is put on the back burner.

In hurling if a team is better then they will usually hammer the opposition.
In football the even if a team is better they probably wont win by more then 3 or 4 point usually.
Hurling needs more skill where football the emphasis is elsewhere.


Its just an observation so no need to get smart.

Lemlin

Waylander wrote:

What is a primamadonna?

Primadonna and from dictionary.com especially for you: a vain and temperamental person.


And would you argue that McDonald isn't one? Like I said, he wouldn't get away with strolling around the 40 with his hands on his hips on any team that are going to win the Championship this year.

As long as Mayo are carrying players like him they'll win nothing. Talented and wonderful to watch when on the ball but lazy and arrogant is the way I'd see him.

DUB

jank wrote:

In hurling if a team is better then they will usually hammer the opposition.
In football the even if a team is better they probably wont win by more then 3 or 4 point usually.
Hurling needs more skill where football the emphasis is elsewhere.

That dosent add up I'm afraid.
In soccer a poor team will often hold a good team to a 0-0 or a 1-0 win.
Are you suggesting then that soccer is less skillfull again?
I think we all agree that Hurling is a faster more skillfull game then football, that dosent mean football is devoid of skill.

Blackjack

Lemlin wrote:

Primadonna and from dictionary.com especially for you: a vain and temperamental person.


And would you argue that McDonald isn't one? Like I said, he wouldn't get away with strolling around the 40 with his hands on his hips on any team that are going to win the Championship this year.

As long as Mayo are carrying players like him they'll win nothing. Talented and wonderful to watch when on the ball but lazy and arrogant is the way I'd see him.

Do you know him personally?. Do you know for a fact that he is Vain and temperamental?. Do you?.

Just because he braids his hair, does not make him a Primadonna. Just because he plays Gaelic Football, does not mean he can't make his own style. What is it with the Colm O'Rourke attitude that all GAA players have to look like Gooch Cooper, with Short back and sides, and sunday-going-to-mass shoes?. Jesus, get a grip. Any county would be glad to have him. He can stroll around the 40 all he likes - as do most midfielders when the ball is elsewhere by the way. Perhaps you should take a look at others who play in the same position as him to see how they carry on. Those that are almost as good are similar. The rest are nowhere to be seen.

jank

DUB wrote:

That dosent add up I'm afraid.
In soccer a poor team will often hold a good team to a 0-0 or a 1-0 win.
Are you suggesting then that soccer is less skillfull again?
I think we all agree that Hurling is a faster more skillfull game then football, that dosent mean football is devoid of skill.

Im just saying that games tend to be closer and more defensive affairs.