Garmin Map Updates

Colly

Hi

One of the biggest if not the only factor in buying a GPS system is the accuracy of the inbuilt maps. I wanted to ask if anyone knows how oftern Garmin update the roads on their maps? From reading posts here and looking at the Q1 2006 Navteq maps on www.mapquest.com alot of new roads like the ballyshannon bypass and new bypasses/motorways are missing. These to me are major gaps and I understand they can't have all the roads on there maps especially as the government agencies don't update navteq on changes anyway making there life harder. But I wanted to know how often I would be waiting for updates (I understand they will cost money probably 50-70 euro each)???

Also what update will Garmin be issuing in September, will it be Q1 2006 Navteq maps as if so they are already well out of date.???

Owen

Garmin are releasing Ireland with 100% coverage in Sept. BUT as some roads are still being built, along with some housing estates, etc, it's expected that approx 7-12% of Ireland will always be unmapped, same as UK, etc.

Colly

ned78 wrote:

Garmin are releasing Ireland with 100% coverage in Sept. BUT as some roads are still being built, along with some housing estates, etc, it's expected that approx 7-12% of Ireland will always be unmapped, same as UK, etc.

Does it take them two years to update there maps though? As Q1 2006 will be out over 8months by the time they have it on their devices. So if they release an update the following Sept the maps will be nearly two years out of synch with reality. Is this normal? two yr old maps. I would have thought a 6month update cycle would be more practical. Maybe it is not possible for such a frequency as Navteq need to incorporate the updates into there system and maps and run tests on it. Am I expecting too much from an update cycle?

Owen

Navteq only provide Raw Data, it's up to Garmin, Tom Tom, Bendix King, et al, to update that Raw Data for their own devices, and for each device in their range. For example, BMW update their Satnav on a 6 month basis.

Colly

ned78 wrote:

Navteq only provide Raw Data, it's up to Garmin, Tom Tom, Bendix King, et al, to update that Raw Data for their own devices, and for each device in their range. For example, BMW update their Satnav on a 6 month basis.

I understand who is who and what each company does, when I said how often do they update there maps I mean as you say the Raw data how often do Garmin convert that raw data into maps(images, voice prompts etc) and release it to the public or install these updates on the hardware.

Thanks for your insight.

Owen

AFAIK, Garmin only release major updates, for example, City Navigator v8 has been out for quite some time. It's City Navigator 9 that's coming in September, and I'd hazard a guess that it'd be another 12-18 months before we see City Navigator 10.

Colly

ned78 wrote:

AFAIK, Garmin only release major updates, for example, City Navigator v8 has been out for quite some time. It's City Navigator 9 that's coming in September, and I'd hazard a guess that it'd be another 12-18 months before we see City Navigator 10.

Thanks Ned that was what I think also just under two years to release new updates for their devices. At least this update is a comprehensive update with secondary class roads. The major gaps will be with bypasses and motorways and one way systems in Dublin Changing.

A shame really as 18months is just too long in my eyes. I will just have to use a recently published map in conjunction with the device or look at an alternate manufacturer who updates on a quarter by quarter basis or even 6month basis. I believe the competition will grow in Ireland as from reading GPSIRELAND other mapping companies such as teleatlas plan to work towards 100% converage for Ireland (ie secondary class roads etc)

eirlink

Colly wrote:

Thanks Ned that was what I think also just under two years to release new updates for their devices. At least this update is a comprehensive update with secondary class roads. The major gaps will be with bypasses and motorways and one way systems in Dublin Changing.

A shame really as 18months is just too long in my eyes. I will just have to use a recently published map in conjunction with the device or look at an alternate manufacturer who updates on a quarter by quarter basis or even 6month basis. I believe the competition will grow in Ireland as from reading GPSIRELAND other mapping companies such as teleatlas plan to work towards 100% converage for Ireland (ie secondary class roads etc)

Well its a bit like computer software in a way..you get in at some point and then look to upgrade down the line.the hardware manafacturers will BUY licences off the likes of Navteq only when they have a new unit in production or as stated above, in the case of a major update.

As these licences cost money, the manafacturers will "evaluate" which release to go for and this "evaluation" will be based on cost versus coverage.Its my opinion that the Q1 2006 maps by Navteq will be best placed to fulfill the needs of most manafacturers, due to the tremendious difference in coverage, compared to previous offerings.I also believe Navteq do indeed have these bypasses etc, mapped in their raw data,and available under licence.

therefore i expect the Q1 2006 maps to be most popular with manafacturers,with the select few (ie BMW ) paying the premium for the very latest maps,bearing in mind they can then pass on the premium to its customers.

I personally have Q1 2006 at present and find it amazing.I have found the odd omission and have notified Navteq.I can happily live with this...compared to Q4 2005.But i intend to update my maps in 12 to 18 months for around €50.by that time the €50 will be well spent for the 7% to 12 % i am missing at the moment!!

even if you buy a beemer you are not guaranteed the "very" latest maps.

eirlink

Colly wrote:

..... how often do Garmin convert that raw data into maps(images, voice prompts etc) and release it to the public or install these updates on the hardware.

Thanks for your insight.

prob every "major" map update or new hardware production run.

Trotter

Sorry to hijack the thread but you all sound like you know what you're at. If you were to buy a basic handheld GPS with decent road maps of Ireland right now, what would it be? Thanks!

Colly

Trotter wrote:

Sorry to hijack the thread but you all sound like you know what you're at. If you were to buy a basic handheld GPS with decent road maps of Ireland right now, what would it be? Thanks!

Would hardly call myself an expert on this but here is what I am planning on buying.

Given the thread name surprise surprise it is a Garmin, the model is a Nuvi 310 deluxe (deluxe as it comes with the european maps and it has bluetooth) on pixmania.com it is €540. The reason for buying the Nuvi is that it has a small form factor so can be carried around in a pocket when on foot so I have the opportunity to get more out of the high cost. There are plenty of reviews on GPS devices online have a look at the selection and make your mind up, remember devices with Navteq maps are the only ones you should be looking at and Garmin won't be releasing the new maps on there units until Sept. Once they have it released and you buy a device after a certain date which has the old maps you can write to Garmin with a coupon and your receipt and get the update for no cost, so you won't have to wait for the old stock to clear. That is my plan so guess I will have it by October but will be keeping my eye on the garmin site to see when they release it version 9 and I can claim a free copy if I buy a device without it.

aphex™

Do they ever provide maps as a download??

Colly

aphex&#8482 wrote:

Do they ever provide maps as a download??

Garmin do once you pay or if you buy the devise with the old maps and a new map is out you can get it mailed to you on DVD. I believe the maps are only available on DVD as they are so large.

Strasser

Typical, I bought a garmin nuvi 300 yesterday. If I had known about this map update timing thing I would have waited a few weeks for version 9 of the maps. Am I screwed now and will I have to pay for the updated version 9 maps?

There is a yellow coupon type sheet in the box with an unlock code, will this help I wonder, and how do I use it?

Colly

Strasser wrote:

Typical, I bought a garmin nuvi 300 yesterday. If I had known about this map update timing thing I would have waited a few weeks for version 9 of the maps. Am I screwed now and will I have to pay for the updated version 9 maps?

There is a yellow coupon type sheet in the box with an unlock code, will this help I wonder, and how do I use it?

In my eyes this update (version 9) will be worth the money as today minor roads are not listed outside of large towns and in this update most of them will be present which is what you want a sat nav unit to do as it needs to tell ya where to go once off the main roads.

I am not 100% sure but if you don't register your unit until after the update is released you maybe okay but on the coupon that needs to be printed out on the garmin site they are looking for a copy and not a photocopy of your sales receipt.

You might be able to look at the ins and outs of what you need to do to get the new update but it may not be out until next yr as an update and in device prior to that so at least you get to use it for a few months before the update comes out and we have to wait all those months.

Where did you buy your nuvi 300 and how much was it?

Owen

I have the Garmin Nuvi 360 with Bluetooth, it won an award recently as the best all round GPS. I'm delighted with it having owned a lot of GPS' in the past, including a Nuvi 350, C310, BMW Motorrad Navigator II, and GPS Route 66 for my Nokia n90.

Sesonic

Bought a sony Sony Nav-U70T with full european coverage last thursday.

Did a trip from athlone to monaghan and was very inpressed with the map
coverage. It has every town in it as far as i could tell and very deailed maps of dublin, cork, galway etc.


Check out sony.ie

NV-50 is €350


Don't know which navyeq maps, but it's meant ot have 100% coverage for ireland.

Colly

ned78 wrote:

I have the Garmin Nuvi 360 with Bluetooth, it won an award recently as the best all round GPS. I'm delighted with it having owned a lot of GPS' in the past, including a Nuvi 350, C310, BMW Motorrad Navigator II, and GPS Route 66 for my Nokia n90.

Where do you buy them from?

Strasser

Colly wrote:

Where did you buy your nuvi 300 and how much was it?

Halfords in the newhall retail Park in Naas, €429.00

ffocused

Sesonic wrote:

Bought a sony Sony Nav-U70T with full european coverage last thursday.

Did a trip from athlone to monaghan and was very inpressed with the map
coverage. It has every town in it as far as i could tell and very deailed maps of dublin, cork, galway etc.


Check out sony.ie

NV-50 is €350


Don't know which navyeq maps, but it's meant ot have 100% coverage for ireland.

I have the NV-50 and it has the Q4 2005 map on it. It does not have any 3rd class roads on it. (none i have driven on anyway).
It also does not include motorway sliproads as exits from roundabouts for some reason. i.e. take 1st exit on roundabout is the instruction, but i want the second one. the first is a motorway!! This luckily happened while i was testing it on routes i know already.

Colly

ffocused wrote:

I have the NV-50 and it has the Q4 2005 map on it. It does not have any 3rd class roads on it. (none i have driven on anyway).
It also does not include motorway sliproads as exits from roundabouts for some reason. i.e. take 1st exit on roundabout is the instruction, but i want the second one. the first is a motorway!! This luckily happened while i was testing it on routes i know already.

I believe Sony use the navteq maps which are the most comprehensive of Ireland now with minor roads also. They only convered the minor roads as of March 2006 (Q1).

eirlink

Colly wrote:

I believe Sony use the navteq maps which are the most comprehensive of Ireland now with minor roads also. They only convered the minor roads as of March 2006 (Q1).

...Correct Q1 2006 includes minor roads and is a major update from Navteq since Q4 2005.
Also worth noting is the fact that 45,000 townlands are mapped so the search function is unbelievable at present

I will be getting my hands on Q2 2006 maps this friday so it will be interesting to see what further is added.

Will post more then

Colly

eirlink wrote:

I will be getting my hands on Q2 2006 maps this friday so it will be interesting to see what further is added.

Will post more then

I emailed garmin map support dept and they gave me the following response on when they will be releasing V9 and what Quarter Navteq maps they would be using. Nothing definite, I spoke to them on the phone also and the lad said they tell us no dates now or details as previously this was said to customers and the dates changed which leads to disappointment and frustration so best to tell us nothing (he did not say that in as many words but that was the gist)

"Thank you for contacting Garmin Cartography. There is not firm release date
at this time. I can't say exactly what quarter maps we are using but they
will be updated through 2006."

Eirlink let me know how the maps look and if they are any different to Q1 in Ireland, thanks. I have the feeling they wont be dramtically different for Ireland from Q1 to Q2 but I could be wrong and they are continually surveying the country.

byrnefm

Navteq have an update section for their website for submitting information which they're missing from their maps. Using a combination of Mapopolis with Dublin maps and Destinator 6 for the Q1/2006 Navteq maps, I submitted feedback early last month about some of the missing / incorrect features for roads in Donegal, such as the 'new' roundabout outside Donegal town (that was formerly an intersection), the Ballyshannon & Bundoran bypasses and some missing road names in Dublin.

So far, I haven't seen any additional feedback from them after six weeks (on the status section, when you submit feedback) but at least they should be aware of the Donegal changes, anyway. However, I'd say it'll be at least the Q1/2007 maps before they're added on. Assuming they even read the feedback page

FYI, the link in question is: http://update.navteq.com/

eirlink

byrnefm wrote:

Navteq have an update section for their website for submitting information which they're missing from their maps. Using a combination of Mapopolis with Dublin maps and Destinator 6 for the Q1/2006 Navteq maps, I submitted feedback early last month about some of the missing / incorrect features for roads in Donegal, such as the 'new' roundabout outside Donegal town (that was formerly an intersection), the Ballyshannon & Bundoran bypasses and some missing road names in Dublin.

So far, I haven't seen any additional feedback from them after six weeks (on the status section, when you submit feedback) but at least they should be aware of the Donegal changes, anyway. However, I'd say it'll be at least the Q1/2007 maps before they're added on. Assuming they even read the feedback page

FYI, the link in question is: http://update.navteq.com/

It is most likely that Navteq already have the Donegal Changes and indeed others mapped.When GPS manafacturers go to Navteq for maps they have to buy a "licence" to include the RAW data in their software.They are given choices at this stage as to what version of mapping they wish to licence.Bear in mind that its not always the case where they buy the latest maps, as cost will be in play.

so,beacuse a place is not mapped when you turn on the device does not mean Navteq dont have it...it may be because of the map data licence chosen by the device manafacturer.

This became evident when Route 66 ran into trouble with their branding early this year,whereby their logo for uk showed Ireland and all of british isles as having 100% coverage.This was clearly a mistake by someone in R66 depts cause ireland did NOT have anywhere near 100% at that time (may have been late 05)...
Anyway to save face,and a potential legal affront,due to false advertising ,R66 went in serch of an answer and found it in Navteq,who amazingly had the Q1 2006 maps available.Albeit at a premium.
These maps appeared very quickly and enabled us to enjoy a fantastic update at the cost of a marketing error.

I will be reviewing Q2 2006 map data tomorrow...cant wait.

gagga

Strasser wrote:

Typical, I bought a garmin nuvi 300 yesterday. If I had known about this map update timing thing I would have waited a few weeks for version 9 of the maps. Am I screwed now and will I have to pay for the updated version 9 maps?

There is a yellow coupon type sheet in the box with an unlock code, will this help I wonder, and how do I use it?

I've heard that if you don't register your Nuvi until the new maps are available from Garmin they will send on the new maps for Ireland free.

As I say I have really only heard this so it might be best to check - But don't ask Garmin!:)

Incidentally, Halfords will give you a full refund if you return the product within 28 days of purchase.

eirlink

gagga wrote:

I've heard that if you don't register your Nuvi until the new maps are available from Garmin they will send on the new maps for Ireland free.

As I say I have really only heard this so it might be best to check - But don't ask Garmin!:)

Incidentally, Halfords will give you a full refund if you return the product within 28 days of purchase.

why not contact garmin?
nothing wrong with asking.Just enquire "IF i buy such and such" whats the story with getting latest maps etc,how do i do this? .....

Just DONT enter the activation code till youre sure.(thats the code on a yellow sticker )

Strasser

gagga wrote:

I've heard that if you don't register your Nuvi until the new maps are available from Garmin they will send on the new maps for Ireland free.

Unfortunately I had registered the unit before I had got up to speed on these issues.

gagga

Strasser wrote:

Unfortunately I had registered the unit before I had got up to speed on to these issues.

That is unfortunate. I was lucky enough to be told this by someone only recently and I have since had it confirmed by another.

The worst that can happen is you will be charged 75 dollars for the up-grade and then you'll be right on top of things.

The Nuvi 300 is a good quality product with a host of genuinely usable features. Granted there is no blue tooth, but this isn't really as important as we might think - most new mobile phones come with this feature so it's no big deal.

One of the really cool things I like about the 300 is the easy way you can set any location to your favourites with a couple of finger taps. Very useful.:)

eirlink

Well,got the Q2 2006 maps Friday and there is one addition to the mapping that i`ve noticed which is the inclusion of the Bundoran bypass.

Also,while travelling the M50 fri last i noticed that the Junction numbers are now included in the mapping.As you travel it also pops up the name of the road plus the direction you are travelling,eg "M50 Northbound"..this stays up for about 30 secs

The file size for on the SD card is larger but im sure that this is down to new mapping in NI and UK being included.So overall ,its only a minor update and i`ll know more as I drive around.

gagga

Eirlink. Thanks for that.

Is it a unit you would recommend?

I hear that the Fermoy by-pass is not on the map for Ireland, is this the case?

mackerski

eirlink wrote:

Well,got the Q2 2006 maps Friday and there is one addition to the mapping that i`ve noticed which is the inclusion of the Bundoran bypass.

Is there any sign of them having filled in the huge area of missing coverage in Dublin 15? The area I'm talking about is essentially everything between the Blanchardstown Centre and the Ongar/Little Pace estates, including important through-routes like the ones from Clonsilla to Clonee and Hollystown to Kilbride.

Dermot

Colly

mackerski wrote:

Is there any sign of them having filled in the huge area of missing coverage in Dublin 15? The area I'm talking about is essentially everything between the Blanchardstown Centre and the Ongar/Little Pace estates, including important through-routes like the ones from Clonsilla to Clonee and Hollystown to Kilbride.

Dermot

I think the Area you are talking about is including in a jpeg attached to this post. I am also curious if there is a road going over the railway tracks from Riverwood the small circle and an area called riverwood present on the map?

mackerski

Colly wrote:

I think the Area you are talking about is including in a jpeg attached to this post. I am also curious if there is a road going over the railway tracks from Riverwood the small circle and an area called riverwood present on the map?

Your map does include the bit I'm referring to, but the missing data goes some way outside the areas you've marked. ISTM that when the original Dublin coverage was being "completed", this part was considered countryside, and when they filled in the countryside later it was forgotten.

Dermot

eirlink

gagga wrote:

Eirlink. Thanks for that.

Is it a unit you would recommend?

I hear that the Fermoy by-pass is not on the map for Ireland, is this the case?

Afraid so...Im not familiar with Fermoy too well so have a look for yourself
Id reccommend the Airis T920,for lots of reasons.One feature i like is the ability to enter my own POI`s (points of Interest).using this feature you can enter Gatso speed camera sites and the unit will prompt you as you approach them with a sound and on screen flashing symbol.All legal and above board.No good for the mobile cams though.

eirlink

mackerski wrote:

Your map does include the bit I'm referring to, but the missing data goes some way outside the areas you've marked. ISTM that when the original Dublin coverage was being "completed", this part was considered countryside, and when they filled in the countryside later it was forgotten.

Dermot

Dermot
Youre correct in assuming that this was rezoned land at time of "one " survey and thus was not mapped as there were no roads to drive on.However updates will have picked up on this.I believe this area is mapped but as i dont know it you will have to excuse me if im wrong.I base this on the maps i`ve just looked at, a screenshot below ....

If you PM me with addresses i will do a search and if it returns a hit then its mapped!!

eirlink

Colly wrote:

I think the Area you are talking about is including in a jpeg attached to this post. I am also curious if there is a road going over the railway tracks from Riverwood the small circle and an area called riverwood present on the map?

Colly
It would appear there is a road crossing the railway line:) sorry 2 in fact.its getting too late for this.

eirlink

mackerski wrote:

Is there any sign of them having filled in the huge area of missing coverage in Dublin 15? The area I'm talking about is essentially everything between the Blanchardstown Centre and the Ongar/Little Pace estates, including important through-routes like the ones from Clonsilla to Clonee and Hollystown to Kilbride.

Dermot

Dermot
Again im not familiar with the area but it does have mapping for an area between allendale and mountainview ...

mackerski

eirlink wrote:

Dermot
Again im not familiar with the area but it does have mapping for an area between allendale and mountainview ...

Well, it was hard to tell anything from those other screenshots, but that last one shows some big progress. The Ongar Road is present, as is the road linking Blanchardstown Road South to Carpenterstown over the canal and railway.

Any chance you could check for the existence of Tory Square (on the side of Blanchardstown Hospital)?

Dermot

eirlink

mackerski wrote:

Well, it was hard to tell anything from those other screenshots, but that last one shows some big progress. The Ongar Road is present, as is the road linking Blanchardstown Road South to Carpenterstown over the canal and railway.

Any chance you could check for the existence of Tory Square (on the side of Blanchardstown Hospital)?

Dermot

Dermot
Its difficult to post the screenshots to show the level of detail required when im not familiar with the area,mostly due to fact that as you zoom out to include a wider area of map you lose the street names /text etc.

I have searched for tory square and its not returning anything so from that i take it its not mapped.
there is a feedback link on navteq website to report errors / unmapped areas so if you would like to submit this info to them it should be included in an upcoming map update.

Eirlink

mackerski

eirlink wrote:

Dermot
Its difficult to post the screenshots to show the level of detail required when im not familiar with the area,mostly due to fact that as you zoom out to include a wider area of map you lose the street names /text etc.

That's no bother - you've done me a big favour by confirming that the missing data have been added. I've been eagerly anticipating this.

Dermot

Colly

Thanks Eirlink for confirming navteq are doing a good job at staying up with the building of new estates. Here is hoping they use the Q2 2006 maps in garmins new map release in version 9 coming soon. But I suspect they will go for the cheaper Q1.

If you have time, and at the risk of your head melting doing screen shots, can you check for an area called Woodbrook Hall, just off the Riverwood Road in Carpenterstown.

gagga

eirlink wrote:

Afraid so...Im not familiar with Fermoy too well so have a look for yourself
Id reccommend the Airis T920,for lots of reasons.One feature i like is the ability to enter my own POI`s (points of Interest).using this feature you can enter Gatso speed camera sites and the unit will prompt you as you approach them with a sound and on screen flashing symbol.All legal and above board.No good for the mobile cams though.

Thank you for that recommendation. I will certainly be checking this out.

eirlink

Colly wrote:

Thanks Eirlink for confirming navteq are doing a good job at staying up with the building of new estates. Here is hoping they use the Q2 2006 maps in garmins new map release in version 9 coming soon. But I suspect they will go for the cheaper Q1.

If you have time, and at the risk of your head melting doing screen shots, can you check for an area called Woodbrook Hall, just off the Riverwood Road in Carpenterstown.

Hi Colly,
I like bringing good news and helping out ....even if the technology wrecks my head at times..

Anyway,the good news continues YES Woodbrook hall IS mapped.See below!!

Colly

eirlink wrote:

Hi Colly,
I like bringing good news and helping out

Sound as a pound, impressed with Navteq as they seem to be fully commited to 100% coverage or as close to as practically possible.

Strasser

I see city navigator europe version 8 has disappeared from the garmin map updates page http://www.garmin.com/unlock/update.jsp Hopefully this means the new version will be available soon.

Colly

Strasser wrote:

I see city navigator europe version 8 has disappeared from the garmin map updates page http://www.garmin.com/unlock/update.jsp Hopefully this means the new version will be available soon.

Hopefully as I would say they are loosing revenue to route 66 as they have utilised the new maps for some time now. Even if people don't purchase route 66 devices it is negative press to remain out of the picture in a country in Europe when it comes to national coverage.

iceage

just got a price this afternoon from Deevys Motor Accessories in Clonmel.....400.000 euros!!!! for the nuvi 310.

Colly

iceage wrote:

just got a price this afternoon from Deevys Motor Accessories in Clonmel.....400.000 euros!!!! for the nuvi 310.

You can get it delivered to your house online for 420 and this one includes the european maps not just Ireland and UK.

Our man in Havana

Anyone know where I can get maps for the Goodmans GNAV 10?

iceage

Colly wrote:

You can get it delivered to your house online for 420 and this one includes the european maps not just Ireland and UK.

surely thats not the nuvi 310