EU to call country 'Éire Ireland'

Dub13

http://www.breakingnews.ie/2006/06/27/story265243.html

Ireland is to be known as “Éire Ireland” at official European Union meetings in the future, it emerged tonight.

The move follows last year’s EU decision to designate Irish as its 21st official and working language from 2007.

The Éire Ireland name change will apply to signage and name plates at Council of Minister meetings and leaders’ summits from January 2007.

The Government today approved the measure at its weekly Cabinet meeting in Dublin.

A Government spokesperson said afterwards: “The name ‘Éire’ already appears on all Irish passports, stamps and coins, so it is an entirely consistent move.”

Member states like Finland and Belgium already have dual-language status at official EU meetings.
Under the 1937 Constitution, the state can be referred to as the Republic of Ireland, Ireland or Éire.

From 2007, all legislation approved by the Council of Ministers and the European Parliament must be translated into Irish.

Ministers and MEPs will also be able to speak in Irish on request during Council meetings and European Parliament plenary sessions.

Up to 30 jobs for Irish translators and interpreters are expected to be created in the European institutions as a result.

Dub13

I was not expecting this and it got me thinking what the cost is to have everything translated into Irish.Not that it matters of course as it has to be done.

As for “Éire Ireland”,I don't really like the sound of it.What was wrong with plane old Ireland...?

esperanza

Dub13 wrote:

I was not expecting this and it got me thinking what the cost is to have everything translated into Irish.Not that it matters of course as it has to be done.

As for “Éire Ireland”,I don't really like the sound of it.What was wrong with plane old Ireland...?

They must have been bored to tears, the buggers.;) Na, seriously, they are probably just trying to be fair -- we are supposedly a bilingual nation after all, aren't we? We should be damn proud that the EU has officially recognised our first official language, and thus the country's bilingual status.

I do hate the term "Eire" -- doesn't the term seem archaic or is it just me?

oscarBravo

esperanza wrote:

I do hate the term "Eire" -- doesn't the term seem archaic or is it just me?

It's not archaic, it's Irish. As gaeilge, "Éire" is ainm don stáit. In English, it's "Ireland".



Apologies for any grammatical errors as gaeilge.

5uspect

this is almost like revenge for the whole Dingle thing!

I'm not hugely fond if the irish language personally but its part of us so its good for Eire to be recognised, but the "Eire Ireland" seems a bit strange
Eire/Ireland or something would be more appropiate for signs etc.
If both names appear I don't really see any problems just as long as the distinction is made and we don't get known as the Republic of Eireireland.

esperanza

oscarBravo wrote:

It's not archaic, it's Irish. As gaeilge, "Éire" is ainm don stáit. In English, it's "Ireland".

Well, my gut feeling about the term having sth odd about it is confirmed in this wikipedia article. Apparently, the "use of "Éire" is associated with a condescending attitude to Ireland in some right-wing quarters of the British media.":(

Come to think of it, I have had many friends from the UK referring to Ireland as Eire, I've always wondered why, now it makes sense. Or else "Southern Ireland" to refer to the "Republic of Ireland"... ouch! There are just some people 'over the water' who have a very distorted view of our country, don't you think? (I won't even go into some continental Europeaners who still think we belong to the Brits! -- maybe our official bilingual name will raise some eyebrows in a good sense...

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89ire

"The name Éire is the nominative form in modern Irish of the name for the goddess Ériu, a mythical figure who helped the Gaels conquer Ireland as described in the Book of Invasions."

Interesting one, and never knew this (never been a staunch Republican or a big fan of the Irish language or culture in general, so please forgive my ignorance).;)

A Dub in Glasgo

Whatever happened to 'Republic of Ireland'? Are we afraid to indicate that we are a Republic?

oscarBravo

It's a descriptive term; one which I use quite regularly. But the name of the country is Ireland.

ScottishDanny

Could some set up a poll on the issue? It would be interesting to see what name other Board members would prefer

• éire/Ireland
• Ireland
• Republic of Ireland
• éire
• other

daveirl

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therecklessone

daveirl wrote:

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Thats so Johnny Giles doesn't get confused and call them the Deutschlandanians...

daveirl

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esperanza

therecklessone wrote:

Thats so Johnny Giles doesn't get confused and call them the Deutschlandanians...

Good one! On that note, are Brussels also planning to designate us an adjective...??

spurious

Éire and Eire are two different words.

For all the fuss about giving status to the first official language, the least they could do is use the right bloody word and not one that means load or burden.

esperanza

spurious wrote:

Éire and Eire are two different words.

Oh, really? Can you explain, please?

Chakar

Notice the dash Éire, this refers to the Republic of Ireland while other meanings of the term EIRE is EIRE- Employment Issues Reducing the Employer. EIRE- Entomological Inoculation Rate. EIRE- ETS IRF Response Element.

esperanza

Chakar wrote:

Notice the dash Éire, this refers to the Republic of Ireland while other meanings of the term EIRE is EIRE- Employment Issues Reducing the Employer. EIRE- Entomological Inoculation Rate. EIRE- ETS IRF Response Element.

OK, got it but, to be quite honest, I don't agree with you that people would confuse the two.

If a writer wished to refer to "EIRE" (i.e. Employment Issues Reducing the Employer), for example, then (s)he would be more likely to write the term in upper case, especially in official English texts, which you did not do in your first post -- hence my question!

It is common, however, for such acronyms to be written in lower case in certain languages, particularly French, after a period of extended usage and depending on their pronunciation... sorry for rambling!

Note: This is a dash - while the character over this letter is a fada "é", or an acute accent in English.

daveirl

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esperanza

daveirl wrote:

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Yes, exactly, that's what I've understood too. The OP didn't capitalise "Eire" so that's why his argument wasn't clear, at first.

seamus

From the Irish constitution:

Article 4
The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.

Afaik, the use of Éire as a derogatory term is an attempt at a "We still own 6 counties of your island". It's subtle, but the insult is completely defunct in this day and age, and no Irish person should take offence at its use. Quite the opposite.

flogen

Meh; non story really... not a big deal...
I'd like to think that this might encourage growth in the language, but I doubt it.

I agree that Éire is often used in the UK in the derogatory sense, but there's only one way to change that I guess!

aidan_walsh

esperanza wrote:

Good one! On that note, are Brussels also planning to designate us an adjective...??

Éireans?

/ducks

daveirl

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lostexpectation

daveirl wrote:

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thats an amazingly accurate description, and is exactly why we Irish should use Éire and not be afraid to use Éire.

although non-Irish and visting americans should use Ireland.

partly becuase of the awkardness of mixing English and Irish together in one sentence.

alt+shift+e folks

mike65

"Look old bean if the bog trotters of the er Dial thingy wish you be known as
Eire so be it! Its nice the Free State government has come up with such an innovative employment scheme.

Toodle pip"

---

As for Americans well, they'll just think its quaint. God help all of us.

Mike.

oscarBravo

lostexpectation wrote:

...we Irish should use Éire and not be afraid to use Éire.

I'm not afraid to use it - when speaking (or writing) Irish. It's just silly to use it in English.

lostexpectation wrote:

alt+shift+e folks

...or, if you use a real operating system, Compose, ', E.

monument

To agree with others, it’s not a big deal, it is silly when used in English, and 'Éire – Ireland' just sounds wrong.

Dyr

seamus wrote:

From the Irish constitution:

Afaik, the use of Éire as a derogatory term is an attempt at a "We still own 6 counties of your island". It's subtle, but the insult is completely defunct in this day and age, and no Irish person should take offence at its use. Quite the opposite.

Its funny, i was on the phone to a union rep in the UK today and everytime she said "eire" my teeth grinded. Of course the majority of english people just use that word because they probably think it's the correct term but it doesnt change my suspicion that "éire" was used originally because the british media etc couldnt bring themselves to say "republic of ireland" :rolleyes:

lostexpectation

Bambi wrote:

Its funny, i was on the phone to a union rep in the UK today and everytime she said "eire" my teeth grinded. Of course the majority of english people just use that word because they probably think it's the correct term but it doesnt change my suspicion that "éire" was used originally because the british media etc couldnt bring themselves to say "republic of ireland" :rolleyes:

you should have gently corrected her, she would have thanked you later for it

zuma

Bambi wrote:

Its funny, i was on the phone to a union rep in the UK today and everytime she said "eire" my teeth grinded. Of course the majority of english people just use that word because they probably think it's the correct term but it doesnt change my suspicion that "éire" was used originally because the british media etc couldnt bring themselves to say "republic of ireland" :rolleyes:

Its also probable got to do with the fact that they shorten Northern ireland to Ireland which thn relegates us to Éire!

I get the shakes as well when non Irish refer to this country as Éire while speaking English and having ZERO knowledge of the irish language!

oscarBravo

lostexpectation wrote:

you should have gently corrected her, she would have thanked you later for it

I've had one person get the hump in a big way. He thought he was going out of his way to be correct.

flogen

I would correct people who said "Southern Ireland" to me; I understand that it's probably an innocent mistake (after all, the other chunk is Northern Ireland), but still...

And yeah, pointless calling Ireland Éire unless you're using the word in an Irish sentence; to use an example earlier you would say "They play football in Germany" or "Spielen sie Fussball in Deutschland" or whatever it is... but not "they play football in Deutschland" or "Spielen sie Fussball in Germany"

LovelyHurling

mike65 wrote:

"Look old bean if the bog trotters of the er Dial thingy wish you be known as
Eire so be it! Its nice the Free State government has come up with such an innovative employment scheme.

That an actual quote then? How is calling the Republic of Ireland 'Eire' an insult? It wasnt Churchills decision, and the King of England didnt design it, DeValera did. So when British people refer to Ireland in the native language of its people as set out in its constitution, it is seen as a bad thing? It is better to prefer to the country in the language that you might otherwise argue was 'imposed'?

Please.

From the consitution of 'The Republic of Ireland', then:

In the Name of the Most Holy Trinity, from Whom is all authority and to Whom, as our final end, all actions both of men and States must be referred,

We, the people of Éire...

Do hereby adopt, enact, and give to ourselves this Constitution.

and most importantly:

Article 4

The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.

oscarBravo

LovelyHurling wrote:

...and most importantly:

Article 4

The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.

Exactly. The name of the state, in the English language, is Ireland. To refer to it, in the English language, as "Éire" is incorrect.

mike65

I blame the stamps myself.

Mike.

A Dub in Glasgo

To really confuse people who call the Republic of Ireland 'Southern Ireland', ask them ' Where is the most nothern part of Ireland?' Is it in a) Nothern Ireland or b)Southern Ireland.

Dyr

lostexpectation wrote:

you should have gently corrected her, she would have thanked you later for it

Nah, I think most British people use the term Éire because they think Ireland refers to the whole island including the six counties and therefore they should use Éire when referring to the "South", They're probably trying to be respectful lol. That and the fact that British soccer pundits call us Éire means there's no point in arguing :rolleyes:

monument

No, Mike got it right with stamps.

LovelyHurling

oscarBravo wrote:

The name of the state, in the English language, is Ireland. To refer to it, in the English language, as "Éire" is incorrect.

You should have been around to correct DeValera when he referred to "we, the people of Eire" then.

And Im not trying to be pedantic, but the name od the state is not Ireland. Ireland is an island and Dublin is the capital of the Republic of Ireland/ Southern Ireland/ Eire

they think Ireland refers to the whole island including the six counties

It does. Common speech just refers to the south as 'Ireland'

oscarBravo

LovelyHurling wrote:

Someone should have told DeValera that when he referred to the people of Eire then.

I'm sure they should have. Do you unreservedly accept everything DeValera ever said as gospel?

LovelyHurling wrote:

And Im not trying to be pedantic, but the name od the state is not Ireland. Ireland is an island and Dublin is the capital of the Republic of Ireland/ Southern Ireland/ Eire.

I am being pedantic, and the name of the state is Ireland, as clearly stated in both the Irish and English versions of the constitution. I don't know about you, but if I'm going to choose an authoritative definition, I'll choose the state's constitution over a putative throwaway remark by a late statesman.

Ireland is the name of the state, and Ireland is the name of the island of which it comprises a part. "The Republic of Ireland" is a descriptive term. "Southern Ireland" is, at best, a vague geographic reference to Munster and south Leinster. "Éire" (complete with fada) is the name of the state in the Irish language.

Dyr

LovelyHurling wrote:

And Im not trying to be pedantic, but the name od the state is not Ireland. Ireland is an island and Dublin is the capital of the Republic of Ireland/ Southern Ireland/ Eire

*rev's up the constitution*

Article 4

The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.

oscarBravo

More to the point, the Irish version - which is the authoritative version - is clearer: "Éire is ainm don stáit, nó, sa Sacs-Bhéarla, Ireland." (I'm quoting from memory, as I can't find an Irish-language version online.)

CiaranC

What kind of a country has people in it that dont even know whats its called? Good grief.

tba

I prefer the name

"That rainy country at the top left of Europe, then one that Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman came from. Come on you know the one I mean."

Its more subtle

simu

From the article linked to in the opening post:

The Éire Ireland name change will apply to signage and name plates at Council of Minister meetings and leaders’ summits from January 2007.

So, it'll be on the signage. They're not going to start saying Éire-Ireland instead of Ireland or whatever. Not that crazeh really!

CiaranC wrote:

What kind of a country has people in it that dont even know whats its called? Good grief.

Why be straight-forward when you can cloak people in a mist of confusion? Tis the Éireannach-Irish way!

LovelyHurling

Ireland is the name of the state, and Ireland is the name of the island of which it comprises a part. "The Republic of Ireland" is a descriptive term. "Southern Ireland" is, at best, a vague geographic reference to Munster and south Leinster. "Éire" (complete with fada) is the name of the state in the Irish language.

Argue about it all you want its not particularly interesting. I presume from your pontifications (couldnt resist:) ) that you refer to Northern Ireland as Longford/ fermanagh/ Louth/ Meath then yes? Theres an Northern Ireland and a Republic of Ireland, two different states sharing a stretch of land called Ireland.

darkman2

I dont like the term 'Eire' being used as it does be by the British imparticular and the beeb often say 'Irish Republic' (thats also NOT correct). The name of this country in English is the 'Republic of Ireland' and I do correct sometimes particularly English ppl using 'Eire' because as has been mentioned they cant bare seeing us being refered to as a 'Republic' or else their just to bloody lazy to. It is condescending when used by the English media.

zuma

LovelyHurling wrote:

Theres an Northern Ireland and a Republic of Ireland, two different states sharing a stretch of land called Ireland.

When I did Geography years ago I learned that the two states that share this island are Ireland and the UK.
Nothern Ireland is not a state like Ireland...but merely a division of the state known as the United Kingdom.

oscarBravo

LovelyHurling wrote:

Argue about it all you want its not particularly interesting.

I'm not arguing, I'm clarifying. You seemed to find it interesting enough when you thought you were right.

LovelyHurling wrote:

I presume from your pontifications (couldnt resist:) ) that you refer to Northern Ireland as Longford/ fermanagh/ Louth/ Meath then yes?

No. Northern Ireland refers to a province of the United Kingdom on the island of Ireland.

LovelyHurling wrote:

Theres an Northern Ireland and a Republic of Ireland, two different states sharing a stretch of land called Ireland.

There's a province called Northern Ireland and a state called Ireland sharing an island called Ireland.

It's really not as confusing as you'd like to make it out to be. It's no more confusing than there being both a town and a county called Longford (ZOMG how will people evar figure out where they live!!1), or two states of the USA called, respectively, Virginia and West Virginia.

darkman2 wrote:

The name of this country in English is the 'Republic of Ireland'...

No, the name of this country is English is 'Ireland', as clearly spelled out in both the Irish and the English versions of the constitution, and as repeatedly pointed out on this very thread.

djmarkus

how many times does this discusson come up on boards.

The Republic of Ireland (Irish: Poblacht na hÉireann) is the official description[1] of the sovereign state which covers approximately five-sixths of the island of Ireland, off the coast of north-west Europe. The state's official name is Ireland (Irish: Éire)[2], and this is how international organisations and citizens of Ireland usually refer to the country

If Northern Ireland isn't a country then why does it have its own football team?

MrJones

Yes this should set us apart. Lets face it,thousands have died for the cause of us Irish people having an independent country, so let's hope having Eire Ireland adds to our national (and international ) identity.
Éire abu!
p.s. i cringe when i hear people referring to ireland as southern ireland.

esperanza wrote:

people 'over the water' who have a very distorted view of our country, don't you think? (I won't even go into some continental Europeaners who still think we belong to the Brits! -- maybe our official bilingual name will raise some eyebrows in a good sense...