training first thing in the morning on empty stomach

Superdub2

hi, i started goin the gym before work and have been getting up at 5.45 to eat brekkie (cereal) before 6 then at 6.45 take no xplode and on the weights floor by half 7 at the latest, but i would rather get up at 6.30 and take just the no xplode and then hit the gym, giving me extra sleep but no brekkie until after the training bout 8.30

is this a good idea?

yomchi

If your goal is to build muscle its probably not a good idea. All night your body is starved and will enter into a catabolic state, taking amino acids from your muscle in order help the rest of the body function hence breaking muscle proteins down. In your case, you are then getting up and going to tear the be jaysis out of them during weight training, BSN's N.O Xplode unfortunately does not contain BCAA's to help prevent this muscle break down.
On the other hand, your carb storage and glycogen will be very low first thing in the morning which will lead to fatigue a lot quicker. Again, the sweetner in N.O Xplode is Asparatame, which does not act like a sugar carb like fructose.

My opinion would be to scrap the N.O Xplode and stick to having a breakfast, if you can't fit the NO in well so what. Also if you are building muscle, you will be eating approx six meals a day, missing breakfast (the most important one) will only leave you scrammbling to try and make the rest of the meals up.

Don't jeapordise the most important meal of the day for supp like NO Xplode, you will get better gains out of a healthy balanced breakfast than an Nitric Oxide stimulater.

Superdub2

well i still eat breakfast after the training so if im goin to scrap the NO Xplode how long before i tain shud i eat the cereal

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

well i still eat breakfast after the training so if im goin to scrap the NO Xplode how long before i tain shud i eat the cereal

Cereal?

What are your goals superdub, If its just cereal your eating?

Superdub2

yeah cereal, thats what i eat before training and then i eat another breakfast after i train and havent i heard somewhere that cereal is the breakfast of champions!

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

yeah cereal, thats what i eat before training and then i eat another breakfast after i train and havent i heard somewhere that cereal is the breakfast of champions!

Thats Kellogg's 'start' you mean!!

What type of breakfast are you feeding your self? Im assuming you want to put on muscle?

Diamondmaker

Jon what would you recommend to build bulk food wise?
Im extremely fit from running and swimming ( could swim for a week p with sprints in between to build stamina ) but want to bulk up weight wise for rugby..As I am well built for the above 2 I am light for rugby I.
( 10.5 st 5'10" )

Superdub2

not too sure what you mean bout "kelloggs start"

a bowl of all bran then after the gym a whey shake, a banana or two, a nutri grain bar and some nuts. thats basically my breakie

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

not too sure what you mean bout "kelloggs start"

a bowl of all bran then after the gym a whey shake, a banana or two, a nutri grain bar and some nuts. thats basically my breakie

Kellogs start was a brand of cereal out a few years back, the cereal of champions and all that.

Your early morning meal and post work out food could be better in order to help you gain muscle.

yomchi

Diamondmaker wrote:

Jon what would you recommend to build bulk food wise?
Im extremely fit from running and swimming ( could swim for a week p with sprints in between to build stamina ) but want to bulk up weight wise for rugby..As I am well built for the above 2 I am light for rugby I.
( 10.5 st 5'10" )

Its quite simple, you want to gain weight you must increase your calorie intake. Increase protein and carbohydrate, incorporate good fats and lift like a bastard!
Being a rugby player however you would be better incorporating functional strength exercises rather than lifting for physique.

Superdub2

Jon wrote:

Kellogs start was a brand of cereal out a few years back, the cereal of champions and all that.

Your early morning meal and post work out food could be better in order to help you gain muscle.

what would you suggest baring in mind that im in the gym at 7 and on the weights floor by 7.30 at the latest in order to get everything done and be in work by 9?

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

what would you suggest baring in mind that im in the gym at 7 and on the weights floor by 7.30 at the latest in order to get everything done and be in work by 9?

I'd seriously recommend training later in the day or evening if possible. Otherwise, you'd want to be getting up at 4 for brek and going back to bed which isn't going to happen!

Thats if your goals are to get big of course! If you want to stay lean and keep fit, what you're doing is ok, just jiggle around your breakfast a little

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Superdub2

i see loads of people in the gym at that time, many doing weight and well built so surely there must be a reasonable way?

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

i see loads of people in the gym at that time, many doing weight and well built so surely there must be a reasonable way?

You should maybe ask one of them what type of routine they stick to. All im saying is that after an 8 hour starving on your body you are heading straight to the gym (albeit with a dose of fibre in you) to rip and tear muscle which will have already being dipped into by your body's natural need for amino acids, its loose loose where building big thick lean muscle is concerned.

Maybe someone else will have an opinion to offer?

Superdub2

i understand thats a fair point but so many people seem to do it that there must besomething to be said for it!

yomchi

Superdub2 wrote:

i understand thats a fair point but so many people seem to do it that there must besomething to be said for it!

Are these guys body builders? If they are into their body building like some guys I know you'll probably find that they wake up at 5am for an all in one shake or the like then head back to bed.
Its worth asking one of them!

g'em

Superdub2 wrote:

i see loads of people in the gym at that time, many doing weight and well built so surely there must be a reasonable way?

As Jon said, it's quite common for BBers or in fact anyone who trains hard first thing to actually wake themself up, have a shake then go back to bed for an hour or so. Food gets broken down by the body via catabolism, when there's no food it uses its own tissues to supply energy breaking it down by anabolism. After a long night's sleep and no food intake your body will be anabolic. Training in that state will only lead to muscle wasting so having a shake an hour or so before training will provide food and energy

Dragan

Superdub2 wrote:

i understand thats a fair point but so many people seem to do it that there must besomething to be said for it!

The simple fact of it is that is your go the gym with no breakfast in your, or only a quick digested carb, then your gonna be burning muscle while you workout because you will have no amino acids in your systems and will be in a catabolic state.

As far as i know, NO-Eplode by BSN does no contain any amino acids so i don't think that will help you out in that way, regardless of what else it does.

Chances are that the big guys down there ( and are the actually big or are the just normal guys with low bodyfat and definition, the difference is pretty big between the two ) do indeed get up early, have some food and go back to be for an hour or two.

The simply fact is that if you want to grow you need to put the work in and sometimes do things that suck....as i said before, sometimes i train real early on a Saturday....i'm awake a 6am eating, then get a little more sleep and then go train.

I know a guy who sets an alarm to go off at 3 am, when he will have a slow digesting shake ( and he already had one at 11 before going to bed ) and he will then go back to bed, then get up at 7 and have his breakfast.

It's work, but if you want to acheive any decent level of size and strength then you need to put in the work.

It's really that simple.

Jak

I would really advise against setting alarm calls during the night to get up and eat. Yes there is some logic behind the approach, but unless you already suffer from insomnia I would leave your sleep patterns alone. Spread your meals through your waking day and maybe have some slow digesting food stuff before bed if you are particularly concerned about 'Entering a Catabolic State!".

The way some articles are phrased you would swear that your body fkin canabalises itself while you sleep undoing all your hard work ... utter nonsense. It gets on my nerves. I would consider myself a good natural counter point to anyone who suggests you need to take such approaches to make the big gains.

To labour a point I make often on this board, there are numerous training, diet and routine changes on the fringe which can contribute to overall gain, however, the core aspects of training (posted often enough) remain by far and away the most important things to get right. If you have these right you can achieve huge results irrespective.

When people look for answers in the fringe before getting the basics sorted, they are cheating themselves and overcomplicating the simplicity of hard, intelligent training with a well balanced diet.

JAK.

yomchi

Jak wrote:

I would really advise against setting alarm calls during the night to get up and eat. Yes there is some logic behind the approach, but unless you already suffer from insomnia I would leave your sleep patterns alone. Spread your meals through your waking day and maybe have some slow digesting food stuff before bed if you are particularly concerned about 'Entering a Catabolic State!".

The way some articles are phrased you would swear that your body fkin canabalises itself while you sleep undoing all your hard work ... utter nonsense. It gets on my nerves. I would consider myself a good natural counter point to anyone who suggests you need to take such approaches to make the big gains.

To labour a point I make often on this board, there are numerous training, diet and routine changes on the fringe which can contribute to overall gain, however, the core aspects of training (posted often enough) remain by far and away the most important things to get right. If you have these right you can achieve huge results irrespective.

When people look for answers in the fringe before getting the basics sorted, they are cheating themselves and overcomplicating the simplicity of hard, intelligent training with a well balanced diet.

JAK.

Your point is well made Jak, there is more study to suggest that uninterupted deep sleep encourages natural growth hormone release hence helping you grow also. But who I think Dragan was refering to was dedicated Body builders who maybe training for a show or the like. They stick to pretty stringent times for eating etc, especially as they diet which is the toughest part for them. During this period, an hour without food can result in some loss!

Having said that, going back to OP - if he want to make real gains, weight training first thing in the morning on an empty stomach is going to slow the process of muscle building right down

Dragan

Jak wrote:

I would really advise against setting alarm calls during the night to get up and eat. Yes there is some logic behind the approach, but unless you already suffer from insomnia I would leave your sleep patterns alone.

Well put Jak. I did not mean this as an example of what SHOULD be done, purely as an example of what some people do in pursuit of mass.

To be honest Jaks post is very well put….i see lots of people posting about the latest supplement etc, without really seeming to have diet down to a T yet.

I would place more emphasis on having a proper breakfast than in having the latest shake tbh.

t-ha

I know I'm not a 300lb BBer, but I'm able to eat enough before bed that I don't run out during the night. Your metabolism slows naturally while you're asleep.

With regards working out on an empty stomach - I don't know how anyone could do that. You run out of fuel. A whey shake with some fruit, milled oats and glucose drunk first thing after waking shouldn't be giving you any digestive hassle by the time you hit the gym floor. It might be an idea to have a shower first (and not neccessarily a warm one) to switch off the sympathetic nervous system and maybe get your stomach a bit more receptive to the idea of eating (if that's a problem).