exclusive schools

thebaz

where do you think the serious wealthy send there offspring to secondary school in Ireland :-
apparently for girls its Rathdown and Mount Anville - and the boys :-
St Gerards ; Clongowes ; St. Columbus and Blackrock college .
was out last night , surrounded by a bunch of very posh and very moneyed and they all seemd to come from this Rock, Clongowes and Mount anville background, and this discussion was raised.

Dord

who cares! :cool:

SoupyNorman

My Aunt and Uncle have their son in clongowes and daughter in rathdown. They dont share their wealth with the family!

In actual fact, because their boarding they get away with murder. Private school breeds the wrong qualities if we want a fair and even society, thats my oponion.

*Tripper*

These schools aren't exclusive as such. Most of the private schools in Ireland charge the same prices for day school/boarding. The area you live in usually decides which school you go to be it private or public.

*Tripper*

joe robot wrote:

who cares! :cool:

So true

Heyes

*Tripper* wrote:

These schools aren't exclusive as such. Most of the private schools in Ireland charge the same prices for day school/boarding. The area you live in usually decides which school you go to be it private or public.

exactly

LegacyUser

If you are going by most expensive schools in the country, don't forget schoos such as Bruce and the Institute. But honestly, who does care?

the_syco

I think that you have to goto the school in your area, if its a public school, but you can go to schools outside your area if its a private school.

casanova_kid

If you want you kid to wear a pink t-shirt and talk like a fag, send them to those schools.

melekalikimaka

cheesedude wrote:

If you are going by most expensive schools in the country, don't forget schoos such as Bruce and the Institute. But honestly, who does care?

bruce is no more

insistute isnt really a school, its basically a collection of kids going to a room to get notes, leaving for coffee, then some study

melekalikimaka

casanova_kid wrote:

If you want you kid to wear a pink t-shirt and talk like a fag, send them to those schools.

clearly someone got a inferior education...just remeber my friend, those 'fags in pink t-shirts' will be your bosses, ya wont get far the that sorta attitude

hullaballoo

thebaz wrote:

where do you think the serious wealthy send there offspring to secondary school in Ireland :-
apparently for girls its Rathdown and Mount Anville - and the boys :-
St Gerards ; Clongowes ; St. Columbus and Blackrock college .
was out last night , surrounded by a bunch of very posh and very moneyed and they all seemd to come from this Rock, Clongowes and Mount anville background, and this discussion was raised.

1. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054918452
2. St Gerard's is mixed.
3. St Columba's is mixed.
4. It doesn't matter where you send your children to school. What matters is the parenting. (Re attitudes.)

mloc

hullaballoo wrote:

4. It doesn't matter where you send your children to school. What matters is the parenting. (Re attitudes.)

I don't think it doesnt matter completely. While parenting is the most important factor, the school environment is a factor also.

Children want friends. Send your child to a school full of knacks, and he'll probably become one.

hullaballoo

mloc wrote:

I don't think it doesnt matter completely. While parenting is the most important factor, the school environment is a factor also.

Children want friends. Send your child to a school full of knacks, and he'll probably become one.

Not if they're brought up properly. Most people can relate to their peers without actually having to become assimilated to the group. I think proponents call it individualism or something.

lodgepole

People who go to private schools think that public schools are full of knackers, and public school goers think private schools are full of posh snobs. Neither is true. Neither system is any better or worse than the other and neither makes an attempt to breed discrimination between supposed class differences in the country.

My parents sent me a private school because when I started school it was consdiered one of the best schools in my area. At this point in time there are a couple of public schools that were rated comparably by the Irish Times, so maybe they'd make a different decision today.

It's the quality of the school that matters, and if you happen to live in an area where the highest quality school is private then if you can afford it, you should pay it.

In answer to your question though... I would say that there are people amongst the seriously wealthy (as there are across society) who have the attitude of "the more expensive the better". But on the whole people who have wealth probably make the same decision that less wealthy people do, to send their children to the best possible school. Their wealth just gives them more options.

melekalikimaka

hullaballoo wrote:

Not if they're brought up properly. Most people can relate to their peers without actually having to become assimilated to the group. I think proponents call it individualism or something.

i dont think many schools promote indiviualism, uniforms etc. spending 6+ hours in a building is going to influenece you, the people in that building and their attitudes will stay with you. IMO

hullaballoo

melekalikimaka wrote:

i dont think many schools promote indiviualism, uniforms etc. spending 6+ hours in a building is going to influenece you, the people in that building and their attitudes will stay with you. IMO

Uniforms do promote individualism. Where you have uniforms, people don't have to worry about how they dress (at least not in school) and thus are able to fit in without having to assimilate.

I went to two secondary schools which were polar opposites of each other, and I found that in the school where there was no uniform, there was far more pressure on people to conform to the predominant dress code.

By the time you reach secondary school, you are starting to evaluate your peers attitudes for yourself, and you can use your own judgement to decide what's right for you. Some people spend their entire time being non-conformists, and that works for them. In turn, others see fit to become just everything that they see is popular. I find that the most rounded people are those who have found a middle-ground somewhere.

Hermione*

I wouldn't necessarily agree with that, I think one of the reasons schools like uniforms etc, is to try to create a school identity and a community spirit within the school. It's possible to feel like an idividual while co-operating with the school system. As hullaballoo said, how you're brought up has a huge part to play in this. It doesn't have to be a choice between assimilation or isolation.

Heyes

Lodgepole wrote:

People who go to private schools think that public schools are full of knackers, and public school goers think private schools are full of posh snobs. Neither is true. Neither system is any better or worse than the other and neither makes an attempt to breed discrimination between supposed class differences in the country.

My parents sent me a private school because when I started school it was consdiered one of the best schools in my area. At this point in time there are a couple of public schools that were rated comparably by the Irish Times, so maybe they'd make a different decision today.

It's the quality of the school that matters, and if you happen to live in an area where the highest quality school is private then if you can afford it, you should pay it.

In answer to your question though... I would say that there are people amongst the seriously wealthy (as there are across society) who have the attitude of "the more expensive the better". But on the whole people who have wealth probably make the same decision that less wealthy people do, to send their children to the best possible school. Their wealth just gives them more options.

I think that says it all

The public/private divide wouldn't bother me, but would definitely not send a child of mine to either a boarding school as a boarder or any school that was not mixed. Was fortunate enough to go to a small mixed school with no uniforms, and it was a great great place. Academically poor, but it was a good place to grow up.

Femelade

thebaz wrote:

where do you think the serious wealthy send there offspring to secondary school in Ireland :-
apparently for girls its Rathdown and Mount Anville - and the boys :-
St Gerards ; Clongowes ; St. Columbus and Blackrock college .
was out last night , surrounded by a bunch of very posh and very moneyed and they all seemd to come from this Rock, Clongowes and Mount anville background, and this discussion was raised.

did you mean Dublin?

Agent Smith

Mount anville - is this not a non fee paying school?

melekalikimaka

agent smith wrote:

Mount anville - is this not a non fee paying school?

its fee paying

model

Lodgepole wrote:

Neither system is any better or worse than the other

Surely the sign of a good school is the average points achieved each year in the Leaving Cert? Therefore, would you not agree that private schools tend to achieve better results than public schools (with exceptions) and have the right to be considered better than the other (in this case, public schools).

Also, as a secondary student, students in Rathdown aren't really proud of going there, so I wouldn't say it fits in the above category of "exclusive schools". I'd also say that that is rather misleading. These schools arent really hard to get into to, just a bit expensive.

model

model wrote:

Surely the sign of a good school is the average points achieved each year in the Leaving Cert? Therefore, would you not agree that private schools tend to achieve better results than public schools (with exceptions) and have the right to be considered better than the other (in this case, public schools).

Wouldn't agree at all. The average points depends on many factors, such as how many grinds Mammy and Daddy have paid for their kids, whether they've been sent off abroad for a summer or two for a foreign language, whether they can afford the crash courses in Bruce or Leeson Street etc. There are many advantages which people with money, being those who send their kids to fee paying school, can afford and which are out of the range of others.

melekalikimaka

model wrote:

also say that that is rather misleading. These schools arent really hard to get into to, just a bit expensive.

there are interviews and waiting lists for most of these schools

*Tripper*

Htats a load of BS. Once you have the dosh you'll get in. Private Schools arent aloud to acept you on the basis of an exam/interview.

Vorsprung

model wrote:

Surely the sign of a good school is the average points achieved each year in the Leaving Cert? Therefore, would you not agree that private schools tend to achieve better results than public schools (with exceptions) and have the right to be considered better than the other (in this case, public schools).

Bollocks. If a school produces students who get 500+ points but they're all twats, is it still a good school? Schools schould strive to produce students that do well in their studies (or do well enough so that they can do what they want in life), but also get rounded educations that teach them lessons that'll serve them for life.

model wrote:

Also, as a secondary student, students in Rathdown aren't really proud of going there.

Do you know anyone who went there? My gf went to Rathdown back in the day, she's sitting beside me and can think of only one girl who wasn't happy with the school.

melekalikimaka

*Tripper* wrote:

Htats a load of BS. Once you have the dosh you'll get in. Private Schools arent aloud to acept you on the basis of an exam/interview.

no its not BS, I went to a family run private school , and i know people who tried get in and they were refused on the basis of their interview, what do you base your arguement on?

model

bigjimthefirst wrote:

Do you know anyone who went there?

No I do not know people who went there, I know people who go there, and they tend to prefer not to say they go to Rathdown. That's from people I know, maybe I'm wrong.

bigjimthefirst

bigjimthefirst wrote:

Bollocks. If a school produces students who get 500+ points but they're all twats, is it still a good school? Schools schould strive to produce students that do well in their studies (or do well enough so that they can do what they want in life), but also get rounded educations that teach them lessons that'll serve them for life.

While I'm reluctant to suggest that one system or another churns out a better person, must say that in our small, mixed school with no uniforms and no discipline and no good teachers, we had a blast. Even now 15 years later many of us stay in touch and I could bump in to any of my former classmates and go for pint any time. That may be nothing to do with the school, maybe it's just cos we all grew up together in a small town, but all I remember were sunny days spent practising smoking and talking about girls...there was no bullying, no drugs, we were hammered in every sports outing, many were just passing time before taking over the farm, but they really were great days.

Vorsprung

model wrote:

No I do not know people who went there, I know people who go there, and they tend to prefer not to say they go to Rathdown. That's from people I know, maybe I'm wrong.

So do you reckon that's because they're ashamed of going there or because they don't want people judging them on the basis of their school?

Vorsprung

Deleted User wrote:

While I'm reluctant to suggest that one system or another churns out a better person, must say that in our small, mixed school with no uniforms and no discipline and no good teachers, we had a blast. Even now 15 years later many of us stay in touch and I could bump in to any of my former classmates and go for pint any time. That may be nothing to do with the school, maybe it's just cos we all grew up together in a small town, but all I remember were sunny days spent practising smoking and talking about girls...there was no bullying, no drugs, we were hammered in every sports outing, many were just passing time before taking over the farm, but they really were great days.

I agree and I wasn't trying to say that private was better than public. I'm just saying that if a school is hoping to be regarded as a good school, it needs to produce someone with more than a good leaving. This can be both private or public, and it often isn't private (or public).

model

bigjimthefirst wrote:

So do you reckon that's because they're ashamed of going there or because they don't want people judging them on the basis of their school?

Bit of both, if they don't want people judging them on the basis of their school, they'll most likely become ashamed of it.

This is from 3 people I know who go there, as I said I could be wrong.

Deleted User wrote:

Wouldn't agree at all. The average points depends on many factors, such as how many grinds Mammy and Daddy have paid for their kids, whether they've been sent off abroad for a summer or two for a foreign language, whether they can afford the crash courses in Bruce or Leeson Street etc. There are many advantages which people with money, being those who send their kids to fee paying school, can afford and which are out of the range of others.

Another person who assumes all people who attend private schools are snobs. That's like me saying "What about all the knackers who go to public schools in Northside Dublin who end up unemployed and get involved in criminal activities?"

model

model wrote:

Another person who assumes all people who attend private schools are snobs.

Complete and utter rubbish. Please don't attribute to me opinions that I don't have.

I was merely making the screamingly obvious point that people who have the money to send their kids to fee paying schools can also afford to pay for grinds, trips abroad, crash courses etc. all of which might be relevant as to why kids in fee paying schools get etter results. Although I went to a public school, my parents did the same for me so I spent weeks in the Gaeltacht, in Bruce etc. etc. I didn't say they were 'snobs' at all, they could be tree hugging hippies for all I know - my dad worked in the ESB, but just felt that an education was vital. Most of my friends and neighbours didn't do this. But it had nothing to do with snobbery. The fact is that money opens more doors than just the address of the school and can be used to benefit kids facing the Leaving Cert.

LegacyUser

Private Schools = Life Contacts.

lodgepole

Deleted User wrote:

I was merely making the screamingly obvious point that people who have the money to send their kids to fee paying schools can also afford to pay for grinds, trips abroad, crash courses etc.

That's not true. My parents sent me to a private school but couldn't afford any of those things. Many students in private schools have parents working their asses off to keep them there. In my case i'd say about fifty percent were from wealthy backgrounds and the rest of use were from more moderate ones.

cheesedude wrote:

Private Schools = Life Contacts.

Ha. Is it? Anything to back that up? My school has never given me any oppurtunities beyond the education that I got there.

Lodgepole

Lodgepole wrote:

That's not true. My parents sent me to a private school but couldn't afford any of those things.

As you weren't sent on these things yourself, how would you know who goes to the Gaeltacht, who goes to Bruce, who takes grinds etc. etc.?

I was, hence I can tell you you're wrong, and the number of kids from rich backgrounds on these jaunts far outstripped the number of kids from deprived areas...

lodgepole

You said that people who could afford private schools could afford grinds/gaeltacht et al... Which isn't true. So i'm not sure how i'm wrong... I agree that there are probably more people from wealthy backgrounds attending these things, but am sating that private schools and wealthy backgrounds aren't mutually exclusive.

*Tripper*

melekalikimaka wrote:

no its not BS, I went to a family run private school , and i know people who tried get in and they were refused on the basis of their interview, what do you base your arguement on?

Firstly, if this is in practice is in place, i think its wrong in relation to secondary schools rejecting people on the basis of an interview/exam. Obviously with a job its diffferent but is it not illegal in this case?

Secondly, years ago it was a case of having your name down for years to get in but that has all changed now. Once you have the money your in, personally im fine with that.

Thirdly, family run private school. Couldnt be to many oof them around these days???

LegacyUser

*Tripper* wrote:

Thirdly, family run private school. Couldnt be to many oof them around these days???

More than likely Rockbrook Park School if what i have been told in the past is true...and either way, that school is the biggest joke. That I do know.

Macha

Confession: I went to Rathdown.

Yes it is that snobby & posh, one of my school friends had her own private jet...need I say more?

Oh, just that I was there on a half scholarship so no slagging

mloc

*Tripper* wrote:

Firstly, if this is in practice is in place, i think its wrong in relation to secondary schools rejecting people on the basis of an interview/exam.

I went to same school as melekalikimaka. There was an interview process. Why shouldn't there be? A school should be a community. Entry in to the community should be regulated, as places are limited.

Secondly, years ago it was a case of having your name down for years to get in but that has all changed now. Once you have the money your in, personally im fine with that.

For many schools, in particular popular primary schools, there are still waiting lists. I know of several schools where it is almost a neccessity to put your name down during pregnancy, unless you have other children in the school already (the schools favour entry from siblings). This occurs for both public and private schools.

In terms of school results, I don't think whether paying fees or not has much impact on the final outcome. It will, in my opinion however, effect the overall education of the child.

melekalikimaka

*Tripper* wrote:

Firstly, if this is in practice is in place, i think its wrong in relation to secondary schools rejecting people on the basis of an interview/exam. Obviously with a job its diffferent but is it not illegal in this case?

Secondly, years ago it was a case of having your name down for years to get in but that has all changed now. Once you have the money your in, personally im fine with that.

Thirdly, family run private school. Couldnt be to many oof them around these days???

no theres not too many around anymore at all i think. i don't think its wrong to reject on basis of interview.
its privately owned-they get a fraction of the grants public schools get, they in general have superior facilities and in many cases teachers. they should be able to decide who they want to use their facilities, its like a club, you pay to avail of sevices that the government fail to provide. I think the waiting list thing isnt as bad as it once was but there is still a good few years waiting for most the private schools

melekalikimaka

cheesedude wrote:

More than likely Rockbrook Park School if what i have been told in the past is true...and either way, that school is the biggest joke. That I do know.

no its not Rockbrook Park, nice to see you've something constuctive to add tho

drdre

black rock college is the best:D

Sangre

melekalikimaka wrote:

no theres not too many around anymore at all i think. i don't think its wrong to reject on basis of interview.
its privately owned-they get a fraction of the grants public schools get, they in general have superior facilities and in many cases teachers. they should be able to decide who they want to use their facilities, its like a club, you pay to avail of sevices that the government fail to provide. I think the waiting list thing isnt as bad as it once was but there is still a good few years waiting for most the private schools

If this is a whites only 'club' then sign me up!

melekalikimaka

Sangre wrote:

If this is a whites only 'club' then sign me up!

:rolleyes: yes it was and we all wore white hood cloaks and used words like ya'll(you all) and Maw(mother)

Faith

Gee, I never realised the only "good" schools in the country are in Dublin :rolleyes: .

mloc

melekalikimaka wrote:

:rolleyes: yes it was and we all wore white hood cloaks and used words like ya'll(you all) and Maw(mother)

hmm... there was kev's facist day where we all wore blue shirts. Good times.

LegacyUser

melekalikimaka wrote:

no its not Rockbrook Park, nice to see you've something constuctive to add tho

Your welcome pugwall