Driving on 1st Provisonal

jamescrombie

I am 24 and live in Dublin. I have taken 10 driving lessons and have my full liecence test coming up in 3 weeks. I have been instructed by my driving instructor that I need about 10 more hours driving on my own to get ready for the test. It is impossible for me to have my parents or any other Full Liecence holder with me in the car as I live on my own. I have bought a car and am getting it insured today.... how am I ment to have someone with me.... what will happen if i get stopped by the guards... I am very sensible and not a boy racer.... any advice

Thomas_S_Hunterson

you could ask a friend or something to sit in with you

jamescrombie

50% of the time that will be possible but 50% it wont.....

Garth

Your driving instructor is a moron. Your best shot is to never have driven on your own, to always have had someone in the car telling you the right way to do it.

Most people lose their skill by driving lazily, and that only happens once you get into the car by yourself.

Driving by yourself on a 1st provisional is illegal. How about "what happens if I not competent enough and kill someone" instead of "what happens if the gardai catch me".

I would suggest that you get a good driving instructor, one that won't encourage you to break the law.

Keedowah

Its a tough situation - my instructor said the same thing to me and its totally impossible for me to have someone with me.

jamescrombie

Garth so if I had the cop on like my brother and applied for his provisional 3 years ago never driven and then got a car this year I am now the safest driver in the world..... I am then on my 2nd provisional no driving experience but am perfectly safe to drive on my own.... this is why I think this law is a joke... even though I don’t think it really is a law more a restriction as I seen a court case where a judge through a case out because he had no solid law to prosecute some on for driving on there own...

Please explain

Keedowah

There is a big problem in this country - the amount of accidents / road deaths is shocking. Why isn't there more education in place? I really think that there should be 10 hours of class time given to secondary students about driving - nothing on the road - just classwork.

There should be a requirement (and proof) of getting a certain amount of lessons from a certified instructor before you are allowed to sit the test.

The queues for the test should be seriously shorter.

The traffic police should be more visible - I hardly ever see any police on the roads.

*I have nothing bad to say about the cops - they have a tough job - but they need more resources.

Litcagral

"I am then on my 2nd provisional no driving experience but am perfectly safe to drive on my own...."




You would be legally entitled to drive on your own but that would not make you safer.

Garth

Explain what? If I had my way, that particular law would be enforced properly.

However if you posted this just to hear,

"Sure everyone drives alone on their 1st provisional, go ahead" I'm sure someone will say it.

Vegeta

Garth wrote:

Your driving instructor is a moron. Your best shot is to never have driven on your own, to always have had someone in the car telling you the right way to do it.

Most people lose their skill by driving lazily, and that only happens once you get into the car by yourself.

Driving by yourself on a 1st provisional is illegal. How about "what happens if I not competent enough and kill someone" instead of "what happens if the gardai catch me".

I would suggest that you get a good driving instructor, one that won't encourage you to break the law.

That's all well and good in theory but completely impractical, with 9-10 month waiting lists what are people supposed to do, quit work or college for 10 months until they have their full licence.

I too would like to take the moral high ground and say i'll never drive without a full licenced driver with me but i'd have to quit work or spend a fortune on taxis every day.

Bluetonic

Here we go again..... must be a week since this topic came up.

Pigeon Reaper

I would not advise you to drive by yourself however as having an instructor or fully licenced driver in the car will allow them to point out your mistakes or shortcomings. If you are making any errors and do not realise what they are, you will possibly make them into a habit. If you can't get someone in the car with you're probably better off not practicing. The law and enforcement on this point is a joke. Unless you do something exceptionally stupid you won't get pulled for this although technically it's not legal.

Big Nelly

Bluetonic wrote:

Here we go again..... must be a week since this topic came up.

haha, yeah I had a good laugh on that thread.

To answer the OP question it is illegal, end of story. Doesn't matter that you live on your own etc, you are not legally allowed on the road. So you will just have to wait till your mates can drive with you(the ones with a full license) or get more lessons. There is enough people on the roads in Dublin without a proper license than adding another one to the carnage.

Again as I suggested before I would love if the Garda where given the power to ban someone for 1-2 years if they catch them on the road without the correct license, or without a licensed driver with them. Would end all this crap

jamescrombie

I have a friend who has a full licence to drive a motorbike ... he passed that test would that work as theoretically he has a Full Licence

Big Nelly

jamescrombie wrote:

I have a friend who has a full licence to drive a motorbike ... he passed that test would that work as theoretically he has a Full Licence

As far as I know its not because its for a motorbike and not a car, your friend would still be on a provisional license for a car?

Litcagral

jamescrombie wrote:

I have a friend who has a full licence to drive a motorbike ... he passed that test would that work as theoretically he has a Full Licence

Obviously it has to be in the same category. When I was doing the articulated truck, the accompanied person also had to be a holder of a C+E licence.

Vegeta

Big Nelly wrote:

To answer the OP question it is illegal, end of story. Doesn't matter that you live on your own etc, you are not legally allowed on the road. So you will just have to wait till your mates can drive with you(the ones with a full license) or get more lessons. There is enough people on the roads in Dublin without a proper license than adding another one to the carnage.

I would like to see the garda release a report with the number of provisional license holders that caused accidents and the number of full license holders that cause accidents.

I too am all for the no driving unless you pass your test but the government is a joke, the waiting times for the test are too long, way too long. There is a loop hole as pointed out above where you can just get a 1st provisional never drive and then drive away on your second provisional,

What is the theory test for the provisional all about, completely pointless. Have road deaths fallen since its introduction, I don't know exact figures but I highly doubt it.

The system is flawed and needs changing big time but they wont bother doing that because people are happy to drive on their own on a provisional and the garda/government are happy to let them.

Big Nelly

Vegeta wrote:

I would like to see the garda release a report with the number of provisional license holders that caused accidents and the number of full license holders that cause accidents.

I too am all for the no driving unless you pass your test but the government is a joke, the waiting times for the test are too long, way too long. There is a loop hole as pointed out above where you can just get a 1st provisional never drive and then drive away on your second provisional,

What is the theory test for the provisional all about, completely pointless. Have road deaths fallen since its introduction, I don't know exact figures but I highly doubt it.

The system is flawed and needs changing big time but they wont bother doing that because people are happy to drive on their own on a provisional and the garda/government are happy to let them.

Same arguement everytime and I come back with the same reply, if you want to do the test you will get a test no problem. A mate of mine started a new job and needs a car, is doing lessons etc and I am bringing her out, she applied about a month or 2 ago and has her test this month. That wasn't too hard?

I agree the theory test is a joke, as posted before my brother had a quick flick thru the manual, walked into the test, came back out with full marks, he had never driven a car before in his life and 5 mins looking at the manual. Most of the question you can answer if you have any cop on at all.

jamescrombie

i agree i passed the Theroy test without studying got 39/40.... its just to cash in on a few quid as far as i am concerned.... i have my Full Test in 3 weeks so will only be driving on my own for a few hours while i practice....

Guy:Incognito

Vegeta wrote:

That's all well and good in theory but completely impractical, with 9-10 month waiting lists what are people supposed to do, quit work or college for 10 months until they have their full licence..

They're supposed to not get jobs/go to college thats requires them to drive. Just because it's inconvenient to get the bus/train doesnt make itsomeone elses fault.

Keedowah

2 months! Wow thats amazing - I have been waiting 11 months now - and still no sign.

Howcome if I send in a letter they can magic up a place for me a lot sooner? Surely its not all down to cancellations?

Beruthiel

Big Nelly wrote:

As far as I know its not because its for a motorbike and not a car, your friend would still be on a provisional license for a car?

I have driven bikes on a full bike licence for over 10 years, I still had to go do the theory test and get a provisional licence for my new car.
I had provisional licences for driving cars (3 ) before my bike, but never got around to doing the test, silly me.

Big Nelly

jamescrombie wrote:

i agree i passed the Theroy test without studying got 39/40.... its just to cash in on a few quid as far as i am concerned.... i have my Full Test in 3 weeks so will only be driving on my own for a few hours while i practice....

Doesnt matter if only a few hours, its ILLEGAL, your in Dublin so there is a heavy concentration of traffic so there will be very few area where you can guartee you won't meet cars/traffic. What happens if you crash because you where not sure what to do? if you only have 3 weeks to go then get a mate, pay him a few quid or just do more lessons. Why bother taking the risk?

2 months! Wow thats amazing - I have been waiting 11 months now - and still no sign.

Howcome if I send in a letter they can magic up a place for me a lot sooner? Surely its not all down to cancellations?

Everyone puts in those letters now, when I did my test(good few years back now) I stuck in a letter and I got mine within the same month but everyone soon realised this and started to put in the letter as well. Not sure if it was a cancellation or what but not one of my mates/family ever had problems with getting a test within the 2-3 months time limit

Litcagral

Beruthiel wrote:

I have driven bikes on a full bike licence for over 10 years, I still had to go do the theory test and get a provisional licence for my new car.
I had provisional licences for driving cars (3 ) before my bike, but never got around to doing the test, silly me.

I was in a similar situation. I had a full licence in 12 categories (all except A & A1 Motorcycles). Even though I have no interest in bikes, I decided to do the test to complete the lot. I had to sit the theory test with all the newbies even though I am an experienced driver in many categories.

Vegeta

Big Nelly wrote:

Everyone puts in those letters now, when I did my test(good few years back now) I stuck in a letter and I got mine within the same month but everyone soon realised this and started to put in the letter as well. Not sure if it was a cancellation or what but not one of my mates/family ever had problems with getting a test within the 2-3 months time limit

I work for a company who will not give me a letter so I will be waiting the bones of a year for my test. For the smart arse who said get the bus/train to college/work. Yeah cos everyone in Ireland lives within a short stroll of the nearest bus stop/train station :rolleyes:

Here's an example, my house is about 17 miles from where I went to college or about 20 min drive as the roads are good. The bus would not have me in class for 9 in the morning and there was no train so I had to live on campus. Now if I could have driven to college on a provisional then it would solved all my problems

maidhc

Big Nelly wrote:

What happens if you crash because you where not sure what to do? if you only have 3 weeks to go then get a mate, pay him a few quid or just do more lessons. Why bother taking the risk?

Because the risk is negligible I suspect. Yes, everyone does drive on their first provisional, and yes, it is bold. (blah, blah..)

I dont buy this whole provisional drivers are a walking (or driving) menance at all. Sure they are inclined to be the ones in the wrong lanes and may well scratch your car trying to park, but they are generally aware of their shortcomings and quite courteous as drivers.

Big Nelly wrote:

Not sure if it was a cancellation or what but not one of my mates/family ever had problems with getting a test within the 2-3 months time limit

The actual waiting times are here:
http://www.environ.ie/DOEI/DOEIPub.nsf/0/daac160e1d73c27d80256f0f003dbc05/$FILE/Vehicle Registration 05.pdf
(5.5mb pdf!)

And they are more than 3 months.

Big Nelly

Vegeta wrote:

I work for a company who will not give me a letter so I will be waiting the bones of a year for my test. For the smart arse who said get the bus/train to college/work. Yeah cos everyone in Ireland lives within a short stroll of the nearest bus stop/train station :rolleyes:

If you company won't give you a letter then I guess 1. You don't need a car for work? 2. They provide transport to and from your office 3. There is enough public transport in the area that is provided so you wont need a car. I work in field now so I need a car in the office but its a joke the amount of people travel in when they don't need a car with them, company provides transport and there is public transport in the area so no need for car

Because the risk is negligible I suspect. Yes, everyone does drive on their first provisional, and yes, it is bold. (blah, blah..)

I dont buy this whole provisional drivers are a walking (or driving) menance at all. Sure they are inclined to be the ones in the wrong lanes and may well scratch your car trying to park, but they are generally aware of their shortcomings and quite courteous as drivers.

Its illegal, end of story, doesn't matter what some driver you seen do on the road because they are legal on the road and have a full license. Learner drivers should not be on the road if they havent a full license driver with them.

If you think it is ok for some dumbass learner to scrape the whole side of your car and then drive off(which they all do) then thats ok for you, I rather like to think when I park my car it wil be in the same condition when I get back and I can tell you I would be very pi**ed if it wasnt.

Aware of there shortcomings? haha, most of them do 2-3 lessons so they can learn how to get from A-B and then head out on the road with there new "baby" and think they are the best drivers in the country, alot of them are quick to rip off the L plates as well so the Garda wont notice them. I know people like this and I have said it to them but all you get back is "Im a greta driver" etc

Blut

I'm not sure how Big Nelly can get so upset over how provisional drivers are breaking the law by driving on their own but still advocate pretending to need a full license for work to bump yourself up the waiting list, surely thats some sort of misdemeanor too?

OP, dont worry about driving on your own on L plates. As long as youre somewhat competent at driving, dont race around like a boy racer and on the off chance youre pulled over you dont give any abuse to the gardai youll be fine. The worst that'll happen is they'll tell you 'dont do it again'. I've known probably 30 people driving around on their own for at least 6 months each on L plates in the last few years and not one has had any hassle, a couple have been pulled over but thats all that was said to them.

Next time youre driving around just have a look at all the other L plated cars around you, 75% of them are probably people on their own.

Big Nelly

Blut wrote:

I'm not sure how Big Nelly can get so upset over how provisional drivers are breaking the law by driving on their own but still advocate pretending to need a full license for work to bump yourself up the waiting list, surely thats some sort of misdemeanor too?

No its not, and yes I need the car for work

Blut wrote:

OP, dont worry about driving on your own on L plates. As long as youre somewhat competent at driving, dont race around like a boy racer and on the off chance youre pulled over you dont give any abuse to the gardai youll be fine. The worst that'll happen is they'll tell you 'dont do it again'. I've known probably 30 people driving around on their own for at least 6 months each on L plates in the last few years and not one has had any hassle, a couple have been pulled over but thats all that was said to them.

Next time youre driving around just have a look at all the other L plated cars around you, 75% of them are probably people on their own.

Great advice, tell him to break the law, hence why I would love the Garda to have the power to ban these 75% of people. All of these 75% don't need the car they are spinning around in and it will cut the traffic congestion in city centre

Vegeta

Ok there were some serious generalisations there but aside from them, you are right I don't need my car for work I need it to get to work. I could use public transport but when the garda don't enforce the law why should I. Yeah its illegal but so is speeding and a lot of other things and I suppose you're going to tell me you have never driven a car over the speed limit in you life. If you have then you shouldn't be on the road either

I very rarely speed and it is amazing how many drivers will drive way too close to the rear of my car, definitely not safe distances, they brake the rules of the road and are generally full licenced drivers. The craziest driving I have ever seen is always by full licenced drivers. I have yet to see a micra with L plates doing about 150 kph overtaking on a hill while crossing a solid white line but saw 2 guys doing it friday

The problem is enforcement, if I knew that every time i got in the car there was a very strong chance I would be pulled over and fined then I wouldn't speed, drive without a full licence or break any rule of the road. I drive on the N7 and N20 every morning for about 12 miles and have never seen a guard there in 7 months. Joke, Bertie says Irish people need a greater belief/pride in their community, I say we need something greater to believe in, I have no faith in anything to do with the government. Tax, licences, garda, public transport, hospitals. They have all let me down badly in the past and have not been improved upon.

Guy:Incognito

Vegeta wrote:

I work for a company who will not give me a letter so I will be waiting the bones of a year for my test. For the smart arse who said get the bus/train to college/work. Yeah cos everyone in Ireland lives within a short stroll of the nearest bus stop/train station :rolleyes:

Here's an example, my house is about 17 miles from where I went to college or about 20 min drive as the roads are good. The bus would not have me in class for 9 in the morning and there was no train so I had to live on campus. Now if I could have driven to college on a provisional then it would solved all my problems

Just becasue you feel you can pick and choose to obey certain laws to suit yourself doesnt make it right. Can I break a few if it makes my life a bit easier day to day?

What would you do if you couldnt afford a car? die because the shop was too far away to go? No you'd adapt. Get a bike.

Vegeta

Stekelly wrote:

Just becasue you feel you can pick and choose to obey certain laws to suit yourself doesnt make it right. Can I break a few if it makes my life a bit easier day to day?

What would you do if you couldnt afford a car? die because the shop was too far away to go? No you'd adapt. Get a bike.

Never broke a speed limit no??? failed to use an indicator on a roundabout, even once??? You take the moral high ground even though I can gurantee you have broke the law while driving just as I have

Also I didn't have a car in college, I walked from campus accomodation to college everyday. My parents have a car also so they generally shopped when I was in college. I never said i didn't live near a shop either just not the college

Blut

Big Nelly wrote:

No its not, and yes I need the car for work

Yes, but what about people who need their cars for college? Or for a job that wont provide them with a letter? It isnt really practical for most people to stay off the roads for 11 months while waiting on your test, then another 11 months after that if (and chances are pretty high you will) you fail.

Great advice, tell him to break the law, hence why I would love the Garda to have the power to ban these 75% of people. All of these 75% don't need the car they are spinning around in and it will cut the traffic congestion in city centre

Realistically speaking its at pretty much the same level as jaywalking in terms of how its enforced.

I'm not denying its technically illegal, or that its 'wrong' or whatnot, I'm simply telling the OP how the system actually works in the real world. You seem to be caught up in the morality of it rather than providing him the honest answer to his question.

gline

this law is crazy in ireland

my mam was actually told by her instructer that she should practice, she told him that she cannot get someone to be in the car with her all the time, he told her to "tell the police if she was stopped that her friend that is usually in the car with her wasnt able to make it and she needed to get to work".


That is crazy the instructer telling her to say that

there is a big problem in this country - laws not being enforced.

Personally I think they should get rid of the whole provisional license system, you should have to prove you have done a certain amount of lessons etc and speed up the test waiting period and that should encourage more to get their full license

But at the moment you cant blame people for driving on 1st provisionals, as the waiting period for a test is crazy, and if you have to commute a long distance to work it is a necessity

Though i suppose at the end of the day it is illgal and you run the risk of being prosecuted, so it is not advisable to "chance your arm"

on another point, what is the penalty for being caught on a 1st provisional driving alone??

Big Nelly

Vegeta wrote:

Ok there were some serious generalisations there but aside from them, you are right I don't need my car for work I need it to get to work. I could use public transport but when the garda don't enforce the law why should I. Yeah its illegal but so is speeding and a lot of other things and I suppose you're going to tell me you have never driven a car over the speed limit in you life. If you have then you shouldn't be on the road either

So in other words you don't need the car to get to work, your just to lazy to get public transport. I have gone over speed limit, nothing major but havent got a penalty point yet. It might amaze you but there is proper drivers in this country. We don't all hop into our car and break every law possible. You on the other hand get into a car without a licensed driver...one law broke....then you speed....second law, God knows what else you do when your "driving"

Vegeta wrote:

I very rarely speed and it is amazing how many drivers will drive way too close to the rear of my car, definitely not safe distances, they brake the rules of the road and are generally full licenced drivers. The craziest driving I have ever seen is always by full licenced drivers. I have yet to see a micra with L plates doing about 150 kph overtaking on a hill while crossing a solid white line but saw 2 guys doing it friday

Well the Micra wouldnt be able to go that fast is prob why you never see it:D

Vegeta wrote:

The problem is enforcement, if I knew that every time i got in the car there was a very strong chance I would be pulled over and fined then I wouldn't speed, drive without a full licence or break any rule of the road. I drive on the N7 and N20 every morning for about 12 miles and have never seen a guard there in 7 months. Joke, Bertie says Irish people need a greater belief/pride in their community, I say we need something greater to believe in, I have no faith in anything to do with the government. Tax, licences, garda, public transport, hospitals. They have all let me down badly in the past and have not been improved upon.

Usually Irish attitude, sure if I can get away with it I will continue to break the law. This is why I would love the Garda to ban people, you cry about the Garda not being able to enforce but I bet as soon as they are you would br crying because now you have to use public transport and you have to get up a few mins earlier to get to work on time

Jumpy

For anyone interested, this the NSW Australia license information page.
I believe this system is one of the best I have seen in my travels.
Specifically the Learner, P1 and P2 licenses and the vehicle restrictions.

http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/licensing/index.html

Pigeon Reaper

Enforcement of the law is the problem as others have pointed out. Irish society does not take raod safety seriousl resulting in many crashes both minor and serious. A number of earlier posts on this topic have highlighted this clearly. The rules of the road are here for a reason. If two people break minor rules either by mistake or intentionally it can often cause a crash. Speeding just compounds the severity.

No driver is perfect but the difference between a full licence and provisional is a full licence holder has proven that they are of a certain level. This of course is not the end of their learning and every driver should try to improve constantly. A learner may not even be aware of their mistakes this is why they should not drive alone. In most EU countries this is the case with our system being the exeception.

Saying the test waiting time is so long is not an excuse. It has been this way for a number of years. Anyone who is on their first licence knows this and should have applied as soon as possible for the test before they felt they needed to drive to get from A-B. Most learners drive by themselves for conveniance as it's easier than trying to arrange other transport or a licenced driver. As a user of public transport it is bad but still usable. If you can't use public transport how did you get around before the car?

gline

Pigeon Reaper wrote:

Most learners drive by themselves for conveniance as it's easier than trying to arrange other transport or a licenced driver. As a user of public transport it is bad but still usable. If you can't use public transport how did you get around before the car?

what if you live in an area with little to no public transport

also why would a full driver license folder sit in the car with you and go everywhere with you when they can drive themselves?? It is sometimes next to impossible to get someone to sit in the car with you..

Big Nelly

Blut wrote:

Yes, but what about people who need their cars for college? Or for a job that wont provide them with a letter? It isnt really practical for most people to stay off the roads for 11 months while waiting on your test, then another 11 months after that if (and chances are pretty high you will) you fail.

Why would you need your car for college? walk or get a bike. I never needed a car when I went to college. Second college I was living outside of the town and couldnt really get travel in each day so I moved into the town, got a job and paided my way thru college. I never had enough cash to buy a car. Problem now is with parents earning more they are buying little Jonny a car so he can drive his little mates around the neighbourhood even thou he could walk if he wasnt a lazy s***.

Nobody in there right mind needs a car for college because all college are in major towns etc. which will have public transport into and out of etc. You dont need a car

Also people that say they need a car to drive to work are a joke, most companies are again in major cities so public transport etc is provided.

I actually hate that I need my car, it means I have to be up at 6 to get into work on time in the city centre because of the amount of cars on the road. Would be alot easier to get the train(5 mins from house and 5 mins walk from office) but I can't

Big Nelly

gline wrote:

what if you live in an area with little to no public transport

Well your location is Dublin, southside so you have no problems with getting public transport there? so do you have a full license? if not do you drive illegally instead of getting the train/bus?

gline wrote:

also why would a full driver license folder sit in the car with you and go everywhere with you when they can drive themselves?? It is sometimes next to impossible to get someone to sit in the car with you..

Havent a clue what your first sentance is supposed to mean, plenty of full license drivers dont mind sitting with a learner driver to help them. I have no problems teaching people to drive, we are not all monsters!

gline

Big Nelly wrote:

Well your location is Dublin, southside so you have no problems with getting public transport there? so do you have a full license? if not do you drive illegally instead of getting the train/bus?



Havent a clue what your first sentance is supposed to mean, plenty of full license drivers dont mind sitting with a learner driver to help them. I have no problems teaching people to drive, we are not all monsters!

no i get a luas and then a bus to work (1.5hours each way, 3 hours travel a day).

Also i know how hard it is to find someone to sit in the car when you are learning, as i was gettting lessons at one stage and preparing for a test and it was impossible, i couldnt get anyone, so in the end i had to cancel the test as i couldnt afford all the lessons I was paying for

pontovic

Heres what I think

Don't drive on a provisional licence unless you really have to. I know that's not what you want to hear, but unless it's absolutely necessary, I wouldnt do it. I got myself a VW polo about a year ago now and started working out in Citywest. I live in Howth, so that's a 45 mile journey everyday, and there was no way it was feasible to get there and back everyday using public transport. I took a risk. I went out on my own on my 1st provisional and I drove to work everyday. I flauted the law but I had no other way of getting to work. I have my full licence now. If I had been in an accident, I would have been in trouble. If you are going to go out, make sure you are comfortable driving in all conditions ( get plenty of lessons, ask people everything always ask! ).

I would object to learner drivers being on the road if we had a proper testing system here, like they do in America, where you can walk into a testing center in the morning, sit and wait 40 mins, and you are then ready to do your test right there and then. Unfortunately, for my testing center, the wait is 13 months !
I would also object to 1st provisional drivers on the road if it was feasible for people to start learning to drive when they were younger, under greater restriction. This was not the case for me. My insurance would have been far too high at that age. I wasn't a rich kid who was given a car for their 17th birthday. I could only afford to start driving when I was 22 years old. Unfortunately here, insurance costs are way too high and there is no real encouragement for young people to drive. When I was in school here there was no such thing as driver education and there still isn't !!

The attitude to driving here really needs to change. We need to sort out the mess in the driver testing system.

The law that allows anyone with a provisional licence on the road alone, regardless of wether it's their first or second, needs to be abolished. All provisional drivers need to be accompnaied and this law must be enforced, but first, we need to reduce driving test waiting lists. We need to prosecute drink drivers. We need to make alot of changes

Pigeon Reaper

gline wrote:

what if you live in an area with little to no public transport

QUOTE]
How did all the people on provisionals get around before they got their first provisional licence in areas like this? How have the older methods of transport suddenly become impossible to use?

Big Nelly

gline wrote:

no i get a luas and then a bus to work (1.5hours each way, 3 hours travel a day).

At least there is a few on here, it takes me around the sametime going in and out in car:mad: and that depends if I get out of work about 4.30 for the mad race across town before the traffic is really mental

gline wrote:

Also i know how hard it is to find someone to sit in the car when you are learning, as i was gettting lessons at one stage and preparing for a test and it was impossible, i couldnt get anyone, so in the end i had to cancel the test as i couldnt afford all the lessons I was paying for

I never had a problem and always try and help people out. Just tell them that sometimes I lose the rag but for them just to tell me to "fcuk off" and don' take it personally, usually it is with some other idiot on the road:D

How did all the people on provisionals get around before they got their first provisional licence in areas like this? How have the older methods of transport suddenly become impossible to use?

From personal experience in Dublin once someone gets over the age of 10 they have to have a moped or something like that to get to school, also if there is a sign of a cloud in the sky mammy has to get the SUV out to bring little jonny to school in case he gets wet......or his ipod get broken

maidhc

Pigeon Reaper wrote:

How did all the people on provisionals get around before they got their first provisional licence in areas like this?

With great difficulty and inconvenience to others I assure you. When you are insured to drive it is less acceptable to start bumming lifts of you mother, brother and sister.

The fact is that

a) Waiting lists are far too long
b) For this reason (I presume) the gardaí do generally not enforce the accompanied driver rule, even if you crash.
c) The insurance companies pay out, even if you are unaccompanied. I believe they have made public that this is their position on this matter.

If waiting lists were 4/6 weeks, then i believe the law should be enforced. At present it is impractical to do so. It would be nice if people were less self-righteous about the matter.

Bluetonic

Big Nelly wrote:

I have gone over speed limit, nothing major but havent got a penalty point yet

Big Nelly wrote:

and that depends if I get out of work about 4.30 for the mad race across town before the traffic is really mental

The whacky races spring to mind :rolleyes:

Anyone know if you can drive alone on a 5th provisional by the way

gline

maidhc wrote:

With great difficulty and inconvenience to others I assure you. When you are insured to drive it is less acceptable to start bumming lifts of you mother, brother and sister.

The fact is that

a) Waiting lists are far too long
b) For this reason (I presume) the gardaí do generally not enforce the accompanied driver rule, even if you crash.
c) The insurance companies pay out, even if you are unaccompanied. I believe they have made public that this is their position on this matter.

If waiting lists were 4/6 weeks, then i believe the law should be enforced. At present it is impractical to do so. It would be nice if people were less self-righteous about the matter.

totally agree.
BUT if you do drive alone on a 1st provisional you are breaking the law and have to be aware that there may be consequences, also if you do have a serious crash you will have to live with that:(

Vegeta

Big Nelly wrote:

So in other words you don't need the car to get to work, your just to lazy to get public transport. I have gone over speed limit, nothing major but havent got a penalty point yet. It might amaze you but there is proper drivers in this country. We don't all hop into our car and break every law possible. You on the other hand get into a car without a licensed driver...one law broke....then you speed....second law, God knows what else you do when your "driving"

Well the Micra wouldnt be able to go that fast is prob why you never see it:D

Usually Irish attitude, sure if I can get away with it I will continue to break the law. This is why I would love the Garda to ban people, you cry about the Garda not being able to enforce but I bet as soon as they are you would br crying because now you have to use public transport and you have to get up a few mins earlier to get to work on time

For all you know I could be a much more competent driver than you, how would you ever know. Also I assume you never drove alone on a first provisional.

I would have no problem using public transport if I knew my test would be in like 2 weeks or even 4 weeks but 10 months is a joke and I don't care if I break this law and I will continue to do so

Vegeta

pontovic wrote:

Heres what I think

Don't drive on a provisional licence unless you really have to. I know that's not what you want to hear, but unless it's absolutely necessary, I wouldnt do it. I got myself a VW polo about a year ago now and started working out in Citywest. I live in Howth, so that's a 45 mile journey everyday, and there was no way it was feasible to get there and back everyday using public transport. I took a risk. I went out on my own on my 1st provisional and I drove to work everyday. I flauted the law but I had no other way of getting to work. I have my full licence now. If I had been in an accident, I would have been in trouble. If you are going to go out, make sure you are comfortable driving in all conditions ( get plenty of lessons, ask people everything always ask! ).

I would object to learner drivers being on the road if we had a proper testing system here, like they do in America, where you can walk into a testing center in the morning, sit and wait 40 mins, and you are then ready to do your test right there and then. Unfortunately, for my testing center, the wait is 13 months !
I would also object to 1st provisional drivers on the road if it was feasible for people to start learning to drive when they were younger, under greater restriction. This was not the case for me. My insurance would have been far too high at that age. I wasn't a rich kid who was given a car for their 17th birthday. I could only afford to start driving when I was 22 years old. Unfortunately here, insurance costs are way too high and there is no real encouragement for young people to drive. When I was in school here there was no such thing as driver education and there still isn't !!

The attitude to driving here really needs to change. We need to sort out the mess in the driver testing system.

The law that allows anyone with a provisional licence on the road alone, regardless of wether it's their first or second, needs to be abolished. All provisional drivers need to be accompnaied and this law must be enforced, but first, we need to reduce driving test waiting lists. We need to prosecute drink drivers. We need to make alot of changes

This guy speaks sense

Carb

Big Nelly wrote:

Also people that say they need a car to drive to work are a joke, most companies are again in major cities so public transport etc is provided.

Priceless:D

Big Nelly

Bluetonic wrote:

The whacky races spring to mind :rolleyes:

Anyone know if you can drive alone on a 5th provisional by the way

Mad race across town usual at average speed if lucky of 10mph. Its trying to get across town without some idiot learner driver taking the wing off your car;)

5th? can you go as far as a 5th one?

For all you know I could be a much more competent driver than you, how would you ever know. Also I assume you never drove alone on a first provisional.

I would have no problem using public transport if I knew my test would be in like 2 weeks or even 4 weeks but 10 months is a joke and I don't care if I break this law and I will continue to do so

Did I say you where a bad driver? no I said you where an illegal driver. Doesn't matter if your the best driver in the World you are still not legal to be on the roads.

just as a matter of interet how long are you driving? what provisional are you on?