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Metallica

  • 14-02-2006 11:44am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,552 ✭✭✭


    hey... i was thinking lately...what happens right if...bare with me... metallicas new album comes out and its actually good and somehow over the past year or so they found something that somehow magically makes them able to write like they used to and all of a sudden they release master of puppets part 2...

    i dunno why idecided to post this and theres no real question i'd just like to hear your thoughts on it...


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,326 ✭✭✭Zapp Brannigan


    No matter what they'll get flamed. It's just the way things are nowadays.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 888 ✭✭✭Merrick


    Slurms wrote:
    No matter what they'll get flamed. It's just the way things are nowadays.

    Too true. If they want to avoid another St Anger, they'll have to come up with something absolutely FANTASTIC. Now how likely is that to happen..?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,095 ✭✭✭OLP


    Steoob wrote:
    hey... i was thinking lately...what happens right if...bare with me... metallicas new album comes out and its actually good and somehow over the past year or so they found something that somehow magically makes them able to write like they used to and all of a sudden they release master of puppets part 2...

    i dunno why idecided to post this and theres no real question i'd just like to hear your thoughts on it...


    I don't see how they'd bring Cliff back to life tho, 'casue unless that happens their still fùcked.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,552 ✭✭✭Steoob


    OLP wrote:
    I don't see how they'd bring Cliff back to life tho, 'casue unless that happens their still fùcked.
    thats a good point...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    I can only speak for myself, but I eagerly await every new Metallica release, just in case it's actually good. I think a lot of old fans like myself hope they've still got it in them but usually get disappointed. The reason is that the first four albums were so good, you've just got to cling to the hope that the people who wrote that music still have it in them to rediscover the lost form, not to repeat what they've done and release MOPII, but just to have that creativity, energy and authenticity which made the first four albums essential and the absense of which has made the last 15 years such a crushing disappointment.

    I'll never forget the day, coming home on the bus listening to Load on the walkman for the first time and actually checking the lyrics on the inlay against what I was hearing on the tape to see if it was the wrong tape or something.

    In hindsight, I think Newsted leaving was the end of the band, not his actual departure, but that he felt so disillusioned with them as a band that he left one of the most lucrative jobs around. It was the signal that the Metallica of old was dead. He knew it for sure and his work with Voivod is all the ressurance that anyone needs that he still has a love of innovative and creative Metal.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,326 ✭✭✭Zapp Brannigan


    Doctor J wrote:
    I'll never forget the day, coming home on the bus listening to Load on the walkman for the first time and actually checking the lyrics on the inlay against what I was hearing on the tape to see if it was the wrong tape or something.
    Thats exactly what I done, except it was Reload for me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 688 ✭✭✭merlinsmerryman


    I fully expect it to be more like the first 4 albums then the last few releases judging by what I have read in recent interviews and if the rumour that Bob Rock is un-available there is a lot of hope.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,326 ✭✭✭Zapp Brannigan


    I fully expect it to be more like the first 4 albums then the last few releases judging by what I have read in recent interviews and if the rumour that Bob Rock is un-available there is a lot of hope.
    Bob Rock will do it, thats prolly why the went on Tpur rather than record a new album. Cos by the time they come off tour Bob will be finished with Motley Crue and free to work with them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,589 ✭✭✭✭Necronomicon


    I'm hoping since Rob Trujillo is actually writing on this one that he will have a positive influence. I'm not sure how much of a difference he'll make to the overall direction that the band take on this one, but I've always liked him.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    I've got to say I think Bob Rock is very unfairly blamed for Metallica's downfall/popularity (delete as appropriate). He didn't lead them anywhere they didn't want to go. End of story. As for stanger, that abomination, in my opinion, is the sound of a band who simply ran out of ideas. OK, the sound is woeful, apart from the songs, but they all played a part in it, the documentary proves that album was made by committee if nothing else. The songs were created by cutting and pasting sections of jam sessions together in Pro Tools and that's what you do when you've run out of straws to clutch at.

    I actually have a lot of time for the guy. He did some sterling work on The Cult's Sonic Temple and self-titled albums, especially the self titled one (goat on the cover) which was a pretty raw but not gick sounding album long before stanger.

    Never forget, Metallica went to him to change their sound, he was not imposed upon them. To be honest, even if Andy Sneap produced the next one I still think the tank is empty and it will suck regardless.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,466 ✭✭✭Blisterman


    I'm almost definate Metallica's next album will be better than St Anger (not that that's too hard). Considering the circumstances at the time. They were playing great the last 2 times in Dublin.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,658 ✭✭✭Patricide


    Although i absolutly love metallica, i gotta agree with docor j on this one newsteads departure really says it all.He leaves THE most succesfull band of all time so that he can really be happy with the stuff thats coming out.

    I highly doubt the next album could be anything spectacular, something of a half redeeming factor like megadeths the system has failed maby.There creative tanks are truly running on empty all you have to do is look at the lyric sheets for st.Anger to see that, i mean come on Invisible kid anyone?

    The thing i hate is when people blame rob trujillo for st. anger because he had nothing to do with its writing, If anyone can help metallica get out of the rut its him.

    As for the whole BOB ROCK = DEVIL issue, I Amnt saying he deserves all the blame here but some of the production for st. Anger was really shotty, The Drums for example sound like **** but im not sure if that was him or lars or whatnot, i will say also that he has a tendency to take them in new directions While not allways a bad thing the fans are SCREAMING out for something reminicent of the old style metallica.

    I hope to god they release somthing spectacular but untill they do its Master of puppets for me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    Well we can only up that good things really do come to those who wait.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 179 ✭✭davie_b


    I reckon/hope/pray that st. anger (being the poorest offering of the lot that they have released) was just an album they had to get owt of their system!!
    and now they can come owt an release an album in the same vein as ride the lightening or heavens forbid kill em all(what an album) and people will forgat the last 10 years of substanderd release's bar S&M


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,382 ✭✭✭Motley Crue


    Doctor J wrote:
    I'll never forget the day, coming home on the bus listening to Load on the walkman for the first time and actually checking the lyrics on the inlay against what I was hearing on the tape to see if it was the wrong tape or something.

    I can only imagine being a Metallica fan in 1996 and seeing the video for 'Until It Sleeps', just sitting there thinking 'What the ****?'
    Doctor J wrote:
    In hindsight, I think Newsted leaving was the end of the band, not his actual departure, but that he felt so disillusioned with them as a band that he left one of the most lucrative jobs around. It was the signal that the Metallica of old was dead. He knew it for sure and his work with Voivod is all the ressurance that anyone needs that he still has a love of innovative and creative Metal.

    Thats true, yes, but Newsted was also put through an abusive cycle in that band that James even admitted never really stopped...so i think Newstead must have felt so boxed in after so many years he just couldnt take it anymore, regardless of whether he had one of the most lucrative/high profile jobs in the world or not.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    I can only imagine being a Metallica fan in 1996 and seeing the video for 'Until It Sleeps', just sitting there thinking 'What the ****?'

    The video wasn't too bad, I thought maybe they'd been hanging out with Smashing Pumpkins or something... It was really just hearing Ain't My Bitch for the first time and reading the inlay thinking "What the hell has happened here?" :v:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,894 ✭✭✭✭phantom_lord


    Steoob wrote:
    hey... i was thinking lately...what happens right if...bare with me... metallicas new album comes out and its actually good and somehow over the past year or so they found something that somehow magically makes them able to write like they used to and all of a sudden they release master of puppets part 2...


    I would have taken it as a positive sign that they've gone back to playing loads of old stuff on tour, and since they were doing loads of jamming and recording the new stuff should be in a similar vein...hopefully...

    Anyway if the 'break out of studio tour' or whatever it's called is like the last one we should hear a song or two from the new album.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,552 ✭✭✭Steoob


    what ive always wanted to know is....do metallica know that their true fans hate them now? do they enjoy the fake success that their getting?

    i myself haven't been to a metallica gig but do the crowd go crazy when they play songs off new albums? (by crazy i mean good crazy)... becuase i have yet to actually see a person who likes their new albums (except of course for the groups of 12 year old girls that go around wearing st. anger t-shirts...)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,810 ✭✭✭lodgepole


    How is the success fake?

    I don't know what people are talking about in regards Metallica gigs going downhill since St. Anger. I can understand people who don't like those particular songs disliking those songs being played, but they band are as good live today as they've been at any point in the last decade. I can't comment on gigs before that as I first saw them in 1996.

    Personally I thought St. Anger had it's moments. I don't spin it often and I rarely play it all the way through but it's not the worst. I should add that i'm not a twelve year old girl.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,552 ✭✭✭Steoob


    i think its fake because they sold out... maybe fake was harsh but they are playing their new music to make money IMO


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,466 ✭✭✭Blisterman


    What's wrong with that? Most bands want to make money.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    Ha ha I will say one thing for Metallica, people don't sit on the fence. Perhaps I should just sticky a Metallica thread because they get the most contrasting arguements, whether it's old farts like me who remember the (good) old days or young un's who dig the post 1990 Metallica, there is always an opinion to be heard :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 58 ✭✭paulmartin


    Doctor J wrote:
    Ha ha I will say one thing for Metallica, people don't sit on the fence. Perhaps I should just sticky a Metallica thread because they get the most contrasting arguements, whether it's old farts like me who remember the (good) old days or young un's who dig the post 1990 Metallica, there is always an opinion to be heard :D

    Well as a young fan I certainly prefer the older stuff, particularly Master Of Puppets. But I think younger fans while not liking the newer stuff as much, still like it more than the older fans. A lot of people (well me anyway) got into Metallica because of Enter Sandman and Nothing Else Matters, and then went back to the older stuff. I don't know why older fans have such a problem with the Black Album though. There is a lot of filler, but so do all the early Metallica albums (accept MOP). Sandman, NEM, and the Unforgiven are all classics. I certainly don't see it as a sell-out album. Those songs wouldn't have worked as well with the older method. Imagine Sandman with a million other riffs and Nothing Else Matters with a heavy chorus as they had done with ballads before that - it wouldn't have worked.

    Personally I prefer Black Album to ...AJFA, which is too extreme. AJFA was like everything early Metallica were about done to the most extreme, whether or not it worked musically, and that ruined some songs. In the first three albums they only put as much riffs in a song as sounded good, whearas AJFA it was like lets puts as many riffs and parts into a song as humanly possible. Black Album was the opposite and it worked for the songs they were writing at that time.

    Having said all that, if I could choose to see Metallica live during any period it would have been with Cliff Burton after Master Of Puppets album. I downloaded his last concert in Stockholm and was amazing.

    Admittedly Load sessions were mostly poor with the exeption of a few songs and Stanger is crap. I don't think an album full of 7 and 8 minute songs could ever be considered commerical or mainstream sellout, it's just ****.

    I think what will dictate whether the next album is a success is the quality of the songs. Not the production or what drums Lars uses or anything, just whether or not they are inspired. I doubt it, though. All we can hope for is a few Kirk solos as they're always good.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 688 ✭✭✭merlinsmerryman


    Doctor J wrote:
    Never forget, Metallica went to him to change their sound, he was not imposed upon them. To be honest, even if Andy Sneap produced the next one I still think the tank is empty and it will suck regardless.

    He imposed himself on them, well challenged them. Told them that they weren't capturing the sound and atmosphere they captured live on a record. Clever on his part really.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    Not particularily. It's a producer's job to get the very best out of a band, both performance wise and sonically, to work on arrangements and to make the music as good as it can be (sometimes with a commercial flavour). A producer should introduce avenues a band might not think of, a sort of creative consultant. Rock had them do a lot of things which never ended up in the final mixes, wanted Holier Than Thou to be the first single, he tried lots of things they resisted. Don't forget, they had attempted to use Mike Clink (without success) when starting to record AJFA and reverted to using Flemming Rasmussen. As I recall, they were impressed with the big sound of The Cult's Sonic Temple album and sought Bob Rock out. If they weren't happy with what Bob Rock was doing they would have fired him, as they did with Mike Clink beforehand. I think they were trying to be a little more open minded after the AJFA era though. They had become rather popular, made their first music video, been somewhat accepted into the mainstream and were looking to change their ways. Rock was a part of that process but was not the instigator or... ahem... a master of puppets :v:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,914 ✭✭✭✭tbh


    Steoob wrote:
    what ive always wanted to know is....do metallica know that their true fans hate them now? do they enjoy the fake success that their getting?

    I'm not having a go, steoob, but the true fans don't hate them now. The people you are talking about are fans of the pre-justice Metallica, but not fans of the "new" metallica. Obviously if you hate them, you're not a fan anymore. Which is cool and all. The point is, they make music based on whats going on in their lives at the time. As they've gotten older, they obviously mellow, and priorities change - for james, that looks like he's more involved with his personal demons than whats going on in the outside world. Obviously, as bands progress, they evolve and want to try out new things and new directions. I havn't been mad about anything since justice, but I at least you can't accuse them of churning out the same stuff over and over, which I admit I may have preferred. its what AC/DC do, and they kick ass. Metallica do what the feel the need to do, if you don't like it, you don't have to. I for one hope they release MOPII, but I'd doubt they will, because thats not where they are right now. St. Anger was a 'difficult' album alright, but I think its a step (back) in the right direction.
    steoob wrote:
    i myself haven't been to a metallica gig but do the crowd go crazy when they play songs off new albums? (by crazy i mean good crazy)...
    Depends on the song really. They generally go mad for all the songs except "Nothing else matters". Go an see them, by the way - everyone should see them once. I'd be interested in your opinion after seeing them, I've seen them loads and its always been a brilliant show.
    steoob wrote:
    becuase i have yet to actually see a person who likes their new albums (except of course for the groups of 12 year old girls that go around wearing st. anger t-shirts...)
    no fair to judge a band on the fact that 12-year old girls are wearing their t-shirts :D

    I do see your point, but I guess if you don't like the music, you don't have to buy it, and I think thats what most people do rather than actively hateing them. I don't really understand that reaction - its musical snobbery if you ask me. You may not like it, but at least they are out there doing it

    tbh


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,625 ✭✭✭Sofaspud


    paulmartin wrote:
    I don't think an album full of 7 and 8 minute songs could ever be considered commerical or mainstream sellout, it's just ****.


    Sure, the songs were 7 or 8 minutes long in theory, but they were actually 2 minute long songs, repeated 3 or 4 times to make them seem longer, with a heavy bit for the last 30 seconds. That's what annoys me most about Stanger. One verse, one chorus, six thousand repetitions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,034 ✭✭✭✭It wasn't me!


    Doctor J wrote:
    was not the instigator or... ahem... a master of puppets :v:

    ...Doc, I actually groaned... :p Personally, while Master of Puppets was the definitive album, I'd much rather hear the rawness of Ride the Lightning of Kill 'Em All back again, with all the speed and power that entailed. My history in Metallica is that, for about a year, I heard all the new crap floating around, stuff from the Black Album onwards. After this I was just "bleh" about them. Saw nothing of teh specialness everyone seemed to see, and couldn't have been arsed getting any of their stuff. Then someone got me Master of Puppets, trying to educate me I suppose. :p Well, threw it on, and I'm not sure what i expected, but that album stuck with me. I'd play it about three times a day. Battery just blew me out of the ****ing water. It's one of the most creative and unique albums I've ever heard, to this day. From the speed and energy of Battery to the passion of Orion. It's magnificent. And yet I can't help but love the energy and power of the previous two even more, though they lack the grandeur and compositional detail. That's my story anyway. Three great albums (After several years, the jury's still out on ...AJFA), followed by a somewhat questionable progression into crap. Still, if there's a light at the end of the Metallica tunnel, I'll go nuts once more about them :) Perhaps the fumes left in their tank will give us one last blast of the band they really are.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭LundiMardi


    this is a good read, keep it coming people, it's nice to read over peoples opinions without reading stupid comments/remarks.

    Personally, i'll be getting the new album and i look forward to it. I'd prefer not to hear a MOPII, but i do like their load days, but who knows what it's gonna be like..

    Does anyone have any links to reviews etc?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17 Agent_X


    ...talk about sellouts. They are trying 2 hard to go with the trend. U don't hear them blasting out any classics anymore.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭LundiMardi


    Agent_X wrote:
    ...talk about sellouts. They are trying 2 hard to go with the trend. U don't hear them blasting out any classics anymore.
    Do you mean in general or on their records?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,914 ✭✭✭✭tbh


    LundiMardi wrote:
    this is a good read, keep it coming people, it's nice to read over peoples opinions without reading stupid comments/remarks.
    I'm with ya on that one.
    talk about sellouts. They are trying 2 hard to go with the trend. U don't hear them blasting out any classics anymore.

    I don't agree with you on that one at all. Load and the albums after that up to st. anger were not the metallica I started listening to 18 years ago (jaysus) but then I'm not the person I was 18 years ago - thank god for all concerned. You have to put each album in context. And St anger is hardly commercial is it? It's not exactly being played off the radio. If you're younger, you'll probably like the music they made when they were younger, but you know, its all good. If you don't like them, you don't like them, but you can't accuse them of being sellouts. They're not Kiss - yet. And I'll say again, every time I've gone to see them, they've been brilliant. and at the end of the day, thats the main thing.


    tbh


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    Doctor J wrote:
    It was really just hearing Ain't My Bitch for the first time and reading the inlay thinking "What the hell has happened here?" :v:

    That's actualyl hilarious considering what the song is about.

    That stuff doesn't bother me since it's still talented people churning out talentful songs. What would really piss me off would be having to listen to a band churn out the same old stuff every album, ala Megadeth and Maiden.

    I'm not sayign St. Anger was very good but we're atleast guaranteed that the next album will be different.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    Aye, Ain't My Bitch, followed by 2x4, followed by I dunno whatever the Hell is on that cursed album. It just lacked the energy, the fire, the passion of the early stuff, the things which made them so special. All mid-tempo plod rock, bloated and pompous which I still can't bother listening to, not because of who they were and what they became, just because I thing they're really weak songs, honestly. Their legacy keeps me coming back but their recent output drives me away time after time. Seriously, I remember looking out the window of the bus, going through Ranelagh, then going back to the inlay... the band I had loved for 8 years at that point was gone and in their place was this... horrible, horrible thing. I couldn't tell you what the lyrics were about, their take on Sisters Are Doing It For Themselves I gather, I listened to the whole thing through once in total disbelief and then only came back periodically to check to see if it sucked as much as I thought it did :p

    Funnily enough, I did the same with stanger (I didn't bother getting Reload because it was just another serving of ****e), with stanger they had been playing the old stuff exclusively at gigs before it came out and there was much talk of a return to form, etc, so foolishly I took the gamble and bought the cd... and lost :)

    I still go back to it every now and then just to make sure it's as bad as I remember.

    The documentary, I must say, I can watch again and again :D

    As for Megadeth being repetative.... eh maybe Youthanasia and Crytpic Writings were kind of similar but that's about it. Risk was a bag of ****e in an entirely innovative way.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    Ah no, the 'Bitch' in 'Ain't my Bitch' refers not to a woman or anything, but about bitchiness, whineing, moaning etc... from fans about their new 'sirection'.
    Basically saying 'so what. we're doing what we want.'...or some such jazz.

    I know what you mean about Megadeth but when I listen to old school Megadeth, it just sounds (to me) like the same old idea strummed out a few times whereas while old school Metallica was in the same genre, every song had a unique feel to it.
    Ofocurse my opinions aren't fact but that's just how I feel listening to Megadeth, Maidend or your average thrash band.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    All we have is our own opinions :)

    Nah, it's intersting to hear other people's perspectives on this, it's a good thing. This is a good thread. For me, I grew up with the first four albums, coming on board around the time of Garage Days Revisited, Metallica were a huge part of my youth and there's enough in the those albums for me to still think they might just one day get it back. I learned to play bass by playing along to Cliff Em All. The Black album, I suppose I like it, but there are parts which make me cringe (the intro to Don't Tread On Me, the "Seek the wolf within thyself" bit and more) but Load... Jaysus, it slayed me. It's not that I don't like softer music (I'm currently loading some Travis into my ipod :p ) but it's just that... growing up with AJFA and MOP especially... seeing them on the AJFA and Black album tours... I didn't really believe in the music from Load onwards. It didn't ring true for me, though I appreciate my history with them colours my opinion on the new stuff. I have actually tried, really made an effort, to get into Load and Reload but they just leave me cold. The band that I knew back then doesn't really appear to be a part of what has gone on since the mid 90's, if you know what I mean.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,712 ✭✭✭✭Mushy


    Some good points here on both sides of the argument. And without people getting slayed for the opinions.

    Personally, i dont mind the Load or Re-load albums. They arent the worse. If it wasnt for my bro makin me listen to Until It Sleeps, i mightnt like good old rock music. Im lookin forward to the new album. Should be interestin to hear it. If they were to release an album that had the same sound as an old album, id prefer Ride the Lightning. The perfect transition of sound between KEA and MOP. I would love to have been around when they first started comin big. Would have been interestin to hear the progression of sound at the time. not like doin it over an hour or so at home nowadays.

    As for Rob Trujillio recordin himself on the new album, i hope he adds a new dimension to Metallica. And a positive one at that obviously. Lets keep our hopes up anyway, should be interestin to hear. Now for metallica tickets in 8 hours. YAYYYYYY!!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,673 ✭✭✭✭senordingdong


    DoctorJ wrote:
    All we have is our own opinions

    Nah, it's intersting to hear other people's perspectives on this, it's a good thing. This is a good thread. For me, I grew up with the first four albums, coming on board around the time of Garage Days Revisited, Metallica were a huge part of my youth and there's enough in the those albums for me to still think they might just one day get it back. I learned to play bass by playing along to Cliff Em All. The Black album, I suppose I like it, but there are parts which make me cringe (the intro to Don't Tread On Me, the "Seek the wolf within thyself" bit and more) but Load... Jaysus, it slayed me. It's not that I don't like softer music (I'm currently loading some Travis into my ipod ) but it's just that... growing up with AJFA and MOP especially... seeing them on the AJFA and Black album tours... I didn't really believe in the music from Load onwards. It didn't ring true for me, though I appreciate my history with them colours my opinion on the new stuff. I have actually tried, really made an effort, to get into Load and Reload but they just leave me cold. The band that I knew back then doesn't really appear to be a part of what has gone on since the mid 90's, if you know what I mean.

    Yeah, that makes sense.
    I agree that black was a god album and it definatly had alot of cringe worthy moments on it.

    But what I always ask people is, why do we have to compare their albums at all?
    Sure Load etc... is nothing compared to the likes of MOP but as stand alone albums, I still think that each Metallica album is quality and excels at whatever the hell genre each happens to be in.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭Beekay


    Doctor J wrote:
    All we have is our own opinions :)

    Nah, it's intersting to hear other people's perspectives on this, it's a good thing. This is a good thread. For me, I grew up with the first four albums, coming on board around the time of Garage Days Revisited, Metallica were a huge part of my youth and there's enough in the those albums for me to still think they might just one day get it back. I learned to play bass by playing along to Cliff Em All. The Black album, I suppose I like it, but there are parts which make me cringe (the intro to Don't Tread On Me, the "Seek the wolf within thyself" bit and more) but Load... Jaysus, it slayed me. It's not that I don't like softer music (I'm currently loading some Travis into my ipod :p ) but it's just that... growing up with AJFA and MOP especially... seeing them on the AJFA and Black album tours... I didn't really believe in the music from Load onwards. It didn't ring true for me, though I appreciate my history with them colours my opinion on the new stuff. I have actually tried, really made an effort, to get into Load and Reload but they just leave me cold. The band that I knew back then doesn't really appear to be a part of what has gone on since the mid 90's, if you know what I mean.

    The albums maybe bad in your opinion but i still think its better that Metallica keep releasing albums for as long as they can for one reason.And that reason is to keep bringing in new fans who will try out there old stuff.

    For example

    When i started getting into Rock/Metal in 2002/2003.I was only listening to Korn, Deftones, Slipknot even Linkin Park:o :o .Then Metallica released St.Anger.I didn't know much about Metallica at the time,i knew they were big and all that from my older brother but i had never listened to them.

    So when i got this album,i put it on and thought it was great(don't ask me why) and this made me think what there old stuff ws like,so i went out and got Kill 'Em All - The Black Album(they were all only 9.99 :D ) over about a month.

    And since then i have never looked back.i have started listening to lots of other stuff Pantera, Nevermore,Slayer, Opeth, Death etc.And i kind of owe it all to St.anger

    So i will be happy if Metallica release another album if it keeps pulling in new fans to listen to the old stuff


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    But what I always ask people is, why do we have to compare their albums at all?

    I wouldn't compare them at all, you take each one as it comes. Bands change, they evolve, I wouldn't compare early Death compared to the later stuff, or early Black Sabbath vs later Sabbath, to me they're either good or bad on their own. I can dig Eternal Idol in a huge way even though it had little to do with Master Of Reality. Just listening to Load and Reload, be it objectively or subjectively, does nothing for me. I have one of the Jools Holland DVDs with a performance of Hero Of The Day (I think) on it and it's just... meh. Even the Cunning Stunts dvd... me and a mate stood for about 15 minutes when it was on sale in HMV and worked out that there was about 60% "good" tunes on it, so it was worth the €12 they were looking for. I brought it home and even the old stuff is delivered in, to me, a horrible, forced way. It's so choreographed, so overly "Yeah 'tallica is here for you the fans" beating a fist into the chest, "we mean it, maaaaan"... gah I can't bring myself to watch it again. I just don't get it.

    I am interested in hearing what people find good in those albums. I don't get them, but a lot of people do, so let the discussions continue, I say.
    Mushy wrote:
    Some good points here on both sides of the argument. And without people getting slayed for the opinions.

    Indeed. It's time for the slaying to come to an end. It's quite refreshing to engage in disussion for a change :)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭LundiMardi


    Who's actually going to the gig in the RDS, i'm just about to buy tickets.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭LundiMardi


    bought and paid for... €80 each!! although i'm an old fogie at this stage, i like my seats so i does, no standing for me thank you!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭LundiMardi


    Does anyone here actually prefer the late 90's stuff to the early stuff? I personally thing the older stuff sounds so dated and the production, guitar tones, pretty much everything sounds really bad! Where as i love the production in load, the guitar tones are sweet and i do think they pull out some great songs! hero of the day, Bleeding Me, 2X4 etcetera, that's just me i guess though:o


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 487 ✭✭Cungi


    Got my ticket for the Rds gig. can't wait. I've seen them 3 times before
    Back on topic though i actually love Load & Reload (but my fave Metallica song is Dyers Eve) but not impressed with St Anger. 2 ok songs. The rest of it to me sounded like a jam session (cut & pasted) I first heard them back in 93 and i was amazed. The old albums are also great but to me Load & Reload sounded more mature though some might say more commercial but as was pointed out earlier a band can't keep rehashing earlier albums. I'm actually listening to The Rds gig 04 right now. It's available from livemetallica.com. So anyway lets hope the new album isn't like St Anger:D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭Rockee


    LundiMardi wrote:
    Does anyone here actually prefer the late 90's stuff to the early stuff? I personally thing the older stuff sounds so dated and the production, guitar tones, pretty much everything sounds really bad! Where as i love the production in load, the guitar tones are sweet and i do think they pull out some great songs! hero of the day, Bleeding Me, 2X4 etcetera, that's just me i guess though:o

    I dont really 'prefer' the late 90s stuff. My friends just think I sit on the fence when I say I love it all....from Metal Militia to Mama Said. Just something about them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,480 ✭✭✭projectmayhem


    apparently everyone i know is going to the gig. including my girlfriend, who doesn't even like metallica. i guess i'm going then!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,658 ✭✭✭Patricide


    Steoob wrote:
    i think its fake because they sold out... maybe fake was harsh but they are playing their new music to make money IMO
    In all fariness there sven, They didnt intend to sell out, they thought they were getting away from all that driving the album in a heavier direction(which lets face it, it was after load and reload).The songs i think were meant to be short simple heavy and catchy but they just turned out terrible having only 2 IMO half listenable songs on the entire album; sweet amber and the unnamed feeling.By half listenable i mean that i could listen to them in the backround without having to change but they really just are not metallica.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,326 ✭✭✭Zapp Brannigan




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    That is encouraging. Rubin has, after all, produced two of the finest albums of all time, specifically Trouble's self titled album and Masters Of Reality's Blue Garden.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,326 ✭✭✭Zapp Brannigan


    Also BSSM with the Chili's


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