Paul McKenna...

dubadubdub

I was watching Paul McKenna's prog about weight lose on Sky last night and couldn't believe that a TV station was putting out such rubbish.

The audience seemed to made up of about 95% women and it was obvious that these were people with some serious health problems because of their weight but Sky and Mr. P Mc were happy to treat this as an entertainment show, what next a game show for the terminally ill?

Last nights show - apparently tapping your forehead is a good way to stop cravings! - was possibly the exact moment that TV stopped scrapping the bottom of the barrel and started to dig through it.

Rant over. My question is this, did anyone else see it and did it contain some valid health advice that I missed?

Dragan

I've been flicking back and forth to it as it did intrigue me. This **** works the same way hypnosis does when curing smoking. The people touting it simply claim that some people cannot be helped , i.e we failed and won't admit it.

It's all bollox , the next fad for people who lack the honesty to admit the extent of the problem they have and the willpower to do something about it.

joejoem

This show annoys the piss out of me. I tuned in for one bit where he said

"If you dont feel like having breakfast, dont. Just wait until later in the day when you are hungry"

Cue annorexics

Dragan

Actually, i was watching a show about some eating diorders last week and this one girl was living on 100 calories a day.

Now that's crazy ****.

joejoem

Dragan wrote:

Now that's crazy ****.

Thats like a nutrigrain bar right? Give that girl some pompinote (sp, the stuff in the trocaire adds)

Dragan

She would have two small handfuls of dry cornflakes for breakfast, then she would eat some rice cakes before she went to bed.

Another girl was on 200 calories a day, but she couldn't bring herself to eat solid food, so she would just have soup and tea and stuff. The worse thing is that the first girl was in a really bad way, skinny as **** and very sick all the time.

The second girl had really just started to get very bad, and she looked great, she really did, the perfect body for any girl to want and just knowing that she was gonna end up like the first because of a twisted self image was really depressing.

ErinGoBrath

To me it seems like reverse brain washing, albiet very tacky. It's a safe assumption that bad eating habits are a result of method passed to us by our parents and food manufacturers throughout our lives e.g. Parents making you finish all the food on your plate regardless of wheather your hungry or not.

What Paul seems to be doing is letting the public know that it's our natural instinct to eat to stay alive, eat when hungry and eat until your satisfied. No fads or untruths in that is there?

I did catch some of last nights show and the bit where they were tapping different points was ridicilous. I don't believe it has any effect, just makes people think there craving has gone because some high profile TV hypnotist has plugged it. Then again if they people believe it works then it will. Simple as that.

I must say that I was disgusted with the girl addicted to Cola. She was heavily overweight, unemployed and seemed to have emotional issues. After the third day without Cola she broke down into tears. WTF???

Dragan

Anything can be addictive. Thats the way things go. People need a crutch for failures, so they come up with "problems" as to why they cannot do things, instead of just accepting limitations and moving on. People assume that addictions lead to problems, when it's always the other way around.

No one start of heroin, or drinking themselves to death because it's fun. Something kicks them off and then things get worse.

ErinGoBrath

Dragan wrote:

Anything can be addictive. Thats the way things go. People need a crutch for failures, so they come up with "problems" as to why they cannot do things, instead of just accepting limitations and moving on. People assume that addictions lead to problems, when it's always the other way around.

Well said.

Come to think of it, it's very like Allen Carr's method to giving up smoking (which I'm a big fan of).

Transform

I think paul mckenna is one of the best in the business - hypno and NLP.

His methods are brilliant as they teach people how to run their brain more efficiently which is much better than positive attitude BS. Most of the people picked on all types of health make over shows are all from the extreme as you can see the most dramatic changes.

If you have tried other methods and failed then i would recommend reading his book to learn how you can retrain yourself to push your own buttons rather than allowing others (friends, family, advertising etc ) to run your brain for you.

fletch

I saw bits of it too (was flickin between it and the autopsy on C4)....and OMG never heard so much bull**** in all my life...how the **** does tapping some part of your body stop cravins....and did you see the girl they showed who was addicted to coca cola....it was so cheesy!

Transform

tHe tapping is a manual form of acupressure (like accupuncture), google EFT or emotional freedom technique. It uses a lot of positive affirmations and the admission that there is a problem which for most is half the problem.

Siogfinsceal

cola can be addictive i was never over weight but I used to be addicted to it - drank 5 cans a day sooo bad for me. Dont drink it that much at all now I only let myself have it at weekends. anything can be addictive.

This programme just works by motivating people and telling them what they shoul dalready know. The irony is if these people were out doing some excercise instead of sitting on their @rse watching tv they wouldnt be fat in the first place...

padraigcarroll

One thing is for certain, it's not bull****.
It does work, but it doesnt cure or come to deal with the real issues.

Hypnotherapy does reprogram you but its sort of like taking paracetamol, ur attacking the symptoms rather than the sickness.

Eating disorders are related to problems from childhood, counselling is the only thing that can get to the root of it properly.

Some of you seem to think that excercising is the answer to all fat peoples problems, and nothing could be further from the truth. The biggest eating disorder in the world is one of the least talked about, binge eating and most people are guilty of it from time to time.
Erin go brath made a great point re: finishing whats on the plate etc...
The references to Alan Carr are good too as he has taken what Paul McKenna is at to another level, and has realised that the problem relates to happiness.
But again it's not getting at the real problem.
Anyone who reads books on these type of topics should chek out The Hungry Years: Confessions of a Food Addict
by William Leith

This guy gets closer to the real issue of eating disorders/obesity/being fat/being unhappy ..... whatever, than I anyone else I've ever heard speak/seen to write on the issues.

And it really does for the most part go back to your childhood lol!

Blub2k4

I've lost nearly a stone since it started just by doing the 4 golden rules, I had just lost touch with when I was hungry etc and eating to empty the plate. I didn't need the tapping but that is because I dont do emotional eating, I just eat too much per sitting.

It does work. It is not a system it is just putting you back in touch with eating correctly.

Blub2k4

Just thought I'd add, that I have now lost over the stone and it is still going......

Blub2k4

From 15 stone 7lb down to 13 stone 12lb now, in the space of just over two months with no excercise.

This works people the girlfriend is also still losing weight on it.

By the way, the key to it is the first show, all the hypnotherapy stuff afterwards is BS, so effectively you only have to follow the 4 golden rules and that is it, the rest was window dressing to make him a show.

Boru.

Congrats! Keep it up!

DOLEMAN

What are the 4 golden rules???

Blub2k4

Rule #1
Eat when you are hungry.
Rule #2
Eat what you really want to, not what you think you should have.
Rule #3
Eat Consciously, Enjoy each mouthful.
Rule #4
Stop when you think you are full.

I know I'm getting full when my stomach starts to grumble.
I know I'm getting full when the food stops tasting quite so good.
I know I'm getting full when I can't think of anything else I'd like to eat.
I know I'm getting full because I suspect I might be.

The key is rule #3 and the best way to do #3 is put the knife and fork down between each mouthful and make an effort to chew 15-20 times.

Basically I dont stick to the rules as strictly anymore, but what it has done is to retrain me, now I look at food and can tell how much fits and I am much more aware of my stomach becoming full.
If there is more interest I can repost a post I made to another forum which fleshes this out a bit.

Blub2k4

I'm down from a 38 to a 34 inch waist and it's looking like the new 34 jeans I bought wont last much longer either...

turbot

Paul McKenna is excellent, IMO.

Anyone who says his work is bull**** is probably full of such bull**** themselves. The kind of bull**** of jumping to conclusions, of assuming they know better without detailed, case specific experience, while only basing their ideas on their own life experience, without taking into the difference in how other people experience the world.

I know people who have lost weight, successfully using his system.

He has gotten good results based on the premise of helping people become more attuned with what their body indicates it's smart to eat and how, not ignoring their own processes.

This is a long term solution about achieving a smarter relationship with food.

justsomebloke

The problem with this regime is that rather that being an unfit fat person you become an unfit skinnier person. As such I don't see why this is on a fitness thread as it has nothing to do with a person being fit; it only has to deal with a person losing weight. Yes a lot of the threads in this forum are in relation to losing weight and diet however they all also include people exercising and increasing their fitness levels, were as the Paul McKenna regime does nothing to help a person get fitter and get all the benefits that that entails

turbot

The problem with this regime is that rather that being an unfit fat person you become an unfit skinnier person. As such I don't see why this is on a fitness thread as it has nothing to do with a person being fit; it only has to deal with a person losing weight. Yes a lot of the threads in this forum are in relation to losing weight and diet however they all also include people exercising and increasing their fitness levels, were as the Paul McKenna regime does nothing to help a person get fitter and get all the benefits that that entails

Not quite.

The bi-product of tuning into your body is also that you notice how some exercise makes you feel better. The bi-product of eating less and what your body indicates you need is you have more energy.

Both of these catalyse all kinds of conditions that are condusive to more exercise.

The idea of the gym for some of the people who use his system is one of torture. Not only is his approach totally accessible, it is also very compelling, making it easier to stick to, instead of using will power to stop eating anything, it channels this into making body smart decisions.

Doing this right, by itself, will increase overall fitness and pave the way for more exercise. It's a step in the right direction.

Odysseus

I would'nt buy the type of results he claims to achieve on TV. I think what he is using is his onw version of NLP, [correct me if I'm wrong]. Overeating/complusive eating tends to be viewed as an addiction these days. Hence to use an example from addiction treatment it is easy to detox the person, its the follow through for the next few years that it difficult.

Also as far as I'm aware the historical reasons why a person is eating like that are not addressed. If this is the case this intervention simply aims to replace the pathological reasons why a person may be overeating. This is not to say that it won't help anyone at all. However, there are many other proven therapies out there that may help. Additionally, I imagine there is a hugh screening process before a person is taken on as a client for the programme. In other words, those who are likely to succeed.

This is not the ramblings of someone based on personal experience, I am a psychotherapist who was worked in various treatment settings over a ten year period. The bottom line is there is no magical cure for the pain and suffering people encounter in the lives and beware of anyone who offers you one.

turbot

Odysseus,

I would'nt buy the type of results he claims to achieve on TV. I think what he is using is his onw version of NLP, [correct me if I'm wrong]. Overeating/complusive eating tends to be viewed as an addiction these days. Hence to use an example from addiction treatment it is easy to detox the person, its the follow through for the next few years that it difficult. .

Certainly, NLP / DHE / Hypnosis and Personal Change derived techniques are used by Paul, often exquisitely, to help people change. Just because an aspect of human behaviour can be viewed as an addiction or compulsion, doesn't mean it's the only way to view or understand these behaviours. In so far as understanding such behaviours in these or other ways, enables the change facilitator to interact usefully and help his or her client get results, they can be deemed useful systems of understanding.

Yet the universe and every individuals neurology and physical / psycho / spiritual make up and the world they uniquely experience and the aspects of it they inhabit is highly personal.

There are some NLP techniques that used right, are often effective in mitigating such addictions or compulsions, and Paul is certainly skillful enough to use these techniques to get results.

Also as far as I'm aware the historical reasons why a person is eating like that are not addressed. If this is the case this intervention simply aims to replace the pathological reasons why a person may be overeating. This is not to say that it won't help anyone at all. However, there are many other proven therapies out there that may help. Additionally, I imagine there is a hugh screening process before a person is taken on as a client for the programme. In other words, those who are likely to succeed.

A different way of expressing what Paul is doing is an elegant system of understanding, the bi-product of which is he can interact with people in a way that helps them often change easily.

All of your words are based on your ways of understanding and describing these phenomena; such that these ideas exist in your head, and your ideas may or may not accurately represent what is going on with the person Paul is treating.

It may be useful for you to imagine how a screening process works, but if you are simply hallucinating, you should question if this is really useful or instead an imprecise process you use personally. With his stage shows, he certainly finds the most suggestible candidates as part of his induction. Yet, in running seminars it is very hard to filter the attendees except via marketing processes, and he claims a very impressive level of results even with attendees.

While your background / indoctrination may be in Psychotherapy; have you honestly tried these techniques for yourself as they are suggested? Surely this is the best way for you to make high quality judgements about what works?

This is not the ramblings of someone based on personal experience, I am a psychotherapist who was worked in various treatment settings over a ten year period. The bottom line is there is no magical cure for the pain and suffering people encounter in the lives and beware of anyone who offers you one.

Your imprecision in thought is significant here.

Firstly, you are still referencing your personal experiences, albeit you have gathered these working in various treatment centres.

Secondly, it's ridiculous to say that there isn't a cure for the pain and suffering people encounter, and much wiser to say that based upon your life experience, education and present worldview, you personally hold it to be true that no such cure exists, which is not to say it doesn't actually exist, rather, it has not existed in your reality such that you believe in it yet.

Sometimes the simplest cures are the most effective. My understanding of Pauls weight loss system is that it is remarkably simple, and elegantly and usefully directs a persons attention to pay attention to what their body tells them about nutrition. This seems to lead to results in practice that are much better. There is no claim he makes that this will, by itself, lead to a person achieving an optimal state of health, rather, for the stratas of people who turn to his products and shows, his techniques lead to improvements which are worthwhile, and for them, thats often good enough.

Odysseus

Hope I not going off topic, and don't want to get into a long debate, that's too much like work. A point I made is that many things may work, and I did'nt say that I personally viewed eating disorders as an addiction. My own opinion is that the are'nt too many things are viewed as an addiction these days. However, any form of eating disorder is a hughly complex issue, and as such needs to be dealt with accordingly.


You feel that I am basing my thoughts on my personal experience, I thought that I was being quite open, I did not suggest that one type of psychotherapy would work better that others. I have put a decent amount of research into other therapis over the years, and continue to do. I lecture on different treatment modalites.

Yes your right, this may work for some people, I have no problems with that, however, I would ask what type of research on long term results has been achieved.

In relation to the notion of a cure, there is no cure for the pain and suffering we encounter in life, life is hard. Yes, of course we may overcome things that cause us pain, I see it on a daily basis, however, the notion of a cure is quite problematic, what is a cure, is the reduction of symptoms, a better quality of life, a will to face up to lifes difficulties? the list can go on, but no matter what, the will be more pain and suffering, life is like that! At some stage for a lot of people they need to acknowledge that maybe this is as good as it gets.


As regards my opinions being based on my own experience, as above I have studied and research many treatment modalities, so I hate using this but they are based upon a professional study and practice, by this I mean all the people I have have treated, however cannot the same not be said of your own opinion that they are based upon the experience that you have encountered in your life.

metrovelvet

Of course there are no magical cures for things, but there are cures. To say that pain we encouter in life is incurable is just well, what?!!!!!! Why are you even in a healing profession.

A cure, is eliminating the cause of the symptoms.

Everyones body is different as is everyone's relationship/history with food so I cant see the point in even having a debate about what works better or worse. Or even positing one as superior over the other, but pessimism certainly doesnt get anyone anywhere.

Odysseus

I'm not going to reply to this again, as I come here to learn about improving my training, I had doubts about posting on this as I though the discussion would be better dealt with in the psych forum, but I may be wrong and I am new here. In relation to the notion of a cure, one of the most used intereventions in relation to addiction, would strongly say there is no cure, it can be arrested but not cured. Can the trauma a person experienced in life be cured, I think not. However, the person's relationship with it can be changed, the cause of those symptoms cannot be cured.

I would'nt would'nt use the words healing profession myself, but I work in this field, because I get the opportunity to see people turn their lifes around, and that is an amazing thing to see. I did'nt name any one form of treatment as better than others, merely I said I don't agree that form of treatment. Are there not big ethical issues around showing this on tv in the first place. Just my thought's I never claimed to have access to the ultimate truth.

Blub2k4

OK it seems that people need the whole thing fleshed out a bit more to see what the whole thing is about, so I'll post something I posted to another forum on this subject.
==========
Ok here we go.
Fat people are not at fault for being fat, it is an animal response.

As animals when we eat our brains shake out a lot of endorphins to make us happy and continue eating as the animal doesn't know when the next meal is coming from, this is however outdated as a concept as we just buy our next meal in the shop.
In any case what happens as a result of this is that we keep eating past the point of being full.
Basically there is a lag in time between food hitting the stomach and the brain realising it, as a result of this and the happy chemicals we overeat all the time ( if we're overweight that is).
Taking this into account the system has 4 rules, I'll explain them and their significance now. If you stick to these you will lose weight.
A precursor, and it's not really a rule as such but dont drink alcohol while you are eating it confuses the system, you can drink before or after but not while you are eating, we would when we are out but that is a special occasion and we would possibly eat a little more than normal anyway, although the twice we have been in restaurants since we started we have brought about half of it home with us.

4 Golden Rules


1/Eat when you are hungry.
Imagine a scale of 1-10 1 is starving/nauseous and 10 is stuffed/nauseous and in between is a scale with 5-6 being the happy medium. Well you never want yourself to go below three and above 7, stay in the satisfied/not too full zone always. If you get over hungry then you will bolt the food again.

2/ Eat what you really want and not what you thing you should have.
There are no forbidden foods, this sets up a mentality of doing the forbidden and makes things more appealing, eat whatever you want there are no bad foods. You will find you will make up your mind as to what bad food is with time and couldn't face bad food.

3/Eat consciously. Enjoy each mouthful.
This is the key to the whole system, between mouthfuls of food, put your knife and fork down and chew your food, 10-20 chews per mouthful, enjoy how the food changes texture and flavour as you chew it, slow down big time. What is happening is you will enjoy your food more and you will have time to feel your stomach filling. You will find your tastes will change and that bad food wont stand up to the slow chew method, we haven't ordered a pizza since we started this, fatty food doesn't seem to want to pass my lips. Dont bolt your food anymore, you end up eating automatically and you really dont taste anything, put the cutlery down between bites and chew chew chew chew.

4/Stop when you are full.
If you do the rest of it right this will fall into place, honestly it becomes uncomfortable to overeat as you do this. At the beginning always leave something on your plate, stop making the portion the target, make your stomach being full the target, dont worry about finishing it all up, after a while you will get used to eating correct portions and wont be wasting food as you will probably have only half as much on the plate.

Believe me this does work, 9 out of 10 people fail at diets, they dont work, this does.

Do this for a few weeks and you will find you can retrain your stomach and you will become aware of overeating, there is no effort or willpower required if you follow the rules, it is really easy and it wont be long until your present eating habits positively disgust you.


One other thing, dont use a scales for 4 weeks, weigh yourself and then dont get on it for 4 weeks, it's hard enough, but you are not dieting you are changing the way you eat forever.

poobum

Blub2k4 wrote:

Rule #1
Eat when you are hungry.
Rule #2
Eat what you really want to, not what you think you should have.
Rule #3
Eat Consciously, Enjoy each mouthful.
Rule #4
Stop when you think you are full.

I know I'm getting full when my stomach starts to grumble.
I know I'm getting full when the food stops tasting quite so good.
I know I'm getting full when I can't think of anything else I'd like to eat.
I know I'm getting full because I suspect I might be.

The key is rule #3 and the best way to do #3 is put the knife and fork down between each mouthful and make an effort to chew 15-20 times.

Basically I dont stick to the rules as strictly anymore, but what it has done is to retrain me, now I look at food and can tell how much fits and I am much more aware of my stomach becoming full.
If there is more interest I can repost a post I made to another forum which fleshes this out a bit.

these rules are ok i like number 3 the brain takes a few minutes to respond to feeling very full as far as i know i you eat slowely then you will not eat until you are over full!
but here are the facts to lose weight cals in less then cals out! eating less dosent make you more energetic however having a lower weight means you are able to use your energy more efficiantly! (as far as i know)
eating what you want to? this isnt to good! i mean if i ate peanuts(im in love with these) all day then it would take ages to fill me up and before i knew it its be on seriously high cals! this is more a release for peole to allow them some freeway! but iv heard people comlain about this one! its not right in his opinion because it was very abused by him! he ate till he was full but he ate things like cake etc...
eat when you are hungry? isnt it proven that its best to eat every 2-3 hours roughly as a guide to kee your metabolism at its otium and stop it going into "starvation mode" and consuming muscle for energy instead of fat?
these "rules" are more just a guide line! they will work for the very obese but in essence they are only a very basic guide and not very accurate!
i know hes trying to deal with the sychological issues etc...and i can see how this would benefit alot of them but for the rest i feel its not a very good guide!

freddie

Hi Blub2k4

Juts bought Pauls book and am very interested in how you are getting on now? It seems too simple to be through, but at the same time makes perfect sense! Are you down to your ideal weight yet?

thanks
freddie

MrJones

Blub2k4 wrote:

Rule #1
Eat when you are hungry.

and drink when you are dry

petals

Paul McKenna's shows are deadly but do yee think what he says really works. I'd love to meet the man.

Blub2k4

freddie wrote:

Hi Blub2k4

Juts bought Pauls book and am very interested in how you are getting on now? It seems too simple to be through, but at the same time makes perfect sense! Are you down to your ideal weight yet?

thanks
freddie

Hiya Freddie,

I am more or less at the same stand, that is my weight hovers now around the 13 13, but I have to admit not being as strict with the rules anymore.
Thing is though, I have retrained myself and my stomach has shrunk at this point and I just don't see food the same way as before and cannot overeat anywhere near like what I used to.
I may go back to being strict with it shortly as I have been able to download the show and will be watching it shortly again as I think there's a good chance I need a top up on the NLP side of it.

I swear by it, still. It really works and it only needs the 4 rules. It does change the way you eat forever if nothing else by raising your awareness of things you may not have known.

Blub2k4

I think all the naysayers are getting hung up on the theory, well it works in practise, try it if you're overweight, honestly, then come back and say it was no good, then I'll be more inclined to believe you, cos at the moment I believe it works and is working for me and the girlfriend. I think the NLP also had more effect than I thought initially.

foxy06

jsb wrote:

The problem with this regime is that rather that being an unfit fat person you become an unfit skinnier person. As such I don't see why this is on a fitness thread as it has nothing to do with a person being fit; it only has to deal with a person losing weight. Yes a lot of the threads in this forum are in relation to losing weight and diet however they all also include people exercising and increasing their fitness levels, were as the Paul McKenna regime does nothing to help a person get fitter and get all the benefits that that entails

This is exactly why there should be a weight loss forum so people with a weight problem don't have to read negative comments.

g'em

foxy06 wrote:

This is exactly why there should be a weight loss forum so people with a weight problem don't have to read negative comments.

or what you actually mean is people who want to lose weight but don't want to put in the effort/ willpower/ stamina/ self-control/ into eating less and moving more can have a place where they can moan and console eachother?

they're not negative comments. They're poitning out the obvious. If you want to delude yourself, why do you need a forum to do it? that was really quite a ridiculous thing to say tbh.

Seriously- find me one post where one of the regular fitness posters advises something other than reducing calories and exercise for weight loss

foxy06

g'em wrote:

or what you actually mean is people who want to lose weight but don't want to put in the effort/ willpower/ stamina/ self-control/ into eating less and moving more can have a place where they can moan and console eachother?

they're not negative comments. They're poitning out the obvious. If you want to delude yourself, why do you need a forum to do it? that was really quite a ridiculous thing to say tbh.

Seriously- find me one post where one of the regular fitness posters advises something other than reducing calories and exercise for weight loss

We all know how to lose weight and we all know how to keep fit. I was the all ireland tae kwon do champion many years ago and know it takes hard work and perseverence to succeed but the reasons for my weight gain is personal, I know exactly what causes it (overeating and lack of exercise), What I find hard to deal with is the emotional problems that have lead to overeating and I'm sure most overweight people feel the same way. We all know of someone who has been told by a doctor that they have to stop smoking/drinking or it's going to kill them but how many of them actually stop? Not many and that is because they can't not because they just decide not to. So maybe yes a forum where people are trying to deal with the underlying issues of weight gain can "moan and console each other" is a good idea because there is obviously not much support here.

g'em

foxy06 wrote:

So maybe yes a forum where people are trying to deal with the underlying issues of weight gain can "moan and console each other" is a good idea because there is obviously not much support here.

well in that context it's not a weight loss forum at all. It's a support group yes?

That's an entirely different issue altogether in fairness. And it's not that people who have emtional difficulties with weight loss get shot down in the fitness forum, in fact I'll bet any amount of money that a large number of people who have lost weight have been through their fair share of trials and tribulations, but people post questions about weight loss, not about how to deal with their issues. That's why there's a PI forum.

Yes the two are intrinsically linked, but here we offer fitness advice, which is what jsb was doing above. The Paul McKenna program may deal with overeating or compulsive eating (and other behaviours linked to erratic and bad eating) but what he's saying, and I agree with him, is that in order to be healthy along with being the right weight is to exercise. I don't really see too much 'negative' about that tbh.

foxy06

g'em wrote:

well in that context it's not a weight loss forum at all. It's a support group yes?

That's an entirely different issue altogether in fairness. And it's not that people who have emtional difficulties with weight loss get shot down in the fitness forum, in fact I'll bet any amount of money that a large number of people who have lost weight have been through their fair share of trials and tribulations, but people post questions about weight loss, not about how to deal with their issues. That's why there's a PI forum.

Yes the two are intrinsically linked, but here we offer fitness advice, which is what jsb was doing above. The Paul McKenna program may deal with overeating or compulsive eating (and other behaviours linked to erratic and bad eating) but what he's saying, and I agree with him, is that in order to be healthy along with being the right weight is to exercise. I don't really see too much 'negative' about that tbh.

The forum would be a support to people trying to lose weight specifically and jsb said that the post shouldn't have been posted in the fitness forum as it was to do with weight loss so where should these posts be made exactly in your opinion?


"As such I don't see why this is on a fitness thread as it has nothing to do with a person being fit;"

I'm not interested in starting a row but basically if there is nowhere to post a popular topic then a forum should be created for it.

justsomebloke

For all those who are for or against a pure weight loss forum it can be discussed

http://wwww.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054999182

There is no need to have it discussed in this thread when it would be more beneficial to have the discussion in the above thread. and the reason I stated it shouldn't be posted here is that when you separate health from weight loss (which is what you do if you don't include any activity in your weight loss plan) then you are only looking to lose weight purely for aesthics and then the proper place for this thread would of been fashion & appearance

Blub2k4

g'em wrote:

or what you actually mean is people who want to lose weight but don't want to put in the effort/ willpower/ stamina/ self-control/ into eating less and moving more can have a place where they can moan and console eachother?

they're not negative comments. They're poitning out the obvious. If you want to delude yourself, why do you need a forum to do it? that was really quite a ridiculous thing to say tbh.

Seriously- find me one post where one of the regular fitness posters advises something other than reducing calories and exercise for weight loss

Man that's such a ****ty post. Losing weight is about overall fitness, just cos we don't juice and pump iron doesn't mean we aren't concerned about our overall health and fitness. If someone get's a heart attack cos they're overweight is it cos they're fit? This post could be what a beginner to the forum needs to back up a new health/fitness regime. Cop on with the superiority complexes.

Moan and console, couldn't have been much more derogatory there really could ya now?

Dragan

foxy06 wrote:

What I find hard to deal with is the emotional problems that have lead to overeating and I'm sure most overweight people feel the same way.

Hey Foxy,

I think this is exactly the type of reason why we shouldn't have a "weightloss" forum. The issue itself is not weightloss, the issue is whatever is making you eat, the weightloss will simply be a by product of dealing with that. That however is just my opinion.

For me, one of the best things I ever did was start my journal over on my own site, and daveirl has recently sorted our a thread for journals here! I have found the support I get through the journal to be fantastic, so maybe give that a go and see if it helps at all???

g'em

Blub2k4 wrote:

Losing weight is about overall fitness

which is what jsb said, which was deemed negative, which I retorted to, hence my post.

I don't juice, and while I lift weights, I don't fit the image of iron pumping juicer you seem to describe. I take a compleltey holistic approach to health and fitness, seeing nutrition and exercise as being two inseparable components towards achieving a positive health status. I posted quite harshly but it was in the context of the thread.

People come to this forum to seek advice, guidance and tips from other people abotu fitness, health, diet, weights, general health and oodles of other issues. I would like to think that I've been able to help a few people in this regard. So where has all the backlash against the common sense attitude towards getting fit that we've always advocated come from?

Dragan

Blub2k4 wrote:

just cos we don't juice and pump iron doesn't mean we aren't concerned about our overall health and fitness.

I'm just wondering who is juicing?????

t-ha

Dragan wrote:

I'm just wondering who is juicing?????

I am - great way to get some extra fruit into my diet.

Dragan

t-ha wrote:

I am - great way to get some extra fruit into my diet.

Legend!!! Just make sure you peel a kiwi before you juice it. It doesn't taste bad so much as looked really messed up.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

t-ha

Dragan wrote:

Legend!!! Just make sure you peel a kiwi before you juice it. It doesn't taste bad so much as looked really messed up.

I dunno - it looks so gross by the time it's out of the juicer I've never plucked up the courage to eat it yet...