This Government is a disgrace !

netwhizkid

Never in the history of Ireland has such a travesty been tolerated, It is time for Irish men and women to take to the streets and have "a green revolution" this government is sitting idly by and allowing hundreds of Irish ferries sailing jobs to be replaced by cheap outsourced labour, they are destroying the health system of Ireland with Harney's neoliberal pro capitalist agenda only today a report has said that the few hospital beds the government say they have delivered are actually trolley and couches, what next i suppose they will define the chairs in the waiting rooms of A&E as beds.

They are a thundering disgrace and Fianna Fail should bow their heads in shame to even call themselves republicans, They are undoing everything good in this country and if Connolly and larkin were alive today they would shoot the current government as quick as they shot the tans. They are driving this country on a race to the bottom with slave bonded labour and cutting jobs while costs spirals out of control, It is high time that they were replaced with another broad ranging coalition, It happened sometime back in the 1930's i believe. If something isn't done soon the country will descend into Civil War. Fianna Fail and the Pds are quite frankly nothing short of traitors to this country. They have the telecommunications side of this country in a sh*t since they privatised Eircom, Like can you get broadband, bet ya can't like myself. Did you receive a letter lately posted about a month ago, They are destroying all public essential services and only watching to throw them out the vultures of private enterprise. As i speak there is a Hidden Agenda, by the Pds to Privatise, the ESB, CIE, The education system, and increased outsourcing of Civil service jobs.

We as a nation can not allow this government to carry on any longer they will bring to the country to its knees when the housing bubble bursts early next year. Ireland's "boom" is based on Construction and when that goes bye bye Ireland, we will be faced the prospect of Emigrating out while our country is taken over by Slavonic eastern Europeans. We voted no to this and they broke the rules and had another referendum. It is the priority of every man, woman and child of this nation that our forefathers died after an 800yr struggle to liberate. How dare Fianna Fail and the PDs try and privatise the Country.

They have wasted billions of euro on nonsensical spending and as Pat Rabbite said, Deloitte and Touche were delighted and touched. Stand up and be counted and take the battle to them. There is many things that can be done, I myself attended my Local Fianna Fail cum man and rose the roof about privatisation and the other travesties this government has carried out. A topic that was discussed was Waste, The Fianna Fail delegates were proposing getting Private Operators to carry out the essential job of collecting the garbage of my community. I gave them a mouthful and they could only agree with me.

This is the biggest issue Ireland will ever face and unless we as a society do something about it. It is our children and their Children that will ultimately pay the price.

This government must be stopped and speedily replaced.

Privatisation will ruin Ireland. and it will be every man for himself like the lions den of America.

Paragraphs

Stark

Ah it's not worth reading anyway, look who posted it.

The Corinthian

netwhizkid wrote:

Never in the history of Ireland has such a travesty been tolerated, It is time for Irish men and women to take to the streets and have "a green revolution" this government is sitting idly by and allowing hundreds of Irish ferries sailing jobs to be replaced by cheap outsourced labour, they are destroying the health system of Ireland with Harney's neoliberal pro capitalist agenda only today a report has said that the few hospital beds the government say they have delivered are actually trolley and couches, what next i suppose they will define the chairs in the waiting rooms of A&E as beds.

They are a thundering disgrace and Fianna Fail should bow their heads in shame to even call themselves republicans, They are undoing everything good in this country and if Connolly and larkin were alive today they would shoot the current government as quick as they shot the tans. They are driving this country on a race to the bottom with slave bonded labour and cutting jobs while costs spirals out of control, It is high time that they were replaced with another broad ranging coalition, It happened sometime back in the 1930's i believe. If something isn't done soon the country will descend into Civil War. Fianna Fail and the Pds are quite frankly nothing short of traitors to this country. They have the telecommunications side of this country in a sh*t since they privatised Eircom, Like can you get broadband, bet ya can't like myself. Did you receive a letter lately posted about a month ago, They are destroying all public essential services and only watching to throw them out the vultures of private enterprise. As i speak there is a Hidden Agenda, by the Pds to Privatise, the ESB, CIE, The education system, and increased outsourcing of Civil service jobs.

We as a nation can not allow this government to carry on any longer they will bring to the country to its knees when the housing bubble bursts early next year. Ireland's "boom" is based on Construction and when that goes bye bye Ireland, we will be faced the prospect of Emigrating out while our country is taken over by Slavonic eastern Europeans. We voted no to this and they broke the rules and had another referendum. It is the priority of every man, woman and child of this nation that our forefathers died after an 800yr struggle to liberate. How dare Fianna Fail and the PDs try and privatise the Country.

They have wasted billions of euro on nonsensical spending and as Pat Rabbite said, Deloitte and Touche were delighted and touched. Stand up and be counted and take the battle to them. There is many things that can be done, I myself attended my Local Fianna Fail cum man and rose the roof about privatisation and the other travesties this government has carried out. A topic that was discussed was Waste, The Fianna Fail delegates were proposing getting Private Operators to carry out the essential job of collecting the garbage of my community. I gave them a mouthful and they could only agree with me.

This is the biggest issue Ireland will ever face and unless we as a society do something about it. It is our children and their Children that will ultimately pay the price.

This government must be stopped and speedily replaced.

Privatisation will ruin Ireland. and it will be every man for himself like the lions den of America.

Funniest rant ever

Honestly a lot of what you said is just plain retarded. No civil war is forthcoming, the Celtic Tiger was not based on construction, the country is not about to be taken over east europeans etc.

What exactly about privatised garbage collection would have Connolly rolling in his grave?

Zombrex

netwhizkid wrote:

Never in the history of Ireland has such a travesty been tolerated, It is time for Irish men and women to take to the streets and have "a green revolution" this government is sitting idly by and allowing hundreds of Irish ferries sailing jobs to be replaced by cheap outsourced labour, they are destroying the health system of Ireland with Harney's neoliberal pro capitalist agenda only today a report has said that the few hospital beds the government say they have delivered are actually trolley and couches, what next i suppose they will define the chairs in the waiting rooms of A&E as beds.

They are a thundering disgrace and Fianna Fail should bow their heads in shame to even call themselves republicans, They are undoing everything good in this country and if Connolly and larkin were alive today they would shoot the current government as quick as they shot the tans. They are driving this country on a race to the bottom with slave bonded labour and cutting jobs while costs spirals out of control, It is high time that they were replaced with another broad ranging coalition, It happened sometime back in the 1930's i believe. If something isn't done soon the country will descend into Civil War. Fianna Fail and the Pds are quite frankly nothing short of traitors to this country. They have the telecommunications side of this country in a sh*t since they privatised Eircom, Like can you get broadband, bet ya can't like myself. Did you receive a letter lately posted about a month ago, They are destroying all public essential services and only watching to throw them out the vultures of private enterprise. As i speak there is a Hidden Agenda, by the Pds to Privatise, the ESB, CIE, The education system, and increased outsourcing of Civil service jobs.

We as a nation can not allow this government to carry on any longer they will bring to the country to its knees when the housing bubble bursts early next year. Ireland's "boom" is based on Construction and when that goes bye bye Ireland, we will be faced the prospect of Emigrating out while our country is taken over by Slavonic eastern Europeans. We voted no to this and they broke the rules and had another referendum. It is the priority of every man, woman and child of this nation that our forefathers died after an 800yr struggle to liberate. How dare Fianna Fail and the PDs try and privatise the Country.

They have wasted billions of euro on nonsensical spending and as Pat Rabbite said, Deloitte and Touche were delighted and touched. Stand up and be counted and take the battle to them. There is many things that can be done, I myself attended my Local Fianna Fail cum man and rose the roof about privatisation and the other travesties this government has carried out. A topic that was discussed was Waste, The Fianna Fail delegates were proposing getting Private Operators to carry out the essential job of collecting the garbage of my community. I gave them a mouthful and they could only agree with me.

This is the biggest issue Ireland will ever face and unless we as a society do something about it. It is our children and their Children that will ultimately pay the price.

This government must be stopped and speedily replaced.

Privatisation will ruin Ireland. and it will be every man for himself like the lions den of America.

Don't blame me, I voted for Kronos

mike65

but there's simply no point now!

Mike.

BuffyBot

This government must be stopped and speedily replaced.

Hmmm...ruled by the existing government or people like your good self.

Sad to say, I'd pick this government..

Airblazer

only problem is that the crowd you replace them with would be even worse...the day SF get into power is the day I emigrate..can agree with the above rant..all politicians all think that they're above the law and that they know best..they'l ignore all the experts advice etc and in the end make a complete f>ckup..eg. Port tunnel..now this is where the politician that decided this should have his head slapped again the roof till either he dies or the roof goes up a few inches.
I'm beginning to think that this democracy crap is never going to work..95% of people are just too corrupt or would be easily coerced into having the easy life instead of helping their fellow man..

so roll on the Revolution

Kazujo

Do you seriously think privatising CIE is a bad thing?? How many times has your Bus been on time in the last year?

Nuttzz

This place is such a kip, thats why tens of thousands of eastern europeans have come here to live, college graduates dont have to leave their conferrings and get straight back to their jobs abroad, interest rates are so low, unemployment is practically unheard of, inflation and national debt are at all time lows.....yes this place is a disgrace.....

Stark

Kazujo wrote:

Do you seriously think privatising CIE is a bad thing?? How many times has your Bus been on time in the last year?

The problem with privatisation is that a private company would likely only service the more profitable routes. I think stricter regulation is needed and also CIE needs those new buses that the government promises. Also GPS should be installed so people can keep track of where buses are actually going.

I'd also love to know what goes on with most "out of service" buses. I've seen a lot of buses switch to "out of service" on their way to the city centre when they're actually taking the usual route and could easily have taken passengers along the way.

Timetables also need to be updated. Many of the timetables that are printed on shelters and dublinbus.ie are out of date.

Gurgle

OK, Despite being a raving left wing bleeding heart liberal(TM) and as anti-Fianna Fail as anyone else, I'll try to anser some of your points:

netwhizkid wrote:

this government is sitting idly by and allowing hundreds of Irish ferries sailing jobs to be replaced by cheap outsourced labour

This government can do sfa about it.Minimum wage does not apply to working at sea. If it was to be applied, its no skin off Irish Ferries' noses to go register the boat in Kuala-Lumpor and pay their taxes there .
The answer to that is for us, the customers, to not use Irish Ferries.
At All.
They will sink into bankruptcy within a year, and the lesson will be learned by anyone thinking similar thoughts.

netwhizkid wrote:

they are destroying the health system of Ireland with Harney's neoliberal pro capitalist agenda only today a report has said that the few hospital beds the government say they have delivered are actually trolley and couches, what next i suppose they will define the chairs in the waiting rooms of A&E as beds.

More private clinics & hospitals -> more public beds available for those who don't have health insurance. About ****ing time!

netwhizkid wrote:

They are a thundering disgrace and blah blah blah.

:rolleyes:

netwhizkid wrote:

They have the telecommunications side of this country in a sh*t since they privatised Eircom, Like can you get broadband, bet ya can't like myself.

Can, have, very reliable. Nowhere near as fast & cheap as in european countries with population centres in the tens of millions but not bad for a geographically distributed city-state population like ourselves.
Would'nt have anything if they didnt finally privatise the great white elephant of Eircom and let it totter along at massive costs and no attempt at efficiency for another couple of decade

netwhizkid wrote:

Did you receive a letter lately posted about a month ago, They are destroying all public essential services and only watching to throw them out the vultures of private enterprise. As i speak there is a Hidden Agenda, by the Pds to Privatise, the ESB, CIE, The education system, and increased outsourcing of Civil service jobs.

With the exception of the ESB, the public sector / civil service in Ireland doesn't work as is. For every 1 civil servant who works hard all day, theres 10 who whinge about benchmarking and sit around doing nothing all day. Lets see how they get on when their pay raises depend on performance rather than seniority.

netwhizkid wrote:

when the housing bubble bursts early next year.

€10 says it doesnt happen

netwhizkid wrote:

Ireland's "boom" is based on Construction

No, the construction boom is based on the country's economic performance.

netwhizkid wrote:

we will be faced the prospect of Emigrating out while our country is taken over by Slavonic eastern Europeans.

Hey, lets round them up into gas chambers, that hasn't been done in a while.

netwhizkid wrote:

The Fianna Fail delegates were proposing getting Private Operators to carry out the essential job of collecting the garbage of my community. I gave them a mouthful and they could only agree with me.

Privatisation isnt the problem with rubbish collection, its awarding monopolies to private companies. Give any company a monopoly, they're going to exploit it. It should have been opened up to competition nationwide.
(Of course we shouldn't be paying waste collection at all, but the corrupt lying scumbags in government give all our taxes to incompetant consultants.)

Bloodychancer

Stark wrote:

I'd also love to know what goes on with most "out of service" buses. I've seen a lot of buses switch to "out of service" on their way to the city centre when they're actually taking the usual route and could easily have taken passengers along the way.

Its off topic here but if you post the question in Commuting and transport I would be glad to answer it .

stevenmu

Lots of people seem to be criticising the governments handling of the whole Irish Ferries situation, but I'd like to know what these people think the government should be doing ? It's a private company free to hire and fire who it likes, and if I'm not mistaken they're not even technically an Irish company. The government can't just march in and start giving them orders, any more than they can march into your house and tell you what to eat for dinner. I remember hearing something about the Soviet Union collapsing, I must have missed the part about it reforming here in sunny old Ireland afterwards :rolleyes: .

To me the real travesty here is that port workers are going to blockade ports preventing ships from docking, and denying Irish citizens entry to their own country.

Personally if I was in power, I'd have the people who have taken over the ships in Wales arrested under international piracy laws, and I would use tear gas on anyone trying to blockade an Irish port. People have a right to protest sure, but not at the expense of other peoples freedom of movement and ownership of property rights.

netwhizkid

stevenmu wrote:

Lots of people seem to be criticising the governments handling of the whole Irish Ferries situation, but I'd like to know what these people think the government should be doing ? It's a private company free to hire and fire who it likes, and if I'm not mistaken they're not even technically an Irish company. The government can't just march in and start giving them orders, any more than they can march into your house and tell you what to eat for dinner. I remember hearing something about the Soviet Union collapsing, I must have missed the part about it reforming here in sunny old Ireland afterwards :rolleyes: .

To me the real travesty here is that port workers are going to blockade ports preventing ships from docking, and denying Irish citizens entry to their own country.

Would you feel this way if your own employer (presuming you have one) decided to give you your marching orders only to be replaced by €3.60 an hour bonded labour. If Irish Ferries are not prepared to act in a decent way like the people of the country they are serving they should get out as they have no right here then.

Personally if I was in power, I'd have the people who have taken over the ships in Wales arrested under international piracy laws, and I would use tear gas on anyone trying to blockade an Irish port. People have a right to protest sure, but not at the expense of other peoples freedom of movement and ownership of property rights.

Nobody is blockading an Irish port although imo they should be, Pirates rob ship as was recently demonstrated off the shores of Somalia. Nobodies movement is being curtailed, it is not as if the Unions will be isolating Ireland, Have you heard of the Aeroplane? It was invented 102 years ago by the Wright bros.

Ownership of property rights?
Did somebody thing try to take your property recently? I never heard of any property rights being taken away by the disenfranchised Ferry workers who would be replaced by bonded labour. Like the Eastern Europeans are as much victims in this as are the Irish. Quite basically if you can't argue properly don't bother.

The fact is good paying jobs would be cut for what? Capitalist Greed, How could anyone justify this, and if the government will have the balls to stand up to Irish Ferries and take them on, they are the rulers of Ireland, Not capitalist greed. If Irish Ferries are not happy with operating in Ireland, they can go to India or some other place where hundreds regularly drown on overcrowded ships as it is in these sort of conditions Irish Ferries would like to have here. I was thinking of actually buying a car from England soon, thank goodness for Cork-Swansea, because I’d drive a donkey cart before supporting these tramps at Irish Ferries, (the management, not the innocent workers involved)

mikemac

netwhizkid wrote:

if Connolly and larkin were alive today they would shoot the current government as quick as they shot the tans.

Connolly and Larkin never fought in the war of independance. Connolly was executed in 1916.

netwhizkid wrote:

It is high time that they were replaced with another broad ranging coalition, It happened sometime back in the 1930's i believe.

Wrong again. The coalition government was in power from 1948-1951

J.R.HARTLEY

netwhizkid wrote:

Would you feel this way if your own employer (presuming you have one) decided to give you your marching orders only to be replaced by €3.60 an hour bonded labour. If Irish Ferries are not prepared to act in a decent way like the people of the country they are serving they should get out as they have no right here then.

netwhizzkid i think irish ferries are actually only irish in name, they are registered in either bahamas or bermuda. there's nothing the government can do as it's subject to their labour laws not ours

lucernarian

Originally posted by netwhizkid,
Originally Posted by netwhizkid
if connolly and larkin were alive today they would shoot the current government as quick as they shot the tans.

I understood larkin was the founder of the Irish trade union movement. I never heard anything about him shooting 'Tans, or Connolly for that matter.

You do have some fair points but that doesn't mean that the government is a disgrace. What happened to them would've happened to anyone in their position IMO. They have been in office for 8 and a half years with Michael Noonan and Enda Kenny as leaders of Opposition. They became complacent. They have never faced serious crises likes in the Haughey era.

Most importantly though, all of my immediate relatives of working age have a job. 4% unemployment was partially created by FF/PDs.

Bloodychancer

stevenmu wrote:

Lots of people seem to be criticising the governments handling of the whole Irish Ferries situation, but I'd like to know what these people think the government should be doing ? It's a private company free to hire and fire who it likes, and if I'm not mistaken they're not even technically an Irish company. The government can't just march in and start giving them orders, any more than they can march into your house and tell you what to eat for dinner. I remember hearing something about the Soviet Union collapsing, I must have missed the part about it reforming here in sunny old Ireland afterwards :rolleyes: .

To me the real travesty here is that port workers are going to blockade ports preventing ships from docking, and denying Irish citizens entry to their own country.

Personally if I was in power, I'd have the people who have taken over the ships in Wales arrested under international piracy laws, and I would use tear gas on anyone trying to blockade an Irish port. People have a right to protest sure, but not at the expense of other peoples freedom of movement and ownership of property rights.

Well they could introduce a law similar to the one in Scotland that insists that any company operating a ship on a regular route between a Scottish port and any other EU port must observe either Scottish Labour Law or the law of the other EU country.

If they are non EU ships I don't see any reason why we have to let them into Irish ports at all let them go and ply their trade in the Bahamas

Stark

Don't the Irish Ferries employees get free food and board?

netwhizkid

Stark wrote:

Don't the Irish Ferries employees get free food and board?

Oh Christ their loaded*, How anyone could actually condone what irish Ferries are doing is quite simply baffeling.
*Sarcasm

Cronus333

wow. you mix communism and fascism. well done!!! I didn't even think that was possible but there you go!!!

Karl Hungus

I was having a good read of this thread up untill this point:

Gurgle wrote:

Hey, lets round them up into gas chambers, that hasn't been done in a while.

:rolleyes:

I really am sick and tired of this kind of BS. As soon as someone has an issue with immigration, it instantly comes down to Nazis. Doesn't matter what kind of point is being made, it's always the same insinuations of fascism. Debate the issue? Why bother when you can just play the Nazi Card! :v:

The Corinthian

Cronus333 wrote:

wow. you mix communism and fascism. well done!!! I didn't even think that was possible but there you go!!!

You’ve not read enough on the subject obviously.

Freelancer

netwhizkid wrote:

Oh Christ their loaded*, How anyone could actually condone what irish Ferries are doing is quite simply baffeling.
*Sarcasm

By way of supporting Netwizkid, how many 15yo, know who stimpy is? Thats jus about the only thing in his argument thats worth merit.

dRNk SAnTA

My 2 cents:
according to irish ferries, their competitors have driven down their labour costs by hiring these foreign workers. If this situation continues then inevitably if changes aren't made the company will be in trouble, the irish workers will end up losing their jobs anyway and probably end up with a **** redundancy package.

someone suggested bringing in a law they have in scotland which insists on minimum wage standards. this could work, i dont know. but it would keep the cost importing/exporting goods artificially high in ireland. as a hugely trade dependent economy thats not a hot idea as it would further damage our cost competitiveness.

also, I don't accept your criticism of mary harney. the health service was a shambles well before she bravely took on the challenge of fixing it. She hasn't been in the post long and expecting immediate results is crazy. i'm not defending the government, i just don't think its right to criticise her in this instance.

Gurgle

Karl Hungus wrote:

I really am sick and tired of this kind of BS. As soon as someone has an issue with immigration, it instantly comes down to Nazis. Doesn't matter what kind of point is being made, it's always the same insinuations of fascism. Debate the issue? Why bother when you can just play the Nazi Card! :v:

Please give a rational, economic, plausible and non-xenophobic explanation for this comment from netwhizkid:

netwhizkid wrote:

we will be faced the prospect of Emigrating out while our country is taken over by Slavonic eastern Europeans.

netwhizkid

Gurgle wrote:

Please give a rational, economic, plausible and non-xenophobic explanation for this comment from netwhizkid:

Basically my comment is that Irish people may be forced to Emigrate from Ireland to say somewhere like America if the continuing amounts of Eastern Europeans are allowed to come here, They will work for peanuts, while Irish people would only laugh at such wages. As these people become more prevalent here, Wages will drop and we may have no option only to Emigrate to find high-paying easy jobs. By referring to Slavonic i meant as in the general Eastern European types because for i say Polish (they are the biggest minority of the eastern Europeans here) Basically if they will work some similar wages to ourselves and become unionised and throw off the shackles of letting themselves be exploited then grand, but having them undercutting our jobs is good for no-one.

The Corinthian

netwhizkid wrote:

we may have no option only to Emigrate to find high-paying easy jobs.

Priceless. You can't make up naivety like that. :rolleyes:

Stark

Ireland has a minimum working wage. Pretty much every unskilled job in Ireland is minimum wage. For higher paying jobs, competition for those jobs is usually based on skill and merit, not on who can undercut whom.

The Corinthian

Stark wrote:

Ireland has a minimum working wage. Pretty much every unskilled job in Ireland is minimum wage. For higher paying jobs, competition for those jobs is usually based on skill and merit, not on who can undercut whom.

Not entirely true. Labour supply / demand come into play even then to decreasing levels the more skilled (and hence rarified) the role. Indeed, sometimes the most qualified person will not get the job because the company in question may prefer to take on a less qualified but considerably less expensive alternative.

Gurgle

netwhizkid wrote:

They will work for peanuts

minimum wage

netwhizkid wrote:

while Irish people would only laugh at such wages.

Yes, many prefer to sit at home claiming the dole instead of working at all.

netwhizkid wrote:

we may have no option only to Emigrate to find high-paying easy jobs.

Theres just no answer to that comment!

netwhizkid wrote:

By referring to Slavonic i meant as in the general Eastern European types because for i say Polish (they are the biggest minority of the eastern Europeans here)

I don't care who you mean tbh.

netwhizkid wrote:

Basically if they will work some similar wages to ourselves and become unionised and throw off the shackles of letting themselves be exploited then grand, but having them undercutting our jobs is good for no-one.

Exploitation of foreigners in Ireland is very much the exception, not the rule. The vast majority work hard and get paid well. Where I work has about 30% foreigners, african, east european and asian, and yes they're in the union and paid on the same scale as everyone else.

The reason they're coming here at all is that there's more jobs to fill than people to fill them. Yes, there are unemployed Irish people here - they're the ones who refuse to do the jobs available or who are just un-employable.

wiseones2cents

It is not only happening In Ireland. It is Happening in all the Capitalist nations.
They outsource jobs. Which equates to bigger profit margins for the importers and less jobs for the country. Just watch poverty start to grow in your country rapidly as it has In America.

America is the leader in all this and America will be the first to fall. I'd give a few more years and you will see the American Economy Collapse. And all economies that are tied to it come crumbling down also.

Privatization is really bad because it slowly weakens the Government and puts the power in the hands of Big corporations that are not elected by the people and have no concern for the public.

I watched my country go Privatized and watched it slowly sinking into the ground. Now big business controls governemnt. Not the other way around.

When you start to feel the effects of these things and your economy heads south?Be sure your country will become unstable.

netwhizkid

wiseones2cents wrote:

It is not only happening In Ireland. It is Happening in all the Capitalist nations.
They outsource jobs. Which equates to bigger profit margins for the importers and less jobs for the country. Just watch poverty start to grow in your country rapidly as it has In America.

America is the leader in all this and America will be the first to fall. I'd give a few more years and you will see the American Economy Collapse. And all economies that are tied to it come crumbling down also.

Privatization is really bad because it slowly weakens the Government and puts the power in the hands of Big corporations that are not elected by the people and have no concern for the public.

I watched my country go Privatized and watched it slowly sinking into the ground. Now big business controls governemnt. Not the other way around.

When you start to feel the effects of these things and your economy heads south?Be sure your country will become unstable.

What country are you from wiseones2cents, because the way you are speaking i am guessing either the US, UK or Japan. Correct me if i'm wrong. Communism was an unfair system but some government control is needed over all private enterprise.

wiseones2cents

netwhizkid wrote:

What country are you from wiseones2cents, because the way you are speaking i am guessing either the US, UK or Japan. Correct me if i'm wrong. Communism was an unfair system but some government control is needed over all private enterprise.

I am from Canada. And as soon as Free trade was introduced. The Americans have come in and are taking over. The cost of Living is sky rocketing at an alarming rate. These US corporations with big money come and bribe our leaders and sell off our country piece by piece. After all, the politicians are only in power temporarily.They make their money and leave.

Communism is forced socialism.When Socialism was dreamed up. It was to be the best System. They thought that the Capitalist would eventually go out of business. Little did they know the Capitalists were willing to kill to hold on to their power. That is when Marx I believe took socialism a step further and began to force it in retaliation to the Capitalists. this was the beginning of Communism.

But Socialism in its origional form is the best for the country. It does not allow greed to flourish as it does in Capitalist societies.

Every time I see a Netwhizkid post, I think of the great things Kerry has done. From voting against the Treaty right up to McEllistrim and Ferris dumping Dick Sping on his ass in the 2002 GE. What a county NWK. Look around you and be proud of all we've done. Never mind that Irish Ferries dispute thing, sure that's for the East Coast to worry about. Take a trip out on the Dick Spring train, go past the Dick Spring windmill, and see where the Jeannie Johnston was put together for a reminder of how bad things really were with Irish shipping...

stevenmu

netwhizkid wrote:

Would you feel this way if your own employer (presuming you have one) decided to give you your marching orders only to be replaced by €3.60 an hour bonded labour. If Irish Ferries are not prepared to act in a decent way like the people of the country they are serving they should get out as they have no right here then.

If it happened to me I wouldn't feel happy at all, altough the redundancy package would cheer me up somewhat, as would the fact that thanks to the FF/PD coalition there's a job for everyone who wants one.

netwhizkid wrote:

Nobody is blockading an Irish port although imo they should be, Pirates rob ship as was recently demonstrated off the shores of Somalia.

Protesters have (or had earlier it may have been resolved by now) control of the engine rooms of two Irish Ferries ships docked in Wales, the engine room controls the ship, taking control of someone elses ship is piracy plain and simple.

netwhizkid wrote:

Nobodies movement is being curtailed, it is not as if the Unions will be isolating Ireland, Have you heard of the Aeroplane? It was invented 102 years ago by the Wright bros.

From todays Indo

Passengers on the MV Normandy, travelling from Cherbourg in France, had their travel plans severely disrupted when the ship was locked out of Rosslare Port after Siptu workers refused to let it berth

But late last night the vessel docked in Dublin Port.

SIPTU allowed the docking as there were a number of children among the passengers.

netwhizkid wrote:

Ownership of property rights?

Yes, the Irish Ferries ships belong to Irish Ferries, if they want former employees to leave the ship, or new employees to board it then surely they have the right to do so without having to deploy security teams to make it happen.

netwhizkid wrote:

The fact is good paying jobs would be cut for what? Capitalist Greed,

The fact is that those jobs only existed becuase of capitalist greed in the first place, and thanks to capitalist greed there's plenty of other jobs for them to go to.

wiseones2cents

The fact is that those jobs only existed becuase of capitalist greed in the first place, and thanks to capitalist greed there's plenty of other jobs for them to go to.

I dont know whats going on over there but over here capitalism has caused more jobs but less pay, tripled the cost of living and caused an unstable economy. If and When trade slows down,millions of people will lose jobs.

lazydaisy

Netwhizkid, you're spirit is admirable but sometimes you make no sense. But you are right. Ireland will see a new emigration. The young professionals will all leave to go to big bad Britain or big bad America.

If you're anti-capitalist why would you want to leave for a high paying job? Doesnt that violate your ideologies. Dont you want a low paying job where you have to give 50%-80% of your wages to the governement, a government you probably didnt vote for, so they can redistribute it on housing and benefits for the same immigrants you want kicked out of the country and cant get employment because they are in socialist state where the class system is fixed? Wouldn't that be just how you like it?

Or wouldnt it be better for you if you stayed in Ireland, where its this weird mixture of capitalism, socialism, feudalism and theocracy? {Oh, yes as long as they kicked out all the foreigners!}

fly_agaric

dRNk SAnTA wrote:

My 2 cents:
according to irish ferries, their competitors have driven down their labour costs by hiring these foreign workers. If this situation continues then inevitably if changes aren't made the company will be in trouble, the irish workers will end up losing their jobs anyway and probably end up with a **** redundancy package.

There was an article in the Irish Times a few days ago which said their main competition (Stena) has mostly Irish/Brits manning its boats. It also said that the profits they make on these routes are poor.
Somebody is spraying bullshít about this. Imo, "Irish":rolleyes: Ferries are looking for inspiration from their real competition in the sky. Slash costs to the bone.

netwhizkid

lazydaisy wrote:

Netwhizkid, you're spirit is admirable but sometimes you make no sense. But you are right. Ireland will see a new emigration. The young professionals will all leave to go to big bad Britain or big bad America.

If you're anti-capitalist why would you want to leave for a high paying job? Doesnt that violate your ideologies. Dont you want a low paying job where you have to give 50%-80% of your wages to the governement, a government you probably didnt vote for, so they can redistribute it on housing and benefits for the same immigrants you want kicked out of the country and cant get employment because they are in socialist state where the class system is fixed? Wouldn't that be just how you like it?

Or wouldnt it be better for you if you stayed in Ireland, where its this weird mixture of capitalism, socialism, feudalism and theocracy? {Oh, yes as long as they kicked out all the foreigners!}

I am an Anti-capitalist and only today got literature about joining the Irish Socialist party, I won't be drawn into the dog eat dog world of capitalism, I shall draw full dole and inherit the farm and suck down about €100,000 a year subsidies and to hell with Capitalism, Forestry and Full decoupling plus welfare equals the easy life for me I won't have to do much work allowing me to concentrate on my goal of delivering a united democratic Socialist Ireland run by the people for the people. If i were in politics i would stop foreign companies from taking massive profits from the country and Nationalise all major Industries and Financial services and actually deliver a decent standard of living for people. Most people don't know that the majority of the worlds wealth is in the hand of a few and most of these are based in the USA. A socialist world will become a reality because Capitalism will cripple itself by sacking all the workers, No workers = no consumers = no business = no money for greedy capitalists :eek: Capitalism will ruin itself anyway, More wars over finite resources will be fought and billions will die but capitalism itself will die choking on the mess it has created in the first place.

therecklessone

netwhizkid wrote:

I am an Anti-capitalist and only today got literature about joining the Irish Socialist party, I won't be drawn into the dog eat dog world of capitalism, I shall draw full dole and inherit the farm and suck down about €100,000 a year subsidies and to hell with Capitalism, Forestry and Full decoupling plus welfare equals the easy life for me

So you'll leech off other workers to have the easy life? Workers of the world unite...:rolleyes:

netwhizkid

I leech off the corrupt capitalist system, I will take delight at knowing that some of that money will come from multi-nationals profits. BTw this is my plan at the moment i am currently looking for a job and i hope to implement this plan in my later years. say 50+ I'm 18now btw i hope i will lived through the downfall of capitalism by then.

ronbyrne2005

workers wont flood to ireland to work for peanuts, the cost of living/housing prevents them staying here unless they get a fair wage,there are some being exploited but few if any working for less than min wage as it would be unsustainable to do so in a high cost economy.

wiseones2cents

netwhizkid wrote:

I leech off the corrupt capitalist system, I will take delight at knowing that some of that money will come from multi-nationals profits. BTw this is my plan at the moment i am currently looking for a job and i hope to implement this plan in my later years. say 50+ I'm 18now btw i hope i will lived through the downfall of capitalism by then.

WOW. I must say. I am Quite Impressed with your knowledge of economics
netwhizkid. And only 18? Someone has been teaching you well.

You will most certainly live through the downfall of Capitalism. It is just around the corner. Like I said before, Capitalist are willing to kill to hold on to their wealth. Thats what this war is about. But America and friends have made one to many enemies and have stretched their resources to the brink.
Their going down.

ronbyrne2005

i agree the economy is overly dependent on construction,damian kibaerd has talked about this in sunday times, a quite high % of gdp jobs etc.government gets 100k intaxes for every new house.
but if the economy hit a bad patch the migrants would move on to other parts of europe where the economy was doing well,they are footloose and have no attachment to ireland other than economic ones.

wiseones2cents

ronbyrne2005 wrote:

workers wont flood to ireland to work for peanuts, the cost of living/housing prevents them staying here unless they get a fair wage,there are some being exploited but few if any working for less than min wage as it would be unsustainable to do so in a high cost economy.

Wait until the competition sets in because of the outsourcing. Be preparred to wait in the unemployment lines.

ronbyrne2005

your talking cr4p unwise2cents

netwhizkid

wiseones2cents wrote:

Wait until the competition sets in because of the outsourcing. Be preparred to wait in the unemployment lines.

I'm afraid the people may be living in those lines wiseones2cents, In case you didn't know already with you being from Canada, Most people here have humongus mortgages, at least €250K + and how will they make repayments on €3.50 an hour, I can see houses being sold in droves by the banks in time to come as the repo-depot guys make their money.

ronbyrne2005

netwhizkid wrote:

I'm afraid the people may be living in those lines wiseones2cents, In case you didn't know already with you being from Canada, Most people here have humongus mortgages, at least €250K + and how will they make repayments on €3.50 an hour, I can see houses being sold in droves by the banks in time to come as the repo-depot guys make their money.

3.50 per hour? min wage legislation stops this.
if the wages got so low the immigrants wouldnt come here!and thise here would leave, irish employers would employ irish people rather than migrants if there was a slowdown in economy