Battlestar Galactica, episode 6: "Litmus"

Fenster

The preempters have been officially preempted.

*dance*

Nukem

Dude seek help! Only messing congrads on beating C0y0yte this wk :rolleyes:

c0y0te

LMFAO

Wow - who'd of thunk you took this stuff so personally? Let's hope its a decent episode. Monday nights are gonna be tough when this season is finally over :eek:

c0y0te

Stark

Pity this isn't a public poll, we could see the twats who rated the episode before they even saw it.

c0y0te

Well spotted Stark - I figured most of the posters here (to date anyway) were decent enough, so I'm surprised to find a couple of votes already in. Still - no accounting for the odd bit of muppetry is there?

c0y0te

Nukem

What the f*ck!!!!
Well spotted stark.What dumbass's put that up already.
Its exclusive to sky one aint it,or did someone buy d dvd and is just doing the mickey on it

Fenster

I'll do a public one next week. :mad:

ixoy

Praetorian - As the mod, you can edit the poll. Can you reduce 1 from both the Amazing and OK options as there's no way they're a valid opinion on an episode that noone has seeen.

Fenster

Good episode, it was only going to get an "okay" until the last ten minutes, the last few scenes were really well acted. Caprica is still going nowhere though, and the scenes would really have worked better if it was actually shot at night.

Anyone else notice that the "odd-numbered rule" seems to apply to Galactica, except in this case the odd-numbered ones are the better episodes.

Stark

Okay just seen it (for real ) and voted "Great". Some cocky bits that mean it didn't deserve "amazing", so no coming back and saying it was amazing coyote and Fenster But some choice bits. The witchhunt thing in itself was totally cringeworthy and a complete rip-off of the witchhunt episode from Star Trek TNG to name one source. What redeemed it somewhat though was the aftermath. Star Trek TNG had a happy ending for their episode. It looked like BSG was following the same route and when the guard on duty sided with Adama I very nearly vomited. But seeing Adama acting like a power-crazed lunatic himself turned the situation around.

Some gritty moments including the severely burnt soldier and the start and Boomer being beaten up by Six in an extremely well shot scene. The Caprica plot is emerging very slowly as usual, but at least we now know the Cylons want him kept on the planet for some reason. Maybe they want to create a new Cylon model, they don't have any really attractive male models unlike the females and the girls did comment on how attractive Karl was (I agree ).

Chief and Boomer have now broken up, which is a pity but it does go to show how mad Adama became after the tribunal that he couldn't simply let their relationship slide.

We didn't get to see enough of Baltar AGAIN which is a balls. But Six did get to blow her panties.

Fenster wrote:

and the scenes would really have worked better if it was actually shot at night.

I disagree, the Caprica scenes are very well shot in true "28 days later" style and seem to work well day or night.

GuanYin

It seems to be a bit of a ripoff of an old ST:TNG episode called The Drumhead. Right up to the Commander calling a halt and suggesting its all a witch hunt.

Wasn't overly impressed and I'm also getting tired of the Caprica lark,lets just quite the foreplay and do the naked tango already....

Fenster

Forgot the Six scene. It was great watching Baltar walking along the corridor holding his arm out and talking to himself while everyone gave him queer looks.

Haruspex

syke wrote:

It seems to be a bit of a ripoff of an old ST:TNG episode called The Drumhead. Right up to the Commander calling a halt and suggesting its all a witch hunt.

Exactly what I thought as I was watching it. Considering Ron Moore is a Trek alumnus, I wouldn't be surprised at all of a TNG influence. Can anyone recall if he wrote "Litmus"? I didn't look out for it in the opening credits.

And what was that obvious Hulk reference from Number Six about? ("You wouldn't like me when I'm angry").

Enjoyable episode overall, the suicide bombing in the teaser was a shock opener. No Apollo, but I don't think he was missed. Can we expect the fleet paranoia to rise, now that the new form of the Cylons has been revealed to all?

Stark

No Apollo, but I don't think he was missed.

It has a few too many characters, they don't get enough screen-time each. Like you said, we didn't see Apollo at all, and you only see a brief glimpse of Starbuck. As for Apollo not being missed, I think he brightens up the place considerably Chief seems to have a policy of good looking boys for the Hanger bay as well, what's up with that :rolleyes:

Fenster

Stark wrote:

I disagree, the Caprica scenes are very well shot in true "28 days later" style and seem to work well day or night.

It looks good during the day, but when its supposed to be at night and the sky is blue like in the old westerns, it sorta takes away from it.

EDIT: What's I think ruined it was that the episode photos were done before any post-production was done, so they were daytime ones.

Clicky

c0y0te

Well - this is the first time I've voted "OKAY" for an episode, and I hope it doesn't happen again :eek: ... I have high hopes for this series.

Here it comes folks, the now soon-to-be-patented-if-not-copied-before-hand- good, bad and ugly review of the episode:)

The Good:-

Newsflash!; The Cylons are like us!... this finally makes it possible to ramp up the paranoia and pace of a few coming episodes (I hope!), and it was long overdue. About time the central protagonists were exposed to the public.

Bitch Slappin' Good; Damn that model 6 is a fine thing, especially when she gets all stirred up ... whether it was bitch slapping bad-boomer around on Caprica, or giving our favourite mad scientist a quick 'david banner/hulk' impression, it's all good!!

The Lovely Couple; and no, I'm not talking about the soppy love interest story arc between the mechanic and the flygirl, I'm talking about the scenes with Baltar and 6. They just take over the screen when they are together, it's a joy to watch, especially the corridor scene in tonights episode.

The Music; I know I've said it before, but I'll say it again... the music (both intro and incidental) is really growing on me.

Burn him; he's a witch; at least they didn't let the specialist off. Guilty as charged - of stupidity!

Struggling to find anything else that really stood out this week (unfortunately)...which is part of the problem, and naturally leads to...

The Bad:-

The Witchhunt; as has already been pointed out, it's old, been done plenty of times and was rushed to say the least. I particularly resent the point that having relinquished power to an independant tribunal, Adama then decides to take it back when it suits him. I would have gone a different direction with this given a choice.

Planet PlotFiller; Ok - so we get treated to more pointless stuff planetside, but as said above, it's getting old, really fast. Make the point, deliver the punchline and move on. Compared to the pace of the rest of the show, this is really dragging it down.

Who needs Nukes?; when only 2 shots from a sidearm / pistol seem to be enough to take down a friggin 8 foot tall cylon? Maybe a small rock will do it if they run out of bullets?

Pace Pace Baby; with the urgency of the previous episodes, and the ever present threat of cylons finding the fleet, it all seems to be slowing down now into familiar territory, places I really don't want this show to go, down to the dredges of happy family resolutions and weekly plot wrap-ups. It's getting to slow, developing a middle age spread and thinking of purchasing a family saloon, when it should be a nervous 23 year old, strung out on fear and lack of sleep, wondering where the next fix is going to come from.

And speaking of spotty tenagers we move on to the down right ugly this week...

The Ugly:-

Security my Ass!; so - we have a military ship, fleeing cylons, on constant 24/7 CAP (Combat Air Patrol), having dealt with a prison riot and AWARE that cylons look like humans... and some git is able to walk through checkpoints WIRED FOR BOOM without being noticed? Please.. pull the other one, it's got semtex attached to it. :mad:

Overall this feels to me like a filler episode, something to move the story along while the writers were off furiously trying to be creative and edgy, cause they sure didn't bring any of that goodness to this weeks' party.


c0y0te

TCamen

First off-- some of us do miss Apollo & his square jaw :rolleyes:

As for the episode, there were definitely some cringe-y moments e.g Adama & Tighe "I owe ya one" followed by salute *CRINGE*

I really liked the Caprica bits, and I think the visual style works really well-- the CGI Cylons continue to be used effectively-- they're creepy
Thumbs up for the Six/Doral/Boomer scenes on Caprica, and the suicide bomb pre-credits was really well done too.

Wasn't massively enjoying the witch hunt tribunal-- and it reported back/ was closed down all in a day? Bit fast imo.

I think SURELY now someone has to at least suspect Baltar of being a Cylon after the public announcement and with his weird behaviour being noticed by a few more crew members in this episode!
The Baltar/Six (with Starbuck cameo) was good, but like others have mentioned, 'The Hulk' line did make me cringe!

In closing -- Bring Back Apollo!! :mad:

Fenster

I liked the Tigh scene a lot. These are two who are supposed to go way, way back, but we never see it onscreen. Now especially after the way Adama ordered Tigh around in the last episode, I thought it worked pretty well.

ixoy

The whole tribuinal thing is common to lots of sci-fi, Trek included. DS9 did a particularly decent one when they were trying to frame Dr. Bashir. The scenes themselves were not all that worthy - it's a cheap episode to do (plonk a chair in the middle of a room) and somewhat repititous - can, and was, a bit dragged out. What's different, as noted, is the consequences.

I don't think Adama is exactly power mad. It's that he was sweet f.a. time to bother with internal political fueding and that includes a tribuinal. He clearly believes military matters come strictly under his jurisdiction - which is why he dealt with the situation and not the tribuinal. However, he was pissed off (again) at the end and damn right to take yer man down a few pegs. Putting the whole fleet in jeporady because "you can't keep your fly zipped" is wrong. And the fact the innocent guy wasn't cleared makes EvilMe laugh
...I can definetely see Adama coming to loggerheads with the President and perhaps Galactica breaking away...

As to Caprica, I enjoyed it. It was nice to, once and for all, see Boomer is working with the Cylons. The love/sacrifice experiment is enjoyably twisted. Interesting to see GalacticaBoomer is also involved in testing love - is this some perogrative of the Cylons? Is the Boomer model built to test human fidelity? Is that its design or did GalacticaBoomer fall naturally in love?

More Baltar please! Still at least everyone threw him "Wtf?" looks as he nattered away to himself. I'm assuming nothing's been said because, due to his intellect, they give him more lee-way. It's hard to tell what Six is up to, asssuming she's there at all... Still it adds to my theory that the whole thing may be some sort of freaky test and that's why the Cylons haven't butchered the rag-tag fleet yet....

So it's not quite amazing, but it is good helped by the non-pat resolution of the last few minutes. Now next week: MORE BALTAR!

Haruspex wrote:

. Can anyone recall if he wrote "Litmus"? I didn't look out for it in the opening credits.

Nope, it wasn't....

TCamen

Now next week: MORE BALTAR!

And Apollo

Nukem

Eh!-alright Ep.

Must say was a real acting Ep specialy for 6 and Adama.
Damn that guy looked pissed without saying much,on the other hand 6 is lookin fine and a bitch that could spit fire.Caprica dragging a bit.

Question: Missiles right - Cylons use them all the time,BSG vipers have them?
Use them ,i dunno (not in this Ep but ya know what i mean,bein on my mind kinda)
Remember the quote from this week and last wk about the probe being launched in the hangar bay.

Fenster

Tricia Helfer is doing a fantastic job as Six. Most people who see her for the first time think "oh god, Seven of Nine once again" until they realise what manipulative bitch she really is-I mean, how many former models can pull off such an acting role while wearing little more than a nightie?

c0y0te

Her acting abilities not withstanding ... it also has a lot to do with the camerwork in the scenes between Baltar and 6. Check it out the next time you see them together and you will see what I mean.

c0y0te

Vokes

Quote:
Now next week: MORE BALTAR!


And Apollo

Was very disappointed that Apollo wasnt in last night's episode. Hopefully we'll see a lot more of him and Starbuck next week.

Praetorian

Ixoy,

I don't see an option for editing polls; perhaps it's been disabled.
I suggest people don't post about the episode until they see it

Come to think of it, I haven't seen the episode yet...Hopefully tonight!

ixoy

Praetorian wrote:

I don't see an option for editing polls; perhaps it's been disabled. I suggest people don't post about the episode until they see it

It should be visible there. I double-checked and I have an "Edit Poll" option on any of the polling threads on the Stargate forum, regardless of whether I created it or not. Maybe it's because this is a hosted forum and Stargate isn't?

Public poll next week maybe - that way everyone has to defend their choice and we can't have any pre-emptive muppets. Now Praetorian leave work so ya can catch up on the episode - prioritize man!

delly

I liked the scenes in caprica, what with the post nuke skyline etc.

In relation to the cylon been taken down with a couple of shots, we have to remember that they wanted him to survive and rescue his bit on the side. Even if she is an evil piece of work.

Scruff

are ye's all ghey or birds that yer all clamering for more Apollo?

Thought it was a good episode, yes the trial stuff has all been done before but so have most other plots in sci-fi.
The Baltar and six scenes were great, loved where they showed him from other peoples' perspective acting like a complete screwball.

Still not too impressed with the caprica scenes. is it just one big experiment by the cylons or what. though it was nice seeing boomer no.2 getting slapped around the place by six no.2, she deserved it!

Wondering as well about the fallout from Chief telling Boomer no.1 their relationship was over...will she finger him for the sabotage attemps or will he rat her out??

Tazzle

You have to get ecksor/other admin, to enable poll editing on your forum.

telemachus

I thought the witchhunt theme was rescued more or less by the ending, granted there was a Star Trek-ish short speech by Adama on the morality and myopia of what the tribunal had become but I read into his final scene that it was more or less empty noise and he was in fact being pragmatic "I need my ships to fly" (or something along those lines). He could afford to lose the deckhand as a scape goat more than he could the chief, and ideals had nothing to do with it.

I was also wondering all the way through wether it was all some joint collusion, it just seemed odd that the cylons would expend what must be a finite source of agents in killing 4 men. I was expecting it to be a joint operation involving Boomer and the suicide bomber (expended as no longer particularly covert anymore) so as to show up Galacticas security and put the master of arms in a position whereby she could request a tribunal and cause damage to the command structure all the way to the top.

Johnny Storm

I have to say that I didn't really like this episode as much. I wasn't crazy about last week either. Having said that it's still way better than most TV Sci-fi, it only seems a bit of a let down compared its own standard.

I did like the Tigh salute scene. It seemed real to me. In fact, I'd like to see more of Tigh.

I also thought it was way too derivative of ST:tng "The Drumhead". Only the Trek ep was better IMHO. The Sargent-at-arms all of a sudden becomes a nazi trying to screw Adama and all her colleauges - that wasn't believeable. In fact it also wasn't believeable that the tribuneral only took one day as we all know only too well. At least in the Star Trek episode, Worf develops his "bad attitude" over a period of time and is led astray step-by-step by Admial Satie and her group. Plus he has an established predisposition for this kind of thing...

I'm hoping the next episode will restore my faith !

Praetorian

Tazzle wrote:

You have to get ecksor/other admin, to enable poll editing on your forum.

Thanks tazzle, will do.

telemachus

Johnny Storm wrote:

I also thought it was way too derivative of ST:tng "The Drumhead". Only the Trek ep was better IMHO. The Sargent-at-arms all of a sudden becomes a nazi trying to screw Adama and all her colleauges - that wasn't believeable. In fact it also wasn't believeable that the tribuneral only took one day as we all know only too well.

I read her sudden belligerence toward Adama as a concealed resentment at being left out of the loop in regards the cylons human form, it seemed as if she were trying to shift the blame away from lax security (which she was in charge of, along with the small arms used previously to blow the water tanks) towards a commander she was bitter at for putting her in an untenable position in her view (fitting in with the random techs "everyone for themself" theme)

RuggieBear

telemachus wrote:

I read her sudden belligerence toward Adama as a concealed resentment at being left out of the loop in regards the cylons human form, it seemed as if she were trying to shift the blame away from lax security (which she was in charge of, along with the small arms used previously to blow the water tanks) towards a commander she was bitter at for putting her in an untenable position in her view (fitting in with the random techs "everyone for themself" theme)

I was thinking along those lines myself.....

Praetorian

Thanks to the Cloud for granting me the power to rig polls!

I've removed some of the votes as requested.

Fenster

Hey...why are there suddenly 20 votes for "I'd rather watch Andromeda!"?!

secret_squirrel

telemachus wrote:

I read her sudden belligerence toward Adama as a concealed resentment at being left out of the loop in regards the cylons human form, it seemed as if she were trying to shift the blame away from lax security (which she was in charge of, along with the small arms used previously to blow the water tanks) towards a commander she was bitter at for putting her in an untenable position in her view (fitting in with the random techs "everyone for themself" theme)

Me too!

Only just watched the ep on video - marked it down as another excellent ep. I must say though that have completely lost the ability to objectively view this program - I cant remember any sci-fi series that consistently delivers quality drama and acting like this one does. The only ones that come close are B5 and odd episodes of STNG and STDS9. The drumhead springs to mind for me too. However what raises BSG over ST for example is that they arent afraid to be all dark and nasty - even the DS9 characters only had the odd nasty moment - loved Adama's evil pragmatism at the end too...perfect ending.
Attempting to be a little objective - I dont thing the last two storylines have been the best - but they have been redemed by the quality of the performances and the sheer drama they manage to generate.

TBH I didnt miss Apollo at all in this ep - its nice to have a break from him - I dont think there was much need for Starbucks appearance either tbh.

More dark hints that BaltarSix is playing her own game too...

Oh and where does the line start so I can queue for a bitchslapping from Six? - hubba hubba.

Stark

So many beautiful people. That's what really drives us to like the show. We pretend that's not our main motivation though so we make up stuff like "oh and lot's more adama pouting, very good" so our one-track minds aren't too obvious

c0y0te

I'm quite surprised this ep is getting 'amazing' voting, rather than just 'okay'...still, that's democracy at work for ya

c0y0te

Sooner or Later

I gave it a "Great" rating. Like most people I was a bit disappointed with the witchunt scenes, an idea which seems to have been done to death. But it was saved by the scene with Baltar and Six, the Caprica plot finally beginning to get moving and the bit where Adama turned nasty in the end.

Belisarius

I only just got a chance to see it now on sky one mix.
I have to say despite being fairly low-fi I enjoyed it though a few things are pissing me off,Such as despite having just being informed of another species-threatening cylon peril and the fact that boomer had been wandering around with heavy duty explosives only a few episodes ago ,the chief failed to join the dots only touching on it towards the end. In fact the very idea of this web of lies just for a bit of nookie is kind of annoying too .By stonewalling the tribunal they were putting the fleet at risk in a very serious way. While i think that self motivation is a refreshing change from the boy scout attitudes of something like star trek. I think the gravity of the situation would compelled me to fess up

Beyond that I think its getting a tad repetitive. I dont know how many dramatic shilloette shots of the cylons watching yer man on capricra you can have before you actually get noticed....

Praetorian

Belisarius wrote:

I only just got a chance to see it now on sky one mix.
I have to say despite being fairly low-fi I enjoyed it though a few things are pissing me off,Such as despite having just being informed of another species-threatening cylon peril and the fact that boomer had been wandering around with heavy duty explosives only a few episodes ago ,the chief failed to join the dots only touching on it towards the end. In fact the very idea of this web of lies just for a bit of nookie is kind of annoying too .By stonewalling the tribunal they were putting the fleet at risk in a very serious way. While i think that self motivation is a refreshing change from the boy scout attitudes of something like star trek. I think the gravity of the situation would compelled me to fess up

Beyond that I think its getting a tad repetitive. I dont know how many dramatic shilloette shots of the cylons watching yer man on capricra you can have before you actually get noticed....

Love can be blinding!

c0y0te

The next ep looks interesting and is focused on our frieds Baltar and 6.. so hopefully with lots of screentime together the episode will be a lot better than the last two.

c0y0te

TheWolf

c0y0te wrote:

Security my Ass!; so - we have a military ship, fleeing cylons, on constant 24/7 CAP (Combat Air Patrol), having dealt with a prison riot and AWARE that cylons look like humans... and some git is able to walk through checkpoints WIRED FOR BOOM without being noticed? Please.. pull the other one, it's got semtex attached to it. :mad:
c0y0te

Good review as always c0y0te, but just a quick note on this bit. The fleet at the start of the ep didnt know cylons looked like people, it hadnt been revealed yet. And yer man didnt come over with the explosives, he got it from the arms locker (which Boomer left open) so he was already past the checkpoints. The only reason he was found out was Adama and the XO had come across the same model before

madmorphy

I only just got a chance to see it now on sky one mix.
I have to say despite being fairly low-fi I enjoyed it though a few things are pissing me off,Such as despite having just being informed of another species-threatening cylon peril and the fact that boomer had been wandering around with heavy duty explosives only a few episodes ago ,the chief failed to join the dots only touching on it towards the end. In fact the very idea of this web of lies just for a bit of nookie is kind of annoying too .By stonewalling the tribunal they were putting the fleet at risk in a very serious way. While i think that self motivation is a refreshing change from the boy scout attitudes of something like star trek. I think the gravity of the situation would compelled me to fess up.

I thought the very same thing myself,is the chief thick or what ?No one,especially a soldier would put the whole ship at risk for a bird.Boomer had a box of warheads 2 weeks ago these were used to blow the watertanks on the ship and then the primed bomb on the recon ship. 2+2=4

c0y0te

Thewolf,

Regarding the boyo coming onboard with explosives - you are absolutely correct. My bad :rolleyes:

However.. my point is still valid, in that where as the genreal melee didn't know cylons were human like as yet, the command staff did, and they knew exactly what one of them looked like (otherwise how else would tigh recognise him).. so its not unreasonable to assume that his photo would be at every single checkpoint on the ship as if he were just another terrorist suspect etc.

It just seemed to damn easy for a known bady guy to waltz in and blow the place apart - all for the sake of moving on the story to the point where the 'secret' is out and the witchhunt begins.

But - well spotted regarding my mistake. Guess I was too tired when I wrote that original reivew:)

c0y0te

Fenster

Until Doral turned up on the Galactica packing explosives, Adama and co. had no reason to suspect there was more than one of each Cylon, so that would explain why they didn't watch for him.

c0y0te

You know something Fenster.. you are absolutely right :eek: . I actually thought they did know, but of course the only thing they knew from the mini series is that there were '12 models', but not that there were multiple copies of each model.

I stand corrected (and updated!). Thanks for spotting that.

Note to self... must try harder in reviews to be more accurate!!

c0y0te

The_Bullman

I realy enjoyed this episode, much like the others really.

A few things are bugging me though.

On caprica, how doesn't helo spot the obvious cylons standin around, It's startin to drive me crazy :mad:

Another thing that's a little odd to me. At the president's press conference, there's a huge amount of media there. Where did they all come from? There isn't all that many people left, surely there's no need for so many people to report the same news

secret_squirrel

Coz reporters are like cockroaches??

Guaranteed to survive the end of the world!

irishman_abroad

Yeah I was thinking the same thing bout the reporters but I suppose you could explain it by saying theres one reporter per ship. I thought it a bit suspect though. I think its more a tip of the hat to the usual american presidential way of doing things tho meself.