Was Elvis the greatest.....

Hairy Homer

...or was he a template for all that is bad in popular music?

The King? God? The founder of rock and roll, without whom it would never have happened?

Or a sad bloated drug-addled manufactured pop star who paved the way for the packaged boy bands and corporate whoredom so prevalent in the industry today.

I'm moved to pose this question by noticing the frequent appearance in an ad currently running on TV of Elvis peforming 'Suspicious Minds' from some stage act late in his career. And I'm left asking 'This man is a legend because...?'

The stage act: rhinestone jumpsuit and spasticated dance routine, awful Busby Berkely-style background setting?

The arrangement: Big brass band, dreadful pseudo-celestial chorus from female backing singers, undanceable rythm?

Is this what rock 'n roll was all about? Background music for Las Vegas high rollers?

Some might argue that this was the latter day Elvis. Very different from the young Elvis who really did create a revolution by bringing black man's music to white kids in the 1950s and kick starting a new genre of music from which everything of any import has been derived ever since.

To which I would reply:


1) Elvis was NOT the first white man to play black man's music. Al Jolson, Benny Goodman, Glenn Miller, even Frank Sinatra all made popular music forms that originated in African music long before Elvis ever bought his first pair of blue suede shoes.

American music is the great melting pot of styles from Africa and Europe. It's one of the great things America has given the world, but never forget that the ingredients came from elsewhere. Jazz and swing were American interpretations of African music long before rock 'n roll appeared.

2) Ever seen an Elvis impersonator who models himself on the young, sexy, dangerous Elvis in tight drainpipes, once considered so corrupting of teenage female minds that TV cameras were restricted to filming him from the waist up?

No? Neither have I.

Think Elvis impersonators now and it's some sad fat git in a ridiculous jump suit with fake chest hair and a highly implausible toupe, incorporating side burns singing bloody awful interpretations of songs that could have been great.

If that's the legend of rock and roll it's time to get back into uillean pipes, bodhrans, Mozart and Beethoven and all the other wonderful music that Europe gave the world.

The King is dead. Let him lie.

Sleipnir

Ah Elvis was great. His live performances were just electrifying.
I only wish I had been alive to go to one.....

magpie

Do you even need to ask? Watch the '68 Comeback Special if you need convincing.

Beerbreath

Well,I think it's a cultural thing. I mean, I'm not a huge fan of the music Elvis made...some great songs in the early years and few good ones later on but I've never listened to him at any great length. But I think that back in the 50's, of course he was seen as quite revolutionary because he was the first person that most people saw doing this raw, new rock and roll that parents were so worried about. I guess it was the beginnings of youth culture in a big way, and the first time a massive gap started to emerge between generations that followed through the 60's. You mention that Elvis wasn't the first to mix white and black music..well of course he wasn't, but the original pioneers sometimes are not the most widely recognised. It sometimes takes some figure to propell it to a wider audience, which Elvis did when he cam along. It's not really a bad or good thing, just the way it happens.
I would assume that seeing Elvis on tv or hearing his records back then for a young person would have been quite exciting and the equivalent of punk or whatever in latter days. It was just the impact that Elvis made and everything that followed which is the reason he is held in such reverance. It's up to individual listeners if they think the music itself stands up. Personally, I prefer Buddy Holly's stuff, but that doesn't negate my view that it was really Elvis who was at the forefront of rock and roll it's mainstream infancy.

The Muppet

He was not the founder of rock n roll as Bill Haleys Rock around the closk was the first Rock N Roll Number 1 way back in January 1956. He is the undisputed king of rock and roll and the greatest entertainer ever to grace a stage IMHO.

The King is Dead. Long Live the King

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

imagine, in 50 years time after justin timberlake has passed on for whatever reason, your childrens (or indeed, their children) will be watching videos of his performing live on stage (it was electrifying, grandad said.. to see him gyrate his hips so), singing classics like "... I don't actually know the names of any of his songs" etc etc and wondering "this was the king of music for my parents generation?"

elvis was ... a pop star. Just another one of many.

The Muppet

Mordeth wrote:

imagine, in 50 years time after justin timberlake has passed on for whatever reason, your childrens (or indeed, their children) will be watching videos of his performing live on stage (it was electrifying, grandad said.. to see him gyrate his hips so), singing classics like "... I don't actually know the names of any of his songs" etc etc and wondering "this was the king of music for my parents generation?"

elvis was ... a pop star. Just another one of man.

That will never happen Justin Timberlake and his ilk will be long forgotten in 20 years time, Just ask any twenty year old who's Luke Goss ? They will be unlikely to be able to tell you. Elvis's music is immortal and is still popular across the age brackets from teenagers to grannies and I dont believe that will ever change because he is a legend.

Elvis was a one off , He never was or never will be just another one of many.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

That will never happen Justin Timberlake and his ilk will be long forgotten in 20 years time

wishful thinking? I'd like to think.. but you'd never know..

irlirishkev

Hairy Homer wrote:

..
I'm moved to pose this question by noticing the frequent appearance in an ad currently running on TV of Elvis peforming 'Suspicious Minds' from some stage act late in his career. And I'm left asking 'This man is a legend because...?'

The stage act: rhinestone jumpsuit and spasticated dance routine, awful Busby Berkely-style background setting?

Some might argue that this was the latter day Elvis. Very different from the young Elvis who really did create a revolution by bringing black man's music to white kids in the 1950s and kick starting a new genre of music from which everything of any import has been derived ever since.

Unfortunately, like most of the general public, you've seen too many Elvis (barf) Impersonators.

The scene you're referring to was filmed in Vegas in 1970. Elvis didn't really start to 'lose it' untill 1974. Up untill then he was in great physical shape and cared deeply for what it was always about.. the music.

You refer to a 'spasticated' dance routine? He was moving to the music, and if you ever see the documentary it's taken from (That's The Way it Is), you'll see he's not the only one. For example, during that same song, Sammy Davis Junior is in the audience giving it socks!

Hairy Homer wrote:

Think Elvis impersonators now and it's some sad fat git in a ridiculous jump suit with fake chest hair and a highly implausible toupe, incorporating side burns singing bloody awful interpretations of songs that could have been great

Elvis impersonators are a sick cliché which they themselves have created. I mean come on, not one of them looks anything like Elvis, yet they all seem to look the same. Even in Elvis' lowest moments in the months before he passed away, as much as he looked nothing like his former self.. he still looked a thousand times better than those clowns you see at Elvis conventions.

As Mordeth said - Elvis was a 'pop star'. Very true. But the difference is, he was ground breaking. Nothing these days is ground breaking, because Elvis kicked it off, and everything since then has just been building on that.
Also, Nobody has ever sounded like Elvis, before or since. And that goes for Elvis' voice throughout his career. It was constantly changing, yet it was always recognisable. Even at 18 years of age, Elvis sounded fantastic.

I don't know where I'm going with this, so I'll stop ranting..
In a nutshell, Elvis was the best there ever was. Others have tried, and they'll keep on trying, but no-one will ever even come close.

Kev

Giblet

Watch Suspicious minds with the kick ass drum breaks at the end!

mobile04

love his music style etc
hated the films

sinatra another legend
im trying to get my elvis collection and sinatra beatles
collection complete.
if theres any big serious fans out there
id love to hear from ya.
just got let it be on dvd amazing. ground breaking doucumentry.
elvis is so age less
my kid thinks hes so cool . hes just 12 years old and still he thinks hes got the voice looks etc....
good acts are for ever.

Doctor J

What irlirishkev said.

Avoid the movies and the hype, get the Sun Recordings and the 68 Comeback Special and That's The Way It Is DVD's and feel privileged to be able to witness a true and justified legend.

Dr. Loon

Elvis is/was fúcking amazing. An amazing performer with a brilliant understanding of the music he was playing. He also had an amazing backing band at all times. The only voice IMO that I think is close/as good is Roy Orbison's. It's highly unlikely there will ever be another like him. A pop star yes, but todays pop stars don't have a patch on him.

Tusky

I wouldnt sit down and listen to his music...well the odd time. He is a legend though and one of a kind.... Mordeth feck off comparing him to Justin Timberlake

Dr. Dre

What doctor J and IrlirishKev said.

I'm a HUGE fan.
The Alloha from Hawaii Special in '73 looks to be the best concert ever.

Don't like his movies *cringe* but for me there hasn't been/isn't anyone even remotely near him, but that's just my opinion.

[EDIT] Incidently, as far as impersonators go, I do agree that there are some sh*te ones out there, however I would recommend an impersonator named Mark Leen (goes by the stage name 'Emerald Elvis') He really is very very good, he did a tribute to the Alloha concert in the Gleneagles in Killarney a few years ago and it was sensational.

Dr. Loon

Dr. Dre wrote:

I'm a HUGE fan.
The Alloha from Hawaii Special in '73 looks to be the best concert ever.

There's many more concerts out there where he performed better. He was very nervous at that show, and it shows. Even the two concerts used on the That's the way it is DVD have more energy and showmanship in them. There's also an awful lot of footage floating around of different concerts. Very difficult to come across, although I did manage to get his last show on VHS. Quite sad.

irlirishkev

Dr. Loon wrote:

There's many more concerts out there where he performed better. He was very nervous at that show, and it shows. Even the two concerts used on the That's the way it is DVD have more energy and showmanship in them. There's also an awful lot of footage floating around of different concerts. Very difficult to come across, although I did manage to get his last show on VHS. Quite sad.

Ebay is the place to go for live VCD's, from what I've seen.
IMO, his best documented 70's gigs are available (in part) on the 'Elvis On Tour' documentary, from 1972. Fingers crossed this film will get the '68 Special DVD treatment in the near future..

I also have his last concert. It is very sad, but he really does sing his heart out, and the audience never stop appreciating it.
He had it till the end.

Kev.

Dr. Loon

irlirishkev wrote:

IMO, his best documented 70's gigs are available (in part) on the 'Elvis On Tour' documentary, from 1972. Fingers crossed this film will get the '68 Special DVD treatment in the near future..

Yeah, I have the Elvis on Tour stuff as well... must look into eBay

irlirishkev

Dr. Loon wrote:

Yeah, I have the Elvis on Tour stuff as well... must look into eBay

I have the Pittsburgh New Years Eve gig '76/'77, which is up on ebay at the moment

I can recommend this, it's a really good gig, and the film has been overdubbed with a pretty good audience recording, so it's even better.

Kev.

irlirishkev

... Odds are Elvis will be number one this week with One Night. Originally a hit back in 1957.
Last week he was at number one with Jailhouse Rock.

Who would have thought.. 2005, and two Elvis singles in the Top 10.
Not bad..

Kev.

Dr. Dre

irlirishkev wrote:

I have the Pittsburgh New Years Eve gig '76/'77, which is up on ebay at the moment

I can recommend this, it's a really good gig, and the film has been overdubbed with a pretty good audience recording, so it's even better.

Kev.

Hmmm, that one slipped through the net! I don't have that pittsburgh one - I have everything else that has been mentioned - Hawaii still rules the roost for me as far as performances go.
There's some nice backstage footage in that 'Elvis on tour' - love the gospel stuff with the stamps quartet - 'I, John' etc...
Also a nice rendiditon of 'sweet spirit'

irlirishkev

Dr. Dre wrote:

There's some nice backstage footage in that 'Elvis on tour' - love the gospel stuff with the stamps quartet - 'I, John' etc...
Also a nice rendiditon of 'sweet spirit'

Agreed!

egan007

Mordeth wrote:

imagine, in 50 years time after justin timberlake has passed on for whatever reason, your childrens (or indeed, their children) will be watching videos of his performing live on stage (it was electrifying, grandad said.. to see him gyrate his hips so), singing classics like "... I don't actually know the names of any of his songs" etc etc and wondering "this was the king of music for my parents generation?"

elvis was ... a pop star. Just another one of many.

God bless you......lol

You don't seem to realise that Elvis played a 'black mans music' in a USA where the black man was oppressed and was considered a class below all whites.

His music provoked outrage and brought the little white man out screaming for his head - they knew that he was going to change something, they did not know what it was but they were afraid of it.
FEAR FEAR FEAR in the usa - sound familiar;)

Mr Timberpersonality would have to do more than break a few teenagers hearts to be even considered in the same light.

irlirishkev

He's a legend.
When he was alive he was a living legend.

He was an 18 year old boy who stumbled into a world that wasn't ready for him. He set the standards for all those to follow.
He set numerous records in his lifetime, and in death, he continues to do so.

Part of the reason no-one can live up to what he did in his lifetime, is because today, nothing is as shocking as it was back then; and why? It's because Elvis was the first to do it. He broke the mould.

"Before Elvis there was nothing" - John Lennon
"If Jesus Christ is alive and well, then how come John and Elvis are dead" - George Michael

Kevin.

Kingp35

Elvis DID NOT invent rock n roll he simply copied a black mans music so I dunno where you people are getting that from. Plus elvis DID NOT make music he didnt write any of his songs so tell how in the hell he is the king of rock n roll. The king or kareoke maybe!!!

The guy was a good entertainer in his time but that was it an entertainer not a musician. Simply like todays other rubbish artists he was given songs and he sang them simple as that. Im not taking away the fact he had good live shows back in his time but for gods sake people wake up and realise all the guy did was copy someone elses style of music and then copy someone elses songs.

King of rock n roll??? I F***ING DOUBT IT!!!

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

The king or kareoke maybe!!!

King of rock n roll??? I F***ING DOUBT IT!!!

The amount of people in the world, including musicians that would disagree with you is amazing. They must all be wrong though. He has influenced generations of songwriters, bands and musicians.

He didn't write all of his own songs fair enough. He was a musician though, and it was an honour for songwriters to have their song sung by Elvis. He was a fúcking superb singer and a great entertainer.

Who do you think the King of Rock 'n' roll is?

BolBill

Dr. Loon wrote:

The amount of people in the world, including musicians that would disagree with you is amazing. They must all be wrong though. He has influenced generations of songwriters, bands and musicians.

He didn't write all of his own songs fair enough. He was a musician though, and it was an honour for songwriters to have their song sung by Elvis. He was a fúcking superb singer and a great entertainer.

Who do you think the King of Rock 'n' roll is?

Agree with you, he was a great singer and entertainer. but listen to the lyrics of "Fight the Power" by Public Enemy, some people have a very different opinion of him

irlirishkev

Kingp35 wrote:

Elvis DID NOT invent rock n roll he simply copied a black mans music so I dunno where you people are getting that from. Plus elvis DID NOT make music he didnt write any of his songs so tell how in the hell he is the king of rock n roll. The king or kareoke maybe!!!

Not all artists write their own songs.
Elvis may not have written songs, but as DrLoon said, he was a musician, and a good one at that. If you need examples, please ask. He also produced a lot of his own material.

Kingp35 wrote:

all the guy did was copy someone elses style of music and then copy someone elses songs

Actually, he didn't copy them, he made them his own. Compare the original Hound Dog to Elvis' version, and then tell me again that he 'copied' it :rolleyes: This applies to most of the songs Elvis covered.

K.

Kingp35

irlirishkev wrote:

Actually, he didn't copy them, he made them his own. Compare the original Hound Dog to Elvis' version, and then tell me again that he 'copied' it :rolleyes: This applies to most of the songs Elvis covered.
K.

Its quite easy to take something that is already there and change it to something else where as coming up with totally new and original material is alot harder.Even if he arguably made some songs better, without the original which he had absolutely nothing to do with, then he would not have been able to do this. So to say Elvis was founder of rock n roll is riculous all he did was change something that already existed.

Dr. Loon wrote:

The amount of people in the world, including musicians that would disagree with you is amazing. They must all be wrong though. He has influenced generations of songwriters, bands and musicians.

He didn't write all of his own songs fair enough. He was a musician though, and it was an honour for songwriters to have their song sung by Elvis. He was a fúcking superb singer and a great entertainer.

Who do you think the King of Rock 'n' roll is?

I dont dispute any of these facts of course he has influenced other artists and I have already said he was an excellent entertainer in his day but fact remains he didnt write his songs he just changed other peoples work. And yes true not all singers write their own songs but real artists do and all the truely great ones do. Elvis never came up with anything truely original and cannot be named the king of rock n roll. There were many rock n roll artists before so to say he invented the genre is also ridiculous.

And finally to answer your question n one is the king of rock n roll!!!

Kingp35

irlirishkev wrote:

Not all artists write their own songs.
K.

oh and kev an artist is someone who creates something new and original so yes all artists do write their own songs. Some singers and entertainers like Frank Sinatra dont.

Swarfboy

Sure enough Elvis was Great and I too love the 68 comeback....
But if you want to talk about Rockn'roll inventor.......look up chuck berry...
Also see even Elvis's comments on Chick Berry.... People know very little of chuck berry but he was the one with the riffs... a true musicans musican.!

Kingp35

Swarfboy wrote:

Sure enough Elvis was Great and I too love the 68 comeback....
But if you want to talk about Rockn'roll inventor.......look up chuck berry...
Also see even Elvis's comments on Chick Berry.... People know very little of chuck berry but he was the one with the riffs... a true musicans musican.!

gotta agree with this I have alot of Chuck Berry stuff and he, if anyone, was the founder of rock n roll and it has been said by alot of artists and music magazines etc. that this man started it all

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

And yes true not all singers write their own songs but real artists do and all the truely great ones do.

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did. A whole bunch of songs wouldn't have existed without him, but because they were written for him, they do, and I'm glad of that.

If there were more singers out there who had the same passion that Elvis had for music, the entire music scene would be better. I'm sure of it.

irlirishkev

Dr. Loon wrote:

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did. A whole bunch of songs wouldn't have existed without him, but because they were written for him, they do, and I'm glad of that.

If there were more singers out there who had the same passion that Elvis had for music, the entire music scene would be better. I'm sure of it.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Dr. Dre

Elvis gets the 1000th UK No.1 with 'One night'

Chong

Elvis is and always be a legend, I got his Hawaian special Aloha album and Chuck Berry's Greatest the other day off Amazon, and for as much love I have for Elvis I feel Chuck, and Buddy were equally as good.

JackKelly

what about the likes of Freddie Mercury? Great Performer, song writer, musician. I regard him higher than i do Elvis

Kingp35

Dr. Loon wrote:

We're gonna have to agree to disagree. I used to think a real artist was someone who wrote and performed their own material, but not any more. I'm kind of half way on that call. I dont' respect the likes of Westlife because I believe they have no talent regardless, but I respect Elvis, if he hadn't have existed I don't know what way music might be now. The world of music is a better place because he existed. Same with Sinatra.

I've never claimed Elvis thought up rock 'n' roll, but he gave it the introduction it needed. He also introduced "operatic" rock 'n' roll, which Roy Orbison also did.

I have to say I agree with you here in that Elvis the performer did change music and alot of music these days wuldnt have existed without him but the elvis wouldnt have existed without the likes of chuck berry and the people he covered so that list just goes on and on back through music. Im not discrediting Elvis he was an excellent entertainer and performer what Im saying is I dont get why he is worshipped like a god he is no better than alot of other people and to call one man the king of rock n roll is ridiculous because of the fact he didnt write his own stuff and he copied a for of music that aleady existed. True he changed it a bit but still Elvis would not have existed without the guys before him.

Ultimately I agree with you guys saying that he was an excellent performer and singer and he was but I could name so many more equally brilliant and better than he was simply because they performed original material.

Elvis was very good but to call him the king/founder/legend of rock n roll is taking it way too far and those he dress like him and worship him are a little strange tbh. A man wh does not write his own stuff cannot be credited the same as the people who do. Its as simple as that

Doctor J

Kingp35 wrote:

Elvis was very good but to call him the king/founder/legend of rock n roll is taking it way too far and those he dress like him and worship him are a little strange tbh. A man wh does not write his own stuff cannot be credited the same as the people who do. Its as simple as that

Being a songwriter and being a performer are very different things. Elvis was a great performer, a great arranger and producer of songs and part of his legacy is the people he inspired to greatness. He was an incredible interpreter of songs and made songs his own. Elvis was a phenomenon, in a way that Buddy Holly, Jeery Lee Lewis, Chuck Berry etc, despite their greatness, weren't. When Elvis broke through eveything changed in a way we can't really appreciate these days. There are great artists from his era but none had the impact Elvis had (and continues to have). He was the King, no dount about it.

BrookieD

Hi
He was a burger munching gimp and i am sick of seeing countless "Must Have collections" on the TV all the time, way to over hyped and could not act for his so called burgers.

Kingp35

Doctor J wrote:

He was the King, no dount about it.

why??

Yes he made songs his own but you elvis fans are so blind to the simple fact that if someone did not write the songs elvis would not have existed because he didnt make is own. Its actually laughable that you guys dont realise this. Wake up will ya!! The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!

Doctor J

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

"The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!"

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Doctor J

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

"The king of rock n roll would have to ability to write some songs dont ya think!!!!"

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Kingp35

Doctor J wrote:

Why? Because he put his soul into his singing in a way no-one else I've ever heard could do it. I only started appreciating Elvis in the last few years, I had dismissed his work in a similar fashion to what you're doing now. Then I actually listened to him.

Clearly, no. As I said, performing and songwriting are different things altogether. Frank Sinatra didn't write his own songs but are you going to dismiss him in an equally ridiculous manner? Frank, like Elvis, could guide a band and sculpt someone else's song into his own, which is an artform in itself. You have to appreciate the context in which Elvis' early material became such a revelation.

Eh if you have read my posts you will see that i am not dismissing his work i have said he was very talented in what he did and was an excellent performer and singer. I have already said this but you guys are taking it to another level saying he is the king. There have been better singers and better performers since elvis and they wrote their own songs. Its a fundamental aspect of being a truely great musician and Elvis was lacking this. If the man wrote his own songs he truely would have been the one of the best but he didnt. You love his music and his performances and I respect that he was one of the best performers bt he wasnt performing his own work whether he changed it to make it different or not it wasnt his own work and this is his downfall. Brilliant in his own right and up there but definitely not the best

Phil_321

Elvis is a true and deserving legend.
There is no such thing as a greatest though.

Dr. Loon

Kingp35 wrote:

There have been better singers and better performers since elvis and they wrote their own songs. Its a fundamental aspect of being a truely great musician and Elvis was lacking this.

Your problem is you have a mental block if an artist doesn't perform/write their own music. That's not what music is about. Music is about the enjoyment people get out of it. How the artist is regarded by the world and more importantly other musicians dictates their standing in the world of music. Elvis was named The King for a reason. Every credible artist out there hols him in very high regard. However, just because he didn't write his own music you don't place him the same regard.

Tell me, who has been a better singer since Elvis? There's nobody I can think of. Maybe Roy Orbison. Certainly not Sinatra - he didn't have the same range and was a pretty boring performer.

Elvis' influence on the world is quite obvious. I've said before, I used to think quite like yourself... if an artist doesn't write their own music than they're shít. This quite simply is not true, Elvis alone proves this.

Kingp35

Dr. Loon wrote:

Elvis' influence on the world is quite obvious. I've said before, I used to think quite like yourself... if an artist doesn't write their own music than they're shít. This quite simply is not true, Elvis alone proves this.

I didnt say he was sh1te i really like elvis' music its very good I just cant rate him as the king if he didnt write his own stuff. Its not a mental block its one mans opinion against another. I understand what your saying about the general public and how highly regarded he was/is but as a true music fan who knows more than the general public do I just dont think the man was as brilliant as he is made out to be.

I think Freddie Mercury was a better performer than Elvis the man was charismatic and was an unbelievable performer. Perhaps not as good a singer but the man could still sing.

mwnger

I would go along with Beerbreath's comments regarding Elvis early in this thread. Posters are doubting his legacy because he didn't write his own material, was just ripping off black culture and he wasn't even the first to do that. All of which is true but it doesn't at all take away from his importance. But I'm not talking about his music per se. Cos if Elvis was to be judged on his musical impact alone - then he trails behind the likes of the Beatles and other true musical innovators. But if he is to be judged on his cultural importance and his impact on society in general - then I don't think it's an exaggeration to say he's one of the most important individuals of the latter half of the 20th century, up there with figures like Kennedy and Gorberchev. The difference with them was that they were consciously trying to change the world, while Elvis was just a simple country boy who just wanted to sing songs.
There's no doubt that Elvis was the harbinger of the 'Swinging Sixties', the Sexual Revolution, the counter-culture, whatever you want to call it. What he (inadvertedly) started was taken up by the likes of Bob Dylan and the Beatles who ran with it, bringing a sort of ideology to rock 'n' roll, believing it could change the world for the better. The irony is that Elvis himself did not welcome much of this change. It’s well documented that he was very conservative in his politics (most memorably stated by Public Enemy, as someone mentioned). In fact, he lobbied the U.S. authorities to have the Beatles kicked out of America. He particularly despised John Lennon, blaming him (with some justification, it has to be said!) for creating the hippy movement.
So, yes I do believe Elvis was the great phenomenon his fans make him out to be, but a social phenomenon, in which music was the vehicle. I think his performance style was as integral to his impact as well. It’s as if society at that point was waiting for someone like him to go crazy. It’s probable that if Elvis never got into music and remained a humble truck driver, then the public would have gone mad for someone else – and the changes he was the catalyst for would have happened anyway. So I suppose...

…"if Elvis didn’t exist it would be necessary to invent him".

Dr. Loon

mwnger wrote:

In fact, he lobbied the U.S. authorities to have the Beatles kicked out of America. He particularly despised John Lennon, blaming him (with some justification, it has to be said!) for creating the hippy movement.

In all the books I've read on Elvis I've never once come across these "facts". Elvis was a big fan of all music, and covered many popular tunes, including Beatles numbers as well as Sinatra, Neil Diamond, and Chuck Berry. I've never once heard that he tried to get The Beatles kicked out of America, or that he hated John Lennon although I suppose it's possible. I know he had them over to his house and that he was slightly worried that they might be more popular than him.

Phil_321

Surely you've heard about Elvis' meeting with Nixon where he complained about America's drug problems, and how the Beatles among others were contributing to it. He was even made an honorary federal agent, by his own request, so he could try and do something about it.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/when_nixon_met_elvis/part_1.html
http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,1423,00.html

Dr. Loon

Phil_321 wrote:

Surely you've heard about Elvis' meeting with Nixon where he complained about America's drug problems, and how the Beatles among others were contributing to it. He was even made an honorary federal agent, by his own request, so he could try and do something about it.

http://www.archives.gov/exhibit_hall/when_nixon_met_elvis/part_1.html
http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,1423,00.html

I'm well aware he met Nixon ans was made an honorary DEA agent, but I've never read that he believed The Beatles were causing Americas drug problems, and doubt the truth behind the E online article. In any case it has no bearing on whether he was The King or not. Although it might be interesting reading for fans.