UTV Talk - too good to be true?

_Kaiser_

Hi folks,

Dunno if you've seen this yet: http://u.tv/talk/talk.asp?loc=ie

Basically.... (quoting from the site):

Simply call any local or national number throughout Ireland or UK during the evening or at the weekend and providing your call lasts no longer than one hour you will be charged absolutely nothing - FREE!.

and they even list the workaround to being charged after the hour:

Want to make a longer call? Simply hang up before the hour's up and call back!!!

What I've also discovered:

- No setup fee
- Existing UTV (ClickSilver) customers will be sent an email in the next few days offering a migration path.
- 12 month contract - but this is seperate to your Clicksilver contract (ie: it won't be extended by availing of this offer).
- No eircom line rental - you now pay UTV (is this full LLU??)

Mods, feel free to move if in the wrong place, but I thought I'd let people know and get some feedback - IS this too good to be true?

full forward

for the FAQ...
Is there a minimum call charge?
Yes, the minimum call change is 5.7c (inc VAT), a saving of 10% off the standard Eircom charge of 6.26c.

Still sounds good though.

_Kaiser_

full forward wrote:

for the FAQ...
Is there a minimum call charge?
Yes, the minimum call change is 5.7c (inc VAT), a saving of 10% off the standard Eircom charge of 6.26c.

Still sounds good though.

yea thats what I was thinking... probably should have been clearer, I meant setup fee as in migration fee

Will know more when the email arrives tho I hope

Cuauhtemoc

Basically what it is then is for €24.18 per month you get your line rental and unlimited off peak calls as long as you redial after each hour of talking.

There is no minimum call setup charge for this. That only applies to peak rates according to the website.

jwt

Does this include internet numbers? i.e. not the 1890 ones but the local pop number?

John

Blaster99

Their other rates are fairly uncompetitive so that's where they're hoping to make money presumably. But if 1890 numbers are free as well you can combine this with Telestunt and get free calls to lots of destinations and if 0818 numbers are free you get free calls to Irish mobiles as well...

Blaster99

Not very likely, looks like they charge the same as Eircom for "nongeographic" calls.

govinda

Blaster99 wrote:

Their other rates are fairly uncompetitive so that's where they're hoping to make money presumably. But if 1890 numbers are free as well you can combine this with Telestunt and get free calls to lots of destinations and if 0818 numbers are free you get free calls to Irish mobiles as well...

http://u.tv/talk/pricing.asp?loc=ie

All calls to Non Geographic,Internet, Premium Rate, International Mobiles: Same as eircom

Mr_Man

Does anyone know if the issue about Eircom removing the phone book entry of people who use LLU, been resolved ?

M.

lucernarian

Excuse me, but could anyone explain to the idiots i.e. me what LLU is?

Moriarty

This isn't LLU (Local Loop Unbundling), it's WLR (Wholesale Line Rental). The other telcos rent each phone line off eircom for a monthly fee. All traffic is still carried completely over eircom's network. WLR is, more or less, a marketing gimmick so that any telco can charge you line rental aswell as any calls you make instead of eircom. Eircom no longer send you any bills.

Moriarty

Oh, and moving this over to the nets/comms forum too.

Tom Dunne

To_be_confirmed wrote:

Excuse me, but could anyone explain to the idiots i.e. me what LLU is?

Don't listen to the voices in your head, you are not an idiot.

LLU is short for Local Loop Unbundling. The local loop, sometimes called the last mile, is the length of wire between your house and the telephone exchange. Unbundling in this case means that companies other than Eircon can in theory own the last mile and charge you line rental on it. In reality, Eircon own the wire and other companies just pass the cost along to you.

It is intended to stimulate competition in the telecoms marketplace.

lucernarian

Oh rite! I didnt make the connection between Local Loop unbundling and LLU :rolleyes:
I'm familiar with Local Loop unbundling but I can't imagine it working as engineers from different companies will be maintaining the same equipment, e.g poles, large cables which would carry the lines of many companies.
The "Irish" solution is of course to allow €ircom "manage" the lines.

Paddy20

As a disabled/housebound person my line rental is paid for by the state to EirCon.

UTV are now working on enabling the disabled EirCoN "Free line rental" individuals/customers in the Republic, to be able to sign up for this brilliant new telecoms innovation

So, it looks as though at last. I will be able to finally kick EirCoN's arse right out of my home ?.. HeeeHee, If I was allowed to drink I would get pissed out of my brain.

sceptre

Paddy20 wrote:

UTV are now working on enabling the disabled EirCoN "Free line rental" individuals/customers in the Republic, to be able to sign up for this brilliant new telecoms innovation

That's pretty important Paddy as you correctly identify (and not just for the people who are entitled to it - it's a large part of the market and if they're locked into Eircom, Eircom are assured of a few hundred thousand customers who wouldn't be able to move)

Let alone the fact that this contract hasn't been subject to a bid process but that's a big off-topic issue.

Paddy20

sceptre wrote:

That's pretty important Paddy as you correctly identify (and not just for the people who are entitled to it - it's a large part of the market and if they're locked into Eircom, Eircom are assured of a few hundred thousand customers who wouldn't be able to move)

Let alone the fact that this contract hasn't been subject to a bid process but that's a big off-topic issue.

Yes, I spoke this evening to U.TV TALK, and they asked me to send an e-mail raising my plight with: support@utv.com

I was assured that within a few days this "Oversight" which is not answered in their FAQ's section would be resolved in favour of people in my position.

sunbeam

The one thing that makes me sightly wary of this is the issue of line faults. I wonder if there would be any problems getting an engineer out to us if we no longer had our line rental with Eircom.

Also it would seem from paragraph 4.10 of the terms and conditions that you can't use prefixes to route your calls through other providers once you sign up to this package.

Tom Dunne

Let me confirm if I have this correctly - you switch over to UTV, pay line rental and nothing else and you get free off peak calls up to one hour in duration?

In comparisong to the Esat deal where they are charging 25 Eurons for the pleasure, plus line rental on top of that?

Must get the finger out and switch to UTV.

Paddy20

+ All local & national Ireland & UK Weekend* calls are free, not just the off peak

Esel

tom dunne wrote:

Let me confirm if I have this correctly - you switch over to UTV, pay line rental and nothing else and you get free off peak calls up to one hour in duration?

In comparisong to the Esat deal where they are charging 25 Eurons for the pleasure, plus line rental on top of that?

Must get the finger out and switch to UTV.

I thought the Esat deal @ €25 was for all local and national calls (not 'mainland' UK?) not just off-peak/weekend?

Tom Dunne

It isn't too clear on their website. Then again, they don't mention off-peak, so it must include peak.

Still, with both myself and my wife at work during the day, the UTV deal seems more enticing.

_Kaiser_

Hi all,

Just to clear a point up...

Accordin to their site the FREE calls are weekends and off-peak.. peak rate calls are charged for, but at a cheaper price than eircom - see the link in my first post or their tariff sheet here

Hope this helps..

Couch Potato

couple of Questions :

1) Is the line rental the same as Eircon ? - Why can't they reduce this ? - Isn't the wholesale price due today ?

2) What about the Eircon Voice Mail services - are these lost ?

seamus

Couch Potato wrote:

couple of Questions :

1) Is the line rental the same as Eircon ? - Why can't they reduce this ? - Isn't the wholesale price due today ?

You just answered your own question.

mobpd

hi
what are utvs time definitions for evening and weekend? are they the same as eircon?
thanks
mobpd

Couch Potato

seamus wrote:

You just answered your own question.

more info here ...

When will my line rental move to UTV Talk?
The line rental portion of the UTV Talk service is still in testing. We will only move your line over to UTV Talk once we are assured that the quality of service, fault repair and the billing is of the highest quality. We will contact you before the change-over.

Still in testing then ?????????????????

fatherdougalmag

Also keep in mind that there's a 12 month contract and that if you're line ends up with UTV you won't be allowed to route calls over other people's networks (e.g. Telestunt). I'm going to sit tight and see if Eircom, Esat or someone else responds with something else before signing up to a contract.

fatherdougalmag

Actually now that I look closer, they just define the term "minimum term" but they don't use it anywhere in the terms and conditions. Must look into that.

RicardoSmith

If you are an existing dialup customer UTVipXL etc do get this aswell?

sceptre

RicardoSmith wrote:

If you are an existing dialup customer UTVipXL etc do get this aswell?

From the FAQ it appears that anyone can sign up - you don't have to be an existing customer of any sort

Can anyone sign up for UTV Talk?
Anyone with an active Eircom line can sign up for the service.

RicardoSmith

sceptre wrote:

From the FAQ it appears that anyone can sign up - you don't have to be an existing customer of any sort

What I really mean is it included in your existing telephony/internet charge? or do you have to pay it in addition to your existing subscription?

sceptre

RicardoSmith wrote:

What I really mean is it included in your existing telephony/internet charge? or do you have to pay it in addition to your existing subscription?

Sorry Ricardo, you've lost me.

The way I understand it is that we're paying 24.18 a month to Eircom for line rental.

I'm also paying UTV 29.99 for BB

You're paying UTV whatever you're paying them for UTVipXL

If I go for this, I pay Eircom no more money and pay UTV 24.18 plus 29.99 a month, then I get my free off-peak calls as long as I commit myself to paying them that 24.18 a month for the next year (my BB contract runs out next March so I can continue with this part or drop it at my whim). As far as I can see it's as simple as that.

In your case you do the same if you go for this.


Sorry if I'm stating the obvious and your question's a little more complicated.

RicardoSmith

Sorry, I'm being stupid. I didn't realise this was line rental, not phone charges etc.

Paddy20

Naturally, you will also have to pay 'peak time telephone call charges' as well, but at least they are Cheaper* than EirCon

Nothing in this world is really free !. Except U.TV TALK off-peak and all weekend local & National, and UK Mainland telephone calls, of course.

Lissavane

I note that while call charges under the existing UTVIP phone service are generally about 25% less than Eircom at all times, peak calls under the new Talk package are just 10% less than Eircom - eg National Peak call with existing package 6.15cents/min; with new offering 7.35cents/min.

It will suit me fine though as nearly all my calls are evening and weekend.

Paddy20

Yep, did notice, but what do we want ?.. "Jam on it"

Cork

So, is there one bill for phone and internet?

Do they send out hard copies?

Paddy20

1;Yes [one bill from U.TV] No more line rental bill from EirCoN

2;Itemised bill available on account website, or hard copy upon request {If you do not have a printer or computer filing system}

I will forward my bill to you later ?..

Our man in Havana

do they support isdn rental?

Paddy20

Why not ask them?.. Mr Bond :rolleyes:

chump

Somebody who was dissing the Esat Product

I thought the Esat deal @ €25 was for all local and national calls (not 'mainland' UK?) not just off-peak/weekend?

http://www.esatbt.com/ie/residential/homephone/index.html

You just need to spend a minimum of €15 (Incl. VAT) per month on calls to Local, National, International and Mobile numbers!

The important thing being the mobile calls, as these are the calls that vastly make up regular users home phone bills.

I still believe no provider offers really competitive mobile rates...

You can bundle IOL BB with the Advantage package and get charged a monthly €33.15, which is very good for the 8GIG limit.

Only thing is after the 3 month free trial you must pay the installion charge of 90E I believe.

Back on to the mobile rates topic... who offers the best deal at the minute? Anyone know?


after reading again I may have got confused as to the point, ie. Esat charge for what UTV offer for free...

* For €25 per month, you can call any Irish fixed line local and national (32 counties) phone number for up to an hour each call as many times as you like!

That seems to mean on peak as well!

sorry

Ripwave

Paddy20 wrote:

Yes, I spoke this evening to U.TV TALK, and they asked me to send an e-mail raising my plight with: support@utv.com

I was assured that within a few days this "Oversight" which is not answered in their FAQ's section would be resolved in favour of people in my position.

I raised this issue with UTV about two months ago, and was very disappointed with the response - "Never heard of this - you should check with the Dept of Social Welfare".

I pointed out that there are over a quarter of a million such "free" telephones provided by the Department in Ireland (all people over the age of 70 are entitled to the free telephone allowance), and that it really would be in UTVs own interest to figure out how the system works.

I didn't get any response.

By the way, the Department changed the rules on how this benefit is paid this time last year to make it much easier for companies other than eircom to take part in the scheme - it's not an "eircom only scheme", but eircom have managed to make the way they include it in the telephone bill look so complicated that it may well be scaring some people off from selecting other providers.

chump

Ripwave, why would the other telco's bother with the OAPs?

Even with the line rental being paid by the govnt. I can't see any great earning propects from these type of customers. They also are dodgey enough payers, none being DD, and them paying like 5-10euro a week in the post office, this kinda thing.
They also phone the helplines alot...

I think the new telco's want to aim towards the younger generations who spend huge amounts on calls to mobiles, or calls abroad, internet packages and the like...

Ripwave

chump wrote:

Ripwave, why would the other telco's bother with the OAPs?

Even with the line rental being paid by the govnt. I can't see any great earning propects from these type of customers. They also are dodgey enough payers, none being DD, and them paying like 5-10euro a week in the post office, this kinda thing.
They also phone the helplines alot...

I think the new telco's want to aim towards the younger generations who spend huge amounts on calls to mobiles, or calls abroad, internet packages and the like...

Frankly, that's one of the most ignorant and ill-informed comments I've seen on Boards in a long time (and that's saying a lot).

Not all of the 280,000 people that are in receipt of the free telephone allowance are OAPs, but many of the over 70's who do receive it are quite well off (especially in this age of soaring property prices, a person with an established house free of a mortgage can release a considerable amount of equity).

"Silver surfers", as they are sometimes called, are a very significant sector of the market in the US, and proud grandparents of grandkids who live half way round the world are often very interested in how the internet can help them keep in touch.

Not to mention the fact that retired people living at home are more likely to make use of their phones during the day (when the calls aren't free) than younger people who are at working during the day.

Even if 1% of the people in receipt of the free phone allowance switched over to UTV, it would generate cash-flow of over €75K a month. It's not the sort of market that any self respecting telecoms company can afford to ignore.

gurramok

I'm an existing UTV telephony customer.
Tried to fill in the online form but it gives an error
"AN ERROR HAS OCCURRED: Number already registered on this or other conflicting UTV product. Please contact us."
Guess I have to wait for the migration link to appear in the 'myaccount' section as they say in FAQ, can't be bothered being put on hold over a phone .

Our man in Havana

Does anyone here think that ESAT will move to counter this move by UTV? I am with esat and i am tempted to move.

JTMan

chump wrote:

I still believe no provider offers really competitive mobile rates...

Telestunt are. 4C calls to mobiles. www.telestunt.ie

Speaking of which are 0818 calls included in your allowance with the unlimited Esat BT package?

Paddy20

Good on Ya, Ripwave* .

I'm with you, what a "Chump" that poster is

Tom Dunne

Bond-007 wrote:

Does anyone here think that ESAT will move to counter this move by UTV? I am with esat and i am tempted to move.

I don't think so.

I'm with Esat also and I am very tempted to jump. I think I'll hang on for a month or two to see, but I really can't see them matching UTV.

asmith

Paddy20 wrote:

Yes, I spoke this evening to U.TV TALK, and they asked me to send an e-mail raising my plight with: support@utv.com

I was assured that within a few days this "Oversight" which is not answered in their FAQ's section would be resolved in favour of people in my position.

Paddy20, have you had any more joy with this? I've just seen this http://u.tv/talk/search.asp?faqid=62 on their website so it looks promising. I rang them to confirm if the department would still pay the line rental but the sales rep said "yes" a bit too quick, as if she wasn't really listening to the question.

I dont' want to start the process of moving from Eircom only to find a month from now that UTV aren't really in the department's scheme at all.