Starting out again..

jester77

Hi,

I haven't done much exercise in the past 3 years, mainly due to work reasons and not being able to get a routine going. After seeing myself in some photos I've decided it's time to do something about it! I now have a double chin and pot belly.

I joined a gym 2 weeks ago and got set up with a program.
It basically involves 30 mins jog, some weights for chest, back, abs and upper legs - no arms. And finishing with a 15 min cycle.
The instructor put most emphasis on back excercises to strengthen it as I sit on front of a computer all day. How does this program sound to you? My goal is to reduce my body fat down to the mid to low teens.

I told the instructor that I find jogging very boring and he said that I could split it 15mins jog and 15 mins rowing.
Is there anyway to get over this boredom. I find it very hard to last even 15 mins jogging? Cycling and rowing are fine for me but do they burn off as much fat as jogging?

Also diet, mine was bad. Never had breakfast, usually had an ok lunch and a dinner that was usally Chinese or pizza. I drink alot of beer as we go to the pub to watch almost every game that's on TV! I know this has to stop.. Is there an alternative to the beer that I could drink when I'm out, apart from minerals, juices and water?? Are spirits just as bad?

I don't know much about carbs, protein, etc From reading other posts here I've tried to put a diet together.
For breakfast (8:30am) I now have 2 weetabix with 3.5% fat milk and a glass of orange juice. At about 10:30 I have a banana.
Lunch (12:30) is difficult as options are limited in the canteen. I have a salad, some days there is tuna there and I have that with it.
I go to the gym after work at 18:00 until 20:00 on Mon, Wed, & Fri/Sat. Now this is where I'm not sure. What would you reccomend for a good dinner?
and should I be eating smaller snacks during the day?

I want to get a toned body for the first week of October with a flat stomach - not looking for the 6 pack yet Is this a realistic goal on the above plan or would I need to do more? Also I am on hols for 3 weeks in June so that leaves a little less time in my plan.

Thanks a million!

tunney

What weight are you? What height are you? What age are you?

Running is boring to start off with but stick with it you could find that you love it.

jester77

I'm 26, 5ft 11 and between 13.5 and 14 stone.
Hopefully the boredom will wear off. I also get a pain in my lower back after about 12 mins running, I run at 10.5 km/hr. But I'm hoping the back strengthening exercises will help this.

Fudger

a few weights and hit the pool, best excerise and you limit body damage threw wear and tear.

dave13

To combat boredom bring your own music. Get a little MP3 player or something. I find i can last a lot longer if i'm listening to music i like instead of the s**t they play in my gym.

tunney

So you're looking to drop about 2 stone? Could be ambitious to aim to do that for october - and keep it off. Aim to lose about 2 pounds a week - and make sure its not water that you are losing!!! If you lose a stone by october you'll not recognise your own body so stick at it!

Trojan

Sounds grand - you're probably not that overweight unless you're very lightly built (I'm same weight at 5'7).

I'd be slightly concerned about the back pain - have you been completelly sedentary the last few years? Maybe you just need to ease back into it more lightly (though 10kmph/12 mins is very light). I agree with the pool suggestion.

tunney

Fudger, as I sit here with a mangled shoulder I can't help but disagree with yuor statement that swimming doesn't result in injuries

tunney

5 11 and 14 stone is overweight - never mind 5 7 and 14 stone (unless body builder type)

jester77

hmm, kind of embarassed to say but I can't swim. Plus where I am at the moment I don't have access to a pool.

jester77

@Trojan
I haven't done much exercise for about 3 years. I work in front of a computer so I'm kind of hunched over the desk all day and my posture is not the best. My instructor acknowledged this so he has me doing alot of exercises for the back.


What would be the ideal weight for someone my height 5ft 11. I'm of medium build.

Trojan

Originally posted by tunney
5 11 and 14 stone is overweight - never mind 5 7 and 14 stone (unless body builder type)

Bull!

I'm nowhere near builder size. Next you're going to refer me to the BMI

FWIW logic1 reckoned me at about ~15%BF yesterday... I'm 5'7 and 86kg at last measurement.

ymmv

Al.

logic1

Originally posted by Trojan
Bull!

I'm nowhere near builder size. Next you're going to refer me to the BMI

FWIW logic1 reckoned me at about ~15%BF yesterday... I'm 5'7 and 86kg at last measurement.

ymmv

Al.

We have to realise Al isn't the typical body type either though. Broad across the shoulders, thick across the chest can easily carry 80/90kg without fluctuation over time.

What bodytype would you say you are Jester? You can get an extremly rough idea by measuring wrist size, ankle size and neck size but basically if you're looking in the mirror and have jelly rolls hanging down you're overweight.

It's not rocket science

But for anyone that is overweight and think it's a life long struggle it's not, with extremly strict diet and cardio you can make a massive difference in 8 Weeks. Do an 8 week stint, daily cardio or at least 4 hours per week and excellant diet in 8 weeks you'll be substantially leaner. Keep a food diary, take before and after pictures, all of these things help motivation levels. After the 8 weeks take a 1 week break, eat some pizza, have some burgers. If you need to then do another 8 weeks after the week break.

By september you should be happy with your looks. Remember if you cheat you're only cheating yourself. I could care less if you eat 10 mars bars a day you're only making a fool out of one person.

If you really are serious about this we can help you with diet and routine but the willpower is up to you.

.logic.

jester77

Thanks logic1,

I wouldn't say I'm too overweight. I have small double chin, neck, wrists and ankles have no weight on them, fairly normal. Carrying a bit around the waist, pot belly and saggy "man-boobs". It's noticeable when wearing a shirt and I tuck it in.

I played GAA up until 3 years ago and was in good shape but since I stopped playing the weight has gradually creeped on. I've done no real exercise since then.

I know it won't dissapear overnight, took 3 years to get like this - hopefully not 3 years to get back to the way I was! I think my main problem is my diet more than my routine. I have the willpower plus a guy I work with is going to join me from next month so at least we can motivate each other, make it a little easier for me.

Genghis

Originally posted by jester77
I'm 26, 5ft 11 and between 13.5 and 14 stone.
Hopefully the boredom will wear off. I also get a pain in my lower back after about 12 mins running, I run at 10.5 km/hr. But I'm hoping the back strengthening exercises will help this.

LOL, so you are 14 stone! However, I agree with Trojan that that is not hugely overweight. If you are medium build and you can lose a stone and a bit to bring you under 13 stone, then I would say that you will have achieved what you set out to do.

People have referred to bodyfat % as a measure of ideal weight. Did you get this done at your gym? If you didn't, ask them to do it as, in conjunction with the scales, it is a very good measure of progress. Relying simply on the scales can be disheartening. As you build fitness to a certain extent you replace fat with muscle. On a scales it can look like you haven't lost "weight" (i.e. you didn't), though you have lost "fat", and as a result you will look more toned.

A very good benchmark is also the unsolicited comments of people - friends, family, people who see you occasionally. And of course that inspiring photo - keep that one within viewshot and make your own comparisons as you progress.

Best of luck!

tunney

Next you're going to refer me to the BMI

LOL - not a chance. According to BMI i'm overweight body fat % of 12% BMI only works for sedentary people

logic1

Getting someone to partner with will make it alot easier.

The main thing is getting your diet right. You'll be surprised at how much you actually can eat and still loose weight as ong as it's the right food.

Try get 6 small meals a day in, forget about the concept of breakfast, lunch and a large dinner.

It's the worst routine to follow for weight loss. Try to get a breakfast high in complex carbs and low in sugars, oatmeal, branflakes anything like that and you needn't worry about the skimmed milk, use full fat if you want as long as it's not a gallon

If you breakfast at 8 then have a snack at 11, a snack can consist of a piece or two of fruit or a protein drink or a health bar snack anything along those lines again complex carbs and little simple sugars if possible.

Then for lunch have tuna, chicken, fish, salad, any type of wholemeal bread, low fat spread, low fat mayonaiise, low fat dressings, fruit you really have quite alot to choose from.

3 o clock again have a snack like 11. Then try to keep dinner as close to 6 o clock as you can. After 6:30/7pm you don't want to be eating any more carbohydrates. For dinner as lunch you can have chicken, fish, wholemeal pasta, yams (nice alternative to potatos), tuna, steak, any lean meats, lean mince, lean burger patties, wholemeal breads again and low fat sauces. Try keep away from high fat pasta sauces but a wholemeal pasta dish with sauce once a week won't kill you as long as other areas of diet are strict.

Again the main things you want to cut out of your diet are simple sugars, excess of minerals (a can of coke every second day or so won't kill you either but keep it irregular), white breads and pastas (any overly processed foods) and high fat content sauces etc..

Keep track of your weight, weekly weigh in, if you don't loose weight for two weeks in a row something in your diet or routine needs to be looked at.

As for beers try any of the low calorie beers, coors light, or stick to cleans horts like vodka. Try not to overdo it on pints and creme liquers

Keep a diary of every thing you eat in a one week period. If you can, work out the total amount of calories you've taken in. If you're unsure you can mail the weeks diet on to me and I'll take a look at it and see if you're on the right course or not.

.logic.

jester77

Thanks Genghis,

I didn't get my bodyfat % measured, I will ask next time. As for the scales, I never use it anyway. I rely more on how I look in the mirror. I didn't know my weight until I went to the gym and as far as I can remember I think I was 12 stone last time I stood on a scales but I was in relatively good shape then.. so I was a little shocked, but not surprised!!

I know what you mean about the comments - some of my relations made a few comments last time I saw them. Next time I will see them is in October at a family wedding, so that's why I've set that date as a target. Hopefully the comments will be nicer then

jester77

Thanks a million logic1,

Shouldn't be hard to cut out minerals and white bread as I don't normally eat or drink these. I can cut back on the pasta. Should I avoid alot of dairy products, particulary chesse? I tend to eat alot of it.

There are the days I don't get home from the gym until around 8:15. I go straight to the gym from work as it's too awkward to go home and go back to the gym. What would your recomend as a dinner as it is late in the evening when I get back?

Also what are compex carbs as opposed to ordinary carbs?

Thanks.

moby2101

Hi,
Someone on here a little while back mentioned a book that they'd found useful, ...Its "Nutrition For Serious Athletes" by a guy called Dr. Dan Bernadot....
the best 20 yo yos you'll ever spend on your way to a better body and lifestyle.

I'm 6ft 2 and now weigh 12.5 st, I stepped up to the scales this time 3 years ago at 15.0 st , similar backround to yourself Jester, I played GAA and soccer but had to stop due to injury and piled on the weight over a period of 2-3 years, sitting in front of a PC all the time and wrecking my back and posture.

I joined the Gym and got the weight down to 13.5st in the time frame youre talking about.

I did find it hard to maintain my weight, I could get to 12.5 and then back up to 13.0 or more with in a fortnight, I wasn't managing my diet probably I found the book really allowed me to get the edge I was missing for my training.

I eat healthily all of the time but still have my beers @ the weekend. (I substituted pints of beer, for bottles of beer, less volume....)
I've comleted a few sprint triathlons and am on course for a few Olympic distannce tri's b4 the end of the year.

Best of luck Jester, YOU WILL STUN your rellies @ that wedding!!!!

jester77

Thanks Moby2101,

It's good to hear that, especially as our backgrounds are quite similar starting off!

I came acroos that book while reading through the threads here, sounds good. I really don't know anything about nuitrition, is ok for someone like me or does it expect you to be a little familiar with nutrition?

Wow, sounds like you made unbelievable progress, that's excellent. Hopefully I can say the same thing in 3 years

Best of luck with triathlon at the end of the year!

moby2101

Hi Jester77,

That book is generally meant for Coaches and Athletes., but will suit you down to the ground, and demystify some off the BS thats out there regarding diet and foods.
Its a bit long winded at times but has excellent case studies and reference guides.

It looks only at safe and natural methods of eating good food as fuel for sport.

It really helped me, you'll find at times in your training that you'll plateau and get stuck on a weight or a running time etc..... Generally I found that I wasnt eating correcly at that time.

Even as youre starting out it would help you formulate a plan of action along with what other information the more experienced guys on here will pass on to you.

Invest in a little mp3 player or radio you'll find it breaks the tedium on the machines, I've gone to the gym without mine on a few occasions and winced in pain listening to the ****e on the Gym stereo!!!
Keep us up to date with your progress.

jester77

Think I will get that book, sounds just like what I need. Thanks Moby2101
I will also get an MP3 player, music does tend to suck where I am!!

Trojan

Since I got my new bike I've been out loads, as well as commuting (even though it's a tiny distance). Has made an enormous difference - I think it's due to lots of little cardio regularly. I'm sure Niall can confirm that. I seriously urge anyone attempting to lose bodyfat to take up cycle commuting (any distance).

Corksham

For motivation defo buy a book like Fit For Life or one of the many on motivation and excercise / diet. MP3 player good idea indeed I use one, hope on the old bike as well at the weekends burns the Saturday night beers away.
I'd read a little first to get some motivation / ideas and whilst you dont need to be an expert on diet would be worth reading up on the subject.
Cardio is key to weight loss, worry about toning with weights once the body fat drops a little.

One last thing --> Fair play for getting back in to it and good luck.

AthAnRi

Hi Jester77,

I am in a similar situation as yourself. Trying to lose a couple of stone if possible. I have come accross a few websites that I find very useful. The first is

Netfit.co.uk. It offers great advice on all the different diets and exercise programs. There is a load of info on the site and it also outlines a number of programs that you may want to consider if the back gets a little stronger.

The other website I found useful is Nutrawatch. As you are working with computers all day I assume you have day to day access to the net. If so then this site is very handy for keeping track of the food you will eat during the day. It has a datbase of most foods but will allow you the option to add new foods to the database. As far as I know the trial version is free but for a reasonible fee, something like $20 for the year it will allow you to keep track of the exercise you have done.

I'm sure there are probably other sites like these but these are the ones that are keeping me motivated at the mo.

I like you find the threadmill very boring so I do all my running in the great outdoors. I know it can be difficult in this country but if it's dry I find it the best way to enjoy running. Another disadvantage I find of using a threadmill is that you are lured into a false sense that you are getting fit. I found that I could easily run for 20 mins on a threadmill and when I started running outside I could barely manage 10.

Rowing is an excellent form of exercise and will help you burn of calories as fast as running. It helps to work most parts of your body but concentrate on a good technique at the start and build up gradually.

Personally I find that it is better to start of slowly and concentrate on getting techniques right. Then gradually build up. Keep records of all times and distances and graduall improve on them. Don't try and smash your record in the first week.

Best of luck with it and let us know how you get on.

gibbie

I usually don't get home until 8-8:30 because I go to the gym after work. A trainer told me last year that I shouldn't be eating after 8pm and above all, should not be consuming grains that late at night. So, what I do to compensate is I have my big meal of the day at lunchtime. If you have a canteen at work, that shouldn't be too difficult. I have a small snack before the gym (usually cheese) and then when I get home I have a small meal - usually salad and a hard-boiled egg or something like that.

I don't skip eating cheese. I don't eat much dairy anyway so it's my primary source of calcium. I also figure that even thought it has fat, it's also protein and is therefore burned faster. A small piece of cheese also fills you up.

You didn't mention anything about drinking water. Try to drink 2l a day at least. It's hard to do at first but after awhile, you'll find yourself thirsty all the time if you don't do it. I have a big glass right when I get up in the morning and grab another one when I walk into work. By lunch, I've had a litre. Drinking water will make you feel fuller so you won't hit the vending machine.

gibbie

I forgot to mention a great web site to help you out with the diet.

It's www.fitday.com. At first it's a bit tedious to fill in everything you eat and all your activities but since it stores recent entries, it's easier as the time goes on. It's an American web site so some portion sizes and measurements need to be converted but if you write down EVERYTHING you eat, you'll have a good idea of approximately how many calories you're consuming and what the breakdown is between carbs/protein/fat/alcohol. Sometimes the results really surprise you. And of course, as you're entering in that fourth chocolate biccie or the four pints of beer, it keeps you on track as well.

legend99

Hey Lads,
I'd be much the same. Packed in the rugby jesus about 6 years ago now and basically have crept on weight since. I'm now 27.5 years,6' 2", hoovering on the 17stone mark. I would have a big big build though, for example I take a size 48 suit jacket, and I wouldn't look overly fat, but I am seriously overweight.

Have ambitions to go back to rugby, played with a lot of the Munster players in my school/college days and feel guilty whenever I see all of them still playing. So I tried to get back running/change the diet about 3 weeks back.

First night out(always did my running outside!) it had been raining all day, pitches were flooded and I was shagged with the heavy going after about 600 meters I'd say. Managed to get a Sun/Tues/Thurs/Sat out of me, was digging garden stuff at home on the Sunday, woke up Monday with serious limp. Went physio and had a small hammer tear.

So the knee/hamstring is ok now and this is where I stand.....need to lose serious weight, which as I recall from having lots of fitness assesments people in(this is when I was playing at a high enough level that teams paid for visits!!!) is done ny loads of slow pace running but I also need more short distance work to be able to play a field sport.

Have seriously started on the salads in the last week, but obviously not all the food types needed are in those guys. So I assume I need to eat more than just those salad bowls you get in shops? Loads of greenness but obviously must be missing out some very required stuff....

Also, any advice in terms of what distance/times I should be starting at. Basically as I said I was once very fit but that was years ago...so how much can I push? Got a bit of land when tore the hammer.....kind of realised the last time I was running 4 times in a week was 1997 and I was 20!!!!! Big difference me thinks...

So I am very unfit but carrying the weight is an extra killer of course....try running with a bag of spuds in your arms...

I recall a fitness pyramid, loads of long distance running at the bottom, with 1500M then, progress to 800m, right up to 10 metre sprints, obviously doing a lot more reps as the distance gets shorter.

Even if I managed to get 2 pounds a week off from now til Sep ,thats about 2 stone, be easier to run without that.

So basically any advice/points to note would be cool. Like the other lads who started this thread I work in IT, slumped at desk, and noticed lower back pain during the first 2 nights running.....so could someone talk me through the exercises to try and avoid this....

If I get back fit and playing I'll invite ye all to a match!!!

tunney

Legend99, as much as you want to get out there and starting running fast and doing hard sessions, as you've said yourself you're quite unfit and you need to build a base first. Jog before you sprint!

dangerman

you said you find running on the treadmill a bit boring...

Just a suggestion. Stick with the treadmill for a while until your legs get more used to the pounding.

Then, if you really do find it boring i suggest taking it outside. - Nothing beats the sense of achievement of actually running a distance. The problems here are the stress you can put yourself under, so be careful.

I'm lucky enough to live near enough beach & parkland so i can avoid too much hard cement running, which puts a lot of pressure on knees etc.

Just a suggestion, but you'll certainly need to put the time in on the treadmill to build up some strength before going out. A few laps of a local park on grass is perfect. Once your fitness level increases, you can start incorporating hills, longer routes etc. You could consider signing yourself up for a 5 mile (or is it k?) fun run like the simon community one or some such [in november] to set yourself a concrete goal.

Micro1

Jester, if theres spinning in your gym take that up. YA can burn about 700 calories in a 45 minute session. Also, your doing it with a group so theres more motivation to stay and stick it out. Its hard as nails mind you, but thats what ya need. Your gonna sweat buckets.

jester77

Thanks AthAnRi and gibbie for the links, they are very helpful.

Micro1, there is spinning at the gym, I will defintely give it a try. Really need to cut down on my body fat!

Just got my BMI measured, 27.1. So looks like I've plenty of work to do Just under a quarter of my body weight is fat, that's not good. I would ideally like to have a body fat % in the low teens, at the moment it's 23.5%. If I'm attending the gym 3 times a week, doing about 70 mins of cardio and 30 mins of weights plus a healthy diet then what would be a realistic length of time to reach this goal? Would 12 months be realistic??

Going on holidays at the weekend for 3 weeks so I'll try and take it easy. Once I come back I'm giving up the drink for at least a few months. Also placing an order for the Nutrition for serious athletes book which should arrive by the time I come back!

Also, what would you recommend as good running shoes? I've had a few different ones, but I always get blisters. The current shoes I'm using are Adidas a3 (not sure the exact model). I wear thick white cotton sports socks and I'm getting blisters on my instep now, its from the edge of insole rubbing my instep, quite painful for a day or 2 after.

moby2101

Hi Jester

Good to hear youre sticking at it, how do you think youre doing??

In youre earlier posts you say you weigh between 13.5 and 14 stone, where are you at now??

Your'e currently doing 70 mins of cardio and 30 mins of weights per session 3 times a week @ the mo??
What weights workout and type of cardio are you doing.

Youre Body fat isnt too high!! When I started out I think mine was 28% ..last time I got it measured it was 11%.
You'll shift the weight and loose body fat if you stick with the excercise, hows the diet coming on??

~Giving up the beer altogether might be a bit drastic(unrealistic), just cut down ..as I said b4 I now drink bottles instead of pints, I found it makes a difference.

jester77

Hi moby2101,

It's been a bit start-stop for me at the moment. I had to do a lot of travelling over the last few weeks so it was hard to get into it. I'm on holidays for 3 weeks from this evening but once I come back I can get into the full swing of things.

It was a bit tough starting out, although it wasn't as bad as I thought. I can almost manage to finish the program that I started on, so that feels good!
I'm doing 30 mins on the threadmill, although the last 10 mins is still a walking pace and 20-25 mins on the rowing machine at the start of my session and finish with a 15 minute cycle. The weights I'm doing are all machines and I do 2x15 at a slow pace on each, can really feel the burn close to the end. Not sure of the names of the exercises. Leg squats at 80kg, chest press at 30kg, chest curl(?) at 25kg, chest pull (sort of like rowing, for the back) at 40kg, butterfly (shoulders, upper back) at 40kg, stomach crunch at 50kg, and some sit ups for my back, I lie over a bench and raise and lower my body.

I'll join the spinning classes when I return. There is also a rowing class, I might give that a go as well.

Diet still needs a little work, started eating weetabix for breakfast, lunch and dinner I still need to change. Waiting for the nutrition book that I ordered so that I can get an understanding for what I should be eating. The links that have been posted on this thread are very helpful. Fitday looks good, not sure if I would fill it in all the time but it gives a good feedback on what you are eating.

Weight is now exactly 13.5 stones, so I've lost a small bit. Once I get going in 3 weeks I hope to see some better progress.

As for the beer, i would find it difficult to just go and have a few, even if they were bottles. I'll give it up for the summer and see how i progress. Really want to try and get into good shape for the start of October. Might review my decision then.

Can your remember how long it took you to get your body fat from 28% to < 15%?
And what sort of effort were you putting in compared to what I'm doing?

moby2101

Hey Jester,

Youtre on the right track, thats a great workout to begin with.
Start to increase your weights and cardio over time, add on an extra 5 mins to your run and row one week and then the following week add 10 mins to your run etc etc.
Start logging your times and weights maybe once a week and keep your gym instructor abreast of your preogress, ask him/her to change your weights workout around every 4 weeks or so. Does yor Gym have a pool??, Swimming is great for toning.

Ive tried various workouts and routines over the years and personally I find it more efficeint and beneficial both time wise and gain return to always do weights first( after a 5-10 mins warmup) and then cardio, other guys on here will disagree.
Not good to face into a hard session of free weights if your knackered after a long run or stint on a rower.

Initially I would have done 4 workouts a week, 3 nights in the gym and 1 night on the road cycling/running...45 mins on a split weight routine and roughly 80 mins cardio.
I lost 1.5 st in the first six months, they were the hardest six DEFINITELY!! keeping it off and getting more off was relatively easier.

A good diet is crucial, cut out all the crap completely if you can (I found this very difficult) I havent had a Mc Donalds (or similar) in over 3 yrs!!

Where youre at is definely the hardest part, motivating yourself to get up and head to the gym, cutting down on the crap food and introducing good food to your diet.

It does get easier and much much better let me assure you, once you start seeing the benefits it will become almost second nature, eating healthily and working out will seem as if they always were part of your lifestyle.

I train 4 nights a week now , I got to a stage after a year or so where I wanted to do more than just workout and run on a threadmill so I started training and competing in Triathlons last year.

Enjoy your holiday and get stuck in on your return.

Trojan

Running shoes: most people recommend Asics, and that's what I've used myself (currently in Reebox). Get the Asics with the gel in both heel and main part of the foot for best absorption. Will cost 85-110 euros depending on where (some sales on in Dublin atm).

monkey24

Never mind trojans advice he has the same pair of asics for the last ten years and he stole those from the buy and sell

Go get yourself a good old pair of wellies and run through the fields that will get ya fit in know time....

emertoff

I haven't had time to read through all the posts but one book I recommend is Chris Ryan's SAS Fitness Book. There are routines for cross-terrain walking, running, swimming, cross training, indoor rowing, and a great section on weight training plus good common sense advice on diet and other matters relevant to fitness and weight loss. It's suitable for everyone from the couch potato to the more fitter amongst us and I really noticed the difference when I applied the techniques to my routines

gibbie

Not sure if they sell them here, but I wear Saucony shoes and really like them.

For a good pair of trainers, I would recommend going to a real sports store (not lifestyle sports or one of those) and get properly fitted. When I bought mine, I tried on several brands and the sales clerk had me run up and down the hall and she watched my gait for pronation, etc. They ended up being the same price as a pair of Nike or Adidas.