Getting a new pc...

Seifer

I will be getting a new pc towards the end of june ie. after my leaving cert. and just wanted to ask some questions about specs and stuff now as I won't be able to go on the internet during the exams and I want to get it asap after them.
I'll prob be getting it from dell and although I've read it is a lot cheaper to build it yourself in many of the threads here I'm not interested in doing it nor do I have the expertise.
The pc will be used almost exclusively for games both online and off. Hope to get broadband around same time.

At the moment the system I'm looking at is:
3.4 ghz intel pentium 4
1024 mb Dual Channel DDR 400
160GB (2x 80GB (7200rpm) IDE Hard drive)
256MB ATI Radeon 9800XT card with TV-Out & DVI
Dell 19" (18.0 VIS) UltraScanTM CRT Monitor
16x DVD & 8x DVD+R\+RW
Altec Lansing ADA 995 Dolby Digital Speakers with Subwoofer
Creative Labs SoundBlaster Audigy 2 (Dell) Sound Card

Comes to about €2300 but I might be able to sort out something with the VAT to bring it down to the €2000 mark.
Questions:
Most importantly is that setup reasonably well future proofed? I won't be spending any more on it but is there something I should beef up at the expense of something else?
Is it worth going for the 256mb 9800xt over the 128MB 9800 Pro, considering it adds €225 to the price?
How do the numbers on the dvd drives ie 16x, 8x affect them? I assume they're speeds but do they matter?
Would it be worthwhile to get a cd burner now or are they being phased out by the dvd ones?

Any help would be greatly appreciated and will probably result in more follow-up questions.

Mutant_Fruit

How about you pay someone to build you one.

You could probably save at least 400 on that system. And i do say at least. I think saving 600-700 would be closer, but without pricing everything i can't be certain.

I'm sure theres plenty of people here(including me) who'd happily build you a system for ERU50-100. All you'd have to do is buy the parts, and then whoever you employ can build it within 2 hours (providing all goes well).

But if you insist on going the Dell route, yeah, it is pretty future-proofed, and should last a good few years into the future.

The drive you have is a DVD Reader/writer. It reads at 16x and writes at 8x, which is pretty standard at the moment. It also burns normal CD-R's, so theres no need to splash out on a seperate CD-RW drive unless you really want to.

Seifer

Cool, thanks for the drive info.
Re the building, in my opinion its just not worth the hassle. A lot of stuff can go wrong and in all honesty im not gonna entrust €1500 of computer parts to a complete stranger. No offence to your abilities intended.

Mutant_Fruit

Its all up to you. If money isn't an issue, then go with Dell, your guarenteed that all will work, and you have your years warrenty.

If you go with someone else and get them to build it, you will save a lot of money, and be practically guarenteed that everything works first time round. And you will get at least 1 years warrenty on all the items, some items come with longer warrenties (some ram has lifetime warrenty).

If you have a resonably tech-savvy friend, get him to do it. Even if something does go wrong, you can RMA the parts and get replacements.

All in all, it really depends on what you want to spend.

And as for the difference between the Pro and XT, at the moment 256mb is overkill. But in the future it would be needed, especially if you game at nice high resolutions. If you have the cash spare, get it, otherwise dont bother.

Alternatively, wait a little while, and grab ATI's new card, the X800. That'd be one major kick-ass card, and is easily among the best out there (if not THE best).

Col_Loki

Dont go for the XT, with the newer cards comming out its a total waste. Id go for the 9800pro, 256mb Ram only becomes an issue at very high resolution and i dont think you could put it to use. Save yourself €225 and get the 9800pro......

Seifer

Will the 9800pro be able to handle half-life 2 and doom 3 when they come out? I won't be playing at very high resolutions, just your average 800/1024.
How long before the new cards drive down the price of the XT?

Giblet

I think you're insane blowing that type of cash, especially considering there will be better types of everything around the corner.

New graphics cards, motherboards, processors all of which will blow everything away.

If I were you (I wish I was ) I'd wait until the end of the summer, and get someone to build you a PC. Save money, get the components which perform best with eachother, and get the best of everything.

neokenzo

I agree in waiting a while but how long should he wait? There's always something new in the horizon anyways. He's thinking about waiting until end of June so at least by then probably the cards will come out.

Seifer

I've waited long enough to get a new pc; I'm typing this on a pentiumII 333mhz with 64mb of ram, so I won't be delaying when I buy it.
Anyway there's always better stuff around the corner, nature of the industry.
How soon til the new stuff pushes down the prices of the current?

BloodBath

Omg build it yourself. You would be surprised at how easy it is to build a rig. You have until the end of June to read up on it. It's a piece of piss m8.

You would build a far superior system for the same money with overclocking potential if you became interested in that in the future. You won't be overclocking with a Dell.

Just noticed thats only with a crt as well not even a tft so it really is a rip off.

Best sites for cheap parts are:

www.shop4memory.co.uk (free delivery)
www.komplett.ie
www.jescomputer.de (best prices)

I'd advice against the 3.4 as well. Get the 3.2 instead. Your looking at paying 200 quid extra for an extra 200mhz, I don't think so. An a64 system is also something you should consider.

Dells mobos are muck as well.

Seriously look into building it yourself otherwise you will regret it down the line when you learn more about pc's. My mistake was buying a packard bell(gettin my mum to buy 1) when I knew **** all about pc's. It was a p3 450mhz with a 7gig hard drive and onboard voodoo 3 graphics and boy did it suck the balls. Have to say the voodoo 3 was great though.

There are so many disadvantages to buying a Dell computer. You will have to buy memory off them if you want more and pay a dell techy to install it. The easiest thing to do on a pc and you lose your warranty if you do it with a Dell lol.


BloodBath

Seifer

You guys are bordering on convincing me. Suppose it would give me something to do during the summer... I'll give it some serious thought.
What's an a64?
Really should be in bed getting a good nights sleep so I can study properly instead of posting here. Thanks for the advice.

RobertFoster

Originally posted by BloodBath
It's a piece of piss m8.

I agree - if you can follow instructions for Lego, you can follow instructions for building a PC (there's less parts in a PC than a Lego set ) - plus, there's always someone on boards to answer your questions if you get stuck

a64 is AMD 64 bit (new type of processor)

Civilian_Target

Hes right. I built my PC with little expertise. Aside from floppy drives, everything only fits together in only one way.

The hard part is choosing/ordering the parts, but theres no end of advice here. A word of advice would be to order from 1 or at most 2 retailers, makes it easier on returning stuff and postage. Don't use ebay. Komplett is great for warranties, I recommend them highly.

Mutant_Fruit

I agree - if you can follow instructions for Lego, you can follow instructions for building a PC (there's less parts in a PC than a Lego set

I couldn't agree more on that statement! Except for one critical point, lego bits can generally be connected in several ways, where as PC bits can only go in one way.

And as for the order they go in? Thats easy, all you do is put in Processor, then put heatsink on. Then put the motherboard in the case and ad in everything else as you see fit. Dead simple.

Apart from saving yourself a bucketload of cash, and getting a better system, and getting your 1years warrenty (same as with dell) (and some parts have lifetime warrenty...) theres no point in bulding it yourself .

And if you are waiting til after the leaving cert, you should easily be able to pick up this incredibly good card (better than what you were plannig on getting by miles) for a bit less than currently listed. And it would still probably work out only a little more expensive than Dell's Graphics card.

uberpixie

PowerColor Radeon 9800 PRO 128MB DDR AGP €229.9

---

Chieftec BX Tower with door, Black Case €88.88

---

Intel Pentium 4 3.2 GHz Boxed PC800 Socket PGA478 €284.76

---

Abit IC7-MAX3 Mainboard S478/800mhz,SATA I875P, ATX,GbLAN,Dual-DDR,Firewire,Raid €197.57

---

Corsair TWINX1024-4000 DDR-DIMM 1024MB Kit w/two matched CMX512-4000 DIMMs €299

---

Seagate Barracuda 7200.7 200GB S-ATA 8MB cache 7200RPM
€158.51

---

MSI DVD recorder DR8-A IDE Retail DVD+R/+RW and DVD-R/-RW
€113.74

---

Creative SB Audigy 2 ZS PCI soundc. w/1394,THX, DD EX7.1, Retail
€136.73


Total: €1508.21 (something slapped together on komplett, just a rough price guide!)

Leaves you €800 to spend on monitors and speakers.

To be honest the Dell is about as much as you would expect to pay especially when you have a p4 3.4, nice speakers and a 19" LCD monitor.

The cheapest 19" lcd on komplett is over €600 (same ****ty stats more or less as the Dell one!)

To be honest building or buying dell work out very similar in price range for what you want. With Dell you get a 3yr warranty however :-)

All in all look at both options and see which is better for you. Often building your first PC costs a little extra, its when you build your second or third re-using previous parts and upgrading over time, buying quality parts do you see the cost savings and benefits.

A PC is fairly easy to physically slap together, it's the getting it to work after that is the hard part! If you do build be prepared for problems and bugs that need to be fixed and parts that should work together that don't and lots of other funny little headaches along the way:-)

Best of luck with what ever you decide to do, either way you will end up with a pc capable of playing HL2 so it's a win win situation really:-)

P.S
If you do go dell get the 9800pro (10 frames slower than an XT) then upgrade to a newer gen gfx card when you feel the need.

Mutant_Fruit

While postage from www.jes-computer.de may take a little while (i think i was just a special case...) it'll work out cheaper if you buy the stuff from jes.

I spec'ed my system on komplett.ie, and spec'ed the same parts on jes-computer.de and i saved about 150euro. Postage took 3 weeks because my packages got mislabled by Securicor, the bstards! I know the package physically arrived in ireland 1 day after it was posted (which was 2 days after i ordered).

Also, with that kind of budget, you should really look into getting an X800 from ATI. Its a lot better than the 9800pro! But the pro is still a good card...

Giblet

Originally posted by uberpixie


Total: €1508.21 (

Leaves you €800 to spend on monitors and speakers.

To be honest the Dell is about as much as you would expect to pay especially when you have a p4 3.4, nice speakers and a 19" LCD monitor.

He is getting a 19 inch CRT though with Dell, I'd hate to see how much they charge for the TFT.



With that sort of cash, definatly wait for the new socket type for the AMD64 to come out, and opt for one of them with an ATI x800. That will play Doom III, Half-life and future games.

Mutant_Fruit

ordering from jes-computer.de i estimate that you can get an
AMD 3400+
1gig of 500mhz DDRram
ATI X800
160GB HD
NEC 2500A dvd burner
motherboard
Case and Good powersupply (400watts+)
for about 1600euro.

An additional 500 will get a 19" TFT monitor, if you really want flatscreen; or an additional EUR150 will get a 19" CRT. That would be significantly better than the Dell computer, and for under the price dell quoted you.

Even if you throw in 100euro to pay someone else to build it for you (friend or stranger) you're talking saving money and getting a MUCH better system.

EDIT: AMD's excell when it comes to gaming performance, and always end up top on the benchmarks.

TacT

If you're really scared about building it yourself then get someone to install the HSF for your processor -- that's about the most likely thing you could break on a first time build. Everything else, as has been said, is easier than lego, manual to one side with instructions and you can't go wrong really. Don't fancy frying a beautiful chip like that on your first build though

Only thing to watch out for is putting the motherboard in the case. You need to install the motherboard risers for it to sit there nice and flat without contact to the case itself.
The funniest thing I've seen from people building their first Pc without experience or consultation was about this time last year -- some guy installed the motherboard without the risers and still managed to get his connections out the back of the case.
The motherboard was bent, if you can imagine the situation, picture a flat piece of paper on the ground then lift one side up while pressing down on the middle so it has a nice concave.

Miraculously I unscrewed everything, installed the risers, said 3 hail mary's and it worked and is still working. You're a jammy dodger if you're reading this, you know who you are

Mutant_Fruit

When installing my first ever mobo, i forgot the risers too. When my case was on its side, it worked perfectly, but when i lifted it verticle (the proper orientation) it wouldn't turn on, and if it was on, it'd turn off.

Luckily enough it didn't break, and its working fine ever since. But that was just me being stupid. Even if it did break, a quick RMA would have solved that problem .

To be honest, there is nothing hard about building a PC. Just remember the little risers, and be careful putting on the heatsink.

Just in case you don't know, risers are little screws, with a bolt on the end. They clip into the motherboard, and onto the case, and keep the motherboard held about 2cm's off your case, thus stopping the motherboard shorting on the case.

BloodBath

Chieftec BX Tower with door, Black Case €88.88

Uuughhh :dunno:

I hate chieftec cases. Heavy ugly pieces of ****.

Cases are kinda a personal thing and everyone has their own taste, have a look i'd recomend the following :

budgetOhhhh

Pricey but greatAhhhh

budget Eehhhh

Flower power

Sink your heat into this.

3.2c

Your mothers bored stick some juice into her before I do

2 x 160 samsung 8mb sata for RAID 0

mx510 sexeh and good

I don't like em but everyone else raves on about them - func pad

Can't see your fingers in the dark?

Sounds like a bargain

Burn baby burn

Jes total not including case

Sub-Total: € 1.039,13

Ati x800 Retailing for about 400-450 euro I think.

Brings us to about 1450.

www.shop4memory.co.uk

1Gb kit DDR PC-3700 EL Dual Channel Gold - OCZ € 263.64

Brings us to just over 1700.

Say you go for an expensive case and then delivery will bring it to 1850 max.


Now all you need is a monitor. If space isn't an issue get a good 19" crt or try and pick up a second hand 21". They are on the for sale board reguarly enough. I picked up one of the best ones you can get for 300 euro that retails for about 800-900.

All in all about 2150 and destroys the Dell system.

This is if you want to go for pentium of course. You should consider the Athlon 64 as well.

This is if your interested in overclocking in the future, if not you could just get pc3200 RAM with lower timings, drop the sp-94 and use the stock cooler and get an Ic7-g saving a few bob.

BloodBath

Mutant_Fruit

nicely linked, but in my opinion, spend another 3 euro, and get the Nec 2500A. Its a faster burner, burning DVD+-R at 8x, and CD-R(W) at 32x. Which is a hell of a lot faster than the listed one above, and all for 3 euro. Mere pocket change.

Personally, an AMD would whoop ass for gaming, they beat Intels any day, but thats your choice in the end.

Nec Link: http://www.jes-computer.de/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=147_109&products_id=15119

BloodBath

Aye I couldn't remember which dvd burner was the best. I thought it was the lite on. Cheers mutant fruit.

If you decide on an a64 your looking at changing the processor (obviously), mobo, RAM and heatsink. It should all come in around the same price though.

BloodBath

Seifer

Thanks for the amazing response, sounds more appealing now but...

A PC is fairly easy to physically slap together, it's the getting it to work after that is the hard part! If you do build be prepared for problems and bugs that need to be fixed and parts that should work together that don't and lots of other funny little headaches along the way:-)

That's what I'd be most afraid of. While usually I can figure out simple problems when they crop up I wouldn't know anthing about delving in BIOS and stuff like that. So is there a lot of messing about before you get it running the way you want it to?

Also when you're actually building it, do you have to be very wary of static? I don't want to fry a €400 graphics card just cause I'm standing on carpet.

There were some conflicting system contents there so I just want to clarify what you need:

Case
Mother board
processor
power supply?
ram
hard drive
graphics card
dvd drive
sound card
speakers
monitor
mouse + keyboard
Windows xp
Heat sink if I want to over clock

BloodBath

Everything in my post above is what you need. Nothing left out I don't think. There are loads of guides online and we are here to help. You will get great satisfaction out of building it yourself and will learn a lot in the process.

Static is not a problem either. Just ground yourself on anything that's earthed, like a radiator before handling the electronic components. I was the same when I first built mine. Grounding myself every few minutes but it's not a problem.

Also do you not know anyone with a copy of xp , that you could, ahem, borrow?

-edit- btw it's easy installing an operating system but if you set up the RAID 0 you will have to do that first, but it's also easy although I ran into a problem that took me 10 hours to figure out but it turned out to be a hardware probelm. I seriously recomend the RAID 0, from power on my computer boots in about 35 seconds.


BloodBath

Seifer

Lol at the repeated grounding!
There isn't really anyone I could get the xp software off. Do dell sell the ms software cheaper than you can get it else where ie. works and xp?
Whats RAID 0?

BloodBath

Those two 160gb hard-drives run at 7200rpm's each. The faster your hard-drive the faster it reads and writes data allowing faster loading times and copy times.

RAID 0 is basically combing your 2 hard-drives into 1. It splits the data between the 2 drives in blocks of either 16kb,32kb,64kb or 128kb. You get to select. I don't know which is better, I selected 64kb. So say you install windows xp onto your RAIDED hard-drives. As it is being copied to the harddrives it is going in 64kb block sizes (in my case) in turn to each hard-drive. This basically almost doubles the speed of your harddrives from 7200rpm to around 14000rpm as the data is being read in sequence from both harddrives simultaniously. Your 2 harddrives will now show as one 320gb harddrive.

Sorry if this is confusing you maybe someone else can explain it better.

The only downside is that if one of your harddrives fails you lose everything but hd's are pretty reliable these days especially samsung ones. Monitoring with siguardian will give you warning if one is near failing allowing you to back up your stuff to dvd or whatever.



BloodBath

Seifer

No it makes sense.:)

Mutant_Fruit

When building the computer, just don't wear big fluffy jumpers the build up static, and big fluffy rabbit slippers (i know you have them too ). Wear normal (non-fluffy) clothes and you'll be grand.

So long as you touch a radiator every now and again, you have nohing to worry about. Componants are very unlikely to die due to static so long as you take a bit of care and don't rub them up and down on your big fluffy jumpers.

Just in case noone said it already, building your own computer gives a great feeling once you have it up and running, you know its exactly what you need, and you know each and every componant inside it was got cheaper than in the shops, and is better than in the shops. I sincerely doubt that Dell will be selling X800's any time soon, and they are some serious kickass cards. Well capable of playing at max resolutions and max details, which the 9800 might not.

Also, when putting in the CPU and other bits, always hold the chips/cards by the sides of the circuit board, don't go grabbbing them around the middle/ Its safer that way.

Seifer

Radeon 9800XT 256MB DDR AGP €440
Chieftec BX Tower with door, Black Case €88.88
Intel Pentium 4 3.4 GHz Boxed PC800 Socket PGA478 €440
Abit IC7-MAX3 Mainboard S478/800mhz,SATA I875P, ATX,GbLAN,Dual-DDR,Firewire,Raid €197.57
Corsair TWINX1024-4000 DDR-DIMM 1024MB Kit w/two matched CMX512-4000 DIMMs €299
Seagate Barracuda 7200.7 200GB S-ATA 8MB cache 7200RPM
€158.51
MSI DVD recorder DR8-A IDE Retail DVD+R/+RW and DVD-R/-RW
€113.74
Creative SB Audigy 2 ZS PCI soundc. w/1394,THX, DD EX7.1, Retail
€136.73
Windows xp €206
19" crt monitor €211.75
Speakers €120
Mouse + keyboard €60
ms office small business €441

Total:€2909
+ delivery of at least €100 = €3000 (€2559 without office)

That is uberpixies recommendation matched exactly to what I would be getting off dell for €2531! (€2204 without office and ms works instead).
Don't mean to be smart but that sure doesn't look like Im saving anything. You could argue that some of the components above are slightly better than the dell ones but that's easily matched by the security that the dell machine will work.
I'm just being objective here so nobody take offence but can anyone explain the obvious discrepancies?

BloodBath

A lot of those components are a stupid waste of money. If you had followed my post you would have a better machine for less.

Don't buy the bloody 9800xt, did you not read the previous posts. The new ATI x800 pro is out for 400 euro on jescomputer and performs nearly twice as much as the 9800xt.

Chieftec? :dunno: Up to you but they are heavy,big ugly mofos.

Why get a 3.4 when a 3.2 is about 200 euro cheaper? Do you really want to spend as much for the last 200mhz of speed as you paid for the first 3200? They overclock to the same level anyway.

Instead of getting one 200gb drive get two 120gb drives and set up RAID 0.

No need for the zs soundcard either unless your using 7.1 surround sound. The Audigy 2 ls has 24bit sound and supports eax for about 60 euro.

650 euro for microsoft software :rolleyes:


BloodBath

Dman_15

dont get a lanfire. i have one. gimmicky, flimsy and overpriced.
do however get a nec2500a. also have one of these. rumour has it that they can be flashed to burn dual layer at 2.4x. they are identical in every respect to the 2510 to be released shortly except for the firmware

Seifer

I read all the posts before but my point with that post was that I can get the same from dell cheaper, I priced the 3.4ghz because thats whats in the dell machine etc.
That was posted as an equivilant to the dell pc and when actually priced turns out to be more expensive yet everyone's been saying its cheaper.

Mutant_Fruit

If you go with dell, you won't be able to upgrade the motherboard OR powersupply later, unless you replace both at the same time.

And as far as i can tell, you can save over 1500 on that system by building it yourself. Check bloodbath's post out. Whilest the parts aren't necessarily the same, the performance is equal or better...

And i'm pretty sure you can get a legal copy of XP for a mere 100euro... check komplett.ie

EDIT: Its 120ish for an upgrade version on komplett, and 250 iish for a brand new full version. I'm positive i saw it cheaper somewhere...

Seifer

Bloodbath's system is €1700 but + monitor, speakers and xp = €2332.
The same as the dell (without ms small office) but with a slower processor.

Newbie question:
AMD Athlon 64 3400+ 2.2 GHz Socket 754, 1 MB cache
How is the above equivilant/better than a pent4 3.4ghz if it only clocks at 2.2ghz? Do the athlons just use the cycles more efficently?

BloodBath

200mhz slower. You won't even notice that difference. All the components in mine are of a much higher quality. A far superior mobo. A far superior graphics card. A far superior power supply. Superior sound. Superior heatsink. Superior mouse and keyboard with a good mat. Superior RAM. Superior hard-drives and speed. A superior case. Did I say superior?


Your looking at about a 50-80% higher 3dmark score with that system than with the dell system. You will also have the option of overclocking if you wish to do so in future and all the parts come with at least one years warranty. The processor has 3 years. The RAM is lifetime.


BloodBath

dont get a lanfire. i have one. gimmicky, flimsy and overpriced.

You either love them or hate them but I love mine. The only thing thats gimicky is the flame on the front. If by flimsy you mean light then this is a good thing. Hmmm a 4kg lanfire or a 15kg chieftec. Cheers I'll take the lanfire. It's strong despite it's lightness.
It is slightly overpriced put the build quality is excellent and you get the fan controller.

Mutant_Fruit

His computer is 1700, then 250 for XP (assuming it can't be found cheaper elsewhere) and 150 for a 19" CRT brings it to about 2100euro. Postage won't be more than 50euro.

I think that is substantially less than the Dell system, and it comes with a better DVD burner, and a graphics card that is at least twice as fast as the one you choose.

And you aren't getting cheapo crap stock stuff aswell, you are getting the creme de le creme....

superfly

Jesus the Radeon X800Pro is only €6 dearer than the 9800xt pro on Komplett
you'd be mad to go for the 9800 as the new X800 is roughly twice as fast as that card

BloodBath

The 9800xt is set to drop a fair bit soon.


BloodBath

Seifer

Im purely talking about price and the 9800xt and the x800 are more or less the same price.
Mutant Fruit: The dell crt is €230 and I just picked the one off the komplett recommended monitors page for €210, speakers the dell ones are a 5.1 setup again I picked ones off komplett for €150, + xp €206 on komplett. = €567
1700+576=€2276

Bloodbath: Fine if your say that system is at least 50% better then I'll believe you.
The keyboard, however, is not superior it just has a light in it. The dell keyboards let you control the sound system and other stuff.
I didn't include the price of the mat.

neokenzo

The good thing about building your own system is that you can play around with what you want with what budget you've got. All these recommendations are good but you'll have to decide what you want for your needs.

Seifer

Thanks for the advice everyone I'll be back towards the end of june when I can really get into researching it but Im getting a bit too distracted from other things I should be doing cough, study cough, so I'll have to leave it at that for now.

BloodBath

You don't have to get the keyboard. It was just a recomendation like all the other parts were. Your just comparing price right and I have shown you that you can get a much better system for the SAME price.

It's not something to rush into but the Dell system is definately a mistake. You should have a look at an athlon 64 system as well. I'm not saying rush out and buy all those parts. I was just showing you that you could build a better system for the same money.


BloodBath

CyberGhost

Seifer, about waiting, dude! when those new things come out! even newer things will be on the way! and it will never stop! so I'd suggest get the system now if it satisfies your needs!

uberpixie

It's not something to rush into but the Dell system is definately a mistake.

-bloodbath

If the dell does what you want it do and plays all the games you want to play well, then i would not call getting one a mistake.

Yeah there dead end and use propritary mobos and cases and they are not the most upgradeable. But if they play the games you want to play well who cares?

Your looking at about a 50-80% higher 3dmark score with that system than with the dell system.

3d mark is a synthetic benchmark: who really cares what you get in it? That score differance probably only translates into 10 frames more in any game.

You going to notice 10 frames? No.

I like building, I would not buy a dell desktop, but I would not call getting one a mistake automatically.

Your right saying Seifer should look at building an intel/amd64 box and not rush it.

But he should also look at getting dell machines. It is a option worth considering.

Building is not the be all and end all.

El_MUERkO

My 2cents:

Using 2 SATA drives in Raid 0 gives an insane boost of speed to just about everything you do with your computer.

64 bit processing is the future, if your going to build a beast then do it right and get an AMD 64 or FX chip.

Get an x800 GFX card, in some shops I've seen them cheaper than 9800XTs and they are twice as fast.

BloodBath

Uberpixie getting the Dell is a mistake.

With the other machine he is looking at loading times nearly twice as fast. Games performance a lot higher.

3d mark is a synthetic benchmark: who really cares what you get in it? That score differance probably only translates into 10 frames more in any game.

Have you looked at the Benchmarks for the x800pro yet? It translates to a lot more than that. Once you go up to 1600x1200 with full detail and AA and AF you get pretty much double the framerate over the 9800xt. Far cry is unplayable with these settings on a 9800xt. You get over 60fps on the x800 with these settings.

Nearly every component you get with the self built machine is better than the dell system. Who wants a ****ty Dell mouse for online gaming when you can use a mx510 or a microsoft intellimouse.

Dell = deh balls


BloodBath

Mutant_Fruit

With the 9800XT you can't run games like Farcry (and presumably Halflife2) on max details, max resolution with max Anisotropic filtering and max AntiAliasing.

While you might think to yourself that it doesn't actually matter that much now... but in a years time the 9800 will creak at higher resolutions, while the X800 will still fly along.

Considaring that he could get a system with the X800 for less than the Dell system, that alone is well worth it. That card is literally twice as good as the 9800. Its not an exaggeration!

CyberGhost

if you want the fastest pc available to general public , get yourself X800+A64 3400+(prolly there will be 3800 by June) like guys have suggested you!

If you don't trust strangers, you can take all the parts you'll buy to pcworld or some other store with a technical department, but it will cost you! No they are not better than the guys here but they are more "official" kind

btw, Dell is cheaper!(excluding VAT of course if you can do something about it)

and I have 9700 Rad(3.06GHz/HT, 1GB RDRam), and I can play all the today's games pretty fine!

I can max out on LOMAC's settings without any framerate problems! and it's a very intensive game!



so It all comes down to Price vs performance, if you want to pay less and get a guarantee but compromise on performance a little go with Dell if you want to pay a littlebit more but get a performance go with custom made pc!

and btw! by june dell will prolly offer X800 cheaper than you can get in any shops! and you won't be compromising on any performance!

but still it's nothing better than building your own pc yourself!

BloodBath

and I have 9700 Rad(3.06GHz/HT, 1GB RDRam), and I can play all the today's games pretty fine!

Playing games fine to you is what? 1280x1024 with no AA and no AF? Try Far Cry at 1600x1200 even with no AA and no AF and let us know how ya get on lol.

so It all comes down to Price vs performance, if you want to pay less and get a guarantee but compromise on performance a little go with Dell if you want to pay a littlebit more but get a performance go with custom made pc!

He's not paying less, he is paying pretty much the same for both. Also he will still be getting a guarantee on all the parts he buys. He's not compromising on performance a little either. He's compromising a lot mainly due to the graphics.

and btw! by june dell will prolly offer X800 cheaper than you can get in any shops! and you won't be compromising on any performance!

I severly doubt Dell will be stocking it by June and even if they do it won't be cheaper than web shops.



BloodBath

Mutant_Fruit

and btw! by june dell will prolly offer X800 cheaper than you can get in any shops! and you won't be compromising on any performance!

ROFLMAO. Yeah RIGHT! I'll believe that when i see it. Big companies are NEVER ever ever cheaper than webshops, simply because big companies have big expenses, therefore big prices to compensate.

What Dell are charging for the 9800XT is the same as what you can buy the X800 for this very minute! And fine, you can play todays games... but what about tomorrows, or next years. I can guarentee you the X800 will still be fast when the 9800 is condidared a bit creaky.

so far he';s getting a far superior system, for less than the Dell (slightly less anyway). He still has a years warrenty (at least) on every part that goes into that system, and he knows every part that goes into it is high quality.

If he's not interested in overclocking, he can probably save about 100-150 euro on the system by downgrading some parts, and if he doesn't want the fancy keyboards etc he can probably save another 50 in total.

To be honest, it blows away the Dell system