Are tabloids really as bad as we think they are?

adeldorf

I'm currently studying journalism and despite the fact that I get given out to every day for buying one, I'm an avid reader of The Sun! I find broadsheets boring and monotonous .... They dont cover sport at all in the way tabloids do and to be honest I've tried to read the new independant "metro" edition and i found it too crammed and too "all over the place" .... Please take it easy on me!

flogen

my view on tabloids is this:
I hate them. Irish tabloids are terrible. I understand that to be tabloid doesnt mean to be poor, but in Ireland it does.
It does cover sport well, and entertainment too, but Im not really interested in sport, and when i buy a newspaper, i look for news, not gossip.

Irish tabloids are sensational, misleading, amazingly bias, and just poorly made. I havent read the metro Independent, so Im not sure what its like, i stick with the normal one, despite its awkwardness.:D

They do, however, cover sport better than the broadsheets.

Flogen

brian_ire

If anyone wants proof of what rubbish tabloids are, try get hold of a copy of last sundays News Of The World.

Its headlines on the front page (more or less)

"Man watches porn" and "Man doesnt pay child support"

Albeit the porn watcher was Celtic footballer Bobby Peta and the not so generous father was Paul McGrath. Still who cares, so what if Bobby watches porn, and im sure there is a lot more cases of parental neglect to their illgeitmate children that don't make it to the front covers.

I only made it to page 3 where i had to stop and promise myself i would never read this crap again.

Page 3 goes a little something like this

"Mother brings child for a walk with boyfriend"

So Jordon goes out for a walk with her baby and gets a whole page dedicated to her. The mind wonders.

monument

I don’t like redtop tabloids for the same reason flogen outlined above.

As for tabloid-size newspapers - the (London) Indo and the (London) Times tabloid-size editions compared to their broadsheet editions have both been found at times to lose information in some articles and sometimes to lose full articles

So, if the editorial quality and quantity gets harmed I don’t think the convenience of a smaller sized paper is worth it, and maintaining both sizes has reportedly been proven to be impractical, therefore it looks as if the papers currently running both will have to chose one.

alleepally

I'm not a fan of tabloids either but I think we're all interested at some level in human interest stories, gossip, celebdom or whatever and I defy anyone who would consider themselves broadsheet only not to have a good laugh reading something like the Sun for example. I was especially glad to see it today, those identical twin sisters on page 3 were stunnas!

flogen

i see your point allee... but they take human interest to the extreme, I mean broadsheets have their features, but The Sun IS a feature

saying that, i will page through the sun and laugh (more at than with), but I would never ever take it as a reliable source of news (they have had many good exclusives, but they seem to just stab in the dark, they go on the slightest bit of research and hope they get it right, sometimes they do, sometimes they go to court....).

I make no comment on page 3....:D

Flogen

alleepally

I think the absolute worst tabloid in Ireland has to be the Evening Herald. Some of their headlines are just way over the top. Now, I know they have to sell the papers but there's no competition in the Evening market so makes you wonder why. Wish I could recount some of the classics they've come up with but everything is in a "SHOCK HORROR, MARTIANS HAVE LANDED" headline even if it's a mundane news story.

NightStrike

Tabloids aren't bad. I buy a broadsheet (indo or times usually) every day and a tabloid (normally the star).

The reason tabloids are so popular, apart from the size is that they give a lot of people what they want. Some people couldn't give a toss if the economy has dropped 3% or something like that but its earth shattering news to know that Britney stripped half naked at her latest concert.

Emboss

Originally posted by NightStrike
Tabloids aren't bad. I buy a broadsheet (indo or times usually) every day and a tabloid (normally the star).

The reason tabloids are so popular, apart from the size is that they give a lot of people what they want. Some people couldn't give a toss if the economy has dropped 3% or something like that but its earth shattering news to know that Britney stripped half naked at her latest concert.

She stripped half naked?

christ what paper was that in!!!

sixpack's little hat

funnily enough ...
tada!

I have to say that i can't read a tabloid from cover to cover,always end up throwing it down in disgust.
I find sports coverage in the times and the examiner to be just as good as that in the tabloids.

monument

Originally posted by alleepally
I'm not a fan of tabloids either but I think we're all interested at some level in human interest stories, gossip, celebdom or whatever and I defy anyone who would consider themselves broadsheet only not to have a good laugh reading something like the Sun for example. I was especially glad to see it today, those identical twin sisters on page 3 were stunnas!

I've seen some good "human interest stories" in the Guardian, the Observer, the Dublin & London Indos, the Sunday Times, and the BBC online.

I'd be lying if I said I'm not interested at some level of what the tabloids have to offer, however they normally go too far, sink too low, and they don’t come close to my politic or moral views.

simu

I find broadsheets boring and monotonous .... They dont cover sport at all in the way tabloids do

Many tabloid readers say this but is it really true? I read the Irish Times and it has sports coverage every day. I have no interest in sport and skip these pages but are they really all that dull? Tom Humphries, for example, from the little I've read of him seems to be a fairly interesting writer.

Or is it that tabloids are more sensational in their sports coverage in the same way that they are with other news and entertainment sections? In what "way" exactly do tabloids cover sports that makes you think they do it better than broadsheets?

sceptre

It's odd to read Jeremy Clarkson's column in the Sun and compare it to his column in the Sunday Times. He uses shorter words in the Sun.

monument

Originally posted by sceptre
He uses shorter words in the Sun.

Some papers make it a requirement, in other words you’re told want words you can use.

Equally broadsheets have house rules for language usage, but normally they are in place to maintain correct usage of the written word, for example the Guardian have a “style guide”.

flogen

ah the style guide,
yes, thats something that most papers will have, it stops some fine piece of literature getting into the sun (:p) and some trash getting into the Times...:D

just like bias; tabloids will have one set bias, eg the sun is right wing, the mirror is left... but lets save bias for another thread

Flogen

Exit

I can't stand them myself, but I had this argument with a few people before and one person said that it brings news to people who are unwilling to read broadsheets. It's usually very biased news, but I suppose at least giving people some information isn't such a bad thing.

And unfortunately the Herald is really delving into the tabloid market. What was it yesterday, the first 4 pages full of David Beckham having an affair. I'd love to know how exactly that affects an Irish audience (or any audience for that matter) so much that it's headline news.

star gazer

I think in fairness tabloids speak a different language to the broadsheets and not necessarily worse because of it. Ok once you understand that there are different priorities in a tabloidesque newspaper it makes it interesting to read a different perspective. Broadsheets can get caught up in their own worlds and miss some stories and while tabloids tend to exagerate human interest stories and lighten-up political stories they do have a flair for crime stories and are generally braver in going with contentious stories.

like it or not men like looking at pictures of good looking women and women like to... i'll stop generalising right there before i get in trouble.

tabloids are here to stay

flogen

I can't stand them myself, but I had this argument with a few people before and one person said that it brings news to people who are unwilling to read broadsheets. It's usually very biased news, but I suppose at least giving people some information isn't such a bad thing.

this is true, however the way Irish (or Oirish) tabloids work means that the bias can be quite strong, for example Bush is undeniably right and brave for going to war with Iraq in the Sun, while the Mirror will put the war down even if WMD were found. While it does give news coverage for people uninterested in broadsheets, it does a very bad job at covering the news (generally, not always though)

I think in fairness tabloids speak a different language to the broadsheets and not necessarily worse because of it. Ok once you understand that there are different priorities in a tabloidesque newspaper it makes it interesting to read a different perspective. Broadsheets can get caught up in their own worlds and miss some stories and while tabloids tend to exagerate human interest stories and lighten-up political stories they do have a flair for crime stories and are generally braver in going with contentious stories.

It is true that tabloids are ahead of broadsheets when it comes to something like investigative reporting, and they do tend to throw caution to the wind more frequently, but thats the problem, when they sensationalise a story, or print it without a good bit of research behind it, they can sometimes be way off and destroy someones reputation for no reason.
There is a place in media for investigative journalism, but it should be consise and educated, and not generalising or full of guesswork.

oh, and when i buy a newspaper I look for news (and maybe a tiny amount of human interest, depending on the topic), I dont look for stories of celebrity affairs (its their personal problem, let them sort it out as a family) or famous people getting drunk (again, so what?), and if I want nudity, there are plenty of other ways of seeing it.

Flogen

star gazer

originally posted by flogen
There is a place in media for investigative journalism, but it should be consise and educated, and not generalising or full of guesswork.

to a point but i think there should be a little room to make reasonable assumptions because sometimes there are stories that people want to know about even need to know about, but the broadsheets are too conservative to run with. Being a tabloid also means that people can dismiss it more easily and the story if light enough won't get them sued. The media in this country go to long lengths to not have an opinion as an entire paper/station but some of their reporters do show some leanings one way or another, maybe it would be better to see clearer editorial stance.

flogen

I have to disagree.
If a paper, broadsheet or tabloid wishes to report something as fact then they should be able to back it up. It is not a matter of being more conservative, but being more cautious. A story reported falsely in a broadsheet can be just as damaging as one in a tabloid, and is just as liablous, no matter how lightly you report it.

In news there is no room for guessing, and anything that is not backed up by strong facts is open to being the subject of a court case.
Broadsheets dont put as much work into investigative journalism as tabloids do, which IMO is why they dont seem to be reporting as much. Tabloids, however do, and have quite often gotten some great exclusives, however sometimes they have made allegations without enough evidence and have been (rightly) sued.

Flogen

Metallicababe

Well I rather enjoy both tabloid and broad sheet!!!!


As I read both I take different stories from them when I want national news stories i'll read the indo when i want entertainment stories i'll read the star....

both newspapers have different merits theres a wide enough market for both

Cork

Tabloids are trash. It is a sad reflection on people that trees are being knocked to produce such rubbish.

News Storys are sensationlist. It is like coffee break chit chat fodder.

emertoff

The Star is not too bad (still don't buy it) but I really dislike the Irish versions of The Sun and Mirror. To be honest I have not read them at all for a long while but when I did they couldn't be bothered to do an editorial relevant to Irish readers and just treated us as an off-shoot of the UK. 20 years ago The Sun was calling for a boycott of Irish agricultural produce in the UK because of our neutrality on the Falklands War.
and in general terms was quite anti-Irish in its editorial policy. We should not forget that.

On a wider level, the tabloids zealous invasion of privacy is sickening as is the type of voyeristic lifestyle they tend to promote. Behind every celebrity caught sleeping around,taking illegal drugs or whatever there is also an innocent family having to put up with being made prisoners in their own homes because of this. And all this without even a mention of Rupert Murdoch. I can't understand how his views manage to exert such an influence particularly when they are rammed down the throats of readers.

Pedrolino

Interesting discussion,

I wouldn't be a fan of them myself, I find a lot of tabloids to be ridiculously sensationalised, unabashedly prejudiced and lightweight. I consider the Dialy Mail a tabloid in this regard.
Found a few blogs convering this sort of stuff which have interesting stuff

http://poorlywrittennews.blogspot.com/

www.fivechinesecrackers.com

Dave!

Yes, the tabloids in Ireland are absolutely disgusting.

Special mention to the Daily Mail and Evening Herald, they are the worst.

Whippersnapper

If you want news, read a broadsheet. If you want gossip, read Heat magazine. I don't see why anyone would buy the likes of The S*n and feel somewhat informed after it. Can tabloids even be considered newspapers? If your idea of news is the type of stuff you hear the neighbours yapping and complaining about then perhaps.

uvox

Some perspective people - the antidote to bad journalism isn't good journalism. The antidote is history.

Where was the Irish Times ten years ago on child abuse? Did Fintan O'Toole object to the size of the Irish Times property supplement then? Anyone remember Roisin Ingle's property porn pumping up of the Gasworks property in Dublin - sorry, I mean Googleland?

By spring, the lyrical hoardings around Dublin's shiniest new neighbourhood at the city's old gasworks will be down. Róisín Ingle finds out what life there might be like.

To the irritation of those who have moved in, much of the new south Docklands neighbourhood is a building site, but here is a glimpse of what developers hope the place might be like when it's finally finished.

Think New York-style penthouse living. Think quayside roller bladers. Think borrowed sugar from the young solicitor in the apartment next door and lattés sipped on river-facing balconies.

Think elegance. Think affluence. Think easy like Sunday morning.

Source: http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/property/2006/0112/1134117221118.html


Here's Ingle, today, about homemade (that must be 'bespoke' in the Irish Times 'Style Guide') Christmas presents:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/magazine/2010/1127/1224283996450.html

Given the economic situation before us, and their involvement in what has happened, ask yourself: Is the Irish Times 'better' than the Irish Daily Star?

steelcityblues

I don't even buy the 'they do sport better' argument. Look at the Irish Indo's excellent sports section on Monday, where the follower gets detailed reports on the weekend's soccer/rugby/GAA/golf and provide the latest tables.

Also, broadsheets usually manage to avoid the insert random world-class footballer going to Chelsea or Man United transfer nonsense which armchair fans seem to always lap up.

Credit to the Sunday Times too for doing interesting, detailed feature pieces on leading sports figures, of which you won't really find in the tabloids.

In short, if you want to read on a daily basis about useless vaccums like Cheryl Cole, Simon Cowell, Jordan, etc. then they are great, but don't expect much else.

UngratefulWhelp

flogen wrote: »

this is true, however the way Irish (or Oirish) tabloids work means that the bias can be quite strong, for example Bush is undeniably right and brave for going to war with Iraq in the Sun, while the Mirror will put the war down even if WMD were found. While it does give news coverage for people uninterested in broadsheets, it does a very bad job at covering the news (generally, not always though)



It is true that tabloids are ahead of broadsheets when it comes to something like investigative reporting, and they do tend to throw caution to the wind more frequently, but thats the problem, when they sensationalise a story, or print it without a good bit of research behind it, they can sometimes be way off and destroy someones reputation for no reason.
There is a place in media for investigative journalism, but it should be consise and educated, and not generalising or full of guesswork.

oh, and when i buy a newspaper I look for news (and maybe a tiny amount of human interest, depending on the topic), I dont look for stories of celebrity affairs (its their personal problem, let them sort it out as a family) or famous people getting drunk (again, so what?), and if I want nudity, there are plenty of other ways of seeing it.

Flogen

For a lad not too keen on bias or generalising, you seem to engage in a fair bit of it yourself.

There are valid criticisms being expressed in regard to tabloids here, but some people seem determined to hate them as some sort of intellectual badge.

Fair enough, tabloids do carry celebrity tittle tattle stories which bore the hell out of those who they don't appeal to. But equally, some of the coverage in the broadsheets, particularly the Irish Times, is on occasion turgid beyond belief. X-Factor bores the hole off me, but it's all a lot of people talk about, and tabloids are there to serve that audience.

As someone who goes through all the papers on a daily basis, I can tell you the tabloids regularly scoop the broadsheets on many stories. Nor do all of them read like they're made up, sensationalism aside.

In terms of investigative journalism, far more appears in the tabloids (Michael Farrell, MoS, Paul Williams - even if he gets it straight from the guards) than appears in their Irish broadsheet counterparts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEWQ7aXobZ0&feature=related

7:35 - 9:37

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=av52GAhLlBw&feature=related

0:00 - 6:02

JustinDee

To answer the original poster's question:
Yes, they most certainly are.
Read Nick Davies' Flat Earth News for examples of what ethics (or lack thereof) lie behind a tabloid in its efforts to sell copy.

People have taken suicide after what's been printed about them, others, their lives ruined, a moments mistake forcing them to leave the country, their legal rights ignored because they're "bad" people who don't deserve the rights of properly-thinking humans.

But it's great sports coverage, so that excuses everything.

Tabloids are scum. I hope the internet kills them as obsolete.

JustinDee

The TabloidWatch blog is also good for a browse sometimes.
http://tabloid-watch.blogspot.com/2010/12/muslims-and-daily-star.html

santosubito

Deleted User wrote: »

People have taken suicide after what's been printed about them, others, their lives ruined, a moments mistake forcing them to leave the country, their legal rights ignored because they're "bad" people who don't deserve the rights of properly-thinking humans.

Really? Who?

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

santosubito

Plowman wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

So let me get this straight: your favourite parts of newspapers are the letters and op-ed pages? You seem to denigrate uncomplicated political news.

Two things: firstly, newspapers are not called viewspapers, they are - funnily enough - supposed to contain news. Secondly, stories are kinda supposed to be uncomplicated - if the reporter writes a piece that is complicated, he or she is not really doing his or her job. We're supposed to inform and explain.

Going off on a tangent slightly, anyone remember the last time the sainted Irish Times broke a major story?

JustinDee

santosubito wrote: »

Going off on a tangent slightly, anyone remember the last time the sainted Irish Times broke a major story?

They report the news and don't try to create it hence not being in courts 4-5 times a year answering libel charges.
Their editorial and informative content is about the best and most reliable there is.

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

UngratefulWhelp

Deleted User wrote: »

People have taken suicide after what's been printed about them, others, their lives ruined, a moments mistake forcing them to leave the country, their legal rights ignored because they're "bad" people who don't deserve the rights of properly-thinking humans.

But it's great sports coverage, so that excuses everything.

Tabloids are scum. I hope the internet kills them as obsolete.

Actually, if anyone is going to flourish in the internet age, it will be the tabloids and not the broadsheets.

It's tabloids who go out and aggressively break news, regardless of whether that news - or the methods by which it is gathered - appeals to you or not.

Apart from the Indo, broadsheets in this country tend to sit back. The Examiner seems to specialise in 'worthy but dull' issues, whereas the Times could occasionally be described in its entirety as dull. Though I do find O'Toole thought-provoking.

UngratefulWhelp

JustinDee wrote: »

They report the news and don't try to create it hence not being in courts 4-5 times a year answering libel charges.
Their editorial and informative content is about the best and most reliable there is.

The only paper which is regularly before the courts on libel charges is the Sunday World due to its habit of sailing rather too close to the wind on matters crime-related.

I suppose it's a case of what interests you. With the Irish Times, you'll get the previous day's court reports and what was on the preceding night's nine o'clock news. If that's what floats your boat, fine. It just doesn't interest me.

I have a particular gra for foreign news and used to get the paper on Saturdays until I realised that the UK broadsheets cover that particular area much better (hardly a slur on the Times, given the budget differences).

UngratefulWhelp

JustinDee wrote: »

They report the news and don't try to create it hence not being in courts 4-5 times a year answering libel charges.
Their editorial and informative content is about the best and most reliable there is.

The only paper which is regularly before the courts on libel charges is the Sunday World due to its habit of sailing rather too close to the wind on matters crime-related.

I suppose it's a case of what interests you. With the Irish Times, you'll get the previous day's court reports and what was on the preceding night's nine o'clock news. Very rarely anything more than that. If that's what floats your boat, fine. It just doesn't interest me.

I have a particular gra for foreign news and used to get the paper on Saturdays until I realised that the UK broadsheets cover that particular area much better (hardly a slur on the Times, given the budget differences).

santosubito

JustinDee wrote: »

They report the news and don't try to create it hence not being in courts 4-5 times a year answering libel charges.
Their editorial and informative content is about the best and most reliable there is.

Cool. I'll ask you again:what was the last major story it broke? Can you think of one?
Or are they judt government by press release?

IRE60

santosubito wrote: »

if the reporter writes a piece that is complicated, he or she is not really doing his or her job.

It's normally left to a sub to rewrite the yarn!

It has to me remembered that the market dictates everything. If people want to read court reports et al for the IT - so be it - there's about 106k people a day that like what's contained in between the covers in the IT.

"Red Tops", as opposed to the format of Tabloid, are the staple diet of 250k people every day in Ireland.

If the 'red tops' where suddenly extinct, do you think that body of people would migrate to the IT or II or the Ex - I doubt it.

There is a market there for them and media companies are filling that need.

Simple as that.

JustinDee

santosubito wrote: »

Cool. I'll ask you again:what was the last major story it broke? Can you think of one?
Or are they judt government by press release?

When I read a newspaper, its because I want to read about whats been happening and will also dabble in a balanced editorial forum.

If you want a story to be 'broke' then watch Watchdog on BBC or something. I'd read Suzanne Breen in the Tribune for this kind of thing myself.
You will never hear of an Irish Times staffer or contributor delving through bins, tapping phones, scaremongering about immigration with baseless stories led by misleading headlines or poking a story out of nothing. They don't have to dish out free DVDs or CDs weekly or give-away 'free money'.
And all without irrelevant headlines about alleged celebs buggering up a national park in QLD or some modern version of Opportunity Knocks minus the talent.

UngratefulWhelp

JustinDee wrote: »

When I read a newspaper, its because I want to read about whats been happening and will also dabble in a balanced editorial forum.

If you want a story to be 'broke' then watch Watchdog on BBC or something. I'd read Suzanne Breen in the Tribune for this kind of thing myself.
You will never hear of an Irish Times staffer or contributor delving through bins, tapping phones, scaremongering about immigration with baseless stories led by misleading headlines or poking a story out of nothing. They don't have to dish out free DVDs or CDs weekly or give-away 'free money'.
And all without irrelevant headlines about alleged celebs buggering up a national park in QLD or some modern version of Opportunity Knocks minus the talent.

You are suggesting that no story gets broken at all without some sort of illegal skullduggery, which is simply nonsense.

Stories, in the main, are broken through connections. That's as much true as the broadsheet media as it is in the tabloids. Both the Indo and the Times are broadsheets - yet the Times never breaks anything. Ever.

Why is that? Who knows. Perhaps because this 'paper of record' tosh means there is no editorial pressure from on high.

Do you seriously think that in order to get exclusive news you have to turn to a programme on the BBC concerning consumer issues? God help us.

For the record, I'm fully aware of the failings and lack of ethics within tabloids. But they frequently break stories that the Irish Times follows up on, but simply never goes out and digs up by itself.

JustinDee

Your argument on their worth vs their lack of ethics is akin to lauding the invention of canned food as a plus-side of Napoleon's reign.
They are NOT the only source for investigative work out there.
Hey, I'm happy with Irish Times. No worries. Its not telling me the Muslims are gonna get me, some famous ex-singer contracted a treatable malaria-related illness or that some miners in Chile could die even though their rescue was underway. Nor do I want a Sara Brightman compilation CD.

UngratefulWhelp

JustinDee wrote: »

Your argument on their worth vs their lack of ethics is akin to lauding the invention of canned food as a plus-side of Napoleon's reign.
They are NOT the only source for investigative work out there.
Hey, I'm happy with Irish Times. No worries. Its not telling me the Muslims are gonna get me, some famous ex-singer contracted a treatable malaria-related illness or that some miners in Chile could die even though their rescue was underway. Nor do I want a Sara Brightman compilation CD.

Whatever floats your boat, as I said. Nor did I claim they're the only ones doing investigative journalism - merely pointed out that the Times doesn't bother.

I've heard Conor Lally gets fairly p!ssed off in there when he regularly comes in with good crime stories only to have them stuck on page 24.

squeakyduck

I do enjoy a bit of sensationalised news every so often, I only read snippets of google news at best, but if someone has the Independant/The Sun I will try my best to read it cover to cover.

I don't think either are bad, news is news, I just remember that most of the news in The Sun/tabloids is absolute garbage, produced to up the scales of the paper being sold daily!

constitutionus

well ya gotta give the sun one thing.

they got the scoop of the week with the RedC poll they comissisioned.

FF behind SF for the first time i can ever recall ?

hard to beat and made all the TV networks. bet the times and co are pissed at that one.

Corsendonk

"Orish" Daily Mail was telling everyone early last week to keep their taps running all night to prevent pipes bursting while the councils of dublin were trying to get people to conserve water an imposing water cut-offs.

JustinDee

Corsendonk wrote: »

"Orish" Daily Mail was telling everyone early last week to keep their taps running all night to prevent pipes bursting

Were they??
Considering they famously and incorrectly accused Starbucks of wasting water before, thats all very ironic.
What is the minimal IQ required to sub-edit that newspaper? Not very high it would seem.