What makes a singer?

KlodaX

What makes a singer rock?

image, attitude, individuality, stage presence, vocal ability?

Doctor J

...an wobbly stage?

feylya

Lungs?

Silent Grape

that they can sing wud be a start

Dave Conway

His or Her band, basically! It's not easy to 'rock' on your own, or even with acoustic guitar, although you can do a passable imitation of it if you 'feel' the song enough, but singing with the full backing of a band who are really into what you're trying to do, and/or you're into what they're doing, is the real thing. Now you can rock! Just express yourself basically. And practice. And take singing lessons (just a few, so you know how to hit a note, or know when you're off). And sing along to evey damn song you hear on the radio, or in your collection. Listen to how others you admire do it. Take bits and pieces from wherever and make it your own. Now you're really rockin!
Long answer, I know. O.K. gotta rock......Ciao.

Coxy

As long as you're totally into what you're singing and you feel comfortable in yourself, you're sorted. The worst thing that I see singers doing is putting on a show.... they think its what the audience wants to see, but they just end up looking stupid and awkward. As a singer you shouldn't concern yourself with doing pantomime style external performances. They're there to hear your band, not see a west end show. If you don't feel comfortable moving around, just stand still god damn it!

dross

****in balls and confidence, in equal amounts, talent is necessary depending on what style youre singing like heavy metal, Lou Reed, Gordon Gano, Black Francis and to a lesser extent steve tyler cant sing right but theyve got balls and confidence, whereas robert plant and axl rose have ****loads of range or whatever.

robbie1876

The ability to be a completely self-centered, patronising arsehole is one of the key qualities to a successful rock singing career. Make sure you are capable of sustaining arguments long past the point where you know you have lost.

Andrew Strong in The Commitments is worth studying for this purpose.

KlodaX

Originally posted by Dave Conway
His or Her band, basically! It's not easy to 'rock' on your own, or even with acoustic guitar, although you can do a passable imitation of it if you 'feel' the song enough, but singing with the full backing of a band who are really into what you're trying to do, and/or you're into what they're doing, is the real thing. Now you can rock! Just express yourself basically. And practice. And take singing lessons (just a few, so you know how to hit a note, or know when you're off). And sing along to evey damn song you hear on the radio, or in your collection. Listen to how others you admire do it. Take bits and pieces from wherever and make it your own. Now you're really rockin!
Long answer, I know. O.K. gotta rock......Ciao.

this I have thought of and agree. I have started with singing lessons ... and am working on a band ... but not everyone can get up with Queen and sound as good as Freddie Mercury! it takes more than vocal ability and a good band.... but what does it take?

The worst thing that I see singers doing is putting on a show.

What about Justin from the Darkness ... you can't say he doesn't rock ... and there is alot of show in there.

****in balls and confidence, in equal amounts,

damm right. You mention alot of guys who totally rock Dross.

I'm lookin for female role models... Grace Slick is the only one I have found so far.
I'll be myself for the most part ... but I just trying to see if there is anything obvious I have forgotten ... or something I have not yet thought of.

KlodaX

Originally posted by robbie1876
The ability to be a completely self-centered, patronising arsehole is one of the key qualities to a successful rock singing career. Make sure you are capable of sustaining arguments long past the point where you know you have lost.

Andrew Strong in The Commitments is worth studying for this purpose.

I call that singer syndrome ... where everything is about you ... its your point of view that everyone should see .... your world.

I think I've that down to a tea aswell.

dross

**** yeah man.

Coxy

Like I said, if you're not 'comfortable' moving around, then you shouldn't. There's nothing wrong with a goon performer. On the contrary, a 'good' performer is a rarity and brilliant to see. However, there are also equally good non-performers such as dylan. (Granted, he wasn't a great singer, but the music was amazing) These are the ones who look good just because they do what feels right. All I'm saying is that you should be natural. If you're naturally a performer then go for it, if not don't do it.
Also, I think its easy to mix up what makes a good frontman/woman, with what makes a good singer. Some of the best frontmen weren't necessarily good singers. Look at Ian Brown.

Coxy

ha ha... I meant 'good' performer there. Not 'goon'!

KlodaX

Ok ... new question so

what makes a good front woman?

I know ... that question is begging for trouble! ... but seriously?

feylya

A nice big set of lungs It's always good if they are easy on the eye too. You thinking of doing some singing?

KlodaX

yeah ... thinking about it ... alot. I need sheet music of songs though ... to bring to my voice trainer .... but they are more difficult to find than I thought.

seemingly I'm contralto ... which I think is a nice way of saying I can't hit the high notes!!! ... I'm trying to find female inspiration .... so far all I've got is 'white rabbit' by Grace Slick .... she sings low ...

got any suggestions? ... or on where to get sheet music for that matter either? ... do you ever buy offline?

I think I'm gonna end up looking for jazz music.

But then to make jazz rock ... hmmm... :dunno:

feylya

Jazz music? Very good. I'll go learn some.

Em, as for sheet music, check out Cumiskey's. They could probably order some for. If you're ever in Dublin, check out Walton's. They have a nice collection.

As for singers, Norah Jones springs to mind. TBH, I'm not a big jazz or female singer listener. You might want to post something in the Blues/Jazz section and get them to help you out. I'm sure Doctor J could steer you in the right direction?

KlodaX

cheers

.. I've been listening to Nora Jones ... but does she rock?
.. no... no she doesn't...

but why? ... and if you stuck her in Freddie Murcury's shoes .... with a totally rockin band behind her ... would she rock then? ... I don't think she would.

what makes a vocalist rock? .... I'm not thinking its the sound of their voice ... cause they all differ so much ....

if she had an attitude? ... is it passion that makes a singer rock?

Lyrics?

feylya

To make a singer rock, you need a good rocking band behind him/her. If you put Freddie Mercury in front of a microphone without Brian May and the rest, chances are he wouldn't rock near as much.

I think it is passion and attitude that makes the singer. Look at Chris Cornell for instance. Passionate about his music, good attitude and a good band backing him up, both in Sound Garden and Audioslave. Same with James Hetfield, Brian Johnson and so many other singers who rock.

KlodaX

know of any females that rock?

*except Janis Jopelin*

feylya

Amy Lee, that person who I can't remember that Angelwhore says was ripped of by Amy Lee and Axl Rose. tbh there aren't many women that "rock" as you say. I suppose you could say Avril Lavigne but that's prety much just pop rock or some such. Why do you need examples anyway? Are you not going to try to be yourself. Or something.

And check out Melissa Aufdermaur, Shirley Manson, Karen O (Yeah Yeah Yeahs) and the singer from The Cardigans.

ferdi

kim deal of pixies and breeders

she didnt scream, she just rocked

mr_angry

I don't really have that much to add, since I gave my opinions to feylya earlier anyway. Still, I do have a couple of things to add.

The one thing that makes a great rock singer: emotion.

Of course, some people apply too much of it at once, and end up looking stupid. Others don't show enough of it, and therefore don't 'rock' by my definition of the word. If you can get the right amount of emotion into your work, you need very little else.

As for people to model yourself on? Well, I'd also mention Paz Lechantin. She didn't really do a lot of primary vocals (more backing), but what she did, she was very, very, very good at. I'm sure a quick search on Google will turn up some of the hundreds of fan-sites on her. (She also happens to be very good-looking, which helps )

As feylya (or really myself) already pointed out - Melissa Auf Der Maur. She's got a new album just out that should be arriving at my door any day now. If you like, I'll burn you a copy...?

feylya

Offering copies of cds? For shame. I should have added that those extra bands were due to Mr_Angry. Anyways, hope this has been some help.

Dr. Loon

Originally posted by redRogue
know of any females that rock?

*except Janis Jopelin*

Why not Janis Joplin? That's who I was gonna suggest. Get your hands on a live version of her doing "Piece of my heart" and you'll see how a female singer can "Rock"
Other than her, female singers that I like.... hmmm..... not many.
Chrissy Hynde from the pretenders.

Whoever mentioned Avril Lavigne should go and bash their own skull in with a hammer.

KlodaX

Melissa Aufdermaur, Shirley Manson, Karen O

I will be keeping my eye on Melissa Aufdermaur ... I do like her style ... Karen O she rocks! ... much like her performance in videos ... never saw live though.....

Paz Lechantin

... I always thought of as a bassist ... but now she is like all hippy pop with Billy Corgan ....

I found this

all bout women

... I'm actually a big fan of Dido ... but I'm more looking for old performances or woman in rock ... I said no Janis Joplin cause thats the obvious one.

but that is exactly what I am looking for.

no one mentioned Gwen Stephanie ... if you are gonna mention the cardigans? you may aswell mention all female vocalists.

I'm looking for the female version of Jimmy Page.
But I can't find her.
So I'm going to have to create her.

:dunno: ... this may take a while

Thanks for your help.

KlodaX

I can't believe it ... I have been workin on 'summertime' with my singing teacher for the past two weeks ... just coped on Janis Joplin sang it too!

excellent.

feylya

Originally posted by redRogue
I'm looking for the female version of Jimmy Page.

Eh, Jimmy Page was a guitarist........

And Dr Loon, I don't believe I shall be using a hammer on my head any time soon. Read carefully what I posted.

mr_angry

Don't you mean Robert Plant? I know Jimmy Page occassionally played guitar, but he was one of the most... unique singers of his generation all the same. Which would kinda make sense in this thread...

mydarkstar

Originally posted by redRogue
know of any females that rock?

hmmm, like someone else said already this could just turn into "name yr favourite female singer" but..... you gotta admit that PJ Harvey seriously knows how to rock

KlodaX

yeah Robert Plant ... :rolleyes: ... dats who I mean't.

I think I'm sorted now.

Janis Joplin
Grace Slick
PJ Harvey .... *how'd did we forget her??*
Melissa Aufdermaur
Karen O

I still have to check out Chrissy Hynde ... but this still leaves the thread unanswered....

what makes them rock? ... I have a fair idea ... but I'm just checking to see if there is a formula? ... *btw I'm getting this idea from school of rock!?!?!*
I have no intention of mimicing them .... THAT WOULDN'T ROCK!

I think its the ability to come across in your music as passionate .. yet not giving a ****... I'm still not sure

feylya ... I still can't believe you mentioned Avril Lavigne ... she used to backing vocals for Shania Twain ... the only thing that rocks about her is her stylist

feylya

It was late and she's just one who springed to mind. :dunno:

See, that film is evil incarnate!!! A singer who rocks is someone who has a stage presence, who interacts with the audience, can sing with feeling and have a good time. Yes, that's a good answer.

I can't believe you mixed up Jimmy Page and Robert Plant!!!!

Grim

I can't believe you mixed up Jimmy Page and Robert Plant
and I can't believe you mentioned Avril Lavigne

This thread has gone to hell.

A singer who rocks is someone who has a stage presence, who interacts with the audience, can sing with feeling and have a good time.

Bewitched?

feylya

Bewitched couldn't sing........

And I only half suggested Avril Lavigne. Ah, I'll stop digging meself a hole....

Dave Conway

Used to enjoy Damien Rice gigs as much to see and hear Lisa Hannigan perform by his side. She oozes something like a stoned sexiness, and makes love to the songs. I agree with a lot of the other recommendations too, and would also throw Blondie into the list. Why not Kate Bush too?

Just a long shot, if anyone's interested. I'm the singer with Trip Hazard. We feature a lot of vocal harmonies, and there's a few songs where I think would really benefit from the addition of a bunch of extra voices. A la Primal Scream's 'Loaded', sort of. We're just finishing off our second ep at the moment and are moving into gig mode, starting at the Isaac Butt on Mar 26th. If anyone's interested in checking it out with regard to the above, send me your e-mail, and I'll arrange for you to get on the guest list. daveconway30@hotmail.com What sort of stuff is it? Press comparisons (for what they're worth): Cardigans, JJ72, Moody Blues, Evanescence, Procul Harum, David Bowie (for the voice), it's mainly fast and melodic, with lots of Muse'ish twists and turns (which in turn comes from 70's prog rock outfits). Audience comparisons from live shows generally range from Dandy Warhols to REM'ish territory. Mar 26th should be good, and is guaranteed fun. We'll have an extra percussionist and female vox on the night to add to the 4-piece. Be delighted to hear from ya.

Capt'n Midnight

A distinctive voice or vocal style helps otherwise they don't stand out. eg: Stevie Nicks

Too much emphasis goes on the video IIRC it's about 70% image and about 30% mucsic in the charts.

Listen carefully to chart stuff when they are doing ballads/quite soulfull much - lots of noisy in-breaths.

KlodaX

interesting write up about your band Dave:

Deviating from the normal front man mode, Dave is also repulsively ugly

Siobhan plays the role of the multi-talented, double-jointed instrumentalist.

mr_angry

LOL!

Thanks buddy. I've now just pissed myself laughing in front of everyone in the office for no apparent reason. Hilarious though!

Dr. Loon

Originally posted by redRogue

... she used to backing vocals for Shania Twain ... the only thing that rocks about her is her stylist

All this bullshít about "ROCKING"!!

I just wanted to add in terms of vocal ability, Shania Twain is a brilliant singer, as is Christina Aguilera. If you wanted to learn how to sing you wouldn't go far wrong listening to those two.

KlodaX

Dr. Loon ... the initial question of this thread was

What makes a singer rock?

NOT .. what makes a good singer?

it isn't bullshít... its the point of the thread!?! I wanted to see if people could critically analysis what makes a person "rock" .... as I said before the idea came when I watched the film 'school of rock' and saw how Jack Black transformed the classical school kids into rockers oh so easily.

some very good points where raised initially in the thread

so for my own personal interest I asked to limit the question to women who rock

even if they couldn't sing ... they still may have the ability to rock.

what I have learn't is that what makes a male 'rock' is the same as what makes a female 'rock', and that the bullshít idea I read on another thread bout how there aren't really many women who rock has been torn to shreads...

as been proved ... there are many. I have learn't plenty from this thread.
My question was answered...in a round about way.

KlodaX

how come no one mentioned fleetwood mac?

Dr. Loon

Originally posted by redRogue
how come no one mentioned fleetwood mac?

I wouldn't say she (Stevie Nicks) rocks... but she's got a great voice and she'd be more so sexy IMO. To see what I mean search for a live version of Rhiannon on Kazaa. Brilliant.

Also

Dr. Loon ... the initial question of this thread was

What makes a singer rock?

NOT .. what makes a good singer?

Are you trying to tell me a singer can be really terrible at singing and still "ROCK"? i don't think so. They need a good voice. You shouldn't take films like school of rock too seriously either.

KlodaX

I saw the video of a Rhianno and thought she totally rocked.

Does Bob Dillan rock?

Dr. Loon

Originally posted by redRogue
I saw the video of a Rhianno and thought she totally rocked.

Does Bob Dillan rock?

No he doesn't... and might I suggest that if you want to be a good talented front woman you forget about "Rocking" for the moment, and learn how to sing properly first. That's where most singers fail. Oh, sure they can "rock" on stage, but they can't sing for shíte.

KlodaX

I'm getting singing lessons.
no need to give out to me! I was only asking a simple question.

feylya

But are the lessons working?

KlodaX

Feck of the lot of ya... you've neither seen nor heard me ... and you are giving me nothing but abuse!?!?

yes the lessons are working.

feylya

You sure?

KlodaX

Why do you ask such a question?

feylya

Oh, I just thought I'd ask :ninja:

KlodaX

You asked ... I answered.. then you asked again.

what are you getting at?