Raise the drinking age to 21

inaccessibleisl

That's what I say. We need to move with the times and loosen the stranglehold alcohol has on this country. How many times do you see under 21s vomiting in doorways, grappling eachother outside nightclubs, publicly displaying their awquard love for slappers and generally being an eyesore. Wether it's a student out to get plastered or an apprentice plasterer out to get legless it's all the same.
Think of how more peacefull nightclubs would be without these louts with crewcuts and white jeans clogging up the social scene. Think how much more time students could spent on their assignments! Think how much they could save and spend better things like soap or haircuts. Todays youth wants to grow up too quickly. If we spent our years between 17 to 21 entertaining themselfs alternativly then we wouldn't turn into the alcholol driven zombies we are today.

Big Ears

i feel a strong argument coming on :ninja:

Dr. Loon

Wouldn't make a difference. I've been drinking since I was 15. Not something I'm proud of but there ye go. The problem isn't the age limit, it's just ingrained in our culture. I don't know how to solve the problem though. Beer killed all my brain cells!

uberwolf

but then the over 25's would be saying look at all those under 25's puking in the alleys...

inaccessibleisl

When the drinking age is 18 people start at 15/16, but if the drinking age was 21 then people may start at 19/20, or maybe they'll be mature enough to say no to drink.
Stiffer penaltys would also be a fantastic idea. People below 21 found guilty of consuming alcohol could be sentenced to commit their weekends to community service. Like cleaning up vomit at hospitals when drunken louts come in.

inaccessibleisl

Originally posted by uberwolf
but then the over 25's would be saying look at all those under 25's puking in the alleys...

And over 30's would say the same about under 30's etc and so on. No! There are those over 21 who make asses out of themselfs but are in general better dressed, more mature, less agressive and don't drink excessively to rebel against their mommys & daddys.

seamus

Originally posted by inaccessibleisl
When the drinking age is 18 people start at 15/16, but if the drinking age was 21 then people may start at 19/20, or maybe they'll be mature enough to say no to drink.

Ah, so part of it is your own problem with alcohol. You seem to believe that drinking alcohol is a sign of immaturity on everybody's part, regardless of age.

Stiffer penaltys would also be a fantastic idea. People below 21 found guilty of consuming alcohol could be sentenced to commit their weekends to community service. Like cleaning up vomit at hospitals when drunken louts come in.

Stiffer penalties sure would be a great idea, with the current age limit. If only the law enforced things in this country.....

eirebhoy

Originally posted by inaccessibleisl
Stiffer penaltys would also be a fantastic idea. People below 21 found guilty of consuming alcohol could be sentenced to commit their weekends to community service. Like cleaning up vomit at hospitals when drunken louts come in.

You're bloody mad.:ninja:

Nuttzz

Its not the age that someone drinks at, it is what they drink. When I was 18-21 I rarely drank a short, neither did any of my male friends, we all drank pints, now people are drinking a great mix on a night out, and mixing them it energy drinks, I used to get pissed and eventually look to get to bed, hyped up on red bull you are less likely too though. Mixing Cider, Voldka, Red bull & lager together is going to give you some nasty results

cournioni

Thats arse, I'm not going into a pub to have to listen to "that guy is under 21, kick him out!!". Underage drinking will be a problem no matter what the legal age is. It's just part of the Irish culture.

inaccessibleisl

Seamus,
I think you misunderstood my point. While I believe maturity is key to enjoying alcohol, it is withdoubt a better option to leave alcohol out of our diets. 18yr olds are not mature enough to realise that weekends can be spent without forgetting them.
And don't be petty, attempting to incinuate that I have a drink problem. Well I do, but no more than the rest of this country.

inaccessibleisl

Originally posted by PORNAPSTER
Thats arse, I'm not going into a pub to have to listen to "that guy is under 21, kick him out!!". Underage drinking will be a problem no matter what the legal age is. It's just part of the Irish culture.

Only something a teenager could say. Your not ready for drink yet, no matter how many pints you and your mates can 'skull back'. Your body is not ready for it, your still growing hair in scary places, popping pimples and playing computer games.

Kiith

i've a big problem with this argument. i agree that some people go overboard when they go out drinking, but it's not like every one between the age of 18-21, gets absolutly bolloxed every time they go out. Just cause you drink alot doesn't mean your immature. and underage drinking isn't just a problem in this country.

Kiith

and who are you to decide if 18 year olds are not mature enough to drink if they want to. i've known 18 year olds who very mature, but they still drink. going out with your friends and having a few pints is something that is a part of the culture. thats because it's fun and sociable to do so.

rs

maturity does not come with age.

People will start drinking at 15 or 16 no matter what the drinking age is. They do in the US (drinking age 21), they do in Canada (drinking age 19), and they do here.

Plenty of over 21's drink just as stupidly as under 21's do.

It's not fair to penalize those under 21 who drink responsibly because many other people their age are morons.

Anyone who is totally plastered in public is arrested in the US and Canada and thrown in jail for the night(called the drunk tank). Then mum and dad get to pick you up in the morning.

It's a lot more effective than an age ban.

Hyzepher

I have to say that rs has a point. The age limit isn't the problem. The real problem is the lack of responsibility by some members of the drinking public and the publicans who serve them. Not to mention the state who should be more vigilant.

If we introduced a policy where being drunk in a public place resulted in a night in the slammer I am sure it would become less fashionable to get drunk every weekend. However, I am not sure that we would have enough cells for everybody initially - lol

Publicans have a role to play and all too often they seem to wash their hands of it. When have any of us ever seen someone get refused drink because they have had too much - hardly ever. Now most of the times it would be difficult to notice - especially as most pubs are packed on the weekend but trying to cut out the drink issue at source seems the most likely to succeed.

Hyzepher

Saruman

Originally posted by Dr. Loon
I don't know how to solve the problem though. Beer killed all my brain cells!

Thats just class!! Should post that in humour!

Anyway i dont drink but it would not make a difference increasing the age.. look at the US, its 21 there in most states and do you think that stops underage drinking? Course not.. its "cooler" to drink underage.. you would just turn 18-20 year olds from legal drinkers into "cool" illegal drinkers.

seamus

Originally posted by inaccessibleisl
And don't be petty, attempting to incinuate that I have a drink problem. Well I do, but no more than the rest of this country.

Sorry, I was in a rush, that part of my post reads wrong. I was actually implying that you're a militant teetotaller.

Believing that you will solve a problem by legislating against it, leads to trouble IMO. That's what Minister McDowell seems to be attempting to do. Sure, raising the age limit will stop *some* younger drinkers from drinking until they're legal, but on the whole, it won't stop anything. Especially at 18/19/20, there would be serious trouble both in enforcing the ban (how do you prove who's 18 and who's not, just by looking at them, that is, if 21 year-olds kept getting hassled on the street, the Gardai would come under fire, if 18 year-olds were never checked because they looked a little older, the Gardai would come under fire, catch-22).

The problem is attitude. Nothing will change, because the Government's attitude to alcohol doesn't change. The Government needs to plough serious money into education and rehabilitation. Drink-Drivers should be subject to harsher penalties. People admitted to hospital for alcohol poisoning, or just because they've collapsed on the street, should be handed a bill for the Garda, ambulance and hospital resources they've consumed. Parents of underage children who are repeatedly found drunk should be punished (and not jailed or fined, but other forms of educational punishment).

You can't just make something illegal and assume it will go away. In a perfect world, maybe.

Besides, no Government would have the balls to raise the age. Any one who did, would be hammered by the publicans and the students.

Saviour_Angel

yes i totally agree.

I work in a bar and I absoultly hate young ones comming in and getting drunk. When there drunk they tend to get out of hand and cause a lot of trouble...

The limit should be raised to 21 as people at that age are a little more responcible than those at the age of 18. Drink is good for socilazing with friends, but to much can only cause troble for you and others.
Around my home town there are many attacks on people by youg people, drink certanly dosn't help...

Sunday night I had my own run in with someone who was drunk and taught I was someone else.......... I have to say this guy came out the worst but not without leaving me with a few brused ribs...
The age limit should be raised to a sutable age where people who drink have more responciblity.....

PS. Sorry about the spelling mistakes.......

GuanYin

Originally posted by rs
maturity does not come with age.

People will start drinking at 15 or 16 no matter what the drinking age is. They do in the US (drinking age 21), they do in Canada (drinking age 19), and they do here.

Plenty of over 21's drink just as stupidly as under 21's do.

I don't know about this, I would say that 90+% of the alcohol poisoning cases I've seen have been people aged 16-20. They tend to drink far less irresponsibly in this sense.

I actually think this is a matter that should be tackled ruthlessly. A few steps that could achieve this:
1. I would ideally like to see the age limit raised (21 sounds ok).
2. I'd like to see a zero tolerence on drunk and disorderly charges.
3. I'd like to see mandatory ID checks for anyone entering a bar or buying alcohol.
4. I'd like to see stricter punishments for drunk driving.
5. I'd also like to see the liciencing hours extended til 4-6am.

What we actually get is stupid half-measures like no happy hours or drinks advertising being banned (something that worked *so* well for smoking... did we learn anything?) and the curtailing of drinking hours.

As I see it the main two issues are stopping a couple of tens of thousands of very drunk people hitting the street at the same time and eradicating the "drink as an excuse" mentality that this country has.

If you are going to look at the USA and Canada, look at some of the knock on effects thatthe drinking laws have. People drink underage, but nowhere near as regularly as here. Underage drinkers are not blatently seen causing trouble, as they know they will be punished by teh law. Its alot cheaper for young people to get car insurance in the US, I often wonder if this is due to the drinking laws.

I don't think that under 21's shouldn't be allowed to drink, but I think if you want to change the culture to the benefit of this society then you have to break a few eggs.

Kiith

ya america is a great example. let's have the alchohol age limit at 21, the driving age limit at 15, and the gun license age at, what, 9,10.

User45701

I Disagree bedause underage drinking is a problem - a large amount of combat on the streats is caused by drinking.
I belive in lowering the age to 16.

If the drinking age was 21 people would still start drinking around 15

inaccessibleisl

It's refreshing to read posts like Syke's.
Instead of posts practically saying 'Sling it mister, I'm 19 and I can handle my bleedin drink, and I know everything, and I am as mature as anyone else and I can grow a deadly mustache in only 3 weeks'. Shyeah.
Teenagers are never going to agree that under 21s are generally massively immature until they get into their 20's. And if you were about to reply with 'Oh so the day you turn 21 you are more mature' then you really are immature and too young to appreciate and handle the alcohol world yet little man/woman.

inaccessibleisl

Originally posted by User45701
I Disagree bedause underage drinking is a problem - a large amount of combat on the streats is caused by drinking.
I belive in lowering the age to 16.

If the drinking age was 21 people would still start drinking around 15

*Shakes head and laughs to self* :rolleyes:

Your joking aren't you?
"a large amount of combat on the streats is caused by drinking."
True
"I belive in lowering the age to 16."
Stop, please, your killing me.

GuanYin

Originally posted by Kiith
ya america is a great example. let's have the alchohol age limit at 21, the driving age limit at 15, and the gun license age at, what, 9,10.

Thats nothing to do with the current topic and a great diversion tactic for taking away from the real issue.

The fact of the matter is, the countries with stricter drinking laws don't have the same disorder on the streets or amount alcohol related injuries as we do.

If you want to take a pop at US gun culture, start a relevant thread and I'll join you, but sticking your spoke in here just looks like your trying to divert a weak arguement.

super_furry

I think it's a dreadful idea. By the age of 18 people can vote, smoke, join the army, drive and are expected to contribute to the upkeep of the country through their taxes, yet you propose to curb their right to go to a pub. It's a question of civil liberty, and one that I thankfully don't think would ever succeed.

The main problem I see is that instead of having gangs of 15-16 year olds hanging around on street corners getting drunk, you'll have much bigger gangs of 15-20 year olds doing the same thing. Like it or not, the pub is the centre of social life in Ireland and if you exclude a group of people from it, you're left with the question - where do they go?

If you take the right of such a huge amount of people the go there, you will only get negative repercussions. If such a ban came into place, things like car-theft, petty vandalism and personal harassment would soar. You'd have much bigger gangs of scangers hanging around bored, getting drunk and causing trouble.

If you ban them from pubs, you won't stop them drinking, you'll just force them to do it in fields and on the streets.

Imposter

I dissagree totally with the idea of raising the drinking age. What I would do is lower it to 16's for beer (pints but not smirnoff ice etc.) and wine while leaving it at 18 for spirits and alcopops.

Other things that I would also do to help enforce this and help change attitudes towards drink would be:

- Require ID for ALL purchase of alcohol (whether 16 or 60)
- Make publicans responsible for selling to underage and/or drunk people - use warnings, fines or confiscate licences when neccessary.
- Come down hard on drunk and disorderly behaviour
- Allow pubs open a lot longer even as late as 4am.

Now there's a lot in there but here's my thinking on it. Allow young 'adults' to drink where they are being watched by a responsible adult (publican - that's not a joke, see above). Educate people early in secondary school as to the effects of alcohol. Make the parents responsible if children under the legal age have been drinking.

Allowing the pubs to open longer would initially cause huge problems but might eventually see people relax while drinking and not rush their quota of alcohol into them before closing time. Allowing the pubs to open so long would also prevent some fights and ease problems with taxis etc.

Tackling the behavioural issues would require a willingness on behalf of the gardai to act.

A lot of that may seem like some sort of pipe dream but if the government were to stand up to the gardai (make them accountable), publicans (make them responsible and/or deregulate) and tackle the issues of education (both of children and parents) then a more civil attitude ot drink and a more civil society in general might develop. On second thoughts it probably is some sort of pipe dream.

Kiith

**** sake inaccessibleisl, just cause some people, as we all know, can't be mature enough to drink sensibly, doesn't mean that everyone under the age of 21 is a drunken scumbag. generalizations like that really piss me off.

GuanYin

Originally posted by super_furry

The main problem I see is that instead of having gangs of 15-16 year olds hanging around on street corners getting drunk, you'll have much bigger gangs of 15-20 year olds doing the same thing. Like it or not, the pub is the centre of social life in Ireland and if you exclude a group of people from it, you're left with the question - where do they go?

If you take the right of such a huge amount of people the go there, you will only get negative repercussions. If such a ban came into place, things like car-theft, petty vandalism and personal harassment would soar. You'd have much bigger gangs of scangers hanging around bored, getting drunk and causing trouble.

If you ban them from pubs, you won't stop them drinking, you'll just force them to do it in fields and on the streets.

Actually, you've hit the crux of the problem on the head, poor infrastructure and high prices means that drinking in a pub is just about the only affordable thing you can do here.

If people could go to clubs without getting wrecklessly drunk, it would be a good thing. However, I would suggest you spend a weekend working nights in a casualty dept in any dublin hospital and then tell me if you think that 16-20 year olds can handle their drink and that it isn't a problem here.

Winters

Originally posted by inaccessibleisl
I'm 19 and I can handle my bleedin drink, and I know everything, and I am as mature as anyone else and I can grow a deadly mustache in only 3 weeks'.

Your mad, I wish I was like you.

Most of the problem is the opening hours. All the pubs close at the same time and so you have large amounts of people coming out of them and onto the street at the same time and starting to cause a little hassle. I know from expierance in other countries that when a bar is open till 6am or later there isisnt as much problem as people do come and go, not all pile out onto a narrow pathway at the same time. Just because pubs and clubs are open later doesnt mean that people will be getting even more drunk etc. they will probably go out later in the night, stop drinking so quickly as they dont have to be worried about the place closing early and so on and so forth.

By changing the drinking age to 21 nothing will be solved. Kids will still try alcohol when they are 14 or so. A lot of the problem with underage drinking can be put to parents not knowing what their kids are up to. i.e 12 year old around the city centre at 1am drinking and smoking.

Also, everybody should be issued ID cards free of charge. I still havent been bothered to get one of the GardaID's due to the fact that being a student €5 is what I live on per week and also .... im lazy.

Imposter

Originally posted by syke
Actually, you've hit the crux of the problem on the head, poor infrastructure and high prices means that drinking in a pub is just about the only affordable thing you can do here.

What exactly do you mean by poor infrastructure? Why is it different to any other country (from a 16-20 year olds perspective). And surely the prices in pubs are quite prohibitive to a 16 - 20 year old?

seamus

Originally posted by Kiith
**** sake inaccessibleisl, just cause some people, as we all know, can't be mature enough to drink sensibly, doesn't mean that everyone under the age of 21 is a drunken scumbag. generalizations like that really piss me off.

This highlights another problem in Irish society. We have a tendency to exlude and/or persecute one section of society because of the actions of the minority.
The exact same attitude can be seen with Insurance premiums, Travellers, and immigrants.
I'll happily bow to the fact that *some* under 21's are too immature to handle drink, in fact more than in older groups, but you can say the same for a lot of things, sex, marriage, driving, employment.
Perhaps we should raise the minimum age for staying in school to 21. Ban all under-21s from driving, having sex, marrying, and getting a full-time job. After all, if it protects us from the minority of them, then it must be good.

As I said, it's attitude. Of the minority, most of them will bow to peer pressure. So if their mates say it's unacceptable, they won't do it. They key is getting their mates to change their attitude. Of course there will be some who get plastered and cause hassle every weekend, but that group exists across all ages.

GuanYin

Originally posted by Imposter
What exactly do you mean by poor infrastructure? Why is it different to any other country (from a 16-20 year olds perspective). And surely the prices in pubs are quite prohibitive to a 16 - 20 year old?

Its cost and access.

Things that are taken for granted in other countries, just aren't available here. sports facilities, swimming pools, cinemas, bowling alleys....whatever. Poor public transport, especially in the evenings also contributes.

They either cost too much or aren't accessible to the majority. A trip to the cinema on a saturday night, which lasts about 2 hours, costs about 15 Euros including drinks and popcorn.

Until people have something better to do the problem isn't going to be dealt with.

rs

Raising the limit to 21 won't solve much, it will just delay what happens now. I spent my teenage years in Canada

I'll draw a parallel.

Over there, you can drive at 16 and most people grow out of their stupid driving but 18 or 19.

Over here, people don't get to drive until their 20's, but they drive just a stupidly for the first few years. In fact, I'd say more stupidly because they've had to wait longer.

Kids will always start drinking before they legally should. That's just a fact. Doesn't matter what the legal age is.

The difference here is that it's accepted that people get twisted in public often. It's not tolerated in places like Canada and the US. If you are twisted and causing trouble then you get dealt with. I'm not saying that we should follow everything that north america does, but they seem to have a better handle on the drink problem than we do.

The point is that punishing all young people won't solve the problem. They'll drink just as much, just not in pubs. And probably, they'll drink more once you let them in to pubs, just because they can.

Once again, punish those responisble for causing trouble.

Saying that young people are more likely to cause trouble so keep them out of pubs is like saying coloured people are more likely to commit crime, so why don't we throw them in jail before they have the chance.

Anyone want to go out in the street and shout that?

Lafortezza

Originally posted by Saviour_Angel
I work in a bar and I absoultly hate young ones comming in and getting drunk. When there drunk they tend to get out of hand and cause a lot of trouble...

Did you ever refuse them because they were too drunk? I doubt it.

I've never seen anyone refused drink at the bar of a pub or club for the simple reason that they were too drunk.
There's always people who will be asked to leave as they stumble around the dancefloor or puke in the toilets but if they can stand at the bar and hand over money then they'll never be too drunk.

Imposter

Originally posted by syke
Its cost and access.

Things that are taken for granted in other countries, just aren't available here. sports facilities, swimming pools, cinemas, bowling alleys....whatever. Poor public transport, especially in the evenings also contributes.

They either cost too much or aren't accessible to the majority. A trip to the cinema on a saturday night, which lasts about 2 hours, costs about 15 Euros including drinks and popcorn.

Until people have something better to do the problem isn't going to be dealt with.

I don't buy that. I would be more of the opinion that young people here look at their elders and what do they see? They see them in a pub. It's then a perception that that's all there is to do. Ireland does have bowling alleys, sports facilities, cinemas (especially cinemas) it's just that it's cooler to be drinking than watching a film for example. I'm not so sure that the point about the public transport holds a much weight as you seem to think either. After all buses run in Dublin until after 11 and i'd assume some sort of service exists in Cork, Galway etc. Smaller towns which don't have public transport are by definition small and this situation occurs in other countries as well.

Lemming

I'd like to pick up on something that rs just mentioned. For the record I am very much AGAINST raising the drinking age as I believe it is only adding to the problem.

Some of you have pointed out the percentage of 16-20 year olds absolutely hammered and in need of some sort of care after a night out. Now why is that?

Because they are too immature to handle drink? Or not wise to the ways of drink and what goes and what doesn't in regards its consumption? I could say the former most certainly applies to people who are WELL over 21 years of age.

I think most young people are initially very stupid (in keeping with rs's comments on learning to drive) when they start taking drink at first but soon wise up. Highering this age limit will simply delay the inevitable, and you end up with people with lots of money (working) getting quite possibly into an even worse state.

zAbbo

Lower it to 16 tbh, i started drinking at 14 or so, nagon of vodka etc. had it out of my system before i hit college. Doesnt take a genius to work out that if you are puking your ring every time you drink that maybe you have a problem. A phase people go through. I pity the drinking culture we have in this country.

MrPinK

Originally posted by syke
The fact of the matter is, the countries with stricter drinking laws don't have the same disorder on the streets or amount alcohol related injuries as we do.

True, but you are jumping to conclusions as to why that is so. There are also many countries such as the Netherlands and Belgium which have age limits of 16 but still have lower amounts of drunken disorder and alcohol related injuries as us.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

the problem isn't law or anything, it's just the irish and the culture we have.

Winters

Originally posted by MrPinK
There are also many countries such as the Netherlands and Belgium which have age limits of 16

The way it operates in the Netherlands (and Belguim I believe) is Beer is available to people of 16+ but spirits etc. are only available to those of 18+. Possibly a system like that may work but as mentioned above, everyone is immiture when starting to drink and it is not until they 'wise-up' and realise their limit do they become a more mature drinker. Its a stage everyone passes through.

Saviour_Angel

Originally posted by super_furry
I think it's a dreadful idea. By the age of 18 people can vote, smoke, join the army, drive and are expected to contribute to the upkeep of the country through their taxes, yet you propose to curb their right to go to a pub. It's a question of civil liberty, and one that I thankfully don't think would ever succeed.

it's not a civil liberty, it's a hinderence on our society that we cannot control..
Drink is simply a drug ! ! !...... A a drug thats tolerated.... But why when it's a major cause of problems in society.... Harsher laws should be brought in to combat these problems...

I don't think that it's fair to labelize all youth however as I am 21 and don't drink much (once a week and no more than 5 pints). It's unfair to call all youth immature even thought a large majority of them are ! ! !

cournioni

Originally posted by inaccessibleisl
Only something a teenager could say. Your not ready for drink yet, no matter how many pints you and your mates can 'skull back'. Your body is not ready for it, your still growing hair in scary places, popping pimples and playing computer games.

What a stupid narrowminded thing to say. :rolleyes:

Stark

The only argument I would have against underage drinking is that a young liver would be less able to handle drink. Other than that, society should stop trying to shift the blame. "It's not us, it's those whippersnappers". I've been drinking since I was 15 and I turned out fine in my drinking habits. I'm a fundamentally non-violent person and that's something that society should attempt to foster as opposed to "blame it on the drink and the young people".

A good phrase I heard - "you never grow up, you just grow old". It's not about age, it's about responsibility. Many 18 year olds can be very responsible in their drinking habits, many 40 year olds can be complete louts.

GuanYin

Originally posted by Imposter
I don't buy that. I would be more of the opinion that young people here look at their elders and what do they see? They see them in a pub. It's then a perception that that's all there is to do. Ireland does have bowling alleys, sports facilities, cinemas (especially cinemas) it's just that it's cooler to be drinking than watching a film for example. I'm not so sure that the point about the public transport holds a much weight as you seem to think either. After all buses run in Dublin until after 11 and i'd assume some sort of service exists in Cork, Galway etc. Smaller towns which don't have public transport are by definition small and this situation occurs in other countries as well.

Really? But where does it all start? I mean until ther eis an option for something else to do besides drink, what and where else will an influence come from. Its not just kids either, I'd gladly be doing those things if they were more accessible to me.

I think you are looking from a skewed point of view on this.

I've lived and worked in alot of countries but I'll bias my arguement and take GErmany and Ireland as examples of best and worst case scenario.

In Germany, most (not all) satellite towns of poulation circe 10K will have a football stadium, a swimming pool (often 50m), recreational facilities (bowling etc) and cinemas. They have good transport services that operate regularly.

Take 3-4 large satellite towns round Dublin. Swords, Malahide, Skerries, Balbriggan. All approaching 10K population. How many cinemas between them? How many swimming pools, bolwing alleys, sports facilities (Swords is close to a few but the fees are beyond your average teenagers means). Take the nearest Cinemas to Malahide, Skerries and Balbriggan.... Santry and Drogheda.... then look at the tiem tables to those places by bus or train.

What else is there to do? Well, strangely there are alot of pubs and liquor stores....

Now, these are places within 30km of Dublin.... try out in the middle of Longford.....

Zulu

Crazy, crazy idea.
You're old enough to decide on the future of the country (ie: vote).
You're old enough to be tried as an adult (ie: criminal offences).
You're old enough to take responsibility to drive a hazardous vehicles (car/lorry/bus). You're old enough to have a child and raise a family (sex and marriage).

...but you're not old enough to have a pint!?! :rolleyes:
Not very much taught put into this one I see...

Perhaps the problem in Ireland is the culture, or perhaps the closing hours throwing all drunken people onto the streets competing for chips/taxis/buses at the same time causes the problems. Perhaps, perhaps....

...hang on - What with all the underage drinking problems in Europe with a drinking age of 16, coupled with the fact that there are no drink related problems with older people in Ireland, ...it must be related to age, WOW, why hasn't no-one taught of this before!!! :rolleyes:

embraer170

I must say that Syke makes some valid points.

Anyone watch that Prime Time feature on Ireland’s drink culture about two years back? Probably the best hour of television I’ve seen; just too true.

Interesting that even in this topic people deny there is a problem.

Imposter

Originally posted by syke
Really? But where does it all start? I mean until ther eis an option for something else to do besides drink, what and where else will an influence come from. Its not just kids either, I'd gladly be doing those things if they were more accessible to me.

That's my point. I think there is other things to do besides drink it's just that people don't see them or don't want to see them.

In Germany, most (not all) satellite towns of poulation circe 10K will have a football stadium, a swimming pool (often 50m), recreational facilities (bowling etc) and cinemas. They have good transport services that operate regularly.

Most towns in Ireland have soccer facilities, gaa facilities etc. If you're talking about supporting such a team as an activity the option is there, it's just people don't do it. If you're talking about participating then it'll usually be during the day (unless at top level) in which case it's not entirely related to drinking in the evening.

Take 3-4 large satellite towns round Dublin. Swords, Malahide, Skerries, Balbriggan. All approaching 10K population. How many cinemas between them? How many swimming pools, bolwing alleys, sports facilities (Swords is close to a few but the fees are beyond your average teenagers means). Take the nearest Cinemas to Malahide, Skerries and Balbriggan.... Santry and Drogheda.... then look at the tiem tables to those places by bus or train.

All these places are connected to the Dublin bus network. Going to an earlier cinema screening is perhaps an answer. If you want to watch a film at 9pm then pop down to your video shop or are there none of them either? If people wanted to go to the cinema that wouldn't be a problem. Perhaps cinema timetables aren't ideal, perhaps bus timetables aren't ideal but it still is possible to go to the cinema if the want is there. Swimming pools, gyms etc are generally not so friendly to a teenagers means but that problem exists abroad as well.

I live in a city of 270,000 here in austria. There are 2 bowling alleys. Not easily accesible either. Cinemas are a similar situation as they're based in Multiplexes out of town. There are a few cinemas in the centre of town where accessability is better but 2 out of the 3 are arty cinemas which wouldn't have the same appeal as mainstream cinemas for teenagers.

What else is there to do? Well, strangely there are alot of pubs and liquor stores....

Surprisingly these exist outside of Ireland too (perhaps not quite the same number of pubs). Add to that the fact that drink can be bought at the cinema, the bowling alley, your local football stadium in fact anywhere that feels like selling it. So other countries that have more outlets for drink, far cheaper alcohol and similar facilities other than pubs, yet these countries have far less of a problem with drink. So how exactly is it a facilities problem again?

Now, these are places within 30km of Dublin.... try out in the middle of Longford.....

How many villages in Germany have such facilities? Then a village in the middle of Longford is really no different.

pauldeehan

(Throwing in 2 cents worth)

A lot of my friends were underage drinkers and nowadays only drink a little (or not at all in some cases). I waited until the legal age and I've had a lot of blank spots in my memory from nights out (currently trying to drink less btw).

I don't know exactly what my point is. :dunno:

Mossy Monk

lower the drinking age for pints to 16 and keep the spirits at 18. it is some of the underagers at the street corners that cause some of the hassle. get them off the streets for a start because chances are they are drinking anyway. a lot of people start off between the ages of 12 and 14

inaccessibleisl

If they ever lowered the drinking age to 16 I'd seriously burn every pub in my town to the ground. That would sicken me to no end. Ffs, then you'd have 15yr olds posing as 16yr olds in pubs and 13/14yr old drinkers on the streets. Unbelievable.
You idiots who say lower the drinking age must be 17 or something.
I'm actually quite baffled that people are that stupid that they would want to lower the drinking age.