Glucosamine and Chondroitin

Genghis

tunney,

Apologising for copying you out of context, but I felt this topic might be useful seperated from the original thread, as it potentially is concerned with a broader range of issues than the original thread .

Originally posted by tunney
(Glucosamine and Chondroitin ) ... is a waste of time. there is no evidence what so ever to suggest it works. From personal experience it doesn't even taken in high doses and is just a waste of money.

I have just started taking them (2 x 500mg glucosamine / 400mg chondroitin daily for 3 weeks or so), and I have to say that I find some difference (for a start I've had no probs with Mr. ITB, despite returning to intensive training runs, though taking G&C was just one of my recovery actions).

I would like to know about your expereince / research that leads you to dismissing G&C so forcefully. Anything I have read is either positive / endorsing (such as the current thread on RW here which presents practically 100% positive feedback from other runners), or scientific research which tends to conclude that there is a 'possibility' of benefit which needs further investigation before it can be definitively declared, rather than a firm conclusion either way as regards its benefit / uselessness.

eth0_

I take glucosamine because I have degenerative arthitis in my left ankle following an untreated fracture I had 8-9 years ago.
I have to say it does work. I have less pain in cold weather now, and when cycling.

tunney

Ahhh yeah I've read that thread on RW before, and the articles in books and magazines. The ones I've read have said that will G&C provides relief from arthitis and the like that there is no proof what so ever that it will prevent injury.

My problem with G&C is that its desired effects are no effects! Did your knee injury recover as a result of G&C? Or was it the other factors in you recovery regime?

Seeing as genghis your injury was ITB, then the answer is without a doubt that the G&C had no impact on your recovery, to give it its full name (or acronym) ITBFS - the last two being Friction Syndrome, ITB injurys are just too much rubbing. Even on that thread they say

"I thought ITBS was a muscular problem, so a bit confused why your physio recommended glucosamine, unless just as precautionery treatment for your joints."

They're only half right but still.

G&C is expensive, its results unproven. My phsyio reckons its not that useful at all. And during the 6 months or so that I took massive doses of it I still got knee pains(non-itb) after long runs. I could have saved alot of money and pain if instead of spending all that money on G&C I bought a nice pair of off road runners and ran on trails and grass.

Its a fad. And since us runners are obsessed with our knees most runners will try anything (except running on grass ) to protect them.

Genghis

But leaving aside specific injuries (the reason I spun this out on its own), is it not the case that runners / other endurance athletes repeatedly put high levels of stress on their joints, and therefore any nutritional supplement that assists with the efficient mainenance and repair of these joints will be of benefit? Or are you saying that you may as well be taking smarties as G&C for any effect they will have?

BTW, G&C can cost hugely variant amonts - The first pack I bought cost almost €19 for 30 from healthfood store. Then last Friday I picked up 100 for €6.49 in the Natures Way sale. When I finsih these, it will be interesting to see if I reach the same conclusion as you!

tunney

You got a lot cheap, but whats the concentration of the G&C? Even the biggest supporters of G&C admit that the quantities of G&C required are massive, double the strongest ones I found in the chemist.

True endurance athletes put huge amounts pf stress on their joints, and if there was anything proven to help I'd take it.

Genghis

Its the standard 500/400 combo, afair. They did have bigger doses too I think, though I was just looking for the same profile as the more expensive one I had bought.

Guv

Chondroitin does have some mild anti inflammatory properties but it is of no use to a human due to it's molecular structure - basically virtually none will be absorbed. Chondroitin is in all the formulas thanks to Barry Sears and the 500/400 combo is what people look for.

Glucosamine however is very effective. There are countless studies if you go looking. It's water soluble so you can take whatever amount you feel you need. Some take 30grams a day.

To conclude

Glucosamine is worthwhile
Chondroitin is not.