Gasto Vans (not a happy Camper)

tech · 18-12-2003 8:58am #1

OK I went passed a lovely Transit van that flashed at me this morning, I know ive been caught, how do I collect / recieve my 2 points? ,,,, is there a back door in the system still ??

Gmodified · 18-12-2003 10:05am

you will receive the fine by post

tunney · 18-12-2003 1:52pm

HA HA! Shouldn't have been speeding!

Seth Brundle · 18-12-2003 10:23pm

Do you mind me asking where this was?
Was it a dual carriageway?
Were you much over the limit?
Was your speed inappropriate for the road (& environmental conditions)?

(before the anti-speeders crucify me, I am not condoning speeding - Im just condeming the current speed trap policy)

mike65 · 18-12-2003 10:27pm

If you are not speeding you won't get trapped, and yes I know its annoying to get busted for doing 34 in a 30
but thats the law...

Mike.

Seth Brundle · 18-12-2003 10:59pm

thats not my point - the Gardai are targeting the safer roads and not the more dangerous (statistically) raods.
Take the Lucan Bypass, notorious for traps yet the only accident I am aware of is one that the Gardai caused

mike65 · 18-12-2003 11:04pm

Fair point - I was on the south ring going into Limerick which is new dual-carrigway and as ever there was a car with camera gun positoned in the central median on a straight stretch picking off targets...amazingly ppl actually manage to get caught along there...

Mike.

Silvera · 18-12-2003 11:59pm

I agree with kbannon.

The Gatso van is regularly parked near SDS on the Naas Rd, near Newlands Cross.
'Shooting fish in a barrel' comes to mind !

I reckon they also park there because they are too lazy to drive any further than Newlands Cross (i.e. it's convenient for them to do a U-turn at Newlands and head back to Dublin Castle).

Fabritzo · 19-12-2003 12:22am

Is it a regular garda van, white in colour?

Our man in Havana · 19-12-2003 1:57am

Originally posted by Fabritzo
Is it a regular garda van, white in colour?

No.

Its a high roof transit, white and there is a green one aswell. No markings at all. Look at the right hand side back window where you will see the camera.

sceptre · 19-12-2003 2:15am

Originally posted by Silvera
The Gatso van is regularly parked near SDS on the Naas Rd, near Newlands Cross.

Newlands Cross... is that around where Bewley's hotel is?

RicardoSmith · 19-12-2003 3:06am

Some would say speed traps are not to slow you down on the dangerous bits ONLY. But are to encourage drivers to stay within the speed limits ALL the time, everywhere.

Seth Brundle · 19-12-2003 6:54am

@ RicardoSmith - some may say that but I haven't met anyone who believes it.

GerardKeating · 19-12-2003 7:55am

Originally posted by kbannon
thats not my point - the Gardai are targeting the safer roads and not the more dangerous (statistically) raods.

One could argue that drivers whom speed on housing estates/backroads etc are also likley to speed on the by-passes/motorways etc, so does it really matter where they catch the speeders.

Of course the many drivers whom only speed on "safe" roads will suffer from this policy...

seamus · 19-12-2003 9:26am

Originally posted by GerardKeating
One could argue that drivers whom speed on housing estates/backroads etc are also likley to speed on the by-passes/motorways etc, so does it really matter where they catch the speeders.

Of course the many drivers whom only speed on "safe" roads will suffer from this policy...

I put a post up recently (maybe it was on Commuting/Transport) about "acceptable risk". Although it might sound logical, research finds that it's not necessarily the same people who speed all the time.

Besides, everybody speeds somewhere. Having designated speed trap areas is ridiculous, since people will then get to know the areas, and avoid speeding there. For example, everyone in Dublin knows that the road between the Red Cow r/a and Citywest has a pretty high risk factor for getting caught. Ditto for the section of N81 between the Templeogue Bridge and the Balrothery Interchange.

I would much prefer to see random areas. Stick Gardai on arsehole-of-nowhere backroads, right on a corner, on a slight downhill. Catch everyone... If you get it into drivers' heads that there could be a Gatso or speedie around any corner, a lot of people will cop on. In the current system, the only people who cop on are those who've been caught.

Merrion · 19-12-2003 9:34am

It won't be too long before the mix of GPS and tachograph type technology takes the whole thing out of the camera's hands and your car will shop you for speeding. Th etechnology will probably be introduced as a "fairer way of charging road tax by number of miles driven" or some such....

ColinM · 19-12-2003 9:47am

Originally posted by Merrion
It won't be too long before the mix of GPS and tachograph type technology takes the whole thing out of the camera's hands and your car will shop you for speeding. Th etechnology will probably be introduced as a "fairer way of charging road tax by number of miles driven" or some such....

Yeah, you're right - this is almost certainly how it will happen. I remember reading that it was being seriously considered in the UK.

Anyone who thinks that speed traps are not about making money first, and road safety a distinct second is extremely naive. In fact, it's a non-argument. At least in the UK, the local authorities admit that their primary purpose are as a source of revenue.

tunney · 19-12-2003 10:44am

Besides, everybody speeds somewhere

Bull. Not everyone speeds. I don't.

Ditto for the section of N81 between the Templeogue Bridge and the Balrothery Interchange.

Why are you moaning about speed traps there? Do you know the number of people that have been killed there?

ColinM · 19-12-2003 11:12am

Originally posted by tunney
Bull. Not everyone speeds. I don't.

Bull yourself!

Do you do 30 or less in a 30 zone always?

Yeah?

Bull!

tunney · 19-12-2003 11:19am

Do you do 30 or less in a 30 zone always?

Yeah I do, when I'm driving.

Once you understand the difference 5-10 mph makes in an accident with a pedestrian/cyclist you do slow down and abide by the limits. Yes it painfully slow at times but whats 10 minutes of my time compared to not killing someone?

seamus · 19-12-2003 11:23am

Originally posted by tunney
Bull. Not everyone speeds. I don't.

Arse. You're fooling yourself.

Why are you moaning about speed traps there? Do you know the number of people that have been killed there?

I'm not moaning about speed traps there. It's just another place where speed traps are predictable. (Yes, people go slowly there now because of it, but once past Balrothery, people speed again.) What's the point in that?

tunney · 19-12-2003 11:35am

Arse. You're fooling yourself.

I couldn't give a toss if you believe me or not. I don't speed full stop.

It's just another place where speed traps are predictable

Sorry, just realised that I confused the one you were talking about with the ones before/after the spawell.

[CrimsonGhost] · 19-12-2003 11:43am

Eh tunney you were previously talking about speeding your push bike. ie doing more than 30 in a 30 mph zone. Stop getting all self-righteous about it.

Originally posted by tunney
Yeah I do, when I'm driving.

Once you understand the difference 5-10 mph makes in an accident with a pedestrian/cyclist you do slow down and abide by the limits. Yes it painfully slow at times but whats 10 minutes of my time compared to not killing someone?

tunney · 19-12-2003 11:48am

Mah, the odds of killing someone on a push-bike other than yourself are slim to none. The odds of killing someone in a car are much greater.

Anyway I'm not being self-righteous about it, someone made a broad sweeping incorrect statement and I was simply pointing out that he was wrong.

Kali · 19-12-2003 12:12pm

Originally posted by tunney
Mah, the odds of killing someone on a push-bike other than yourself are slim to none. The odds of killing someone in a car are much greater.

tell that to the lad who smacked by a courier coming the wrong way down lower baggot st... and died, countless other serious incidents occur from similar accidents (pedestrian steps out on a one-way road looking towards traffic and gets knocked down by a cyclist coming the wrong way).

Our man in Havana · 19-12-2003 12:12pm

I was reading that all the van traps in the UK require advance signage even if they are just temp signs. The UK police were found to be in breach of european law and had to mark every camera trap.

I am researching this judgement with a view to see if it can be applied to Ireland.

tunney · 19-12-2003 12:15pm

Advance signage is ridiculous and anyone who insists on it should be given penalty points just for being such a selfish pr**k.

seamus · 19-12-2003 12:22pm

Originally posted by tunney
Advance signage is ridiculous and anyone who insists on it should be given penalty points just for being such a selfish pr**k.

I tend to agree, but I'm a great advocate of erecting signs, even if there are no speed traps in the area.

Preventing people speeding is better than catching them speeding.

tribble · 19-12-2003 12:31pm

It won't be too long before the mix of GPS and tachograph type technology takes the whole thing out of the camera's hands and your car will shop you for speeding. Th etechnology will probably be introduced as a "fairer way of charging road tax by number of miles driven" or some such....

Can you spell Orwell?

It's one thing having to account for your movements on request - but having ALL
movements on a database is a totalitarian nightmare.

tribble

ando · 19-12-2003 12:41pm

Originally posted by Fabritzo
Is it a regular garda van, white in colour?

far left

Our man in Havana · 19-12-2003 1:09pm

Originally posted by ando

far left

Where was that?

Seems to be overkill with Gatso on one side and bikes on the other. Typical revenue gathering activity.:mad:

tunney · 19-12-2003 2:07pm

Are you for real? You honestly think that the sole purpose of speed traps is do generate revenue? Are you really that ignorant and self centered?

an_taoiseach · 19-12-2003 2:24pm

Its probably an offence to post that piccy

BTW Garda Gatso vans are also available in GREEN IIRC

And please would you all understand that 'Driver Error' is responsible for over five times as many "accidents" as 'speed' is ?

What is more this 'speed' may not involve breaking the speed limit but just be inappropriate speed for the road conditions at the time.

Stay alert = reduce accidents. Stay alert + spot the Gatso van = reduce accidents & save money.

Here are a few piccys of a UK Tallivan ( you all seem to call them Gatso vans )

http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/readers/tax1.jpg

http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/readers/tax2.jpg

http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/readers/tax3.jpg

An T

seamus · 19-12-2003 2:41pm

Originally posted by tunney
Are you for real? You honestly think that the sole purpose of speed traps is do generate revenue? Are you really that ignorant and self centered?

Not the sole purpose, but certainly a primary purpose.

There's a reason why they place themselves mainly on long, straight, wide roads - cos that's where the most traffic is. The roads they choose tend to be places where fatal accidents aren't common, but drivers commonly edge over the limit.

If the Gardai weren't interested in speed traps as a means of generating revenue, most of them would be on backroads in Cork, Donegal and Kerry, notorious for serious accidents and dangerous driving.

And please would you all understand that 'Driver Error' is responsible for over five times as many "accidents" as 'speed' is ?

What is more this 'speed' may not involve breaking the speed limit but just be inappropriate speed for the road conditions at the time.

Yep. Bit like the whole "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" thing. Quite a lot of the time, it can be safer to drive at 40mph in the heart of Dublin City, or 110mph on a motorway than it is to do 45mph on a country road, where 60mph is the limit.

tunney · 19-12-2003 3:02pm

You really have your head up your hole. 110 on an irish road?

I think we'll have to agree to disagree, you go on speeding and justifing it to people. I suppose yuo think you're a great driver adn it will never happen to you?

seamus · 19-12-2003 3:05pm

Originally posted by tunney
You really have your head up your hole. 110 on an irish road?

I think we'll have to agree to disagree, you go on speeding and justifing it to people. I suppose yuo think you're a great driver adn it will never happen to you?

I'm not justifying anything. I'd never do 110 on a motorway, even if my bike was capable of it.

I picked that speed arbitrarily. My point is valid. Dispute it.

tunney · 19-12-2003 3:11pm

40 mph in the heart of dublin city is never valid. The statistics for vunerable road users death rates at various speeds show just how devasting that extra 10mph is to others. It increases the chances of dying from I think its 50% to 9x%. Given the high concentration of vunerable road users in dublin 40mph is a no no.

I do accept the point that 45mph is too much in some places, conditions depending, on country roads. But one good point out of three doesn't make your argument valid.

seamus · 19-12-2003 3:25pm

Originally posted by tunney
40 mph in the heart of dublin city is never valid. The statistics for vunerable road users death rates at various speeds show just how devasting that extra 10mph is to others. It increases the chances of dying from I think its 50% to 9x%. Given the high concentration of vunerable road users in dublin 40mph is a no no.

I do accept the point that 45mph is too much in some places, conditions depending, on country roads. But one good point out of three doesn't make your argument valid.

I only made one point.

Whether a speed is safe at position x is obviously a debatable matter. But you have to agree with me that regardless of your opinion on it, "it can be safer to drive at 40mph in the heart of Dublin City, than it is to do 45mph on a country road, where 60mph is the limit.", which reverts to the original argument to do with that point - Revenue generation is a primary reason for speed traps.

tunney · 19-12-2003 3:48pm

Change the speeds to 30 and 35mph and I'll agree but I am firmly of the opinion that 40mph is never safe in dublin city centre and I do not *have* to agree with you regardless of my opinion,

especially when I think you are wrong.

seamus · 19-12-2003 3:55pm

Heh, have to agree to disagree then

Now, on to the traffic...

RicardoSmith · 19-12-2003 4:25pm

Speed traps are a token jesture to the public perception of the garda combating speeding on Irish roads. In my own area I can give you 5 roads off the top of my head where 90% of the cars are above the speed limit. (Main road in the phoenix park for example) Its s rare to see a speed trap. On my current commute (a 100 mile round trip that takes in about 15 miles of the M50), in 3 months I haven't seen a single speed trap. I'd love to see some statistics of speed trap locations, vs accident hotspots. I doubt they'd collate. In my local area the residents have asked for some response to excessive speeding (60-70+) in our estate, but in 2 years we yet to see a speed trap. I did get done for speeding myself, about 2 years ago, caught off guard by an unexpected 30 mile zone on an unfamilar road after a long drive back from Galway to Dublin. No excuses. Fair cop. I was just lazy slowing down from 50. Once in over 15 yrs isn't too bad I reckon. I think he clocked me at 39 or 40. Its not that there are double standards, there just aren't any consistent standards. Aysmal signage doesn't help either.

the evil belly · 19-12-2003 4:44pm

Originally posted by seamus
If the Gardai weren't interested in speed traps as a means of generating revenue, most of them would be on backroads in Cork, Donegal and Kerry, notorious for serious accidents and dangerous driving.

it can be safer to drive at 40mph in the heart of Dublin City, or 110mph on a motorway than it is to do 45mph on a country road, where 60mph is the limit.

i totally agree with you. i drive the shiity little back roads in cork daily and you'd want to be oof your head to do 60 on then despite being legally allowed to. you're much less likely to be killed a few mph over the limit on a nice big motorway

Originally posted by tunney
40 mph in the heart of dublin city is never valid.

what about the parts of dublin that have 40mph speed limits?

ando · 19-12-2003 5:18pm

Originally posted by an_taoiseach
Its probably an offence to post that piccy

How so, I took the pic with my camera.. I own the picture

BTW, it was the N2 inbound just after where it meets the m50

leonlafrite · 19-12-2003 5:47pm

On thing with that type of speed trap , is that the guy driving on the left "slow lane" (maybe 5-10 mph over the limit) is being flashed, but the idiot doing 70 in his big 03 BMW which forced you off that same left lane wont...
See what I mean.

RicardoSmith · 19-12-2003 5:54pm

Originally posted by ando
How so, I took the pic with my camera.. I own the picture

BTW, it was the N2 inbound just after where it meets the m50

Not the copyright. What the picture is of. Thats why that site that used to have all the garda info on it was taken down.

Silvera · 19-12-2003 8:35pm

sceptre,

The Gatso van is usually parked off the southbound lanes just passed An Post SDS - opposite Joels Restaurant (i.e. - going FROM the Red Cow roundabout TOWARDS Newlands Cross. Bewleys is the other side of newlands i.e. going northbound).

Ricardo Smith,

Is this the website you are referring to Speed Traps in Ireland - http://www.speedtraps.ie.nu/
If so, it's still online.

In Australia, mobile speed traps are ADVERTISED EACH MORNING ON THE RADIO i.e. they are only used to slow drivers down - not to trap/collect money from motorists.

N.B. - I do not condone speeding, far from it. But I believe we should operate a fairer, well balanced system than we currently have.

Seth Brundle · 19-12-2003 9:45pm

Originally posted by leonlafrite
On thing with that type of speed trap , is that the guy driving on the left "slow lane" (maybe 5-10 mph over the limit) is being flashed, but the idiot doing 70 in his big 03 BMW which forced you off that same left lane wont...
See what I mean.

no!

Seth Brundle · 19-12-2003 9:53pm

Originally posted by an_taoiseach
Its probably an offence to post that piccy
<SNIP>
An T

Why?
a) is it not better that people know thre are devices out there that can catch them?
b) the information is already in the public domain
c) prove that it is in fact a gatso van / mobile money maker!

RicardoSmith · 19-12-2003 10:06pm

Originally posted by Silvera
[B...Is this the website you are referring to Speed Traps in Ireland - http://www.speedtraps.ie.nu/
If so, it's still online.
... [/B]

Its not working for me. Yeah I though ihe used to list the unmarked cars vans tec and had to take them down. I can't remember why exactly.

Silvera · 20-12-2003 12:34am

Does this link work for anybody else ?

http://www.speedtraps.ie.nu/

Our man in Havana · 20-12-2003 9:45am

Originally posted by Silvera
Does this link work for anybody else ?

http://www.speedtraps.ie.nu/

Works fine here.

Gasto Vans (not a happy Camper)

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