Quake3, Biitches. (A Devore-length post, and no, I'm not ****ed)

Zero

Any of you who have been around as long as myself in Quake, which is a disturbingly long time, will remember when quake first came out, and the way irish quake was shaped from then til now.

Us UL ppl, completely ignorant of the then-savagely powerful connection we were sitting on, danced around the lan killing muppets, thinking we were great, while on the famous quake.iol.ie:26001, all irish quake players ran around killing muppets in a neverending ffa, where a clan name meant jacksh!t, apart from a few fancy colours.
Eventually, thanks to a bit of work from different people, we all started meeting, more on the indigo ctf server than anywhere else, and those of us that were able to win all the time (me, krusty, g.o.w., tomb, cloud, scaryspice), thought we were sh!thot, more clans formed and things were looking up, especially with the events like quakefest and quakelords.
But in reality, we were always muppets, people were using the mouse and quakeworld when we were only realizing that we could type 'name Zero' in the console instead of going to multiplayer-->setup-->name.
The world was using proxies for ages and ages, it took the accidental meeting of us with 4k_Ser before we knew sh!t about proxies. They had a clan league with multiple divisions in the UK and huge tournaments in the US, when we were still clan-hopping and declaring our brilliance on the IOL mailing list and a whole two clan wars being played every three months.
The sad truth of it all, is that in the whole country, the Irish Quakers can only put out maybe TWO decent teams that could take on a division 1 UK clan, even after all this time, remember quake 1.01 is here since october-november 1996. There are only maybe ten people in the country who can properly execute teamplay throughout a clan war without stopping halfway through and saying ' emm....what the FUKK do i do now? '
Quake2 had a better startoff, because they were mostly born from the Q1 scene, and those that werent, knew from the q1 scene that the UK was the place to learn as they were so far ahead, so the few good q2eers clans we have here actually do well across the water, but they are by no means exceptional.

Us lads down here in UL, in one of our many Quake conversations, are always saying, 'jezus, imagine if we knew two years ago what we know now, if we started playing Quake in the beginning with the mouse, FOV, mipcap, hacked models, decent teamplay, everything, just IMAGINE how good we would have been, nobody in UK could have touched us', and its true, the thing is, us paddies are always second best because anything new we learn, we learn from others, nothing is found out to better our game that isnt from a popular webpage or from the opposition, who dont tell us til they ram a quad rocket up our ar$es.

What I'm saying, boys and girls, is that as regards both national and international gaming, the new way to go is QUAKE3, which is on the horizon. I have played it in Linux, there some good and some bad aspects to it, but as a Q1eer I prefer it to Q2. The game is new, quake veterans obviously have a better kickstart in it than newbies, but what I'm saying is that, as regards Q3, around the world, we are ALL EQUAL, the names Sujoy, QPD, Beast, CW, XC, EA, Hakeem, Xenon, they all mean NOTHING now, to reach the top in Q3 is a hard fast race, but we are all on the starting line at the same point, of course naturals by the name of Xenon and Thresh, and on a lower scale, Timber etc., of course they have a headstart, but not so much of a headstart that you can't lean forward and grab the b@stards by the back of their shorts and pass them out. It's not that hard, there are some very smart ppl that we have here in the Irish Quakers, in both Q1 and Q2, just that nobody ever bothers to get ahead of international opposition because by the time we have an interest, we are miles behind.

What I am proposing, is that from the word GO, we take Quake3 apart, we gain every advantage by learning the physics, knowing every trick and bug, we have our team tactics for every level embedded in our brains before the first Quake3 tournie is even considered. As soon as Q3 comes out, we should go to town on it, for once make the Irish Team be a team to be reckoned with.
What u think? And yes I am bored off my tree, thus the Devore-type message


[This message has been edited by Zero (edited 03-05-99).]

LoLth

Wow! You SURE you're not ****ed?

Actually, he has a point. I would be willing to bet money (real money!!) that right this minute someone without a social life is going over each minute detail of the test version, having a peek at the code (if he can get to it), walking around the test level trying jumps from every centimetre of ledge-space, jumping onto sticky out bits and firing a few tester shots just to get the 'feel' of the game. When the full version comes out that person will already have a head-start on the rest as far as finding little quirks and glitches goes (wasn't Rocket jumping an accidental discovery?).

As to Q3 making everything level.. I'm not so sure about this. Skill is skill, it may be lessened by the translation but once the player gets used to the new feel the skill will surface again. Definitely, practisig now will help (maybe it will take longer for skillful players to pass you out).

ramble,ramble....

J.

This post contains nothing of nutritional value.

*****99% point Free********

SickBoy

Zero is right. We need to be there from the start and we will have a good chance of beating other national teams. I will defo be playing Q3 as No.1 and Quake for old times sake. But you have to remember that a lot of the quake ppl have very basic systems i.e. P166mmx with crappy graphics card. These ppl more than likely would love to jump over to Q3 but its impossible for them. I'm sure there are some Irish Quake legends on these type of systems and they wont get the "Head start" that were talking about. One thing is for certin though, for a Q1 player there will be no looking for a rock in the stream, it will be a straight jump to the other side (Q3)

SB...

harVey

sickboy is dead right.
the real reason that say US and scandinavian players are way better and have a better head start over us is the IT infastructure in those places, not the dumb follow the leader paddy mentality
I had a 386 with a 2400 bps modem (and most ppl didn't have a modem at all) when quake came out, and now have a pII with a 56k, and the college pcs are the same (connection better though with no graphics card)
this compares with T1 and hardcore cable sh!t in the states. so by the time i am ready to play q3 properly, a hell of a lot of west coast gamers have the jump.

all the same, good point zero and i do not think the gap is as big now as it was three years ago (technology that is, not skill).

harVey

shank

Point well made Zero, I would really like to see everyone give q3 a proper go, I know 99% of q2 lads will prolly switch anyway. But if most of the q1 lads take it up aswell we'll have a chance to get some proper leagues going and not a situation where u play the same 2/3 clans all the time and learn nothing. Regarding player skill, I don't know about the Q1 standard atm but 50% of Q2 players in Ireland have no problems shoeing UK/Euro players up n' down the maps.

---

shank1@usa.net
q2n.quake.ie

KinDreD

we could always kill all the brits and yanks and them sweedes then we'd be the best
O_o

juNkie

Fukin A!!! WAN ZERO!!!! Everythin u said makes sense and everythin u said is nothin i haven't thought of before.

Listen to this lad ppl, he knows daa sheeit.

juNk laa

Ronin

sep q3 runs on a p150 under linux, cause we had a german guy on the server the other night, so we can have a hpb lpb war all over again . hehe.

/me hopes they have voodoo's in the puters next year in college :-)

I`ll be playin q3 and quake after me exams in 19 days ..and ut if I can get a copy..

Ro.

DeVore

Ahem...

Well if my name is going to be bandied about I think I aught to have my say

Zero's dead right and its something that we discussed when I was down there recently.
Quake needs a kick in the *****here.
In the us they could handle the split between q1 and q2, here both sides lost critical mass.

We have a chance to learn about q3 from the start. We can scour the net for tactics and report back here, as well as create our own.

As for the machines to run it... well I dunno. Its a problem none of us can fix.
We just have to hope that the proliferation of high spec machines means the price of p350s drops. Its not that expensive to do and upgrade these days.

In all seriousness we have seen players like Regi, Koopa, Beast and Bunny have a go at Q2 and be seriously ninja at it. We have a lot of good q2 players who could make the jump too. There are serious discussions about a trip to Australia for the national q3 team in the offing, though obviously sponsorship will be a problem.

If q3 doesnt suck we will have a community again the way it was a year ago I feel.
Q3 could be the best thing to happen to irish quake for a long long time.

DeV.

m1ke

TESTIFY

yeh, all this stuff here is dead right. I think what ID are trying to do with q3 is make it a cross betwen q1 and 2, and they are making it appeal to as many people as possible. It would be great to see a little unity, see the servers more packed, have an iq3cl with 20 clans in it and instead of 2 small communities of q1 and q2 players have one big community of love. Sounds communist , almost.

ButcherOfNog

can't wait for IQ3CL

once we get a version with TP lets fire it up. no waitin, no egos no nuthin just everyone slap their clans in there. you get good at TP by playing wars, as many as possible.

WhiteWashMan

un confirmed reports mention ath DF have already got hold of a copy of q3 from john C and have tactics worked to a fine art on all 32 levels
happily enough i can tell you that q3 does indeed kick the llamas ass and we shall be in this ol iq3cl whenever it starts off

(is that ok max, RW?)

white(eagerbeaver)wash

Jaden

Wan the Zero!

For Once ure making sense (ugh). Get some sodding servers up when the test comes out, and we have a real chance of kicking ass internationally.

Hail To The King, Baby.

Ronin

Poor Jaden the test is out ..

just not the winblows one ..

my guess is it`ll not be out for at least a week or so, cause they had serious probs with macs, nothing wrong with my linux though, worked perfect from the work go ...

Ro(about to sit an exam)nin or is the s h i t an exam? ...

Daa

Zero, it's what I was planning to do when I see Q3 on the shelves for the first time. I want to be ahead from the start...it's what we all should be planning to do, we have the chance now because we are all very experienced with Q1. WAN THE BOYZ!

Scarab

Shouldnt you be in school right now?

Kegser

I'd just like to tell you all that....

Kegser.

Oh hold on wasn't I supposed to say something? Oh yes. GO FORTH AND CONQUER, MY CHILDREN. Did I mention with Q3? I don't think I did. Oh dear.

Maximilian

Any word on when the damn thing is out on Windows.

Riker

I think all you Irish chaps have a good chance of beating everyone in Europe but as far as the US goes - forget it. They have free local calls and free ISDN/Cable not to mention too much time on their hands. I think yis should stick to Europe for Q3, there's no way you can beat the yanks. They have hundreds of people who play Quake full-time, how many people in Ireland play Quake for a living? Not many methinks but as far as Europe goes we should have 'em all by the balls.

Monty if you're reading this, TAKE IT!!! and tell your sister to TAKE IT!!! also

-Zenif

Dupre

If we get tired of playing Q3, we can just print some hi-res screenshots out and sell them as art on Dun Laoghaire pier or around Stephens Green.

ButcherOfNog

the standard of quake in europe is higher than in the states. clan9 v death row anyone? soz riker but yer well wrong.

Riker

Well then we'll have to agree to disagree

-Zenif

Mickah

If you want the standard to be raised in Q3 compared to Q1 or Q2, you need proper clans.
I don't know about you Q2 ppl but quake 1 clan scene is up it's arse, we have but 3 serious fully irish clans, INC, SCOBE and CW. With CW being far the better with 3 team.ie members on their side.
Fuuck the present clans, reorganise and have a good few decent clans who can play eachother non-stop week in week out. The only way you learn teamplay is by playing wars.

Mickah

Hecate

the situations basically the same in the q2 scene im afraid Mickah...3-4 clans dominate the entire thing, and any players that arent in those clans really arent worth talking about. The best ones are snapped up almost immediately. Also we have a serious lack of newbies...in the past few months i havent noticed ANY new q2 players knocking about the servers on a regular basis.

---

ADVICE:Big Brother is watching you,
learn to make yourself invisible.

robertgallagher@tinet.ie

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Zero

yeah I agree Mickah. Hopefully with Q3, the players will be from both Q1 and Q2.
Any Q1ers or Q2eers who don't like it at first should try and stick with it, it could be the new craze, i mean, in fairness, Quake is dead.
And ure right about the clans two, they should all start from scratch. I'm deffo gonna be a q3eer, Mick, you and me sort a clan when q3 gets goin?

Mickah

Z,
yeah kewl, but the problem is that people want to be in a good clan, and will try to get in with the best. I reckon either we're all gonna have to be mature about it and make sure that the talented players are distributed evenly amongst clans - which i can't see happening. Or we're gonna have ta put some, control on it like this Clan Survival thing eric has goin.

Mickah

Zero

yeah well there are plenty of good players, if we b cool about it, and form clans with only about 5 players in it, we should easily get plenty of decent clans, we don't know totally who'll be class and who won't at the game, but it will be fun to see players who played alongside each other for the last two years fighting it out on a server on different teams.

Slosh

Just as long as Q3 has a quick CA type pickup game for a non pro muppet like Moi!

Vorosha

For the very first time I understand how you Q1 guys feel when it comes to Q2.

I feel sorta cheated now that Q3 is coming out. I've worked hard to learn the Q2 levels and develop a feel for it... get to know players... learn to love the weapons...

So now that Q3 is coming out I really feel attached to Q2 and will find it very hard to leave it behind.



[This message has been edited by DeVore (edited 05-05-99).]

WhiteWashMan

um vor,
just take the pills and go back under the rock. good boy.

Vorosha

Nope, I won't take the pills. I won't take them for YOU, I won't take them for anybody.

As for the rock - I won't be going under it. I won't be going under it for YOU, WhiteWashMan, I won't be going under it... for ANYBODY.

ButcherOfNog

so like, is the rock vacant then like?

Blade

For the very first time I understand how you Q1 guys feel when it comes to Q2.
I feel sorta cheated now that Q3 is coming out. I've worked hard to learn the Q2 levels and develop a feel for it... get to know players... learn to love the weapons...

Yes thats the thing, but we can all have a fresh start with Q3, anyway Vor your talents for this type of game is never a waste, the basic principles that apply to one apply to them all, ie. Movement, aiming etc, only the physics, weps and maps change, I noticed for example when we played last night that even though I beat you bad on DM4 that your aim was actually better than mine, just that you hadn't a clue what to be doing, I just had the advantage of always having more armour and being in a better position than you, but on a more even situation you always won the fight.

Anyway as zero said we have to try and make a commitment to at least give Q3 a real chance if we are to save the "Quake" scene here but I can't say I agree with zero and Mickah on splitting quake clans up and starting from scratch because personally ourselves in CW go back a long long way from Indigo CTF when we hardly knew anyone or anything about DM and theres a strong bond there that I don't want to see broken and I'm sure most of the others in CW feel the same. I'd imagine MP wouldn't like INC split up either after all the work he's put in to building the clan up to what it is today and like CW thats a clan thats been here for years and always stayed "IRISH" and never gave in to taking a) D*ckheads and b) UK ninjas and still manage to be strong. It's very easy for anyone to go around and pick people who they see for the first time on a server kickin ass and forming a clan but these clans don't last p*ssing time, the one thing that makes a clan strong like INC and CW is that we all know each other in real life and get on well. The likes of ABAT's strength lies in the core of it's Irish players who know each other in real life but their UK players will come and go when they feel like it causing instability in the clan, a perfect example of this is one of their UK players 2 weeks ago asked me could he join CW after he had a row with Daaa, and I'd only seen this guy for the first time! The reason I formed CW was to get away from this sort of muppetry when we were all in DAoD (American/Irish clan)

Blade

El_Presidente

One major problem I can see with q3 is that its one of the new breed of games that NEEDS a 3d accelerator. The problem is that I doubt (maybe i'm wrong) that many college PCs will have such cards. This will make college play alot harder and lets face it, a good chunk of Irish quake players are playing from college.

Scarab

Yeah, unless microsoft release word 3d, although our pc's in college have an 8mg rage 3d card i think.

Zero

Just coming from a half-hour discussion on IRC on the whole thing.

Anyone can see that if the four main Q1 clans in Ireland move to Q3, forgetting Q2 for a minute, the whole thing would end up like it is today, the few top clans know their sh*t in a clan war, know their tactics, etc., everyone else is left behind. The reason CA is so big in this country is because u only have a few clans worth talking about, they learn new tricks, keep their teamplay, anyone new starting Quake was either drafted into a mickymouse clan or left to rot on the CA servers. There are a lot of so-called muppets who would probably be very effective as a teamplayer if they were playing for any sort of decent team.
I'm not saying, Oh all clans split up and form new ones with muppets in them. What we need is a decent even distribution of talented players, not four clans with 9 or 10 players in them hogging all the power and the knowledge of how to play the game.
Quake is dead, or at least Irish Quake is dead. The IQCL crashed and burned, there are f*ckall decent clans around, yet loads of players. More is done in Quake1 on the f*ckin IRC server than anywhere else, and I'm sure most people will agree with me, Quake is gone boooooooring.
Quake3 will be new and fresh, a race to see who can be the best, it will be FUN again.
I volunteer to run the IQ3CL, hopefully we can start it late this summer if enuff ppl start playing, and we can have some fun.

Zero.

P.S. While it's bothering me :
<von> you're talking specifically bout splitting CW up i think z : )

The good thing about Q3 is it will get rid of 'up-ureself' attitudes like this one, at least for a while. Just think of it, for at least 6 months nobody sitting up on their Beast's knee looking down their noses at you. von, I was best in this country when you were still in ure Quake nappies. Looking forward to raping ure gay a$$ in Q3.

[This message has been edited by Zero (edited 05-05-99).]

ButcherOfNog

I'd say that the IQ3CL will be a toss up between HIV & DzR, I really don't think you guys should worry about it

on a more serious note, you can't compete in the UK unless you have at least 8 active dedicated players in a clan so I can't see the main Q2 clans splitting.

Oh and before anyone splits CW up, HIV formally challenge their arses in a Q3 war. prepare to TAKE IT!

Vorosha

In Q3, right, will there be a Rocket Launcher?

If so, will it fire rockets or will it just be like... a dud? Like if there IS going to be an RL in there like in Q1 and Q2 then like will they bring rockets over aswell or will it be like a melee weapon? You know like a big pipe for bashing heads?

Were there rockets for the Rocket Launcher in Q1 and Q2? I never found out 'cos my fire button was bound to MOUSE1 and like MOUSE1 is broke... have to navigate windows using the keys... getting sorta good at it now tho.

Anyway I've never killed anyone with the RL in Q1 or Q2 'cos like all I can use it as is like a weapon for bashing in heads and it's sorta hard to bash heads when other players have guns that fire bullets at me like and kill me.

Did y'ever think about going to sea on a boat? Fishing like. You know on 2FM they have that thing where they give people Friday off from work. Like they organise it with their boss or whatever... dunno how it works. Well what if your a self-employed fisherman. How do you get the day off then? Do 2FM give you money equal to the amount of fish you would of caught?

Sometimes people forget that we're actually living on an island... maybe it's just things have got so busy...

...I dunno.

[This message has been edited by Vorosha (edited 06-05-99).]

WhiteWashMan

here, what did i say about those pills?

and where did yur rock go?

you are getting too weird. put yer suit back on and reform dali.it'll give you something to do

[This message has been edited by WhiteWashMan (edited 06-05-99).]

shank

I hate to put a downer on this but we're prolly not gonna see q3 till just before xmas, so why don u q1 lads move to q2 and start practicin for it

Re clans: I can't really see DzR splitting up either.

---

shank1@usa.net
q2n.quake.ie

regi

I think I agree with Zero in that clans should be more fairly distributed, but its never gonna happen. I can't imagine anyone in CW leaving the rock-solid core of Beast + Tomb behind, or anyone in scobe wanting to leave and not play with the likes of Koopa and Bunny. However, I think clan competition has the potential to be large and self-sustaining (!), so long as a majority of Q1 and Q2'ers play the game. Personally, I'd love to 'ave a go at HIV and DZR, as I'm sure they'd like to take a crack at CW and INC. So bring it on, and let us move forward together, to heal this rift between q1 and q2, building new bridges together. (I insist that the members of Q2 fully decommission their railguns first tho).

Anyway, I'm going almost totally concentrate on Q2 between now and then. Man, I really like Q2

Dan

Scarab

Jesus people arent going to wait till the game actually comes out for sale to play it, you can play the test for a few months. Anyways you quake2 lads should move to quake1 to get practicing. Quake 2 muppets will be shafted in Quake3!

shank

Well playin the test is all well and good, but if you've played it you'll know there is only one proper map in it. id did hint that there would be a demo released and seeing as the full game won't be available for a long while yet I reckon we may see a demo this summer.

---

shank1@usa.net
q2n.quake.ie

ButcherOfNog

Scarab, the only things we'd learn from qw is the maps plus the physics of the game, thats where I found I was weakest when I played it, whenever I did play CA I tended to get killed when I reversed into a wall instead of a door etc. in the middle of a fight or misjudging the reload/speed of the RL etc. the fact that i can't setup my keys the same way as i have them in q2 also gets me, as afaik you can't bind stuff to the numeric keypad in qw.

anyways, the qw shaft is just a short range q2 chaingun, same principle of use applies.

theres no point really in us q2'ers learning the qw physics when q3 is going to be different.


[This message has been edited by ButcherOfNog (edited 06-05-99).]

Kali

you can hold ppl in the air with the quake2 chaingun??

Slosh

Ahhh but Q2 doesnt have air movement, def doesnt have the gameplay speed or weapon change speed.. and q3 will have all these.. yahay

Scarab

And my point was that it isnt going to be Quake2 either. It's a mix between the two. There is poxy stupid annoying useless weapon change times and weapons from quake2, mmm railgun, and from quake there is air control as part of the physics, u lads really dont know what u are missing with this, also there are going to be quake weapons in there too, ive used that chaingun thingy and its not at all like the shaft, possibly it aims a little the same, but that is where the similarity ends. i mean you cant bokk someone up into the air and hold them up with the chaingun, now can you.

ID are aiming for a game between quake1 and quake2, i think they realise that they went too far in terms of realim with quake2, making it slower and no air movement and all.
Which is why quake was so much more popular, even if it isnt as popular now.

Dont play CA if you want to experience Quake as it is rather ****.

Scarab

pffffffffffffffffffff

U c unts nicked my points while i was typing!

Ken duel?

Slosh

Dont knock CA Scarry, its a great game for ppl like myself whose quake time is severely limited!

Scarab

I just dont like it because you dont really have to think in it.

Devore please do not reply

ButcherOfNog

i only played CA cause theres rarely anyone on the other irish servers. got fed up of it and qw is sitting in a zip file on my HD