A Different view on Liverpool

Sajan

I just read this on a Liverpool FC website. Not the official one but better. Koptalk.com
I have posted here about my feelings but this guy sums up sensationally. I hope everyone can enjoy.

Following the Spurs game I couldn't really explain how I felt. I was filled with anger, disappointment and frustration yet I still felt for Gerard Houllier after the game even though he had made me feel like that.

I've started taking my daughter Charlotte to all the games from this season and she's been so excited each time I have taken her despite our less than desirable run. All I wanted was for us to put one in the Spurs goal to put a smile on her face. She may only be 10 but she's more switched on football wise than most. "It's not right for fans to boo the team is it Dad?" she said as we walked up the steps in the ground after the game. "No love it isn't but you can understand why some of them are. They're just fed up."

I was going to do an editorial that night but thought I'd leave it until the next day so I felt a bit better. Even then though I couldn't face talking about our start to the season. But here I am now. It's Friday afternoon and I'm about to open a can of Woodpecker and reflect on that game and look ahead.

During the Spurs game I was frustrated with Steven Gerrard. Steven is a great player and was one of the best players that night I know. He runs around all night like a chicken on speed and always gives 100% but I lost count at the amount of killer balls that didn't come off. If he could stop trying to be the new Zidane we'd keep hold of the ball a lot more. I know, I know, if everyone gave as much as him we'd be laughing. I'm not criticising him, I'm just saying that I already know he's great and he has nothing to prove, the rest will come in time with maturity.

Another thing that annoys the **** out of me is why every Red has to come back to defend a corner. This allows defenders from the opposing team to come even further forward rather than hanging around on their own at the half way line. This simple problem is doing my head in. Where's the skipper?

I already know that Kewell plays well on the left but against Spurs this was so evident. He was a genuine threat attacking down the left and he has to be played there or futher in but not on the right. The majority of us already know that so I won't go down that one. During the game I spent a lot of time watching Kewell and Finnan off the ball. Both were forever throwing their arms in the air and shouting at other team-mates to remind them that they were there or becuase they were frustrated at how the ball was given away by some Maradona Wannabe. Finnan exchanged a few words with Dudek several times when he could have delivered a quick throw out to him on the right rather than hoofing the ball up field to nobody. Kewell may have had a slow start to his Anfield career but let's just hope he and Finnan don't become complacent like others.

Diouf had another great game and so too did Smicer. I was really pleased when the Kop voiced their anger when he was taken off. It's those kind of tactical decisions though that amaze me. Why Le Tallec and Riise weren't thrown on towards the end of the game is beyond me, it really is. Personally it's **** or bust for me when at home drawing 0-0 with not long to go. At least the fans would understand if we ended up losing 1-0 because we took a defender off and threw someone on to attack for the last ten minutes and we came unstuck. I would anyway.

Michael Owen was extremely poor against Spurs. He just doesn't look arsed in my opinion. Frustrated maybe but the sooner he stops feeling sorry for himself the better. I don't care who you are, I want 100% all of the time. Just be ****ing proud to wear the Red shirt and get stuck in instead of watching others around you running themselves into the ground.

I appreciate that manager has to take responsibility for his decisions, some of which confuse me but it's time the players repaid the faith he has placed in them. It's just not on. It's also about time that Sammy Lee and Phil Thompson found the guts to stand up and say "Look, this or that is simply not working" - strange how they don't isn't it? If neither of the respected duo can identify the things that the fans can clearly see, how are they helping the manager? Any muppet can slip into a pair of shorts and start waving their hands in the air before the game saying "Ey up lads, come on lads, you know you can do it". If I was Phil Thompson I'd be teaching them a thing or two. Let's say Heskey's fit to face Everton and I was the assistant manager, I'd push the striker up against the wall and point to Gerard Houllier and say, "You see him, you see him do ya? He's stood by you for years you sack of useless ****! Get out there and justify your ****ing self. No wonder he nearly snuffed it! The **** he's taken because of you and all we hear is that your not feeling confident enough. We'll if you're not confident enough, take that ****ing Red shirt off and **** off! Next?"

Gerard Houllier's never going to start throwing cups of tea around but come on, it's not right for some of them to just turn up for a run out. I also accept that it's not right to play players out of position or insult the intelligence of the fans but it's also not right for fans to be disrespectful to the club including the manager be we at the top or the bottom. All of us, the manager, the coaching staff, certain players, certain fans, certain websites including this one have all contributed or said things at one time or another that hasn't helped. It's time that everyone associated to the club accepts their own responsibilities, pull together and said "**** it! We all make up the club, we're one. We win together, we lose together. Forget blame, let's just get on with the job in hand and turn the bluenose ******* over!"

I haven't agreed with a lot of things the manager has done over the last couple of years but I have supported him and will continue to do so in the hope that things will go right for him but without the support of everyone, especially those close to him, we will fail.

I ask you to trust me on this one. I'm not pro-Houllier. Ironically many moons ago I was the only one on the net labelled as anti-Houllier purely because I saw what was coming. I'm not on either side of the fence, I just want what's right for the club and I don't accept anyone can come in and do a better job just now with the squad we have because there wouldn't be millions of pounds to throw around (yes we all know why). Think about it. And while I'm at it, you can forget suggesting Thommo or Lee as a replacement because if Houllier goes, I'd want them all out because why would it be different under them?

As frustrating as it is, I'm prepared to show my support, bite my tongue and plod on through the storm...this is for Gerard Houllier....

When you walk through a storm
Hold your head up high,
And don't be afraid of the dark.
At the end of a storm,
There's a golden sky,
And the sweet silver song of a lark.
Walk on through the wind, Walk on through the rain,
Though your dreams be tossed and blown...
Walk on, walk on, with hope in your heart,
And you'll never walk alone... You'll never walk alone.
Walk on, walk on, with hope in your heart,
And you'll never walk alone...
You'll never walk alone.

KdjaCL

LOL thats funny.


hmm not meant to be a joke is it ?


kdjac

The Muppet

As frustrating as it is, I'm prepared to show my support, bite my tongue and plod on through the storm...this is for Gerard Houllier....

Will he say that Monday if You lose the derby.

UbahOne

What a load bull****.

StickyMcGinty

**** off ubah one

this is from a REAL fan and not just of liverpool, of football.

UbahOne

He clearly is a fan of Gerrard Houllier and Liverpool. He is talking ****. He is totally over reacting. He is taking it way too seriously.

Sajan

He hasn't been a fan of Houllier from day one. He has been very vocal about his dislike of Houllier and what he says there is exactly what happens. he has an objective view on things. Unlike half of the tossers in here

UbahOne

whatever

StickyMcGinty

this man is a passionate supporter of the 'pool and is asking fans to keep faith in the club, whatever fool may be running the show.

jongore

Sentimental twaddle, he may be a Liverpool fan but he suffers from the same sentementality that has held Liverpool back for years.
It's not working, it's crap to watch and Liverpool are in danger of becoming a boring mid table side. GH has been given plenty of money and time and Liverpool are no better now then when Evans was in charge.
The top teams need the champions league and the money it brings. Without this you have neither to money nor the profile to attract the top players.
How many Liverpool players would get in the Utd or Arse teams? Hyppia? Gerard? and these are only maybe.
I'm a United fan and I can remember the 80's when Liverpool were great and United at best were a cup side. Atkinson got the sack when he finished 4th after winning the first 10 games, that season was very similar to the season liverpool had last year. United sacked him got AF and the rest is history. It took five years for AF to turn Utd around but an improvement could be seen every year.
Liverpool and their fans have lived on their history and tradition for long enough. Mention to a Liverpool fan that United(Or Arse) have won the league and they'll trot out the old but we've won more league titles then you!
Get over it get your heads in the 21st century and realise what danger your club is in. If you fall now you may never get up again!

sleepwalker

im not a liverpool fan but in fairness now dudek,owen,hyppia and gerrard would all get into the arsenal and utd team

UbahOne

dudek,owen,hyppia and gerrard

BULL****! Owen a sub for Van Nist. Gerrard would get ahead of Djemba but not Butt and won't get ahead of Djemba in a few years if all goes to plan.

BKtje

Owen would get into the Man U team. WTF would you have him as sub for nistlerooy unless your playing 4-5-1. 4-4-2 hes better than Forlan bya loooong way. Kop on (no pun intended ). Gerard wouldn't get ahead of keane or scholes tbh.

Hyypia? I prefer Silvestre and i have faith in Rio.
Howard has been very impressive. not sure wether him or Dudek would get in my 1st 11.

UbahOne

Owen would get into the Man U team. WTF would you have him as sub for nistlerooy unless your playing 4-5-1.

DUHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rolleyes:

Gerard wouldn't get ahead of keane or scholes tbh.

I take it this bit is not directed at me because i never said such a thing.

Howard has been very impressive. not sure wether him or Dudek would get in my 1st 11.

?????????????

The Muppet

Let's say Heskey's fit to face Everton and I was the assistant manager, I'd push the striker up against the wall and point to Gerard Houllier and say, "You see him, you see him do ya? He's stood by you for years you sack of useless ****!

I thought the inital post made some valid points and was obviously written by a passionate fan. However who is responsible for continuing to play these under achieving players and who bought them in the first place. I would also ask who plays them out of position and chooses team tactics. The ultimate responsibility for results lies with the manager and GH is Obviously lacking in the skills needed to fulfill his duties.



BTW sorry for going back on topic;)

p.pete

Thought the article was really good. He thinks the manager is poor but back the team while he is there.

Also there is a lack of effort from a lot of the players which I think is a fair comment. You see so much more effort from ManU and Arsenal players - regardless of the higher skill levels that arsenal and manu have we still need to work harder.

Also if GH is going Lee and Thompson should be going too.

LizardKing

This article is for Liverpool fans only ... all non-pool fans who comment on it are obviously gonna think its tripe ... They should all feck off and read threads on there own clubs ....

I think the Guy makes some good points , Gerrard does try the killer ball too much for my liking , I would not mind if they worked out but most of the time its just losing valuable possesion..

Kewell needs time as does finnan, both have looked good and will hopefully do well ....

Houllier has had to put up with an awful lot of $hite from fans who should be supporting / encouraging the team, I am firmly against this type of abuse especially booing the team from the stands , even if they lose you should clap them off the pitch....

I was very dissappointed with the reds start to the season as were most fans but now they have gotten a victory under there belts hopefully it will prove to be a positive season for all liverpool fans , and hopefully houllier will be able to smile a bit more

jonno

Originally posted by LizardKing
This article is for Liverpool fans only ... all non-pool fans who comment on it are obviously gonna think its tripe ... They should all feck off and read threads on there own clubs ...

I think the Guy makes some good points , Gerrard does try the killer ball too much for my liking , I would not mind if they worked out but most of the time its just losing valuable possesion..

Kewell needs time as does finnan, both have looked good and will hopefully do well ....

Houllier has had to put up with an awful lot of $hite from fans who should be supporting / encouraging the team, I am firmly against this type of abuse especially booing the team from the stands , even if they lose you should clap them off the pitch....

I was very dissappointed with the reds start to the season as were most fans but now they have gotten a victory under there belts hopefully it will prove to be a positive season for all liverpool fans , and hopefully houllier will be able to smile a bit more

Exactly what I was going to say.

The poster has made some very good points most of which I agree with

Kone

Good article imho

Space Coyote

Football fans are a fickle breed of homosapiens. Kick them when they're down, cheer them when they're up. It's always been like that. Of course there are those who support their team thru thick and thin, but there are breaking points at times when you think... right enough is enough...I'm sick of this sh*t...Get him out...etc.
I would never boo or jeer Liverpool at Anfield no matter how atrosious they played and/or lost the game. I think that behaviour is diabolical and those "fans" should be ashamed of themselves. But your attitude towards certain players and/or the manager is going to change now and again, that's a normal reaction imo.

jongore

Originally posted by LizardKing
This article is for Liverpool fans only ... all non-pool fans who comment on it are obviously gonna think its tripe ... They should all feck off and read threads on there own clubs ....

Get your head out of your ars€, if you post here anyone who is interested in football is going to reply.

Do you think that beacuse we support other teams that we cannot add to the debate about Liverpool?

I'm a United fan, but I also enjoy watching good football, Liverpool during the 80's provided this in abundence, even under Souness they were good to watch, but since Evans and now GH Liverpool are no longer an entertaining team.:(

What I said before is written from a football perspective, I used Utd as an example of how being ruthless can have benifits.

If you want to post messages for Liverpool fans only, then post on the Liverpool site!;)

LizardKing

The Article is from a Liverpool fan to Liverpool fans , United fans or fans of other teams have the right to comment on it if they feel the need however the comments from non pool fans SO FAR have been complete $hite including your own blatently anti-liverpool biased commentary..... As a utd. fan perhaps you should be more worried about your teams current form .. the last 2 games I saw them play against Wolves and Southampton shows they TOO can be boring to watch ...

Liverpool are in no danger of Falling anywhere especially not down a division , I can even see that with my head up my ars€ !!

:rolleyes:

jongore

When I said Liverpool would fall, it was the fall from a top premiership side to a midtable side. If you read the whole way through my post you would realise that.

Liverpool are in no danger of relegation but they have to start becoming regular challengers (and winners) off the league title.

I watched football during the 80s when Liverpool were the team to match yourself against and Utd were the also rans. The present Liverpool team isn't fit to tie the laces of the players from that era.

Liverpool fans must aim for a return of those days when they challanged for or won the title every season, when you settle for less then that you are no longer a top team.:eek:

jonno

Originally posted by jongore
Get your head out of your ars€, if you post here anyone who is interested in football is going to reply.

ya but most of the pool bashing posters post the same monotonous tripe all the time.

If you want to post messages for Liverpool fans only, then post on the Liverpool site!;)

And if you want to bash Liverpool at every opportunity go to a Man Utd site!

LizardKing

I think every football fan knows that teams never permanently stay at the top of the League and they go through phases (unless you look at rosenberg in Norway) ... Utd. have had their phase as did Liverpool in the 80's ... Liverpool have finished in the Top 5 in the last 4 -5 years in the premiership ... now I agree with you that they are not playin the football as was played in the 80's but that team is gone , we have to look forward as well as remembering the good years ...

I also concede the fact you may have meant "falling" to mean a mid-table team ... however Top 5 is not mid table IMO

It'll be an interesting season but its too early to IMO for Houllier bashing and thats the main point of the article above ... lets forget last season and support the current team to push up the table ....

Dr Bolouswki

A thread for Liverpool fans only... c'mon now fella's - surely anyone with a knowledge about football and a passion for it can reply here... though I would agree that the posters that prompted your calls for a closed shop (you scousers - union crazy!) should stay out of it if all they're gonna talk is sh*te (MMMmmm - wonder who they support?)

Good article. However, liverpools age old problem (since GH took over) is still there I feel, despite your signings. Width and creativity. I'm glad to hear finnan was vocal about the lack of balls played to him, and I agree also that Kewell should play on the left or left central... the boo boys do themselves a disservice, as I'd imagine the last thing an underconfident team needs is their own fans booing them...

Finally - a win and 2 draws from 4 games? Not championship winning stuff sure, but hardly time to get the knives out just yet. Gerrards and Owens comments about needing CL football are ill-timed, and I feel the whole team needs and injection of confidence and passion... and in fairness to the naysayers, surely its the managers job to give it to them?

The Muppet

I think every football fan knows that teams never permanently stay at the top of the League and they go through phases

I agree this was the case but all the money now in football and the big clubs getting richer all the time i,m not so sure it is anymore as they can purchase the players to guarentee success.
I dont believe you can buy the title but you can buy the players who will win you the title if they gel as a unit.Uless there are more russian billionaires about I can see it just getting harder for the less sucessfull to breach the divide.

jongore

Originally posted by LizardKing

I also concede the fact you may have meant "falling" to mean a mid-table team ... however Top 5 is not mid table IMO

In the context of the present league and the money generated anyone outside the top 4 (Champions League positions) is a midtable side.

A top side must consistently finish in the top 4 to get in the Champions league, this rises the clubs profile internationally (Merchandising opportunities) and provides a large amount of cash (At least twice what a team gets in the UEFA cup).

This money can then be used to improve the side, not everyone will find a Russian sugar daddy to provide unlimited cash.:)

Waster

Good liverpool article.
http://www.dangerhere.com/gufflog/comments.php?id=P342_0_1_0_C

nasty_crash

All fans of football should be welcomed to air their veiws on any of these boards - thats the idea of having the boards. How come every person that knew anything bout footy commented on the whole Alex Ferguson contract thing and should he stay or go. i am a loyal liverpool supporter and will als be. but the booin the team is nothing short of discraceful! I seen pool play charlton last season and we were 1 down with 15 mins to go - the whole place were booin and calling gerrard als sorts but then he scored the winner and then its i love gerrard!! there passionate fans but the turn and complain far too quick! GH should be given the rest of the season to see how he gets on - if he wins nothing this year then he should be released!! And bring tommo with him, jesus i have nightmares of him managing liverpool!! AHHHH

As for the liverpool players getting into arse or utd teams - what bout finnan surely he would be rated higher than g neville or lauren??? and hyypia is much better than silvertre or keown!! gerrard could get in along side viera at arse but he wouldnt kick out keane or scholes at utd!! Owen would get into both teams - he has bad games but when he is good - he is class!! against everton the other day he was all over the defence (prob cos the defence of everton is s***)!!!

LizardKing

Good Article .. some valid points made by the author ...

The Muppet

Good Unbiased article indeed. I would not agree on Owen displacing van or henry but if either teams were to playy 4 4 2 well then yes he would be an addition. I think sylvester is under rated by non MU fans probably due to his poor start at the club but he is vastly improved and looks good at cb and weather Hypia would displace him is debatable.

UbahOne

As for the liverpool players getting into arse or utd teams - what bout finnan surely he would be rated higher than g neville or lauren??? and hyypia is much better than silvertre or keown!!

No G.Neville is a much better player than FInnan imo. And i would have Silvestre ahead of Hypia anyday.

smemon

if that guy is a football fan, he'd want houllier out. any football fan wants houllier to go.

stop comparing him with alex ferguson, they have completely different styles, houllier keeps changing, fergie hasnt changed much, always gives youth a chance, likes his team to play football and attack.

houllier has a german brain and pub team style of play. any football fan in the right mind wants houllier out of liverpool and football for good.

Dr Bolouswki

No G.Neville is a much better player than FInnan imo. And i would have Silvestre ahead of Hypia anyday.

Maaan... Ubahone... you need to take off the blinkers man... I know you are Man U but seriously, any United fans I know, all very serious about their football (ever hear of Nationwide Football?), don't rate Gary Neville... Silvestre I'd conceed has become quite dependable but is still prone to more lapses than Hypia (Hoopia-h?)

You shouldn't let your allegiances blind you - United have more world class players than most premiership teams can boast, but I don't think Neville can be counted as one of them! Even ferguson rates him as second fiddle....

UbahOne

Gary Neville is one of the most experienced footballers in the premiership. He is quick, can cross and can tackle and pass well. Whats wrong with him?

Even ferguson rates him as second fiddle....

Proove this please...

And what is wrong with silvestre? Hes an excellent player.

JaneyMackers

The guy who wrote this article live and breaths LFC. I am a member of his site and its great. So much info and news. The boards are very good as well.

Its the biggest fans site anywhere. Its been knwon to get 100,000 hits a hours when things get exciting etc.

The article has some great points and on the contarary to what other team fans have been saying is exactly why I support the club so much.

Better than most of your fans being board directors and their guests who don't even normally like football.

The Muppet

Better than most of your fans being board directors and their guests who don't even normally like football.

Huh

Utd must have a big board

LizardKing

if that guy is a football fan, he'd want houllier out. any football fan wants houllier to go.

You would not be tryin' to speak for every football fan now would ya ???? :rolleyes:

p.pete

Originally posted by UbahOne
Gary Neville is one of the most experienced footballers in the premiership.

So is Gary Breen, whats your point?

UbahOne

My point is G Neville is one of the best right backs in the Premiership.

p.pete

Originally posted by UbahOne
My point is G Neville is one of the best right backs in the Premiership.

Who says? our gary was one of the best centre backs at the last world cup - btw i am happy for g neville (or p or neville neville or any of their ilk) to have lengthy careers at old trafford and if ye wouldn't swap them then that causes no grief for most people.

BTW is Carragher in the current England squad? I would give him the right back slot over either of the nev twins on current form

UbahOne

I say he is. Its obvious. Theres something about the Nevilles. There hard working and can tackle hard and can pass the ball, cross it and run wit hthe ball. There good players and i wouldnt have Breen or Finnan ahead of him.

Sajan

Since the start of this thread. UbahOne has not said an objective point. I dont see the point of posting in this thread if all you do is be argumentative and just do peoples head in really who can argue and talk properly. I really dont see the point. And my Dad has been a United supporter for 40 years. And a very keen one. You should see his view on Neville. BTW. Isn't Danny Mills England's number one choice at Right back?

p.pete

Originally posted by Sajan
Since the start of this thread. UbahOne has not said an objective point.

Some words of wisdom from the man himself:

What a load bull****.

He clearly is a fan of Gerrard Houllier and Liverpool. He is talking ****. He is totally over reacting. He is taking it way too seriously.

whatever

BULL****! Owen a sub for Van Nist. Gerrard would get ahead of Djemba but not Butt and won't get ahead of Djemba in a few years if all goes to plan.

DUHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And it goes on like that - all off topic and like you pointed out sajan, not exactly objective.

UbahOne

Im not being arguementative. Im just being opinionated. Maybe a bit too much but still, im just sticking up for what i think is right.

Thanx 4 The Fish

So ya reckon Gerrard would not get a game ahead of Butt eh ?? So why is it then that he is chosen for his national team ahead of Butt?

jonno

That's some collection of no-brainer quotes anyway.

Anyway I reckon Gerrard and Owen would start for most teams in the premiership.

As for the article there, I agree with most of what was said there. GH does need to bring in a pacey defender to partner Sami. Boumsong would be ideal. The aquisition of Carl Medjani is another piece of evidance that GH is indeed trying to add pace to his defence for the future. Henchoz is a great defender but he is fairly static in his play. I think Biscans pace was a key factor in why Liverpool attacked so much against Everton. He may have his critics but to me he performed very well in that match.

Waster

I would suggest that steve finnan is a superior right back for the following reasons.
1. He was voted best right back by his peers in the pfa premiership team of the season 01-02. I don't remember gary neville ever being in it so it looks like the professionals disagree with you.

2. Fergie tried to sign him as uniteds right back before he finalised his move to liverpool. See the following links.

http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/sport/football/manchesterunited/stories/Detail_LinkStory=62645.html

http://www.soccernet.com/england/news/2002/0420/20020420mufcfinnanffc.html

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/archivedirs/news/2003/jun/1/N140422030601-0821.html

http://archives.tcm.ie/breakingnews/2003/05/30/story100860.asp

http://www.soccer365.com/EUROPEAN_NEWS/Premiership/page_99_52899.shtml

Waster

I was very impressed with Biscan on saturday. His tackle on radzinski was perhaps the greatest piece of timing, composure and confidence in the game. His pace and ability to bring the ball out of defence enables us to play 15 yards futher up the pitch without worring so much about defenders getting in behind. With SH and SH there is the fear that neither of them will be able to recover in time if the offside trap fails. This new style does have it's risks and downsides but the positives far outweigh the negatives IMO.

jonno

We also have Jon Ostemober who is an attacking defender (if you know what I mean ). I would like to see him get a chance in cup games so we have another option. Also Babbell (out on loan) is a quick defender. I think when Hamann comes back from injury he will be the anchor in place of Stevie G. He is also a quick player and great at getting back to help out the defence. That would leave Stevie G to play in front of him and use that brilliant right foot of his to thread through balls through to the front men.

I would like to see Liverpool play wing backs as I believe they have the players to pull it off. Finnan on the right with Risse on the left. There was one major problem I noticed in the Everton game. It was Finnan not getting much of the ball when he was overlapping Diouf. Perhaps Diouf isn't used to having a wing back in support seen as how Carragher wasn't an attacking prowess last season. But once he and Finnan gell on that wing it could work very well.