County Councillor claims nothing wrong with going to Argentina at tax payers expense

darkman2 · 29-07-2008 5:48pm #1

Herald.ie

Why I really needed to go on Argentina junket

By Fiachra O'Cionnaith

Tuesday July 29 2008

A SENIOR south-Dublin councillor has claimed she can't understand criticism of her taxpayer-funded journey to South America for an international airport conference.

Yesterday, it was revealed that councillor costs hit almost €30m last year, leading to claims that the public was being ripped off by the high price of local government.

But claiming she couldn't "see the point in getting uptight" about the amount of money being spent, Fine Gael councillor and former Mayor of South Dublin County Council Therese Ridge said the criticism was simply about having an axe to grind.

And hitting out at the insight into how councillors spend taxpayers' money, Ms Ridge -- who last year travelled to Buenos Aires for an airport security conference at the public's expense -- claimed she couldn't understand the interest in how councillors spend their expense allowances.

Speaking on Newstalk's Lunchtime with Eamon Keane, the Clondalkin councillor dismissed claims there was no need to travel to Buenos Aires in November -- but refused to give any details about what took place at the meeting.

"We're a small island, we have security problems. We have had security problems around some of our airports. I'm quite serious about this.

"Now hold on. That's what I did with my allowance, because I felt it was something I was particularly interested in and had no problem in going to it.
"I used my own allowance very wisely. Why are you worried about the distance? It's about the money and I didn't go over my allowance," she said.

*(why indeed):mad:*

Public anger has grown over the amount of taxpayers' money spent on councillors travelling to foreign destinations.

But defending the reasons for her voyage to the other side of the world, the Fine Gael representative said it was far from a short holiday to South America, and that she is always available to her constituents.

"I have been elected since 1985 and I have never been asked about this. I'd like to point out that I wasn't the only delegate from Ireland and it was other areas where people have airports that were interested.

"I genuinely feel that you don't understand from the point of view of Irish people. We're a small island. Our libraries, until we started looking at them in Europe, consisted of nothing but books.

Lessons

"Now, you know, you have public meetings, music lessons, language lessons, everything. All this is brought up because we went away? Listen anyway; I have no axe to grind."

Yesterday, it was revealed that county and city councillors have received over €83m in payments over the past three years through wages, allowances and expenses.

According to the figures, councillors raked in an average of €33,347 last year in wages, allowances and expenses -- some €730 more than the average industrial worker's take-home pay.

This means that the total amount of money handed over to local representatives last year stood at a mammoth €29.4m.

- Fiachra O'Cionnaith

Had to go to Argentina to discuss 'security' - what a load of bollox.:mad:

These councillors up and down the country are getting away with these junkets every single year and we are paying fot it. Can someone explain why a group of County Councillors from Dublin have to go to Argentina to discuss 'security'?

Victor · 30-07-2008 3:38pm

You aren't a very good troll, are you?

darkman2 wrote: »

Had to go to Argentina to discuss 'security' - what a load of bollox.:mad: These councillors up and down the country are getting away with these junkets every single year and we are paying fot it. Can someone explain why a group of County Councillors from Dublin have to go to Argentina to discuss 'security'?

I understand only one councillor went to this meeting and I'm sure people from all over the world attended.

brianthebard · 30-07-2008 3:42pm

In fairness this isn't an isolated incident.The last word had a ff councillor from roscommon a few months ago explaning why he went on a junket to the middle east and how he needed to have nice suits and hotel rooms to impress the people he was dealing with.Councillors take the people for as much as they can as often as they can imo.

darkman2 · 30-07-2008 9:37pm

Victor wrote: »

You aren't a very good troll, are you?I understand only one councillor went to this meeting and I'm sure people from all over the world attended.

I did not say more then one councillor attended that meeting/junket. However everyone knows this is going on and often more then 1 go out with their families and all. There is no needed for any councillor in Ireland to travel that far for anything at tax payers expense.

galwayrush · 30-07-2008 9:42pm

i'm sure the Leitrim councillors who went somewhere exotic some years back to discuss high rise buildings brought back a wealth of vital knowledge

Perhaps the one who wondered who would feed the Gondolas some years back should go on a Haggis hunting trip to Scotland.:D

thelordofcheese · 30-07-2008 9:46pm

darkman2 wrote: »

I did not say more then one councillor attended that meeting/junket. However everyone knows

'Everyone' knows eh? Strike up one for Argumentum ad populum.

darkman2 wrote: »

this is going on and often more then 1 go out with their families and all. There is no needed for any councillor in Ireland to travel that far for anything at tax payers expense.

I find it hard to take you seriously when your making such sweeping statements. Can you honestly say there would never be a legitimate reason for a councillor to travel to Argentina?

darkman2 · 30-07-2008 10:37pm

thelordofcheese wrote: »

'Everyone' knows eh? Strike up one for Argumentum ad populum.

I find it hard to take you seriously when your making such sweeping statements. Can you honestly say there would never be a legitimate reason for a councillor to travel to Argentina?

How anyone can condone councillors travelling around the world, sometimes in big groups with their families, to see or discuss things that could easily be seen in Britain or Europe is unbelievable especially when one thinks of our notoriously corrupt councils. No wonder this country is so corrupt when so many dont give a damn.

marco murphy · 30-07-2008 10:38pm

A motion was passed in Navan TC, which makes sure things like this don't happen.

Phlann · 30-07-2008 10:40pm

Dreadful use of quotes in that article.

Clare_Guy · 30-07-2008 11:29pm

Victor wrote: »

I understand only one councillor went to this meeting and I'm sure people from all over the world attended.

I heard the interview on newstalk. The idiot councillor specifically said she wasn't the only irish councillor there. it's a f*cking joke, councillors getting what they can outta the system.

Right outta the fianna fail school of "public-service"!!!

lost marbles · 30-07-2008 11:48pm

33k would pay a social worker for an out of office hours on call service and probably save a life .
bloody disgrace :mad:

GrahamThomas · 30-07-2008 11:52pm

I can see absolutely no benefit arising from a county councillor attending a conference on something like airport security. I mean how much influence can someone in her position possibly have on the matter?

If it's so important why not send a person of importance, perhaps a member of the Oireachtas committee responsible for airport security or a senior Garda?

Pompey Magnus · 31-07-2008 9:45am

Why couldn't she just organise a teleconference to discuss these issues for a tiny fraction of the cost. I can understand the advantage of experts on airport security needing to be physically present to exchange ideas but I can't see any benefit in a person with (I assume) no experience in airport security being there. We have the technology to save on these unneccesary trips, use it.

By the way what was a South Dublin Councillor doing at an airport security meeting when Dublin Airport is under Fingal County Council jurisdiction?

is_that_so · 31-07-2008 9:53am

Firstly this is the Herdild and the councillor has a point. Not all councillor trips are daft and some councillors do go on to the Dail. It makes sense to me that they should inform themselves. IMO the only requirement of these obvious junkets is that they should be chosen for real benefit and not because they are happening somewhere nice.

thelordofcheese · 31-07-2008 10:10am

Ohh jesus.

darkman2 wrote: »

How anyone can condone councillors travelling around the world, sometimes in big groups with their families, to see or discuss things that could easily be seen in Britain or Europe is unbelievable especially when one thinks of our notoriously corrupt councils.

It can be easilly justified, you just want other people to share in your outrage so you feel better about your impotent rage.

Not all trips are daft, you can't paint every possible trip as some kind of scam because you're convinced they are all corrupt. Well you can and clearly do, but you're wrong for doing so.

And i like the way you're implying that they had a choice between the same conference in ringsend or Rio and because they are all so corrupt they decided to go to the one in the sun because they are all "notoriously corrupt"

Of course as is the nature of such conferences that they don't occur annually and it could well be years before one is even in europe again. And if people actually tried to implement things without doing research (by say.... going to a conference and speaking with the experts there) you'd be the first one to reach for the "new thread" button to copy&paste something from the hearld and moan about how they're all corrupt and useless and can't do anything right.

darkman2 wrote: »

No wonder this country is so corrupt when so many dont give a damn.

I'm sorry i didn't get on your poorly thought out bandwagon.
Here, Have a cookie.

briantwin · 31-07-2008 10:23am

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Ohh jesus.

It can be easilly justified, you just want other people to share in your outrage so you feel better about your impotent rage.

In this particular case i cant see a justification for this coucillor to be there other than to fill a seat. I cant imagine she'll be on the runways of dublin airport directing secuirty around and improving security for any of the nations airports. I can imagine it was seen as something not dissimilar to a time-share viewing where you get free tickets to disney land if you sit through a 4 hour presnetation. The only thing that woman implemented after that conference was a hefty coat of sun screen on her sprogs faces as they soak up the sun in Aregentina on mine/and your penny.

The bottom line and it really is the bottom line, ministers for certain things have every right to get involved up to their nipples in these things, but the idea of a county councillor spending money in such an outlandish way is starting to become unacceptible. If you cannot see that then maybe you are blind enough to pop a hot shot in mary harneys snot slot!

jimi_t · 31-07-2008 11:16am

According to the figures, councillors raked in an average of €33,347 last year in wages, allowances and expenses -- some €730 more than the average industrial worker's take-home pay.

Seems to me that, minus allowances and expenses (and some people don't particularly like taking 10 hour flights believe it or not) that Councillors are making less money than the average industrial worker?

Pompey Magnus · 31-07-2008 11:32am

jimi_t wrote: »

Seems to me that, minus allowances and expenses (and some people don't particularly like taking 10 hour flights believe it or not) that Councillors are making less money than the average industrial worker?

I work in a council and was talking in the pub a couple of weeks ago to a collegue who works in the wages dept and he sends out the councillor's wage slips, I am almost certain that he said each councillor gets about €1,300 p/w and the Lord Mayor gets €1,700 p/w extra on top of his €1,300 as a councillor. But again this was in the pub so I might have misheard / be misremembering.

I don't know if it varies between councils though.

jimi_t · 31-07-2008 11:38am

Depeche_Mode wrote: »

I work in a council and was talking in the pub a couple of weeks ago to a collegue who works in the wages dept...

I'm only quoting directly from what the article said - haven't a clue about the intricacies of wages within councils.

Fratton Fred · 31-07-2008 11:56am

Hopefully this will do a great deal to improve security at all of Clondalkin's airports.

Good thing she went in my opinion.:rolleyes:

SimpleSam06 · 31-07-2008 12:37pm

I'm a bit confused here, they got 33k per year including their wages? So their expenses etc come out of their pay? That doesnt sound so lucrative or even mildly out of order to me. Or is this just their expenses money?

jimi_t · 31-07-2008 1:14pm

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

I'm a bit confused here, they got 33k per year including their wages? So their expenses etc come out of their pay? That doesnt sound so lucrative or even mildly out of order to me. Or is this just their expenses money?

The article says thats their wages; I'm thinking along the same lines as you. Feck it, their take home pay wouldn't be terribly far off a McJob after taxes.

thelordofcheese · 31-07-2008 1:38pm

briantwin wrote: »

In this particular case i cant see a justification for this coucillor to be there other than to fill a seat. I cant imagine she'll be on the runways of dublin airport directing secuirty around and improving security for any of the nations airports. I can imagine it was seen as something not dissimilar to a time-share viewing where you get free tickets to disney land if you sit through a 4 hour presnetation. The only thing that woman implemented after that conference was a hefty coat of sun screen on her sprogs faces as they soak up the sun in Aregentina on mine/and your penny.

I'm sure you do imagine that, but that's because you've a very limited imagination.
It's easy to assume it was a waste of money, and then get worked up about it. Assume the worst, bitch and moan and then feel clever about having done so because you've seen through their charade.

Jesus wept...

briantwin wrote: »

If you cannot see that then maybe you are blind enough to pop a hot shot in mary harneys snot slot!

I bet your proud of that line and all.....

Eoin · 31-07-2008 1:50pm

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

I'm a bit confused here, they got 33k per year including their wages? So their expenses etc come out of their pay? That doesnt sound so lucrative or even mildly out of order to me. Or is this just their expenses money?

A good few councillors have had to resign as they simply can't afford to do the job. Unless you get a chair or mayor position, you can't be in it for the money.

the hedild wrote:

According to the figures, councillors raked in an average of €33,347 last year in wages, allowances and expenses -- some €730 more than the average industrial worker's take-home pay.

This means that the total amount of money handed over to local representatives last year stood at a mammoth €29.4m.

Wow, a whole €730 more per year. I reckon you could compare the job to a middle management position in a private company, where you'd probably be earning twice what they are currently on.

Also a "mammoth" wage bill of €30m? The HSE wage bill has risen by more than 3 times that figure in the last few years.

Quite honestly, I have no problems with politicians getting well paid. Why not try and attract people who want to be successful?

snubbleste · 31-07-2008 1:55pm

I'm a bit confused here, they got 33k per year including their wages? So their expenses etc come out of their pay? That doesnt sound so lucrative or even mildly out of order to me. Or is this just their expenses money?

A county councillor usually has a full-time job in addition to being elected - my local ones are teachers, retailers, postmasters etc. So they get these allowances on top of their day job salary!

Eoin · 31-07-2008 1:59pm

snubbleste wrote: »

A county councillor usually has a full-time job in addition to being elected - my local ones are teachers, retailers, postmasters etc. So they get these allowances on top of their day job salary!

Yes, but being a councillor is probably close to another full time job.

david_the_great · 31-07-2008 2:00pm

According to the figures, councillors raked in an average of €33,347 last year in wages, allowances and expenses -- some €730 more than the average industrial worker's take-home pay.

i dont think this is anything to write home about only €730 more than workers pay- therefore imagine what they get before expenses maybe 25000???

SimpleSam06 · 31-07-2008 2:01pm

snubbleste wrote: »

A county councillor usually has a full-time job in addition to being elected - my local ones are teachers, retailers, postmasters etc. So they get these allowances on top of their day job salary!

Yes but they do their jobs as well, so they should be compensated for this, no? Although in the case of teachers they don't need to work and their jobs are held open while they are in office, as well as full pay, which is a disgrace. Or is it the same case for all jobs?

jimi_t · 31-07-2008 2:04pm

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Although in the case of teachers they don't need to work and their jobs are held open while they are in office, as well as full pay, which is a disgrace. Or is it the same case for all jobs?

That sounds like complete trollop - link?

SimpleSam06 · 31-07-2008 2:15pm

jimi_t wrote: »

That sounds like complete trollop - link?

Eh I recall reading about it as being one of the reasons that many substitute teachers couldn't get permanent work, I could be mistaken in that and google has failed it... anyone got any links either way?

Fratton Fred · 31-07-2008 3:24pm

SimpleSam06 wrote: »

Eh I recall reading about it as being one of the reasons that many substitute teachers couldn't get permanent work, I could be mistaken in that and google has failed it... anyone got any links either way?

No links, but aren't there some TD's who although having been in the dail for 30 years still considered permanent teachers?

County Councillor claims nothing wrong with going to Argentina at tax payers expense

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