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18-05-2006, 22:23   #1
czmate
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222 or 223, and Moderator Permit - Pushin My Luck

Hello everyone,

I am a long-time lurker, who loves this forum, so I've decided to join.

Anyway, I am thinking of replacing the old hornet with something a bit more oomphy, and would like some feedback from your experts on the following topics...

1. Calibre
I like the look of .223, and note from other threads (and by annoying gunshop owners) that ammo variety and price is very good. Performance on foxes is brilliant.

Also, I have been investigating .222 rem, and note that it is also a very accurate cartridge, and is very "moderatable" as it does not produce as much muzzle blast etc as the .223. According to the shooting press it is also powerful medicine on foxes out to 250 yards or therabouts. Problem is ammo is more expensive and rarer than .223. Of course if we eventually get to reload then price is reduced.

2. Rifles
I like the idea of the following...

A. Tikka Varmint in 222 or 223

B. Tikka Tactical in 223 - a beast of a yoke - I groped one in Stakelums in Urlingford a while back

3. CZ 527 Varmint Kevlar in either .222 or 223. you cant beat the old brnos - I will trade in my hornet...


3. Moderators
I would of course have to apply for a moderator permit. I would like to know peoples experiences with the following...

. Reflex or BR moderators that fit back along the barrell
.Muzzle mounted jobbies like the husher and JLS (Landers Tralee does the JLS).

4. Timing.
I have followed the recent threads on "223 and CJB", and cannot deny I am beginning to panic a bit. I reckon I will be on a hiding to nothing when I walk in to the station with "Hello sargeant, I have traded my hornet in for a 223, oh and by the way, I want a moderator license, and and as I think of it, with the new CJB being law, I want to reload". I should have got off me arse and done all this 6 months ago before this "restricted list" catchall on behalf of the minister was mooted.. Having sad that they are well used to me - I have 2 shotguns, a 22 brno, and a CZ hornet - any opinions on this?

thanks to all in advance of your expert advice,

czmate
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18-05-2006, 22:41   #2
mosulli4
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2 Chance your arm -give it a go

Welcome czmate,

I was told many years ago, by my local FO that there was a "one rifle only, but as many shotguns as befits your requirements" rule in force.

I know this was BS, and presented an application for a 6.5 Sako (I joined Midlands in Offaly). He came back with an instistance on inspection of gunsafe by an appointed "house security" garda (plainclothes) and I got the license. I always look back on my Midlands membership card fondly as an Amex card - "that will do nicely sir"

I reckon the new CJB will eliminate a lot of the old wives tales we hear in stations, so go for it...

Let me know how you get on, I could be right behind you.


By the way - plum for the T3 tactical - I saw one too, and you cant beat €9.50 for 20 rounds in such an amazing machine...

best of luck - go for it


mosulli4
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19-05-2006, 09:38   #3
Vegeta
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man i want my licence to come through so bad, go for it, you may get turned down for the moderator but you might get the rifle.

I would advise trading in the .22 hornet as otherwise they could come back saying the hornet is a fine rifle for shooting fox so there is no reason to have the .223
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19-05-2006, 18:15   #4
sniper2
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have a cz .223 laminated varmit,man it is the business,want a tikka tact. and getting one at the best price out there,i say apply for the gun the moderator will follow and good luck
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19-05-2006, 23:47   #5
Keelan
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Gor for it now.
I have a CZ .223 and love it. It fires most factory ammo wthin an inch and is dead cheap to feed.
The following ammo i have for my .223 is:

Sako 55 grain Soft points. 20 Euro a box of 20
Sako 50 grain SP.19 Euro a box of 20
Remington 55 grain Full metal Jacket. 9 Euro a box of 20.
Remington 45 grain Hallow point. 22 Euro a box of 20.
Remington 62 gr HP. 28 Euro a box of 20
Federal 64 GR SP. 19 Euro a box of 20
Federal American Eagle 50 GR HP.( the biss) 12 Euro a box of 20.
Federal American Eagle 55 GR FMJ.10 Euro a box of 20.
This is most, but their is more brands out their.
As you can see, amazing amount of brands available and very cheap, compared to other centerfire ammo.
Who needs all the hassel of reloading when their is all this ammo to choose from.
One more thing. The new Tikka T3s, have a 1 in 8 twist, some accuracy problems are being found with some common ammo available for it.
The best all rounder in my experience and others so far, is the 1 in 12 twist, with the .223.
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22-05-2006, 15:03   #6
oldzed
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twist rates

I disagree totally that 1 in 12 is the best 223 twist rate . 1 in 12
is ok
if you only ever want to shoot 50 or 55grs through your rifle , I have
seen
a remy 700 vssf keyholing 60gr bullets at 100yrds so 60 grs is the
absolute
limit for a 1 in 12 . I believe a 1 in 9 is the best all round twist
rate as
it can handle anything from 50 to 90 grs and i feel this is the best
all
round twist rate .when you push out the distance on a 223 the heavier
heads
work much better and the difference at 400 and 600 in a wind between
55gr
and 75gr heads is huge. i would not recommend a 1 in 8 unless you
always
want to shoot over 70grs and that rules out some of the nice 55gr
ballistic
tips that are some of the best foxing rounds.

Im using a sgc ssr15 speedmaster with a 20inch fluted heavy barrell and
a 1
in 8 twist .

in short dont buy a 1 in 12 unless you only want to shoot 55gr or less
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22-05-2006, 16:42   #7
Dvs
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Czmate,
trade your hornet,
apply for your Rifle only,
do not
mention moderators, until after you have both licence and rifle for a period of time, probably months would be best.

Don't mention reloading, until after it becomes a fact in the CJB.

I understand your logic, you are a law abiding person and wish to be honest and upfront with the enforcers of the law, however, they do not consider you as such, you do not wear the uniform of infallibility, you want a firearm this makes you a potential problem.

Members of the Garda (Superintendents) that deal with granting firearms licenses, do not multi-task well, more than one request at a time causes them problems.

Apparently,
it makes it harder to consider and contemplate for months on end,
each item requires its own consideration time.

Go cap in hand, ask the nice Garda for a license for that yoke,
and don't mention the CJB, reloading, or that you might know more about firearms than they do!
and sure you'll be grand.

Dvs.
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22-05-2006, 21:52   #8
marlin
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welcome czmate
I traded my 17hmr for a tikka t3 lite .223 last jan and am delighted with the rifle and the calibre,fantastic foxing rifle.as for the twist debate I,ve got a 1in8 and actually found remington accutips 55gn and sako gameheads also 55 gn the most accurate. I,ve tried 69gn rems and also 45gn rems and they shoot ok but not as accurate as the 55s. tried a box of federal fmj 55 gns and they were crap in my gun anyway,2 in groups @100 yds.
I think if you know your local guard there should be no problem with licence,
I got a little .22 cz scout a few weeks after the .223 and had the licence within a week ,good luck and happy shooting
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01-06-2006, 19:27   #9
czmate
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Thanks to all and query about Rifle prices

Thanks to everyone for their input. Can anyone give me ballpark prices for the rifles mentioned above, specifically the...

.Tikka T3 Lite
.Tikka T3 Tactical
.CZ 223, especially the varmint, and the varmint kevlar.

I am starting to shop around soon, and need to get a good balance between the cost of the rifle, and maybe a decent scope.

Cheers again for all the help

czmate
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01-06-2006, 20:07   #10
johngalway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czmate
Thanks to everyone for their input. Can anyone give me ballpark prices for the rifles mentioned above, specifically the...

.Tikka T3 Lite
.Tikka T3 Tactical
.CZ 223, especially the varmint, and the varmint kevlar.

I am starting to shop around soon, and need to get a good balance between the cost of the rifle, and maybe a decent scope.

Cheers again for all the help

czmate
It's not what you're after but I was quoted 1015 for a Tikka Varmint SS in .223. The lite would be less and the Tactical a good bit more I'd imagine. Hope that helps a little. Asked about CZ's over a month ago, cant quite remember the models now but they were under a grand.

John
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01-06-2006, 20:19   #11
Rew
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~900 for the lite
~1400 for the Tac
~1000 CZ varmint
~1200 for the CZ Varmint Kev

There all ball park as far as I know.
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01-06-2006, 21:47   #12
czmate
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2 Thanks Rew much appreciated

Rew,

you have been a big help. It's either the T3 Lite @ 900 or the Tactical @ 1400 in other words go the whole hog...


thanks a million

time to hit ebay for scopes - I hae my eye on a deben/hawke 10x42 mildot - I have seen and heard great things about them...


cheers

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01-06-2006, 22:02   #13
czmate
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2 thanks Johngalway

your reply is much appreciated - a good price

I will shop around. I have seen the varmit SS, and it is a gorgeous rifle. I already have a Sako Varmint in 6.5x55, with a "hubble telescope" on top, so I am looking for a sleeker, lower weight rifle for local fun. It is too much gun for standing/kneeling/sitting shots, but at that price I would just share the harris bipod between them...

cheers.

czmate
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01-06-2006, 22:04   #14
TonyM.
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HI
I found this forum by accident on my way to the computer section I do a little shooting I have an Anschutz Hornet (with the Monty Carlo stock)
and see no need to upgrade why are people looking for more firepower?

The company I work for sell guns but i am not involved in that section of the business I am just putting my cards on the table before I join the forum if
anybody wants prices I can refer them to the man in charge if I am not breaking any rules.
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01-06-2006, 22:18   #15
Rew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czmate
It is too much gun for standing/kneeling/sitting shots, but at that price I would just share the harris bipod between them...
Tactical and SS Varmint are both pretty heavy rifles so keep that in mind.
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