Now ye're talking - to a US police officer

22-07-2019 9:11pm

There was a big clean up of New York Streets in the 1990's- I believe "zero tolerance" of "anything" was a prime reason why this was a success- is this something you subscribe to?

However, after a city is "cleaned up", and certainly NY did need a good cleaning of crime, what do you recommend is the ongoing approach to keep streets safe?

I'm a US police officer, AMA · 22-07-2019 9:13pm

This is an unfair & argumentative post. I'm happy to discuss issues in US law enforcement and have a coherent debate, but please back up your claims about corruption, deadly force etc. Your comment of "there is no doubt that many US cops enjoy killing others and indeed join just for that privilege" has no basis in fact. Your comment shows little to no understanding of the impact of taking a human life.

Most respectable agencies require psychological testing, screening for behavioral issues, and an in depth interview with psychologists and ongoing monitoring of officer mental health & behavior. No system is perfect and agencies continue to balance screening with labour laws, personal rights to medical privacy and the needs of the agency.

eeeee · 22-07-2019 9:14pm

You mention working armed and unarmed, and the different skill sets for both. Can you expand on that? Is de-escalation not the primary driver of the process over there?

The Tetrarch · 22-07-2019 9:18pm

Would you draw your weapon at a snowball fight?

22-07-2019 9:20pm

This is a viral video of an innocent black person being profiled by a white cop in recent times- there's a number of examples out there but this one is really frightening. I'd say you've probably seen it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6Q1qqMp5_o

I've watched other videos, all by reputable posters or indeed news agency documentaries around racial profiling by American cops. I can provide any number of links. And also, when these people go to complain to the police head quarters, i've some gob-smacking links to provide also around testing cop head quarters on how they handle complaints against police officers- it's actually quite frightening.

In Ireland, why our police complaints procedure isn't perfect by any means, I'd have a lot more faith in it than in America.

What's your view?

I'm a US police officer, AMA · 22-07-2019 9:21pm

As this is Boards.ie, would I be right in taking a guess that you're originally from Ireland or have lived here? If so, how do you compare your current role to that of a Garda (and if you did indeed grow up here, what made you opt for the US Police rather than An Garda Siochana)?

Policing seems to be universal based on my observations with other forces. Other than the accents, uniforms & kit our roles are the same. US burglaries aren't any different than Irish ones form what I can tell

Do you find, in the US, as a police officer involved in everyday crime, that they (the US, whatever state you may be in) have the same kind of lenient, revolving door sentences that lead to you spending all your time dealing with the same faces over and over again? Or is the stereotypical image that the US is much tougher and stamps that stuff out quickly actually true?

Yep, and I think most cops would tell you this regardless of where you are. We see the same faces to an extent, although the US seems to have a higher degree of willingness to imprison people for minor offences than Ireland. The US locks up more people, but I submit it does little to "stamp out crime".

And a silly question, but have you ever seen or experienced one of your patrol cars being stolen/pursued? If so, does it make it a bit more complicated (is there an element of trying to avoid damaging the vehicle etc.)?

I know it's happened, can't personally recall it any time recently. No, a pursuit is a pursuit, you attempt to apprehend the perp just like any other pursuit. And I'm willing to bet, unlike on TV, they wouldn't understand much of what we are saying on the radio. Most people can hardly tell you their own address, let along listen to block numbers and cross streets at high speed.

Mam of 4 · 22-07-2019 9:24pm

Has there ever been a time when on duty that made you actually fear for your life ? And if so , did it make you question your role as a Police Officer ?
Take care and stay safe

I'm a US police officer, AMA · 22-07-2019 9:29pm

How come a police officer can't admit they're wrong, is it a training issue where you have to be right no matter what.
You see so many incidents on youtube where a cop is so so wrong, but will NEVER let it go. Why is that.

I don't really understand your question about being wrong. YouTube is not what I would describe as a balanced forum. It's not that cops aren't wrong, its more a case of people don't really understand the law. Most people think they know what they are saying because the read it online or saw it on TV, or moan on about their rights. Yes, they have rights, and we follow those rules & laws like we are supposed to, we're not making it up, I promise you. The side of the road is not the time to argue the finer points of Terry vs. Ohio (classic case law), you can have your day in court and let the judge make the call. Think about it, if I'm wrong and make a false arrest, I'll lose my job and face the possibility of jail time for false imprisonment. No thanks. Do cops make bad calls, sure, and they deserve what they get.

If it's on YouTube, odds are it has an agenda. I don't see a lot of YouTube videos where Joe Bloggs wants to show the world he is wrong and is getting a ticket or arrested for it. Makes for poor click bait.

spindex · 22-07-2019 9:39pm

You may have missed the opening question, how many people have you shot ?

The Tetrarch · 22-07-2019 9:41pm

The Tetrarch wrote: »

Would you draw your weapon at a snowball fight?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAgQKJuriIo

Hal3000 · 22-07-2019 9:43pm

Do you agree with the 3 strike system? Do you think it could work here in Ireland?

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 9:49pm

I'm a US police officer, AMA wrote: »

This is an unfair & argumentative post. I'm happy to discuss issues in US law enforcement and have a coherent debate, but please back up your claims about corruption, deadly force etc. Your comment of "there is no doubt that many US cops enjoy killing others and indeed join just for that privilege" has no basis in fact. Your comment shows little to no understanding of the impact of taking a human life.

Most respectable agencies require psychological testing, screening for behavioral issues, and an in depth interview with psychologists and ongoing monitoring of officer mental health & behavior. No system is perfect and agencies continue to balance screening with labour laws, personal rights to medical privacy and the needs of the agency.

Is this in reference to my post? Do you need me to back up my claims?

As a new user I cannot post links. But if someone would like me to PM them the links I would be happy to do it!

18 unarmed people have been killed in the US this year alone by police officers. None of them white!!
Dont belive me, I can PM you the references.

Do you honestly not see the murder of unarmed black men by US police officers as a problem? Do you really not think the people who murder these young innocent men should be punished for it?

Gatling · 22-07-2019 9:53pm

Can the dicks leave the room.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 22-07-2019 9:56pm

You mention above that there is little difference between being a cop in America and elsewhere.

As an outsider the risk of weapons being involved in every crime would have a major influence on being a cop in America.

How much do you think about the elephant in the room. In an average arrest (burglary, drugs, traffic) do you think 'will this guy pull a weapon on me'.

You mention above the number of small. Law enforcement agency's (7 cops for a small town as its own agency. Would an average policeman in one of those agencies spend his career in that agency or would he move for career advancement. How easy is it to transfer between police forces.

Dublinandy2 · 22-07-2019 9:56pm

When you start off your career, after you’ve had your training and start to actually police do you get career guidance? So the ones who want to stay a beat cop can, those who want to be a detective can or move upwards in uniform or are your skills spotted and moved to areas that the bosses think would suit you?

Would you let someone with a criminal record be a police officer?

Are there any types of criminal that you think are beyond rehabilitation?

I'm a US police officer, AMA · 22-07-2019 9:57pm

What's the biggest challenges you come across and what's the biggest change you've seen over your time.

Biggest challenges are how as a society we expect the police to handle issues such as mental health, addiction, homelessness and social behavior which are really not criminal issues but land on our lap. But then, it’s easy to run for pubic office on a “tough on crime” platform as opposed to a “I’ll hire more addiction counsellors and social workers” platform. Biggest change, see above about IT.

Are you constantly watching your 6 and why are so many alone with such dangers out there.

Of course we watch our six, basic survival skills, you have to. Even Gardai do this, it’s fundamental part of street skills and awareness. I don’t know the history of why some many US agencies use single officer units. I do know administrators like it because it doubles the number of units on the streets. Having said that, probably 70% of our calls only need one officer.

With all your experience, are there any laws you really feel don't really serve a purpose and could do with being changed or abolished?

I’m no legal expert, but some of the silly laws that criminalize trivia are just taking up space on the statute books. In Texas it’s illegal to sell a motor vehicle on consecutive days of Saturday & Sunday, seems dumb to me. (TX Transport Code Chap 728, Subsection A, Section 728.002 if you are interested.

Are you worried that you will get into some bizarre and dangerous situation as you get to within a few days of your retirement?

Not really, that only happens in the movies. I’ll turn my kit in and still be on the clock for about 9 months while I run out all my leave & sick time 😊

Going back to your OP, what are an Asp and an AED?

ASP: telescoping baton (Asp is the trade name) same as what the Gardai carry. AED: Automatic External Defibrillator, for cardiac arrests.

What's your favourite cop movie car chase?

The original Italian Job & Bullitt with Steve McQueen.

Do you have a bedside locker? Whats in your bedside locker?

Alarm clock, torch, Kindle e-reader, Glock when I’m at home (in a drawer). We have no kids in the house.

4068ac1elhodqr · 22-07-2019 9:58pm

For all the talk of incidents of black victims, one has to remember while very unfortunate, the US is by it's nature a highly weaponised society.
Highly relevant would be the basic stats on gang profiles, typical membership, everyday (street crime) incidents, and of course incarceration rate profilng, relative to percentages of the total populaiton.

While collar crime (even with billionaires) exists everywhere, but not so much on urban poorly-lit back streets.

Gatling · 22-07-2019 9:59pm

Glock Vs 1911

I'm a US police officer, AMA · 22-07-2019 10:00pm

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

On social media he's listed his occupation as garbage collector. ;-) . However he lives for the job, my own son is a member of AGS for the last 2 years and like my brother lives for it.
Stay safe and enjoy your retirement when it rolls around, are you planning to play 'golf' or seek a new career?

A police family, eh? Good conversations at the holidays I'm sure. Nope, don't play golf, plan is travel and maybe some part time teaching at the local tech.

Collie D · 22-07-2019 10:03pm

Well I think we can close the voting on most interesting answer to the bedside locker question

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 10:05pm

Adriana Disgusting Herb wrote: »

Highly relevant would be the basic stats on gang profiles, typical membership, everyday (street crime) incidents, and of course incarceration rate profilng, relative to percentages of the total populaiton.
/QUOTE]

So your saying white people don't carry guns or commit crimes. And you are saying that is the reason no unarmed white people have been killed in the US this year.

You know that the US is about 75% white. So three quarters of the population is white. And not a single one of them has been shot dead while unarmed by a cop. Do you not think that is a little strange or usual?

Of does it go back to the white people dont commit crimes thing?

cursai · 22-07-2019 10:14pm

apologies for all the adolescent and antagonistic questions from people. Embarrassing when someone believes a ten min video gives a fair and impartial representation of alleged malpractice. Same fools would be the ones giving police a hard time over a routine question on the street.

And crying in the cells when they get arrested.

Zaph · 22-07-2019 10:15pm

spindex wrote: »

You may have missed the opening question, how many people have you shot ?

As with all AMAs, the person doing them isn't obliged to answer every question. If there's a question they feel is inappropriate or are uncomfortable with answering, they're perfectly free to ignore it. It is, after all, voluntary.

Duke O Smiley · 22-07-2019 10:15pm

Do you work with a partner? If so, do you have multiple? Have you ever worked with someone (i.e spent the day on patrol with him/her) who you didn't like? What happens in those instances?

khaldrogo · 22-07-2019 10:20pm

Gatling wrote:

Glock Vs 1911

1911 ftw!!!

Sexual Chocolate · 22-07-2019 10:25pm

Did you notice a change in everyday policing after 9/11 ?

Does your agency require you to have a heavy trigger pull weight on your Glock like the NYPD, who I believe have one of the highest ? (I'm not a gun nut

but did read recently about this and how officers struggle to adapt to this, likewise with DAO sidearms)

And assuming you drove them, do you miss the Crown Vics ?

The Tetrarch · 22-07-2019 10:27pm

cursai wrote: »

apologies for all the adolescent and antagonistic questions from people. Embarrassing when someone believes a ten min video gives a fair and impartial representation of alleged malpractice. Same fools would be the ones giving police a hard time over a routine question on the street.

And crying in the cells when they get arrested.

It looks like this thread is an "us and them" thread.
If boards wants cheerleaders for the US police it should be in the opening post.
I am not an adolescent. I am not a fool.
Why apologise to a US police officer who ignores questions he does not like?

Guy:Incognito · 22-07-2019 10:29pm

Given that you're a veteran on the force, have you ever , in the midst of the action, stopped and said either, or a combination of "I'm getting to old for this ****" / "I'm only x time from retirement".

sdanseo · 22-07-2019 10:36pm

A more mundane question from me, among the very many I could ask.

Do you still have an Irish accent, is it strong or just noticeable if so, and does it affect the way you are interpreted, understood or treated at all, both by cops and the public?

bob50 · 22-07-2019 10:51pm

Hi Officer

Do you have a simalar situation in America you arrest somebody bring them to the station and then they are brought to court And the judge binds them over to keep the peace? And same day, they are out causing the same aggro Knowing they will get away it . And you are arresting the same people over and over? Its demoralisng for Garda in city centre here

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 10:54pm

The Tetrarch wrote: »

It looks like this thread is an "us and them" thread.
If boards wants cheerleaders for the US police it should be in the opening post.
I am not an adolescent. I am not a fool.
Why apologise to a US police officer who ignores questions he does not like?

I thought I was reasonably respectful when I asked my three questions. I am genuinely interested in hearing the officers thoughts on it.

But yeah looks like it looks like an "Us and them". Oh well. I guess this ties in with an earlier poster asking why cops cannot admit when they are in the wrong.

The Enbalmer · 22-07-2019 11:03pm

The Tetrarch wrote:

. I am not an adolescent. I am not a fool. Why apologise to a US police officer who ignores questions he does not like?

I bet YOU couldn't do his job.

4068ac1elhodqr · 22-07-2019 11:06pm

Bellbottoms wrote: »

So your saying white people don't carry guns or commit crimes.

Incorrect, and no.

Merely saying take a look at the ratios of those who do actually commit aggrevated and voilent street level crimes, which by default will lead to a certain amount of profiling. It is what it is, as they say.

According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) in 2013 black males accounted for 37% of the total male prison population, white males 32%, and Hispanic males 22%.

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 11:07pm

Why did you decide to join the police force?
And why in the US, over the AGS?

CIARAN_BOYLE · 22-07-2019 11:07pm

Bellbottoms wrote: »

I thought I was reasonably respectful when I asked my three questions. I am genuinely interested in hearing the officers thoughts on it.

But yeah looks like it looks like an "Us and them". Oh well. I guess this ties in with an earlier poster asking why cops cannot admit when they are in the wrong.

If you ask about anyone murdering other people (when there are very few convictions) you are being purposefully argumentive.

I believe it would be wise to quote the ama police officer's answer to a very similar question.

I'm a US police officer, AMA wrote: »

Are the police forces in US inherently racist? From an outsider it looks that way, but I might be wrong.

This is a complex question, not easily answered in a short forum, so bear with me, and I can only speak from personal experience. I don't think so, most of us just don't care who you are, who you sleep with, what you look like, what you wear/drive. There is a connection between poverty, unemployment, race, education and criminality that is a legacy of history, bad policies, social norms which is a complex and difficult issue. If a minority group suffers from all of the above and an area becomes a high crime area, then there are more police interactions, arrests, searches, etc. Law of numbers say there will be more minority convictions, etc. So, it can be easy, for a quick sound bite to say "the cops only arrest XXXX race in this town". Yet, police face pressure to "clean up YYY part of town, arrest all the criminals". Generational poverty, social expectations and behavior are not going to be solved by the police and more training. However, I'm a realist, are there racist cops, sure, just like there are racist bar staff, lawyers & cooks too. So, probably not, but as a community we can all do better.

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 11:10pm

Adriana Disgusting Herb wrote: »

Incorrect, and no.

Merely saying take a look at the ratios of those who do actually commit aggrevated and voilent street level crimes, which by default will lead to a certain amount of profiling. It is what it is, as they say.

According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) in 2013 black males accounted for 37% of the total male prison population, white males 32%, and Hispanic males 22%.

I don't want to derail this thread. But I want you to take a look at your figures and remember that less the 15 per cent of the ENTIRE population. Do you not think that those prison figures look a little skewed.

I am just going to leave it at that.

22-07-2019 11:10pm

You mentioned earlier that, whilst you have access to the big guns and tactical gear, you find it unnecessary to wear this kinda stuff in day to day policing, as it creates an 'us vs them' feeling with the public.

As a person who lives in Ireland, and as a result, see my Police Service rock around the beat in a pair of slacks, shirt and tie, looking like their first day of school, I adore the idea of 'proper' police outfits. Personally, I find that a police officer with his holster, tactical vest full of all the nonsense equipment he'll probably never use etc. gives a more dominant image, which though I appreciate your 'us VS them' comment, I feel also demands more respect.

So my question is, in everyday actual real life (ie' not statistics or surveys, but your own personal experience) do people actually treat you any different, according to what you're wearing on a given day?

(We have Armed Gardai in Ireland, albeit they're few and far between, but I often see them pop into the local McDonalds with the tac vest, and holster with gun, and no one really passes any remarks or, to my view, looks uncomfortable with it).

Also, slightly more serious question, are you familiar with the whole Maurice McCabe Whistle-Blower thing that happened in Ireland recently? How do you find the police officers in your area act? Do you feel you'd ever need to be a 'whistleblower' yourself, or do you reckon the majority of the people there are doing a decent job and not acting the bollocks too much? (I appreciate everyone's human, and people will make jokes, show up late, have slow days, etc. but im talking more about casual abuse of the position of being a police officer).

Has a very attractive woman ever tried to do 'anything' to get out of a speeding ticket? (even if this never happened, can you just lie and say it happens all the time!

)

Last question, do you ever have a big argument at work, and go home and play GTA and run a load of police cars off the road out of anger?

22-07-2019 11:13pm

Also, do us all a favour and ignore the 'all US cops are racist murderers' comments. It's embarrassing for us reading it, too!

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 11:17pm

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

If you ask about anyone murdering other people (when there are very few convictions) you are being purposefully argumentive.

No, I am asking about a very real problem with US police forces. I would like to know what the posters take is, and how they think it can be addressed. Have a look at the three questions I asked.

This is a AMA, not ask me questions that paint my profession in a great light. Or a chance for a load of Walters to get a boner asking questions about guns.

Listen it is up to the officer to chose to answer the question if he wants to or not. But he chose not to answer it, then comment on the question and claim I was being disrespectful asking it.

I appreciate that they are taking time out of their day to answer questions, and are under no obligation to answer any. But don't be surprised if someone asks a difficult question, and don't get all worked up about it. It was a reasonable question asked in a reasonable manner

Again I don't want to derail this thread. So I am just going to leave it at that.

4068ac1elhodqr · 22-07-2019 11:19pm

Bellbottoms wrote: »

I don't want to derail this thread. But I want you to take a look at your figures and remember that less the 15 per cent of the ENTIRE population. Do you not think that those prison figures look a little skewed.
I am just going to leave it at that.

Precisely the point. (12.6% account for 37% of crime).
I am just going to leave it at that.

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 11:19pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Also, do us all a favour and ignore the 'all US cops are racist murderers' comments. It's embarrassing for us reading it, too!

I never said that

endacl · 22-07-2019 11:20pm

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Where do you serve work?

Better.

Or where are you stationed. Some of the nonsense is best left over the pond.

Ever accidentally brought a bullet on a plane? I only ask because a friend’s wife did a couple of weeks ago. A 9mm round, which she dutifully handed in to a south dublin Garda station. There was a bit of form filling to be done. She serves works in a large metropolitan area on the east coast.

shamrock55 · 22-07-2019 11:22pm

Do you act like glorified tax collectors like the guards do here by doing nothing only setting up checkpoints to check tax and insurance every day of the week while real crime happens all around you

Bellbottoms · 22-07-2019 11:23pm

Adriana Disgusting Herb wrote: »

Precisely the point. (12.6% account for 37% of crime).
I am just going to leave it at that.

But they don't.
Arrests and conviction rates are skewed.
Again, I have a low number of posts and cannot post links. But I can PM them to you if you like.

Phileas Frog · 22-07-2019 11:26pm

Was Police Academy a documentary?

endacl · 22-07-2019 11:35pm

shamrock55 wrote: »

Do you act like glorified tax collectors like the guards do here by doing nothing only setting up checkpoints to check tax and insurance every day of the week while real crime happens all around you

Hedgelayer · 22-07-2019 11:38pm

What do you like to do when you're not working ?

Fishing ?

Hiking ?

Shooting ranges ?

Golf ?

Family Time ?

Hunting ?

Overheal · 23-07-2019 12:12am

What are your thoughts on LivePD? I find it interesting but wonder how cherrypicked it is, guys who know they're on TV etc. vs the reality of the job, that we sometimes see leaked on youtube.

Which reminds me: how challenging is it to enforce against motorcycles?

Thoughts/remarks on 1st Amendment 'enforcers'? Looking for trouble? Important exercise?

What's your insight on Police forces vs. Sheriff Departments, because of the politics of the Sheriff being elected vs. Chief being appointed. I notice in SC, most major city forces are generally a bit nicer than county, aside from infamous speed traps like Cottageville where its all a huge racket. Does the differences in accountability seem in your experience to make them more or less prone to be 'us vs them?'

Finally, what is your perspective on the nature of the beast when it comes to Police Departments taking the 'fraternity' culture too far: departments that won't tell you your badge number, won't let you get a form to file a complaint against a fellow officer, or like that one cop in Miami some years ago, will go out of their way to ruin 'one of their own' that enforces the law against another LEO, - and WHY does it always seem like cops in the public domain always close ranks and never call a bad cop a bad cop? Personally, I'm frustrated as a citizen that it feels like, in at least a small number of high profile cases, that bad cops are not adequately called out by bad cops. As you mentioned there are just too many silos, too many departments, too many disparate training regimens, but what are the common threads?

SaltSweatSugar · 23-07-2019 12:53am

Fair play doing this AMA, I couldn’t be a cop in America.

Just wondering, if you guys attend a traumatic incident (say a shooting, murder, bad traffic accident etc) or experience a traumatic experience first hand (assault, shooting etc), what supports does your department have in place for ye?

As in, do ye get counselling or anything or just left to fend for yourselves?

Cookie_Monster · 23-07-2019 12:58am

What did you do before joining, was the decision to join a career change or sort of always in the plan?

Whats the joining process in the states like, I'm currently going through recruitment for NZ Police and it's a very long drawn out process...

Now ye're talking - to a US police officer

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