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Job problem

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  • 04-08-2020 11:28pm
    #1
    Ladyinthedark
    Registered Users Posts: 629 ✭✭✭


    I have been employed for 7 months now and I was promoted after 3 months. Over the last few weeks my boss has implemented a program to upskill me but it was really just an excuse to make false claims against my character I don’t know what to do know .He rang me one day when I was with a client and said I was not doing my job properly when I was in the process of a meeting . I had a doctors appointment another day and said it last week that it was short notice that I gave him .he also said I’m not contributing anything to the company it’s just constant, always says when I go to answer him to stop using excuses .. what should I do ..quit or is there outside help


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    #2
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    I have been employed for 7 months now and I was promoted after 3 months. Over the last few weeks my boss has implemented a program to upskill me but it was really just an excuse to make false claims against my character I don’t know what to do know .He rang me one day when I was with a client and said I was not doing my job properly when I was in the process of a meeting . I had a doctors appointment another day and said it last week that it was short notice that I gave him .he also said I’m not contributing anything to the company it’s just constant, always says when I go to answer him to stop using excuses .. what should I do ..quit or is there outside help

    Why would he upskill you just to make false claims against your character? Op, it’s relatively easy to let an employee go within the first year of employment, if he wanted you gone, you probably would be gone at this stage.


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    #3
    Ladyinthedark
    Registered Users Posts: 629 ✭✭✭Ladyinthedark


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Why would he upskill you just to make false claims against your character? Op, it’s relatively easy to let an employee go within the first year of employment, if he wanted you gone, you probably would be gone at this stage.

    Am I not entitled to make a defence or reply without him saying there excuses


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    #4
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    Am I not entitled to make a defence or reply without him saying there excuses

    Of course you are, but until you have 12 months service, you don’t have the benefit of The Unfair Dismissals Act.

    It is a bit unusual for a boss to promote someone with a view to undermining them when they have the option of just letting you go. Are you sure he isn’t trying, in a cack handed way, to push you on to perform better?


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    #5
    Dublinandy3
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭Dublinandy3


    If you say he doesn’t let you respond then it probably makes it feel worse for you, especially if you don’t agree with him. I agree with the others, if he wanted to get rid he would, he wouldn’t upskill.
    I would suggest either approaching him and saying you’re keen to learn and get ahead so would appreciate feedback. If he says things you don’t agree with, ask for examples to help you learn. For example if he says you contribute nothing ask him for examples of when he felt you could contribute more.
    When he’s finished thank him for the feedback and ask him if he minded if you had some time to consider what he said. Then give it time, digest the info and when you’re not feeling defensive respond to him via email with facts and statements that can be fact checked.

    It could be it’s a big misunderstanding between you both.


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    #6
    antix80
    Registered Users Posts: 2,419 ✭✭✭antix80


    Upskill? You mean improve your performance.

    Is there truth in what your manager says? It can be frustrating managing someone in an organisation that won't fire an underperformer who thinks they're doing their job but always has an excuse for mistakes and missed deadlines.

    I'll give you advice. If you're asked to do something be clear on what you are meant to do as well as the deadline to do it in (assume 24 hours unless otherwise specified/agreed). If it goes wrong and your excuse begins with "i wasn't shown..." you're deadweight if you use that excuse after doing something wrong or missing a deadline.

    Communication is key. Have a daily call with your manager to say what you're working on that day, work with him on what should be prioritised and if you need help, and don't focus on nice/interesting tasks at the expense of priorities.


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    #7
    Ladyinthedark
    Registered Users Posts: 629 ✭✭✭Ladyinthedark


    antix80 wrote: »
    Upskill? You mean improve your performance.

    Is there truth in what your manager says? It can be frustrating managing someone in an organisation that won't fire an underperformer who thinks they're doing their job but always has an excuse for mistakes and missed deadlines.

    I'll give you advice. If you're asked to do something be clear on what you are meant to do as well as the deadline to do it in (assume 24 hours unless otherwise specified/agreed). If it goes wrong and your excuse begins with "i wasn't shown..." you're deadweight if you use that excuse after doing something wrong or missing a deadline.

    Communication is key. Have a daily call with your manager to say what you're working on that day, work with him on what should be prioritised and if you need help, and don't focus on nice/interesting tasks at the expense of priorities.

    I have no problem with accepting any responsibility but the manager did go back on what he said previous to me and then when I went to say things back he used the excuses line .How can I win ,I’m just looking for advice what to do


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    #8
    nibtrix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,305 ✭✭✭nibtrix


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    Over the last few weeks my boss has implemented a program to upskill me
    antix80 wrote: »
    Upskill? You mean improve your performance.

    I think this is important, have you been put on a PIP (performance improvement plan)?

    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    I’m just looking for advice what to do

    As has been stated, you have no protection against dismissal as you are employed under 12 months. Whether you have been put on a PIP or not it sounds like the writing is on the wall and you will lose your job sometime before the 12 months are up. It does sound like your manager is going about this in the usual half-assed way of trying to "manage you out", but it's up to you whether you value the job enough to try and fight for it.

    By fight for it, I mean making maximum effort to bring your work into line with what the manager expects and wants, not fighting and arguing that you are already achieving the requirement. I'm not saying that's what you are doing, just clarifying that "fight for it" doesn't mean a legal battle or anything like that.

    I think DublinAndy3's suggestion to approach your manager for more feedback and suggestions is good, if the manager is not willing to give you this info then you can be sure that they are not really trying to help you improve, but instead are trying to get you to leave.


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    #9
    Ladyinthedark
    Registered Users Posts: 629 ✭✭✭Ladyinthedark


    nibtrix wrote: »
    I think this is important, have you been put on a PIP (performance improvement plan)?




    As has been stated, you have no protection against dismissal as you are employed under 12 months. Whether you have been put on a PIP or not it sounds like the writing is on the wall and you will lose your job sometime before the 12 months are up. It does sound like your manager is going about this in the usual half-assed way of trying to "manage you out", but it's up to you whether you value the job enough to try and fight for it.

    By fight for it, I mean making maximum effort to bring your work into line with what the manager expects and wants, not fighting and arguing that you are already achieving the requirement. I'm not saying that's what you are doing, just clarifying that "fight for it" doesn't mean a legal battle or anything like that.

    I think DublinAndy3's suggestion to approach your manager for more feedback and suggestions is good, if the manager is not willing to give you this info then you can be sure that they are not really trying to help you improve, but instead are trying to get you to leave.

    It was never mentioned about a pip there is three others in my same position and none are been reprimanded for lateness


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    #10
    Kylta
    Registered Users Posts: 15,457 ✭✭✭✭Kylta


    Maybe the manager is looking for more attention of you. If there is nothing wrong with your work why would he be bothering you? I might be wrong but were you the only one upskilled?


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    #11
    nibtrix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,305 ✭✭✭nibtrix


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    there is three others in my same position and none are been reprimanded for lateness

    This is your first mention of lateness that I have seen, unless I missed something earlier. Are you late, or accused of being late? It doesn’t matter if others are also late, people get away with different things depending on their usefulness and other factors, and provided you’re not being discriminated against on one of the 9 protected areas there is nothing you can do about it


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    #12
    KevRossi
    Registered Users Posts: 4,404 ✭✭✭KevRossi


    is he your boss as in CEO/owner type boss or more a TL/Manager within the company. If it's the latter it could be he wants you out for his own personal reasons.


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    #13
    Dublinandy3
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭Dublinandy3


    It seems like you’ve had several bits of advice but we’re not telling you what you want to hear. It’s hard when it’s fully one sided. I’ve been a people manager for arund 20 years and it’s quite common for people t over estimate how good they are in a role and people very rarely think they’re underperforming unless it isn’t intentional.

    You just mentioned lateness as well and while you may not like it the argument well that doesn’t happen to other people doesn’t really work. You don’t know if they do get dealt with for lateness for example, they may just not broadcast it.

    I’m not trying to antagonize you, it’s just it’s super hard without the full picture which with all the will in the world you can’t give us.


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    #14
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    I have been employed for 7 months now and I was promoted after 3 months. Over the last few weeks my boss has implemented a program to upskill me but it was really just an excuse to make false claims against my character I don’t know what to do know .He rang me one day when I was with a client and said I was not doing my job properly when I was in the process of a meeting . I had a doctors appointment another day and said it last week that it was short notice that I gave him .he also said I’m not contributing anything to the company it’s just constant, always says when I go to answer him to stop using excuses .. what should I do ..quit or is there outside help

    You've either got to meet his expectations, and find out what they are, or just get another job then leave.


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    #15
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Dav010 wrote: »
    Why would he upskill you just to make false claims against your character? Op, it’s relatively easy to let an employee go within the first year of employment, if he wanted you gone, you probably would be gone at this stage.

    Its not unusual for someone to have to take on extra staff that they don't want then make life a misery for them so they leave.

    Probably isn't the issue here but it does happen.


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    #16
    OMM 0000
    Registered Users Posts: 3,733 ✭✭✭OMM 0000


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    I’m just looking for advice what to do

    There is a virus killing people, shutting down the economy, and causing mass unemployment.

    Based on this, and the fact you've only been there 7 months, the smart thing to do is follow your managers instructions so you can get to the 12 month period where your job will be safer. You do not want to be fired as getting another job right now will be difficult.

    I used to spend probably half my time managing my manager. It made my work life much easier.


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    #17
    LimeFruitGum
    Registered Users Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭LimeFruitGum


    What are the expectations of the new role? How different is it to the original role for which you were hired? Did that manager promote you himself?
    I'm curious about what kind of place promotes a new hire after 3 months, when (presumably?) probation is for six months, and there are three other people in that role.


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    #18
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    Something no adding up here and I suspect that we have a very one sided story.

    At any stage in your first year an employer simply has to say that "you are not suitable for the job you were employed for", give you a week's pay and show you the door


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    #19
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,850 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Ladyinthedark wrote: »
    I have been employed for 7 months now and I was promoted after 3 months. Over the last few weeks my boss has implemented a program to upskill me but it was really just an excuse to make false claims against my character I don’t know what to do know .He rang me one day when I was with a client and said I was not doing my job properly when I was in the process of a meeting . I had a doctors appointment another day and said it last week that it was short notice that I gave him .he also said I’m not contributing anything to the company it’s just constant, always says when I go to answer him to stop using excuses .. what should I do ..quit or is there outside help

    Your manager doesn’t sound like he is in anywhere near or approaching having an asses roar of how to manage a business or staff.

    1) if he is genuine and had a genuine concern about an element or elements of your performance he needed to email you and schedule a feedback meeting when it was convenient for him and yourself and the customer.. ie. when the customer wasn’t there.

    2) feedback to be given in that meeting to be documented and minutes and ‘action plan’ as agreed to be emailed to you complete.

    3) bi-monthly meetings scheduled where your progress / improvement could be discussed..


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    #20
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Strumms wrote: »
    Your manager doesn’t sound like he is in anywhere near or approaching having an asses roar of how to manage a business or staff.

    1) if he is genuine and had a genuine concern about an element or elements of your performance he needed to email you and schedule a feedback meeting when it was convenient for him and yourself and the customer.. ie. when the customer wasn’t there.

    2) feedback to be given in that meeting to be documented and minutes and ‘action plan’ as agreed to be emailed to you complete.

    3) bi-monthly meetings scheduled where your progress / improvement could be discussed..

    It would be easier to let an underperforming employee go if less than a year of service.


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    #21
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Dav010 wrote: »
    It would be easier to let an underperforming employee go if less than a year of service.

    If this was a normal situation. It seems likely there is something else driving this irrational behaviour.


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    #22
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,850 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Dav010 wrote: »
    It would be easier to let an underperforming employee go if less than a year of service.

    You have to advertise the job, interview for the job, train a new hire, all the admin, hr, payroll etc all the associated cost and effort that it takes to bring in a new employee... could have greater aptitude for the roll from the get go correct but their personality, are they a team player, integrating themselves into the team dynamic...?


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    #23
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Strumms wrote: »
    You have to advertise the job, interview for the job, train a new hire, all the admin, hr, payroll etc all the associated cost and effort that it takes to bring in a new employee... could have greater aptitude for the roll from the get go correct but their personality, are they a team player, integrating themselves into the team dynamic...?

    So? After 7 months, if the employee isn’t up to speed, the employer may be delaying the inevitable and once service goes past 12 months, it becomes far more difficult to make a change.


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    #24
    padser
    Registered Users Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭padser


    It sounds like he is paving the way to let you go. He doesn't necessarily have to do this (as you have been there less than 12 months) but sometimes it's useful to make it clear to others in the organisation that someone is not performing before letting them go (so he might be going through this process more for their benefit than yours). Its also possible he is genuinely trying to show you where your performance is lacking with a view to keeping you on.

    Going by the attitude you have displayed in this thread, I suspect attitude may be part of your problem.

    For example, you complain that you are given out to for coming in late - on the basis that others also come in late. Two problems with this.

    1. You shouldn't be late for work. It's reasonable to point this out to you.
    2. You don't know the circumstances of others. Maybe they have agreed that sometimes they will be late? Maybe they work through lunch? Maybe one of them is sometimes late, but in 20 years has never not delivered on an assignment.


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    #25
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 24,850 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Dav010 wrote: »
    So? After 7 months, if the employee isn’t up to speed, the employer may be delaying the inevitable and once service goes past 12 months, it becomes far more difficult to make a change.

    The reasons why they are not up to speed needs to be addressed.

    Have they had the necessary training, integrated on the job support.

    When areas of issue were identified was there PIPs initiated ?

    A lot of jobs aims difficult to hire new hires who will flourish without support... you can’t just hire and expect perfection, performance straight away. There is an onus on the employer to ENABLE the employee to carry out their job to the best of their ability.. training, mentoring, checkrides and more besides...


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    #26
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,084 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Strumms wrote: »
    The reasons why they are not up to speed needs to be addressed.

    Have they had the necessary training, integrated on the job support.

    When areas of issue were identified was there PIPs initiated ?

    A lot of jobs aims difficult to hire new hires who will flourish without support... you can’t just hire and expect perfection, performance straight away. There is an onus on the employer to ENABLE the employee to carry out their job to the best of their ability.. training, mentoring, checkrides and more besides...

    There may be an onus, but that does not make it a requirement. After 7 months, you get a pretty good idea if someone is up to the job. That is why I find it odd that the op thinks his/her manager promoted her to knock him/her down, maybe he/she needs to up his/her game.


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    #27
    Dublinandy3
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭Dublinandy3


    Dav010 wrote: »
    There may be an onus, but that does not make it a requirement. After 7 months, you get a pretty good idea if someone is up to the job. That is why I find it odd that the op thinks his/her manager promoted her to knock him/her down, maybe he/she needs to up his/her game.


    Reading back I'm not sure it was a promotion, maybe more of an expectation to perform more complex tasks, those tasks being the ones the OP is struggling with general day to day work. I do think we're not getting the full picture. Shame we'll never know.


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