Coronavirus and the effect on Public transport

devnull wrote: »

I'm in the UK right now and the vast majority of bus operators seem to be using gloves and getting buses cleaned at the end of every lap and running extra vehicles to ensure handrails etc are cleaned at the end of each journey.

Unfortunately more to make them feel good, then much use. If they touch a surface with the virus with the glove and then touch their face with the glove, it will transfer.

Gloves are only useful if you, put on, do a specific job, don't touch face, take off/dispose after job, wash hands. If you are wearing gloves all day long, not much use.

Wiping down the wheel and cab as best you can with cleaning product as you start shift is probably the best you can do.

As you say, rotating buses in and out more frequently and intensive cleaning, including the cab certainly helps.

There probably should be no more mid-route drivers hand overs. Should be bus returned to depot and a cleaned bus taken out by new driver.

Obviously a bit of a organisational nightmare. But perhaps easier with a reduced schedule.

devnull wrote: »

None of these operators are handling cash and the one I know who is handling cash and are asking everyone for contactless and if someone wants to pay in cash they are going through the coin hopper.

Good idea, but the driver still ends up well inside the social distancing distance of 1 to 2 meters.

devnull wrote: »

Do Dublin Bus drivers seal themselves off from their colleagues and keep their distance from them when they are having lunch in the canteen too? Since if you're saying they need to be sealed from everyone then should it not apply to all situations or are bus passengers deemed to be riskier than everyone else?

Canteens should absolutely be closed, no question about that at all!

It is all about social distancing. Lots of key business are putting in place measures to reduce spread within their staff.

As an example, the reason Spanish air traffic control has been limited over the weekend, is because they reduced the numbers of controllers working each shift, with others staying home and self isolating, so if one shift get infected, there is some backup to come in and cover for them next day.

Power stations, water treatment plants, etc. are all doing the same.

devnull wrote: »

I assume most of them drive a car as well, have they also sealed each seat in their car off from each other as well? Have they put a screen inbetween the front and the back of these? How about taxi drivers? Have they done the same thing? What about shops? Have checkouts been enclosed yet?

In a car, you are assuming you are only carrying your family, who you live with anyway. The health care professionals are assuming if one person in a family get it, everyone else in the same house does too, unfortunately.

Checkouts haven't been closed, but they have definitely been directing people to use self service tills more (this is when to use your gloves).

Shelves should be packed overnight or during closed periods during the day, so those workers don't mix with the public.

In Wuhan in China, you couldn't even enter the shop. You approach the door, tell them what you want from a distance, they go get it and then they pass it out to you on a stick!

Sorry, I don't mean to be too alarmist about this or to frighten people more then they already are. But folks running vital services like this have to think extremely carefully about what steps need to be taken to isolate public facing staff as much as possible from the public and how to slow the spread amongst their staff.

Dravokivich wrote: »

It's more difficult to do that then you'll think.

At this stage, I think they should just stop taking fares and seal off the drivers cab.

Also strictly enforce enter via front door, exit via middle door. Stop people passing closely.

Either way the government will need to step in and increase the subsidy to these companies to keep them going due to fall in passenger numbers. A bit extra to cover lost fares for a few months won't make much difference.

Extraordinary times will require extraordinary measures.

dashcamdanny wrote: »

People will not exit via the middle door. In fact they can be so dumb, they walk right past an open middle door to exit the front even after numerous announcements.

Unless new signs are put up maybe.

Yes, constant announcements on the speakers, due to COVID19 ONLY use the middle door to exit for social distancing. And when I say constant, I mean repeat it over and over again every minute. Also bright yellow posters plastered on the window next to every seat, saying the same.

I'm sure some idiots would still use the front door. But the social pressure of something like this might actual see a real social change.

Dravokivich wrote: »

With dublin bus, the drivers already have screens separating them from passengers.

Yes but those screens are pretty limited in this regard, they have lots of holes to talk to passengers and in particular the big cut out section for the drivers ticket machine.

I've seen pictures in papers, I think from Italy, where they have completely covered the door to the drivers cabin in plastic and taped it off. So no interaction with the public. Obviously that would force fares not to be taken, unless perhaps they switched to leap only.

Another option I've seen them do in some countries is tape off the front door and the yellow line by the driver, so entry/exit through the middle door only. Other places are already doing this:

https://www.masstransitmag.com/technology/fare-collection/article/21130017/systems-drop-fare-collection-to-further-enhance-covid19-mitigation-measures

Both excellent points.

GT89 wrote: »

One thing I will say is that any such measures taken to protect drivers and passengers from the virus also have to take safety into account. For example it would be dangerous to cover the drivers cab in protective plastic sheets as they would obscure the drivers being able to see his/her blindside.

I hadn't though of that, very good point, then perhaps the seal off the front of the bus completely so, like in the above link and passengers only use the middle door.

That has issues too of course, no fares can be taken, how to deal with wheelchairs, people entering/exiting through one door pass close to one another, some stops might be difficult to operate. But then there is probably no perfect solution to this, just what is least bad.

GT89 wrote: »

Issuing drivers with ffp2 masks could also be safety issue too. From what I gather and I'm not expert is that these masks can make it more difficult as well as tiring to breathe through also ther could be issues if the driver is wearing glasses with fogging up. I for one certainly would want my full breathing ability whilst in charge of a double decker bus full of passengers. Really the most effective piece of PPE that should be issued to drivers would be alcohol based hand sanitiser in the absence of much needed sanitary facilities. A much more effective tool than gloves, masks or plastic barriers.

ffp2 masks can come in all sorts of different types. From the cheapest types that would certainly have the issues you describe, to high end ones which have exhaling valves etc. that are designed to be used by people all day long in the likes of certain factories and hospitals.

Having said that, the practical issue at the moment, is that these high quality masks are pretty much impossible to get at the moment and any supply that does come in needs to be directed to frontline medical staff who would be at greatest risk of exposure.

There would also be the issue of you need different sizes to fit different faces and proper training on how to use them and properly put them on and off. You are correct, it probably isn't too practical for drivers in general.

As you say though, buses should certainly be getting deep cleaned, including the cab and cleaning products and hand sanitzer available to staff in the cab at all times.

punisher5112 wrote: »

If someone farts or eats or opens even a bottle of vodka upstairs down the back you can smell it ...

Just FYI, it isn't airborne in that manner. It is carried in water droplets of coughs and sneezes. Which is why the advice of 1 to 2m's distancing.