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10-02-2020, 15:46   #16
TheBoyConor
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Manpower is no issue. We can just do what they do in London and what we previously did in the boom. Hire in polish plumbers and romanian blocklayers who don't know one end of a brick from the other, all supervised by some midlands farmer's son who did a diploma in construction management and "sure, lash it up, it'll be grand, the painter will fix it" mentality. All fuelled by breakfast rolls.
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10-02-2020, 15:49   #17
Assetbacked
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Manpower is no issue. We can just do what they do in London and what we previously did in the boom. Hire in polish plumbers and romanian blocklayers who don't know one end of a brick from the other, all supervised by some midlands farmer's son who did a diploma in construction management and "sure, lash it up, it'll be grand, the painter will fix it" mentality. All fuelled by breakfast rolls.
Why would we do it this way?
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10-02-2020, 15:50   #18
The Student
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Manpower is no issue. We can just do what they do in London and what we previously did in the boom. Hire in polish plumbers and romanian blocklayers who don't know one end of a brick from the other, all supervised by some midlands farmer's son who did a diploma in construction management and "sure, lash it up, it'll be grand, the painter will fix it" mentality. All fuelled by breakfast rolls.
Which is what I fear will happen, sure Priory Hall was built by a friend of SF? I am sure he can help build!
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10-02-2020, 15:53   #19
TheBoyConor
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Why would we do it this way?
Because we are Ireland. That is just what would end up happening.
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10-02-2020, 15:53   #20
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Whatever level of influence SF has in the next government, it is abundantly clear that the current housing situation (compounded by the last 9 years) is toxic and needs to change. The electorate have made it certain.
No the electorate have not made it certain. Whom ever gets into power will have to do something. They can promise all they like but once reality comes along they have to deal with that. Legal challenges to some of their proposal already exist. They can't just change the employment of the civil servants. Most importantly they have to figure out how to pay for their promises.

It can all very easily stay the same or get worse if they don't know what they are doing. Their proposals make it clear SF do not understand economics or they are lying knowing they can't deliver.
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10-02-2020, 16:08   #21
Assetbacked
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No the electorate have not made it certain. Whom ever gets into power will have to do something. They can promise all they like but once reality comes along they have to deal with that. Legal challenges to some of their proposal already exist. They can't just change the employment of the civil servants. Most importantly they have to figure out how to pay for their promises.

It can all very easily stay the same or get worse if they don't know what they are doing. Their proposals make it clear SF do not understand economics or they are lying knowing they can't deliver.
This is pure conjecture. With FG and FF and their promises, at least we have evidence that they can't improve the housing situation. FF destroyed the economy and FG have sat on their hands for the past 9 years with the housing issue in particular. The electorate have lifted SF from the third largest party to potentially the largest party in just 4 years. The wider story is the fact that FF and FG have only ever been the parties in power in some form. This is a clear message that the housing market needs strong political intervention.

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Because we are Ireland. That is just what would end up happening.
With FF that is what happened 15/20 years ago.
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10-02-2020, 16:22   #22
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At best what will be built will be whatever the current government have planned/promised.
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10-02-2020, 16:30   #23
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The housing situation has turned around. Rents are now falling, the homeless numbers are dropping and house prices are leveling off. The next government will claim credit for the work done by the last one. The banks are still on life support and no government will be allowed to crash the housing market.
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10-02-2020, 16:31   #24
Ray Palmer
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This is pure conjecture. With FG and FF and their promises, at least we have evidence that they can't improve the housing situation. FF destroyed the economy and FG have sat on their hands for the past 9 years with the housing issue in particular. The electorate have lifted SF from the third largest party to potentially the largest party in just 4 years. The wider story is the fact that FF and FG have only ever been the parties in power in some form. This is a clear message that the housing market needs strong political intervention.



With FF that is what happened 15/20 years ago.
Not really. They propose a rent freeze as a way to help existing tenants. This goes against the known way to get investment into the sector and is known it will reduce investment. How they propose to pay for new housing without private investment has never been answered. They effectively never had a plan and just told the people what they wanted. They are either hiding some amazing genius plan, don't have a real or know they can't deliver.

Of those 3 which do you think is likely? It is amazingly optimism to think they have a secret genius plan that they never spoke about.

A strong political intervention doesn't mean a good outcome if it isn't stable and thought out. You also ignore the will of the people. The public laughed when they were told there was an impending housing crisis and claimed FF/FG were trying to line their developer friends pockets. That was a more popular opinion than the reality of a housing crisis. People just vote in a party that made this claim. Do you think SF are going to override the public to do the right thing or stay with their populist promises knowing it is a disaster? They will want to stay in power and act like the other parties.
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10-02-2020, 16:47   #25
Assetbacked
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Not really. They propose a rent freeze as a way to help existing tenants. This goes against the known way to get investment into the sector and is known it will reduce investment. How they propose to pay for new housing without private investment has never been answered. They effectively never had a plan and just told the people what they wanted. They are either hiding some amazing genius plan, don't have a real or know they can't deliver.

Of those 3 which do you think is likely? It is amazingly optimism to think they have a secret genius plan that they never spoke about.

A strong political intervention doesn't mean a good outcome if it isn't stable and thought out. You also ignore the will of the people. The public laughed when they were told there was an impending housing crisis and claimed FF/FG were trying to line their developer friends pockets. That was a more popular opinion than the reality of a housing crisis. People just vote in a party that made this claim. Do you think SF are going to override the public to do the right thing or stay with their populist promises knowing it is a disaster? They will want to stay in power and act like the other parties.
The fiscal policy of SF involves spending more than the other parties but is apparently conservative in terms of EU fiscal rules.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...ges/ar-BBZOt8d

It is constantly and lazily trotted out that SF's figures don't add up but I can't find hard evidence that they don't.
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10-02-2020, 16:53   #26
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Personally I see a tax credit for tenants. Non tax compliant landlords will leave. SF want indefinite tenancies where you can't evict for reason of selling or for own use. They want to enshrine the right to housing in the Constitution.

I would expect the tax credit and selling with tenants in situ will happen, not sure about the using property for own use. How would it be fair if the tenant had greater rights under the Constitution than the landlord or one of his family.
Banks don't give mortgages with tenants in situ. This is not going to change.
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10-02-2020, 16:58   #27
Ray Palmer
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The fiscal policy of SF involves spending more than the other parties but is apparently conservative in terms of EU fiscal rules.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...ges/ar-BBZOt8d

It is constantly and lazily trotted out that SF's figures don't add up but I can't find hard evidence that they don't.
They have not stated where they will get their money to fund their ideas. Explain how they expect money to be privately invested in the rental market when they are going to punish those that have? Do you think landlords are going to just accept it? I already sold one property and had plans to sell one more now I think I will sell them all. That is the reality they will create. Explain how that increases rental properties. They can't build property quickly enough to replace just what I am taking of the market in a few months let alone in a year
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10-02-2020, 16:58   #28
 
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Which is what I fear will happen, sure Priory Hall was built by a friend of SF? I am sure he can help build!
How many developments were build by friends of FF which are fire pits and how many developers that who engaged in dodgy planning back in the Celtic tiger years were cushioned by Nama and are now buying their
developments back and selling them to foreign investors for hundreds of millions under FG watch,

Isn't it true that FG/FF were once a part of SF before they all split, isn't it true in Building circles that back in the boom some contractors repeatedly took building materials/ used for insulation and fire protection out of the inner walls after the foremen would do a daily check and would seal up to wall hence the insulation & fire problems which are appearing weekly in apartment blocks up and down the country.

When we are seeing Margaret Sweeney of Irish Reit receive a bonus package of €330K in 2019 and 5 other executive receiving 1.34 million it shows how much price gouging in Corporate Rentals have engaged in and how FG staged the non professional Landlords as the bad guys.These Corporations are ripe for hundreds of millions that can & should be paid back to the Irish People to fund our building projects.

Moving on with a New government, a hugh import of foreign builders/developers are needed preferably Chinese obviously with a good track record in building with a contract to take on 50% young or Irish citizens as senior or as apprenticeships which will hopefully keep building and jobs going for the next 10 years and house our homeless.These contracts should only be awarded for a certain timeframe
/period meaning if they overun 25 % is the max the government will pay out,this will do away with builders dragging out timeframes and paid on a monthly basis.

Last edited by johnnygogo; 10-02-2020 at 17:04.
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10-02-2020, 17:02   #29
TheBoyConor
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Doesn't matter if the construction companies are irish or chinese or from the moon. It is the locally hired irish managers that will be the ones pulling the strokes and fast ones.

Anyway, with EU procurement rules can you cannnot narrow it down to companies from a certain country, let alone specify chinese only. You are talking out of your arse.
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10-02-2020, 17:03   #30
ednwireland
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The fiscal policy of SF involves spending more than the other parties but is apparently conservative in terms of EU fiscal rules.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...ges/ar-BBZOt8d

It is constantly and lazily trotted out that SF's figures don't add up but I can't find hard evidence that they don't.
i think the thing is the SF figures add up in terms of thats what it will cost to iplement those polices, the real question is whether the economy can sustain their spending plans
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