FF dismiss rotating taoiseach idea

Long_Wave · 25-02-2020 3:46am #1

What I think will happen is that leo will get a beefed up " department of the "Tánaiste" job without a portfolio so he'll basically be a second Taoiseach in all but name. I also think the greens would be absolutely mad to join a FF/FG partnership as they'd be lucky to get 5% of their policies implemented and they'd get distroyed at the next election. https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/fianna-fails-dismissal-of-rotating-taoiseach-plan-arrogant-fine-gael-claims-983576.html

Yurt2 · 25-02-2020 4:00am

Leo undermining democracy with his petulant demands to wear the Taoiseach cape despite being the leader of the third largest party in Leinster House.

jimmycrackcorm · 25-02-2020 4:06am

Yurt! wrote: »

Leo undermining democracy with his petulant demands to wear the Taoiseach cape despite being the leader of the third largest party in Leinster House.

Isn't the petulant demands, Mary Lou's dept? With only 25% of the vote, demanding to be made taoiseach.

And now her rallies look like they're turning out to be flops.

Yurt2 · 25-02-2020 4:08am

FG meltdowns are best meltdowns.

jimmycrackcorm · 25-02-2020 4:31am

Yurt! wrote: »

FG meltdowns are best meltdowns.

The North Korean reference is apt given how SF elect the single choice candidates as their dear leader.

What's Paddy Power giving odds on Mary Lou getting a 34 year term like the last guy?

Larbre34 · 25-02-2020 4:49am

Its the stupidest of notions, the 'rotating Taoiseach'

You're either the head of government of a Country, or you're not. It gives a weak signal of accountability and responsibility both to the people and to the wider world.

Martin will be Taoiseach for however long this Dáil lasts.

suicide_circus · 25-02-2020 7:41am

Yurt! wrote: »

Leo undermining democracy with his petulant demands to wear the Taoiseach cape despite being the leader of the third largest party in Leinster House.

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Isn't the petulant demands, Mary Lou's dept? With only 25% of the vote, demanding to be made taoiseach.

there are plenty of criticisms shinners can level at Leo but "petulant demands" is beyond hypocritical under these circumstances.

daheff · 25-02-2020 8:06am

suicide_circus wrote: »

there are plenty of criticisms shinners can level at Leo but "petulant demands" is beyond hypocritical under these circumstances.

Nope. Absolutely petulant of SF to demand they get into govt. Nobody has that right unless they get majority of seats or can get other parties to agree to a coalition. SF haven't done either of these things.

Having (or attempting) marches like they are makes me think of how the Nazis behaved back in the 30s....basically did the same & demanded to be in govt.

And we all know how that worked out.

Quantum Erasure · 25-02-2020 8:14am

Larbre34 wrote: »

Its the stupidest of notions, the 'rotating Taoiseach'

Martin will be Taoiseach for however long this Dáil lasts.

As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball. But tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

McMurphy · 25-02-2020 9:21am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

And now her rallies look like they're turning out to be flops.

Who told you that?

Tune into Newstalk now. Over a thousand in attendance, standing room only?

How do you set the bar for something to be a flop?

25-02-2020 9:26am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

And now her rallies look like they're turning out to be flops.

"The room at the Rochestown Park Hotel, set out for 500 people, was full with standing room only as hundreds of people from Cork and beyond."

I think we can nip this one in the bud:
https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Full-house-for-SFs-post-election-meeting-in-Cork-Mary-Lou-says-I-dont-care-what-Micheal-Martin-thinks-of-Sinn-Fein-c50d8b2d-f2c1-4f51-acd7-3e5215633f3d-ds

McMurphy · 25-02-2020 9:28am

Deleted User wrote: »

"The room at the Rochestown Park Hotel, set out for 500 people, was full with standing room only as hundreds of people from Cork and beyond."

I think we can nip this one in the bud:
https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Full-house-for-SFs-post-election-meeting-in-Cork-Mary-Lou-says-I-dont-care-what-Micheal-Martin-thinks-of-Sinn-Fein-c50d8b2d-f2c1-4f51-acd7-3e5215633f3d-ds

https://twitter.com/sinnfeinireland/status/1232031882138849282?s=19

Augme · 25-02-2020 9:42am

Never been a big fan of sinn Fein and didn't vote for them last time out but the reaction of fg(Leo) and ff has been an embarrassment. Leo seems to have learnt zero lessons from his disastrous pre election campaign.

25-02-2020 11:24am

The best (and probably only!) way for FF/FG to beat SF now is the time of get up off their ar*es and do something. Something for the public.

Build public housing right now or tackle the insurance beast, or put proper money into childcare. Look at the optics and look at what people are actually concerned about. A lot of people will not change their vote just because FF/FG say, "but... THE RA!" enough.

Like a few have mentioned, it's absolutely dreadful politics to be constantly haranguing SF, and it is in turn making them more mainstream, feasible and acknowledged as a party on the cusp of power.

blanch152 · 25-02-2020 11:34am

Deleted User wrote: »

"The room at the Rochestown Park Hotel, set out for 500 people, was full with standing room only as hundreds of people from Cork and beyond."

I think we can nip this one in the bud:
https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Full-house-for-SFs-post-election-meeting-in-Cork-Mary-Lou-says-I-dont-care-what-Micheal-Martin-thinks-of-Sinn-Fein-c50d8b2d-f2c1-4f51-acd7-3e5215633f3d-ds

And we will see the same 700 people at the next rally.

Runaways · 25-02-2020 11:50am

Interesting seeing so many on here across several topics so completely rattled and freaked out by the SF vote.

It’s very telling

Eric Cartman · 25-02-2020 11:53am

Runaways wrote: »

Interesting seeing so many on here across several topics so completely rattled and freaked out by the SF vote.

It’s very telling

Yes, people are afraid that terrorist apologists still under the control of an army council in another country have risen in popularity.

Runaways · 25-02-2020 11:55am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Yes, people are afraid that terrorist apologists still under the control of an army council in another country have risen in popularity.

I’d love to see any evidence of that?

I’m far more concerned about Denis o Brien calling FGs every shot for his own benefit than some imaginary ‘army council’ tbh

Fr_Dougal · 25-02-2020 12:05pm

I’m sure they’ll work it out between them and put forward a government that represents the majority of the country.

If it goes to another election so be it. I voted independent last time around, I won’t the next time.

ABSF!

Eric Cartman · 25-02-2020 12:14pm

Runaways wrote: »

I’d love to see any evidence of that?

I’m far more concerned about Denis o Brien calling FGs every shot for his own benefit than some imaginary ‘army council’ tbh

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/ira-has-gone-away-mcdonald-responds-to-garda-commissioner-s-comments-1.4180689?mode=amp

The gardai have evidence of it, so do the PSNI, I see no reason for any of them to insist that a fact that was verifiable in the past would be incorrect now

Runaways · 25-02-2020 12:23pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/ira-has-gone-away-mcdonald-responds-to-garda-commissioner-s-comments-1.4180689?mode=amp

The gardai have evidence of it, so do the PSNI, I see no reason for any of them to insist that a fact that was verifiable in the past would be incorrect now

Convenient at best. I thought the Gardai weren’t allowed to be politicized?
That’s really telling ff Fg have dragged them into it.

Again though, when will we look at denis o Brien dictating to FG for his own benefit?
That’s a matter of record. Whereas the other really isn’t.
If there’s an ira army council why not round em all up and arrest them?

Eric Cartman · 25-02-2020 12:28pm

Runaways wrote: »

Convenient at best. I thought the Gardai weren’t allowed to be politicized?
That’s really telling ff Fg have dragged them into it.

Again though, when will we look at denis o Brien dictating to FG for his own benefit?
That’s a matter of record. Whereas the other really isn’t.
If there’s an ira army council why not round em all up and arrest them?

Whataboutery and conspiracy theories about FG are bot a defence for SF’s actions.

Runaways · 25-02-2020 12:31pm

Was that english?

Which SF actions? Specifically

Have you heard of siteserve? Not a conspiracy theory you’ll find if you look it up

Floppybits · 25-02-2020 12:36pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The best (and probably only!) way for FF/FG to beat SF now is the time of get up off their ar*es and do something. Something for the public.

Build public housing right now or tackle the insurance beast, or put proper money into childcare. Look at the optics and look at what people are actually concerned about. A lot of people will not change their vote just because FF/FG say, "but... THE RA!" enough.

Like a few have mentioned, it's absolutely dreadful politics to be constantly haranguing SF, and it is in turn making them more mainstream, feasible and acknowledged as a party on the cusp of power.

This is the best outcome of the election. The rise of SF will now put huge pressure and focus on FF and FG to address the issues affecting the country such as Health, Housing and Insurance. Failure of the new government in what ever guise it is in to make some in roads into these issues will see them decimated at the next election.

I feel that this is the reason why FG are trying to step away as well, they know there will be huge focus on these issues and they can see what will happen to any party that wont address them. Michael Martin and FF are so focused on being in government that they are not see this. They also do not have the talent in their party to address the issues.

In reality what we do need is an all party consensus on what needs to be done to tackle each of the major issues and then deliver on it. I know there is Slainte care for health but has it even started. This is the problem they talk the talk but they never walk the walk. Now is the time to start walking and delivering or face decimation. People are sick of it.

blanch152 · 25-02-2020 12:37pm

Runaways wrote: »

Convenient at best. I thought the Gardai weren’t allowed to be politicized?
That’s really telling ff Fg have dragged them into it.

Again though, when will we look at denis o Brien dictating to FG for his own benefit?
That’s a matter of record. Whereas the other really isn’t.
If there’s an ira army council why not round em all up and arrest them?

Harris just told it as it is. He was asked a question, he gave a straight answer.

He also said that he would serve the public, no matter who was in government.

Sometimes the truth hurts, but those like you who hint that Harris should have withheld the truth are the most dangerous to our democracy.

Runaways · 25-02-2020 12:39pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Harris just told it as it is. He was asked a question, he gave a straight answer.

He also said that he would serve the public, no matter who was in government.

Sometimes the truth hurts, but those like you who hint that Harris should have withheld the truth are the most dangerous to our democracy.

Those like me?
Dangerous to democracy?
I didn’t hint anything...

Wow you’re a special one

average_runner · 25-02-2020 1:47pm

Runaways wrote: »

Convenient at best. I thought the Gardai weren’t allowed to be politicized?
That’s really telling ff Fg have dragged them into it.

Again though, when will we look at denis o Brien dictating to FG for his own benefit?
That’s a matter of record. Whereas the other really isn’t.
If there’s an ira army council why not round em all up and arrest them?

And if there isn't one, why don't SF come out and say it directly, or even say it has nothing to do with it directly?

GS11 · 25-02-2020 1:52pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Isn't the petulant demands, Mary Lou's dept? With only 25% of the vote, demanding to be made taoiseach.

And now her rallies look like they're turning out to be flops.

Hasn't she got more votes than either of the other 2.

This take that someone that didn't voted for you is 100% against you is rubbish, media trying to portray it as 75% don't want Mary Lou, that's not the case.

If it was, there's an even higher % that don't want Michael or Leo.

average_runner · 25-02-2020 1:54pm

GS11 wrote: »

Hasn't she got more votes than either of the other 2.

This take that someone that didn't voted for you is 100% against you is rubbish, media trying to portray it as 75% don't want Mary Lou, that's not the case.

If it was, there's an even higher % that don't want Michael or Leo.

But we weren't voting on Leo/Martin/Mary.

We were voting on candidates in our area.

Think you are getting mixed up with USA

RandomViewer · 25-02-2020 1:54pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/ira-has-gone-away-mcdonald-responds-to-garda-commissioner-s-comments-1.4180689?mode=amp

The gardai have evidence of it, so do the PSNI, I see no reason for any of them to insist that a fact that was verifiable in the past would be incorrect now

Noonan s retired now, will FG releases the minutes of every meeting he had with Dinny in 2011-12 ?

Loafing Oaf · 25-02-2020 2:21pm

Varadkar probably knew the rotating taoiseach thing was never going to fly. Part of a well choreographed game of hardball that FF and FG are playing with each other ahead of the inevitable deal.

RandomViewer · 25-02-2020 2:47pm

If it happens it will be another do nothing government, FG are against public healthcare,housing an nd any changes to the insurance industry, FF are that mad for power that they'll agree to the status quo just to draw the wages and expenses and rant about being back in government. 5 year s of stagnation

James Brown · 25-02-2020 2:54pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Isn't the petulant demands, Mary Lou's dept? With only 25% of the vote, demanding to be made taoiseach.

And now her rallies look like they're turning out to be flops.

Is Mary Lou in on this FF/FG Axis of me feinery?
Three posts in on a FF/FG thread :rolleyes:

blanch152 wrote: »

And we will see the same 700 people at the next rally.

The FG contingent are becoming more and more Trump like.

James Brown · 25-02-2020 2:56pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Yes, people are afraid that terrorist apologists still under the control of an army council in another country have risen in popularity.

I don't think so. I'd much prefer if FF/FG matured and looked at their own record and what they might do to improve rather than be pathetic brats, but it is entertaining. I'd love a Kenny come back. His stories were the best. More stupid than bitter.

It's a battle of egos. MM wants the title, LV doesn't want to be second fiddle...'stability' though right?

Fr_Dougal · 25-02-2020 3:09pm

Bowie wrote: »

I don't think so. I'd much prefer if FF/FG matured and looked at their own record and what they might do to improve rather than be pathetic brats, but it is entertaining. I'd love a Kenny come back. His stories were the best. More stupid than bitter.

It's a battle of egos. MM wants the title, LV doesn't want to be second fiddle...'stability' though right?

Does the 9th January 2017 to 11th January 2020 ring a bell?

SF abandoned the people of NI for three years, when it mattered most.

That’s the sort of ‘stability’ that SF can offer.

James Brown · 25-02-2020 3:17pm

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Does the 9th January 2017 to 11th January 2020 ring a bell?

SF abandoned the people of NI for three years, when it mattered most.

That’s the sort of ‘stability’ that SF can offer.

You keep mentioning this. I suggest you got look at all the retorts for each time you have. I'll not be going in circles with a person who ignorantly uses the photos of dead children to try score points.

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 3:48pm

Yurt! wrote: »

Leo undermining democracy with his petulant demands to wear the Taoiseach cape despite being the leader of the third largest party in Leinster House.

Always worth noting that when a poster invokes affronts to democracy, they don't care about it at all! What law or part of the constitution is he offending? If a deal is done, Taoiseach Number I resigns and Taoiseach Number II gets the votes that's the new Taoiseach. In 1994 there was even brief talk of Spring doing a deal with Bertie, who'd replaced Reynolds.

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 3:50pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

If it happens it will be another do nothing government, FG are against public healthcare,housing an nd any changes to the insurance industry, FF are that mad for power that they'll agree to the status quo just to draw the wages and expenses and rant about being back in government. 5 year s of stagnation

No they are not, all political groups are in favour of Slaintecare and the rest of the post gets steadily worse.

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 3:52pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

Its the stupidest of notions, the 'rotating Taoiseach'

You're either the head of government of a Country, or you're not. It gives a weak signal of accountability and responsibility both to the people and to the wider world.

Martin will be Taoiseach for however long this Dáil lasts.

See 1992-1997 for precedent!

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 3:53pm

Long_Wave wrote: »

What I think will happen is that leo will get a beefed up " department of the "Tánaiste" job without a portfolio so he'll basically be a second Taoiseach in all but name. I also think the greens would be absolutely mad to join a FF/FG partnership as they'd be lucky to get 5% of their policies implemented and they'd get distroyed at the next election. https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/fianna-fails-dismissal-of-rotating-taoiseach-plan-arrogant-fine-gael-claims-983576.html

They concur with FG & FF on a good bit of it so I don't see how they'd only get 5% done. Oh and you really wouldn't expect FF to give up anything at the start of "exploratory" talks.

weldoninhio · 25-02-2020 3:56pm

Runaways wrote: »

Interesting seeing so many on here across several topics so completely rattled and freaked out by the SF vote.

It’s very telling

Imagine not wanting the economy to go into a worse recession than the 2000s, one that will be a lot harder to return from.

weldoninhio · 25-02-2020 3:58pm

GS11 wrote: »

Hasn't she got more votes than either of the other 2.

This take that someone that didn't voted for you is 100% against you is rubbish, media trying to portray it as 75% don't want Mary Lou, that's not the case.

If it was, there's an even higher % that don't want Michael or Leo.

I think you are mixing up UK FPTP voting system, with Ireland PR voting system.

bullpost · 25-02-2020 3:59pm

The next five years is most likely going to see a recession. Whoever gets into power will be under serious pressure to deliver change while keeping the economy strong.
If its FG/FF in power, SF may be able to take advantage by consolidating their status as a single party opposition who could get a majority come next election.

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 4:00pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

Noonan s retired now, will FG releases the minutes of every meeting he had with Dinny in 2011-12 ?

Why?

Fr_Dougal · 25-02-2020 4:01pm

Bowie wrote: »

You keep mentioning this. I suggest you got look at all the retorts for each time you have. I'll not be going in circles with a person who ignorantly uses the photos of dead children to try score points.

Show me where else I mentioned SF abandoning their electorate.

weldoninhio · 25-02-2020 4:01pm

bullpost wrote: »

The next five years is most likely going to see a recession. Whoever gets into power will be under serious pressure to deliver change while keeping the economy strong.
If its FG/FF in power, SF may be able to take advantage by consolidating their status as a single party opposition who could get a majority come next election.

And turn the recession into a depression.

is_that_so · 25-02-2020 4:05pm

bullpost wrote: »

The next five years is most likely going to see a recession. Whoever gets into power will be under serious pressure to deliver change while keeping the economy strong.
If its FG/FF in power, SF may be able to take advantage by consolidating their status as a single party opposition who could get a majority come next election.

That mean they would need to get 60 seats+ at least but then they'll have cleared out all their possible buddies and still not get a majority. It's also nigh on impossible with 60% of FF/FG voters not inclined to vote for them and they don't have a lot of support in the oldest demographic, who vote every time.

Mortelaro · 25-02-2020 4:10pm

Yurt! wrote: »

Leo undermining democracy with his petulant demands to wear the Taoiseach cape despite being the leader of the third largest party in Leinster House.

How many seats had SF when in the last Dáil they proposed their Uchtaráin for Taoiseach or indeed leader of the Greens, both also petulant?

Odhinn · 25-02-2020 4:29pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/ira-has-gone-away-mcdonald-responds-to-garda-commissioner-s-comments-1.4180689?mode=amp

The gardai have evidence of it, so do the PSNI, I see no reason for any of them to insist that a fact that was verifiable in the past would be incorrect now

What has that to do with "FF dismiss rotating taoiseach idea"?

James Brown · 25-02-2020 4:45pm

Mortelaro wrote: »

How many seats had SF when in the last Dáil they proposed their Uchtaráin for Taoiseach or indeed leader of the Greens, both also petulant?

You're in the wrong thread.
If johnny has six apples and you take away two...SF something something....

Larbre34 · 25-02-2020 5:23pm

is_that_so wrote: »

See 1992-1997 for precedent!

That was two different Governments, not leaders within a coalition or other support arrangement playing spin the ****ing bottle.

FF dismiss rotating taoiseach idea

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