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Notre Dame fire conspiracies

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  • 16-04-2019 4:47pm
    #1
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,775 ✭✭✭✭


    Well they've all kicked off on various conspiracy forums, one of them is along the lines it being an inside job by the French government to divert attention away from the Yellow Vests protests


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    #2
    Sleeper12
    Registered Users Posts: 16,878 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    Dohnjoe wrote:
    Well they've all kicked off on various conspiracy forums, one of them is along the lines it being an inside job by the French government to divert attention away from the Yellow Vests protests


    Or it was stated by the yellow vest protesters


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    #3
    Topgear on Dave
    Registered Users Posts: 4,521 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    The FAI organised it as a diversion to take the media heat off Delaney.

    The French owed them a favour from a few years ago.....


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    #4
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    Well they've all kicked off on various conspiracy forums, one of them is along the lines it being an inside job by the French government to divert attention away from the Yellow Vests protests

    Having watched hours of footage, live and afterwards, I am indeed wondering whether all happened as they are telling us…for example, what was the story with the response by the Paris fire brigade? They were talking about some 400 firefighters in action…looked more like a dozen or two to me, mostly strolling around leisurely, and I think I saw about two ladders in action, none reaching high enough, and maybe a hand full of fire hoses at best…certainly not the all-out mega effort one would expect in such an event…and it apparently took them forever to arrive at the scene, too…and then questions must be asked around fire safety in the building, considering the outer roof went up like tinder…
    I’d say at the very least a pathetic and catastrophic failure on the part of the authorities and fire brigade, possibly arson and maybe an inside job…


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    #5
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,775 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Good overview here from the Guardian about the attempts to spread conspiracies and misinformation regarding the fire - and the successful and not so successful measures to counter them

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/16/social-media-platforms-failed-to-counter-notre-dame-fire-conspiracies-say-critics
    The Notre Dame Cathedral fire was one of the first major tests of social media companies’ nascent programmes aimed at fighting misinformation in real time – and critics say they failed.
    YouTube apologised for the mistake, saying its systems “sometimes make the wrong call”. Other aspects performed better: a search for Notre Dame is automatically recognised as a search for a news event, pushing videos from legitimate news agencies to the top of the results.
    But that has failed to stop misinformation about the fire from raging on the video-sharing site and elsewhere. One video of the flames, with 36,000 views, has had the audio edited to suggest that Islamic observers were crying “Allahu akbar” (“God is great”), in celebration. Another zooms in on a figure apparently wearing a high-vis vest and hard-hat, captioning it as a “Muslim at Notre Dame”.
    Those claims have been accompanied by others, spread in the comments on YouTube, Facebook and Twitter, and on “independent” media sites, that attempt to suggest the fire was deliberately set. One said it was “suspicious” that “officials have stated there was no work being done and the cathedral was empty”; another, since deleted, tweet claimed to be from someone who knew an employee at the church, and said they had been told it was an act of arson.

    Those suspicious were added to by tweets from accounts purporting to be news outlets like CNN and Fox News, claiming that the fire was caused by “an act of terrorism”, and spreading false claims about the reaction of American congresswoman Ilhan Omar.

    Paris public prosecutor Rémy Heitz said on Tuesday that “nothing indicates” the Notre Dame blaze, which brought the iconic building’s towering spire and roof crashing down, “was a voluntary act”. The cathedral had been undergoing intensive restoration work which firefighters said could be linked to the inferno, investigators said.


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    #6
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    George Soros paid David Hogg to drive a bus full of immigants to plant nano termites. The vaults contained the secret of Angela Merkel’s parentage, so it had to be destroyed.


    https://themikerothschild.com/2019/04/08/angela-merkel-hitler-daughter/


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    #7
    DJIMI TRARORE
    Registered Users Posts: 3,558 ✭✭✭DJIMI TRARORE


    It was either Muslims, Travellers or those naughty Prods:):):)


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    #8
    is_that_so
    Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Alien ship, innit?


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    #9
    jeremyj1968
    Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭jeremyj1968


    It's too early to decide anything. The only thing that is slightly odd is that the media are reporting that it is definitely not arson, and most likely an accident. I wonder do they protest too much. I mean how do they know what it is at this stage? If I were the builders I don't think I'd be happy at being basically accused before any investigation has been done.

    Very sad no matter what happened.


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    #10
    Charles Ingles
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,181 ✭✭✭Charles Ingles


    I think it was deliberately started without a doubt, just another way to attack the fabric of society


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    #11
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Charles Ingles wrote: »
    I think it was deliberately started without a doubt, just another way to attack the fabric of society

    Because creating conspiracy theories about how everyone is out to get us does wonders for the fabric of society.


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    #12
    Augme
    Registered Users Posts: 5,095 ✭✭✭Augme


    jeremyj1968 wrote: »
    It's too early to decide anything. The only thing that is slightly odd is that the media are reporting that it is definitely not arson, and most likely an accident. I wonder do they protest too much. I mean how do they know what it is at this stage? If I were the builders I don't think I'd be happy at being basically accused before any investigation has been done.

    Very sad no matter what happened.


    They are saying it because the fire services have said it. People in authority will often know before an official investigation is completed and signed off on.


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    #13
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 75,290 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Augme wrote: »
    They are saying it because the fire services have said it. People in authority will often know before an official investigation is completed and signed off on.
    They were suggesting it was started where workmen were actually working at the time. If that's the case they have eye-witnesses to tell them how they thought it started. Could be as stupid as someone having a sneaky fag and not extinguishing it properly


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    #14
    c.p.w.g.w
    Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    The speed of the fire I think is the only thing that seems strange...also the fact that this is the 11th church fire in 2019 in france


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    #15
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    c.p.w.g.w wrote: »
    The speed of the fire I think is the only thing that seems strange...also the fact that this is the 11th church fire in 2019 in france

    That, and the fact that the fire brigade and authorities didn’t really seem to bother too much…


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    #16
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    That, and the fact that the fire brigade and authorities didn’t really seem to bother too much…

    How didn’t they? So are they in league with muslim arsonists or the deep state/planet?


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    #17
    pummice
    Registered Users Posts: 241 ✭✭pummice


    Quasimodo's Revenge


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    #18
    Charles Ingles
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,181 ✭✭✭Charles Ingles


    Christianity is under attack in Europe I've no doubt it was arson


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    #19
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    Ipso wrote: »
    How didn’t they? So are they in league with muslim arsonists or the deep state/planet?

    I wouldn’t know…what I do know is what I saw, i.e. the minimal fire-fighting effort that was made, like two or so hoses used on the roof more like symbolically…I have seen many roofs on fire over the years, and that’s definitely not how you do it…and they arrived much too late, there was clearly no plan in place for such an emergency at Notre Dame…which is worrying…


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    #20
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    I wouldn’t know…

    Let’s leave it there.


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    #21
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    Ipso wrote: »
    Let’s leave it there.

    so all is grand once again…


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    #22
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,405 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Charles Ingles wrote: »
    Christianity is under attack in Europe I've no doubt it was arson

    And this right here is why these threads (rightly) belong in this forum:rolleyes:


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    #23
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,775 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    so all is grand once again…

    There were up to 400 firefighters involved in tackling the blaze

    Just because some people on the internet with no clue about firefighting have decided they didn't see enough "big hoses spraying water on it" doesn't mean they know the first thing about the effort involved and complexity of fighting such a blaze under those conditions

    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/04/15/europe/firefighters-notre-dame-intl/index.html


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    #24
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    so all is grand once again…

    No, all is not grand. But staying in the realm of reality would be grander. I have no idea how the fire started, but because someone has an iphone and an internet connection doesn’t mean they are experts in every major event that happens.


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    #25
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    Ipso wrote: »
    No, all is not grand. But staying in the realm of reality would be grander. I have no idea how the fire started, but because someone has an iphone and an internet connection doesn’t mean they are experts in every major event that happens.

    Is there a good reason for the Paris fire brigade to not have a fire ladder big enough to reach even the main roof of Notre Dame? I am not even talking about some weird conspiracy, just about neglect and failure at the highest level…


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    #26
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    Is there a good reason for the Paris fire brigade to not have a fire ladder big enough to reach even the main roof of Notre Dame? I am not even talking about some weird conspiracy, just about neglect and failure at the highest level…

    Of course you’re not talking about a conspiracy. just asking questions, amirite?


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    #27
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,405 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    Is there a good reason for the Paris fire brigade to not have a fire ladder big enough to reach even the main roof of Notre Dame? I am not even talking about some weird conspiracy, just about neglect and failure at the highest level…

    Dublin fire brigade wouldn't be able to reach the top of liberty hall (not that liberty hall would be a great loss) how high do you think fire ladders should reach?


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    #28
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,775 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Wayne Gorsky wrote: »
    Is there a good reason for the Paris fire brigade to not have a fire ladder big enough to reach even the main roof of Notre Dame? I am not even talking about some weird conspiracy, just about neglect and failure at the highest level…

    Why do you immediately suspect failure and neglect? We don't really have all the details yet but it sounds like you think you actually know more about tackling that specific type of blaze than the Paris fire department...


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    #29
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Beasty wrote: »
    They were suggesting it was started where workmen were actually working at the time. If that's the case they have eye-witnesses to tell them how they thought it started. Could be as stupid as someone having a sneaky fag and not extinguishing it properly

    However reports in the French media said there wasn't any work taking place at the time the blaze began because workmen had finished for the day.

    A spokesman for the Cathedral said: "At this moment we don't know how the fire started. There shouldn't have been any workmen on the site because they stop between 17:00 and 17:30...

    With workers supposed to have finished for the day it appears they were all off site by the time the fire broke out.

    https://www.thelocal.fr/20190415/do-we-know-how-the-notre-dame-fire-started

    If that was the case - it must have been from something which happened before they all went home ...

    Though I cant see someone owning up to having the sneaky fag tbh


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    #30
    Wayne Gorsky
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭Wayne Gorsky


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Dublin fire brigade wouldn't be able to reach the top of liberty hall (not that liberty hall would be a great loss) how high do you think fire ladders should reach?

    Well, there are fire ladders on the market that could easily reach high enough for anything at Notre Dame, and you’d think a city like Paris would have some sort of contingency plan (and the equipment) in place for an emergency at one of its (and the world’s) main icons (also because, as opposed to liberty hall, it would be a loss)…
    oh, and, as some around here seem to be experts in putting out cathedral fires, what should they have done? Fact is, there was no major effort made to put out the fire on the roof at all…two or three hoses were never going to cut it…and yes, they probably arrived too late anyway, which poses its own set of questions…


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    #31
    jeremyj1968
    Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭jeremyj1968


    Augme wrote: »
    They are saying it because the fire services have said it.

    But the point still holds. Have they carried out a full forensic investigation already?? They were certainly quicker coming to that conclusion than they were actually getting to the fire!


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