Footage or pictures to media, papers etc.

Kramer · 24-03-2019 6:39pm #1

Can't locate an answer to this.
Is it possible to contact media to offer footage or pictures of an incident (in public), that would be of public interest?
GDPR issues etc. aside, is it through an agency or is it possible to contact media directly?
One would assume media would want to examine the footage first, what would then stop them using said footage, profiting from it & not paying for it?

magicbastarder · 24-03-2019 6:42pm

Kramer wrote: »

One would assume media would want to examine the footage first, what would then stop them using said footage, profiting from it & not paying for it?

copyright law, it's not theirs to use if they don't own copyright or have not agreed use with the owner (whether for payment or not).

davegilly · 24-03-2019 9:08pm

Contact media outlets directly - numbers are on their website. Do it immediately as news gets old really quickly. Tell them what you have and they will tell you if they are interested or not. If they use it you will get paid when you invoice them.

Unless it's something really exclusive then you will be paid their standard rates for publication.

Pablo_Flox · 26-03-2019 6:10pm

Purely hypothetically, if you had photos of a crime being committed and it was used on crime call, would you be able to send RTE an invoice? Just something that popped into my head. I assume that you still own the copyright to the images?

twowheelsonly · 28-03-2019 12:40am

Pablo_Flox wrote: »

Purely hypothetically, if you had photos of a crime being committed and it was used on crime call, would you be able to send RTE an invoice? Just something that popped into my head. I assume that you still own the copyright to the images?

Eeney, Meeney, Miney, Mo.....but I'd say no. Personally I'd look on it more like Public Service / Civic Duty as in the first instance you'd be supplying them to the Gardaí to help them with their enquiries and it would be their call to use them as possible evidence.

Having said that... I don't honestly know the answer but I wouldn't be charging for that.

Now if RTE were to use them in a documentary or such...… Ching Ching !!!

Irishphotodesk · 11-04-2019 10:55pm

Kramer wrote: »

Can't locate an answer to this.
Is it possible to contact media to offer footage or pictures of an incident (in public), that would be of public interest?
GDPR issues etc. aside, is it through an agency or is it possible to contact media directly?
One would assume media would want to examine the footage first, what would then stop them using said footage, profiting from it & not paying for it?

Apologies for slow reply, it took a while to get registered so I could comment.

Yes, it is possible to contact media to offer footage or pics of an incident, often members of the public get paid for this, there are companies like storyful, who trawl the internet trying to find and licence “stories” so they can resell them to media outlets and give the person that was in the right place at the right time a few quid (I’m not a fan of the business model of not properly* paying the person who happened to capture the image/video) ...but sometimes people are happy with the knowledge that their video has been seen by thousands or hundreds of thousands)
Companies like this tend to have a network of media outlets to distribute and often they need to do verification checks before the clip/image is distributed.

There are a few ways to distribute newsworthy footage/images - the amount you can make depends on the footage/image and its newsworthiness, there’s no point in trying to sell/distribute a fresh image of last weeks aintree winning horse because it was last weeks story, if the horse was involved in an accident and you had pics, then it’s a fresh news story.

GDPR doesn’t apply to editorial images, but some images would be not used on moral grounds or ethical grounds.

With regards your final comment on them receiving the footage and choosing to use it and not pay - this would rarely happen, and should never happen.
Yes, they would receive the image/video prior to them publishing it in their paper or on their website and they would make the decision to use or not use, if they use - they must pay, often you should try negotiate a fee for usage prior to sending it into them and also negotiate a fee for exclusivity - if you are only dealing with one publication.

A freelance photographer will often send out the image and check the next day to find out if anything was published and if so they will invoice for their normal fee.

I’m happy to help if you (or others) have other questions.

CelticRambler · 15-04-2019 4:43pm

Out of interest, what would be a typical "standard rate" or "normal fee" for publication in a local or national newspaper? I've only once been in someone else's wrong place/wrong time with a camera to hand and a perfect vantage point, and didn't do anything with the image (other than post it here on boards.ie a long time later :pac: ). But it'd be nice to know for future reference whether such an image would at least pay for a dinner out.

Irishphotodesk · 15-04-2019 6:22pm

Different photographers/publications have their own rates and agreements, as a general guide an image in a national paper is worth about €70.

With the introduction of online news sites, a photojournalist should expect the same rate for usage online and in print (they are different media and appeal to different audiences), however in real world applications, most online publications try to avoid paying or try to negotiate lesser fees for online(despite them having larger reach), most photographers that I know tend to be happy with €50 for online usage, it’s a difficult thing to monitor/get money from.

Recently I found a radio website with one of my images - they are going to receive a bill for €1000 soon outlining that failure to pay will result in the matter going to my solicitors, the reason I charge such crazy amounts for a single image is because it’s a lot of hassle and they used the image without permission (if they had asked for usage it would be €50 but I have a serious dislike to someone stealing an image an using it online)

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-04-2019 10:53am

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

Different photographers/publications have their own rates and agreements, as a general guide an image in a national paper is worth about €70.

With the introduction of online news sites, a photojournalist should expect the same rate for usage online and in print (they are different media and appeal to different audiences), however in real world applications, most online publications try to avoid paying or try to negotiate lesser fees for online(despite them having larger reach), most photographers that I know tend to be happy with €50 for online usage, it’s a difficult thing to monitor/get money from.

Recently I found a radio website with one of my images - they are going to receive a bill for €1000 soon outlining that failure to pay will result in the matter going to my solicitors, the reason I charge such crazy amounts for a single image is because it’s a lot of hassle and they used the image without permission (if they had asked for usage it would be €50 but I have a serious dislike to someone stealing an image an using it online)

Thanks for your posting knowledge of this area.

I had a photo in a national physical irish paper and online. I got paid.The paymen was in line wth your examples.

When the case was appealed they used my image online again. Not sure about physical paper.

Should I be paid again? Is there a separate payment for online and offline, two payments if both used?

Can you suggest wording when sending in photos. Should you say pay per use or pay per offline/online use

I have had a few photos published. I find if they are not used no reply is made. Or they may be used a couple weeks later for some other purpose like illustrating a columnist. I would have missed one but someone told me they saw it. Is this usual?

If you have footage how do you send it as is too big to email. What is the usual practice

Thanks

CelticRambler · 18-04-2019 11:09am

As regards the last question, I would imagine the easiest (and safest) way to offer footage would be to upload a low-res version to somewhere like dropbox, then e-mail a link to the news outlet, to include a brief description of the incident/perspective on same, and specifying the resolution/format of the original clip.

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-04-2019 1:28pm

CelticRambler wrote: »

As regards the last question, I would imagine the easiest (and safest) way to offer footage would be to upload a low-res version to somewhere like dropbox, then e-mail a link to the news outlet, to include a brief description of the incident/perspective on same, and specifying the resolution/format of the original clip.

low res? any i have seen are high res

CelticRambler · 18-04-2019 2:09pm

Yes, low-res for evaluation purposes. That makes it accessible to would-be purchasers, but stops anyone from stealing the better quality footage.

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-04-2019 2:20pm

CelticRambler wrote: »

Yes, low-res for evaluation purposes. That makes it accessible to would-be purchasers, but stops anyone from stealing the better quality footage.

there would not be time for that in todays media. Have you done this?. anyway i have never been ripped off. had to chase payment once. and i did not claim fo the second use mentioned above

Irishphotodesk · 18-04-2019 7:06pm

Naya Substantial Chickenpox wrote: »

Thanks for your posting knowledge of this area.

I had a photo in a national physical irish paper and online. I got paid.The paymen was in line wth your examples.

When the case was appealed they used my image online again. Not sure about physical paper.

Should I be paid again? Is there a separate payment for online and offline, two payments if both used?

Can you suggest wording when sending in photos. Should you say pay per use or pay per offline/online use

I have had a few photos published. I find if they are not used no reply is made. Or they may be used a couple weeks later for some other purpose like illustrating a columnist. I would have missed one but someone told me they saw it. Is this usual?

If you have footage how do you send it as is too big to email. What is the usual practice

Thanks

Every time your image appears in print or online you are entitled to receive a payment, online or in print - the rate is up to you - some photojournalists don’t charge for online others charge same rate as print and others again will charge a different rate than print, it generally comes down to your agreement or willingness to monitor usage and send in an invoice.

I have argued with pic editors over the years RE: the online versus print usage, it’s a different format in my eyes, the usual argument I put forward is.... if I was placing an advert for online only, I get charged a rate, if I place an advert for print edition only I get charged a rate, if I want to place an advert both print and online, the newspaper will charge me money - so why can’t they pay for it.

Same argument works for multiple usage ie. on different days, if the paper publishes my pic on a Tuesday - I charge a fee, if they use it on a Wednesday - I charge a fee, it’s a different edition of the newspaper, so in answer to your question about a second usage - yes, you can/should invoice for this.

I estimated in the past that I might miss out on about €4/5k a year across all the papers by not checking them all religiously, it’s a tough balance between the time/cost required to go through the newspapers in a shop (or to purchase them all), many shops get annoyed and don’t want people standing there flicking through newspapers.... these days my freelance images are not as popular and I’m not out shooting as much so I’m happy to miss out on whatever is published that I don’t see/find.

In 2016 the star used an image that I took and sent out to all the papers in 2012, they used it twice in the same week because the person was in the news, it was just luck that I spotted it and invoiced for it, I have no idea how many times they have used it since or before - if that person is in the news again I will check and see if it’s been used.

There is no point in trying to dictate terms (ie. No online usage/print only) if they are restricted in usage they are less likely to use, similarly with pricing if you are charging €150 per image it means they will be selective with when they use your images, however if you are charging less than average rate you risk devaluing the industry and ultimately making it more difficult for future photographers to earn a living, also, I wouldn’t expect any newspaper to contact me if they were using my images, open a paper and count how many images are used, chances are it’s reasonably high and contacting each photographer would be time wasted for the newspaper, if you want the money you have to do the work lol.

As regards large files (ie. Video) I don’t do video, but other photojournalists use we transfer/Dropbox or FTP (file transfer protocol) a link into the pic desk where video or pics can be dropped, it’s a modern day version of the ISDN lines from the 90s.

Irishphotodesk · 18-04-2019 7:12pm

Should also add multiple usage in a newspaper, if a pic is used twice in same edition. (For example page 6 and page 13) the normal thing to do would be first usage is normal fee, second usage would be half rate.

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-04-2019 8:26pm

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

Every time your image appears in print or online you are entitled to receive a payment, online or in print - the rate is up to you - some photojournalists don’t charge for online others charge same rate as print and others again will charge a different rate than print, it generally comes down to your agreement or willingness to monitor usage and send in an invoice.

I have argued with pic editors over the years RE: the online versus print usage, it’s a different format in my eyes, the usual argument I put forward is.... if I was placing an advert for online only, I get charged a rate, if I place an advert for print edition only I get charged a rate, if I want to place an advert both print and online, the newspaper will charge me money - so why can’t they pay for it.

Same argument works for multiple usage ie. on different days, if the paper publishes my pic on a Tuesday - I charge a fee, if they use it on a Wednesday - I charge a fee, it’s a different edition of the newspaper, so in answer to your question about a second usage - yes, you can/should invoice for this.

I estimated in the past that I might miss out on about €4/5k a year across all the papers by not checking them all religiously, it’s a tough balance between the time/cost required to go through the newspapers in a shop (or to purchase them all), many shops get annoyed and don’t want people standing there flicking through newspapers.... these days my freelance images are not as popular and I’m not out shooting as much so I’m happy to miss out on whatever is published that I don’t see/find.

In 2016 the star used an image that I took and sent out to all the papers in 2012, they used it twice in the same week because the person was in the news, it was just luck that I spotted it and invoiced for it, I have no idea how many times they have used it since or before - if that person is in the news again I will check and see if it’s been used.

There is no point in trying to dictate terms (ie. No online usage/print only) if they are restricted in usage they are less likely to use, similarly with pricing if you are charging €150 per image it means they will be selective with when they use your images, however if you are charging less than average rate you risk devaluing the industry and ultimately making it more difficult for future photographers to earn a living, also, I wouldn’t expect any newspaper to contact me if they were using my images, open a paper and count how many images are used, chances are it’s reasonably high and contacting each photographer would be time wasted for the newspaper, if you want the money you have to do the work lol.

As regards large files (ie. Video) I don’t do video, but other photojournalists use we transfer/Dropbox or FTP (file transfer protocol) a link into the pic desk where video or pics can be dropped, it’s a modern day version of the ISDN lines from the 90s.

There is no point in trying to dictate terms (ie. No online usage/print only) if they are restricted in usage they are less likely to use, similarly with pricing if you are charging €150 per image it means they will be selective with when they use your images

OK so what would you say when sending in the images.? Or would you not say anything and just invoice when they are published? But what would you invoice for? Going rate? Could you put up a mock invoice to an imaginery paper

Great info. Thanks. If you have anymore please post

Irishphotodesk · 18-04-2019 9:33pm

I have been in photojournalism for around 20ish years, I don’t say anything, although, I have recently put a note into the images stating that unauthorized usage is subject to a €10,000 fee, it’s only going to be used in the event that someone illegally uses my work and I know they have the means to pay.

I put the details of who is in the pic and the details of what’s happening in the pic and my copyright/contact info.

Afraid I don’t have any invoices on my iPad, I only access boards on iPad.(so I manage to restrict my time online and don’t loose too much time)

In general, invoice will have, my name/address, newspaper name/address, date and my reference number of invoice and my newspaper account number/reference.

Details of images printed:
Page number, persons name (headline of story pic was attached to) and fee.

Payment details (bank account/iban & bic)

The sun are one of the exceptions to the rule in that they pay space rate, the amount paid is dependent on the size of the image (I have accepted their terms) so a postage stamp size pic is worth about €35 and a half page is worth about €200, if you are a regular contributor there is no need to invoice them as they will deposit the money directly into your account, the mirror have tried to do this too but from my experience you need to follow up by email/phone to ensure money is coming.

7znbd9xmoiupye · 18-04-2019 10:29pm

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

I have been in photojournalism for around 20ish years, I don’t say anything, although, I have recently put a note into the images stating that unauthorized usage is subject to a €10,000 fee, it’s only going to be used in the event that someone illegally uses my work and I know they have the means to pay.

I put the details of who is in the pic and the details of what’s happening in the pic and my copyright/contact info.

Afraid I don’t have any invoices on my iPad, I only access boards on iPad.(so I manage to restrict my time online and don’t loose too much time)

In general, invoice will have, my name/address, newspaper name/address, date and my reference number of invoice and my newspaper account number/reference.

Details of images printed:
Page number, persons name (headline of story pic was attached to) and fee.

Payment details (bank account/iban & bic)

The sun are one of the exceptions to the rule in that they pay space rate, the amount paid is dependent on the size of the image (I have accepted their terms) so a postage stamp size pic is worth about €35 and a half page is worth about €200, if you are a regular contributor there is no need to invoice them as they will deposit the money directly into your account, the mirror have tried to do this too but from my experience you need to follow up by email/phone to ensure money is coming.

OK thanks for the info

7znbd9xmoiupye · 19-04-2019 1:41pm

I saw a potential nice of shot involving young child today. i would have had to ask the mother. In such a scenario would you tell the parent you are a photographer and you will be sending it to a paper.? Do you get any hassle about you being paid for their [childs] image?

Irishphotodesk · 19-04-2019 2:16pm

In general when kids are involved you would tell a parent that you are taking pics of people enjoying the sunshine etc , assuming it was such a scene, if they don’t want to have the pics sent the papers then say thanks and walk away.
If they are agreeable I will usually ask the parent for an email address so I can send on the pic to them, in the event that the paper doesn’t print it (I might send 10-15 images of people enjoying the sunshine and they might use 1)

Same goes for taking pics of fans outside Croke park for all Ireland semi final and finals - most people don’t have an issue with it.

As for sports events, newspapers are unlikely to want images from a random game unless they have an interest in it or have a journalist covering it, it’s generally assumed that if you are taking sports pics you are sent there by a paper or you have a connection to the club, many amateur photographers take sports images for their club website and often give or sell the images to the opposition clubs. (I have heard of this happening and the photographer getting €25-€50 per game - I don’t know if it’s true or not but don’t see why not, handy enough money for someone)

7znbd9xmoiupye · 19-04-2019 3:25pm

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

In general when kids are involved you would tell a parent that you are taking pics of people enjoying the sunshine etc , assuming it was such a scene, if they don’t want to have the pics sent the papers then say thanks and walk away.
If they are agreeable I will usually ask the parent for an email address so I can send on the pic to them, in the event that the paper doesn’t print it (I might send 10-15 images of people enjoying the sunshine and they might use 1)

Same goes for taking pics of fans outside Croke park for all Ireland semi final and finals - most people don’t have an issue with it.

As for sports events, newspapers are unlikely to want images from a random game unless they have an interest in it or have a journalist covering it, it’s generally assumed that if you are taking sports pics you are sent there by a paper or you have a connection to the club, many amateur photographers take sports images for their club website and often give or sell the images to the opposition clubs. (I have heard of this happening and the photographer getting €25-€50 per game - I don’t know if it’s true or not but don’t see why not, handy enough money for someone)

Great info. Thanks. But why would the opposition want the photos by a supporter of the other club?

Footage or pictures to media, papers etc.

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