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IS CE marking needed on everything?

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  • 07-02-2019 10:36am
    #1
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭


    Hi There,
    I was wondering if I needed to buy a CE marked laundry shoot, or could I just weld up one myself. THe engineer says that all the building materials need to be CE marked.

    Another thing, would be a small still frame to box out under an overhang, the steal frame would just be bolted to the concrete wall and covered with MDF and rendered over.
    Would that steal frame need CE marking too?


    Thanks


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    #2
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    Guy on this thread mentions in the first post that some people fabricate their own chute

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=68287303


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    #3
    BryanF
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 10,140 Mod ✭✭✭✭BryanF


    That post is almost ten years old - so prior to current CE requirements

    The steel work - yes this needs CE marking

    The Shute - I doubt there is a HEN applicable standard - assuming this no CE mark required


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    #4
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    Is that because it's considered structural? say you put some custom brackets up on the inside of your home, would they also need a CE mark? or is it just structural steel?

    Thanks again


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    #5
    Metric Tensor
    Registered Users Posts: 3,724 ✭✭✭Metric Tensor


    It's a tricky one ...

    All factory fabricated structural steel requires a CE Mark.

    If the structural steel is fabricated on site (not recommended) - then the fabricated structure does not require a CE Mark but the various steel components of it do require their own CE Mark if they're covered by the hEN standards.

    So in your case - if you buy a pre-made laundry chute the question is whether it is a "structural steel" item as per EN 1090. If it's "bolted to the wall" it could well be considered part of the structure - tough one to call. For example a railing on your balcony would be in a similar situation and would definitely be a structural item in my opinion!

    Also - by-the-by - the anchors to the wall should probably have ETAG CE Marking too and there's a specific HSA standard to make sure you design and choose the right size anhor to hold up the frame. It sounds over the top - but it's not because the whole unit could come down on someone's head if it's not fixed up right.


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    #6
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    Excellent answer, If I could only invent a time machine and go back just a few years before all this regulation :(
    Builders are telling me they won't connect anymore to the Sewers/water either. You need to be part of some 'connection' society apparently before you can apply for a road opening license....5K for a 2 meter connection...half the cost of the builder running all the drainage pipes...madness

    Better get building quick before they rule out self builds!

    ok rant over


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    #7
    dusteeroads
    Registered Users Posts: 79 ✭✭dusteeroads


    Install the chute after the engineers signs off. Take the responsibility yourself.
    Yeboyeah.


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    #8
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    Thanks. but that would be a bit of a pain in the hole to be honest, It penetrates an air tightness line, and the plasters and trades would be finished by then, It would be a unnecessary cleanup operation, I might just fork out the €800 for the 2M stainless chute and of course ;p install it myself.


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    #9
    have2flushtwice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,399 ✭✭✭have2flushtwice


    Put it in now, bolt it to the wall securely and it will be fine. There's no CE cert for a glorified downpipe. As long as the air tightness is up against it securely and there is no cold bridge created from fixings or bolts.
    The structure holds up the house. Is a fixing into the inner wall affecting the strucrure, such as a plaster slab fixing? The chute fixing is no difference, and to be clear on this, where is the chute going to go if it is contained and fitted correctly and securly.


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    #10
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    It's an internal wall, something like this
    Distance_of_Pipe_including_chute_drawing_PVC.jpg?raw=1


    But I was thinking of maybe just getting the Fireproof door for the landing, and then leaving it at that, Why do I need a tube anyway? THe boxed out frame is probably good enough to deliver clothes down the short drop, Why over-complicate things :)


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    #11
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    Another question on CE markings, I've found some lovely internal doors with manufactured framing for them too. Do the doors in a house need a CE mark? or would you get away with them not having it,

    I found this link, as I think this HEN covers internal doors "CEN/TC 33"

    https://ec.europa.eu/search/?queryText=CEN%2FTC+33&query_source=europa_default&filterSource=europa_default&swlang=en&more_options_language=en&more_options_f_formats=&more_options_date=


    But I can't make any sense out of it. Do you literally have to hand over a CE certificate for every product you have installed in your house to the certifying engineer?


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    #12
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,515 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    magnethead wrote: »
    Do you literally have to hand over a CE certificate for every product you have installed in your house to the certifying engineer?

    Yes, its possible.

    Have you got a link to the actual doors?
    The CE mark just means they meet a certain performance criteria and can be sold in that marketplace, the Declaration of Performance determines if they can be used in your specific situation.

    So in the case of internal doors, specifically fire doors, you would need every piece of paper.


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    #13
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    These are the guys I'd like to get the internal doors from
    https://www.dre.pl/en/

    and these are the guys I'm picking up the Firedoors from
    http://kmt.com.pl/en

    THe Firedoors will have all the bells and whistles (CE mark) but not the internal door company.....you said 'Yes it's possible'....but do they really look for a CE cert for every product? I can understand the construction steel, concrete etc...but what about my lampshades, sure;y they're not that bad!


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    #14
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    actually, there are some technical forms at the end of this page ....Something about EOTA (Hopefully that's a declaration of performance like you said)
    Once I have that, all's good?

    https://www.dre.pl/pl/do-pobrania

    https://www.dre.pl/images/files/aprobaty/KOT_2018-0633.pdf


    EDIT: the Cert directly above says it's "approved by the technical institute of Krakov" .. I guess that counts :)


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    #15
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,515 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Ask them for a copy of their fire test results and specific configuration.

    The fire test has to be Carried out in a European fire test house.
    Also ask for all the details on what ironmongery can be fitted to their doors and still comply with the fire test results. You can’t mix and match.

    PS. A lampshade is not a construction material. It’s a fitting or interior fitting. It should comply with relevant BS codes for ignition and surface spread of flame though.


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    #16
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    These are two separate companies now, I'm not worried about the firedoors, but I will get the answers to your questions.

    I'll double check with the internal door lads, if that's a declaration of performance, but it sure looks like it.

    This CE cert collection is becoming a serious PITA

    Thanks


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    #17
    magnethead
    Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭magnethead


    THanks Very much kceire , That was massively helpful. I checked today and the internal doors all have 'declarations of performance'

    Yey!! Ordered put through...


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