Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Issues with house rewire

  • 14-07-2019 5:58pm
    #1
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭


    I had a complete house rewire done recently and have a few concerns.

    Mainly being:

    The electrician drilled completely through a joist to hang a light bulb
    Diagonal wall chasing
    Exposed live wires in boiler room
    *pics attached*

    We chose him because he was a work connection of my partners and we had faith in him to do a great job, we had the job done off the books, no certs, bad move - probably but what’s done is done.

    We have contacted him regarding the above and he’s vehemently defending his work. He’s coming over tomorrow evening to discuss. We paid a lot of money for the job as we were promised top notch work.

    I’m by no means an expert on this but surely this is not good practice?

    Opinions appreciated

    Thanks


Comments

  • #2
    bfclancy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 181 ✭✭bfclancy


    That most certainly is not a roof joist by the appearance of it.
    Diagonal chase was necessary to avoid the existing switch above I'd imagine what other route could he take


  • #3
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    bfclancy wrote: »
    That most certainly is not a roof joist by the appearance of it.
    Diagonal chase was necessary to avoid the existing switch above I'd imagine what other route could he take

    Surely the light switch could have been placed differently?
    And it is a ceiling joist...


  • #4
    Larbre34
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,357 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I love the fact there is an embedded advert alerting to cowboy electricians in this thread.


  • #5
    Sharp MZ700
    Registered Users Posts: 673 ✭✭✭Sharp MZ700


    What is the brass switch for? Did he make that hole in the ceiling for access?


  • #6
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    Sharp MZ700 wrote: »
    What is the brass switch for? Did he make that hole in the ceiling for access?

    I imagine an old broadband/phone connection? Yes he made the hole for access


  • Advertisement
  • #7
    Sharp MZ700
    Registered Users Posts: 673 ✭✭✭Sharp MZ700


    katie275 wrote: »
    I imagine an old broadband/phone connection? Yes he made the hole for access

    Just saw that now. Hard to think he couldn't have used that chase already... Maybe it's old timber trunking inside but if it was plastic he could've swapped the two. The cabling in the second photo is worth a photo, for the scrapbook.


  • #8
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    If there is no certificate issued,then what way is the new distribution board connected into the meter.?


  • #9
    Tuco88
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,053 ✭✭✭Tuco88


    If thats a roof joist, I'd invest in a Carpenter.


  • #10
    olestoepoke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    bfclancy wrote: »
    That most certainly is not a roof joist by the appearance of it.
    Diagonal chase was necessary to avoid the existing switch above I'd imagine what other route could he take

    Where does the OP say it was a roof joist? Its a ceiling joist and if stepped on by any unsuspecting person could be very dangerous.


  • #11
    olestoepoke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    What were they thinking when they installed that light in the closet? Is that an exterior waterproof light? Those wires exposed like that can't be safe.


  • Advertisement
  • #12
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    olestoepoke wrote: »
    What were they thinking when they installed that light in the closet? Is that an exterior waterproof light? Those wires exposed like that can't be safe.

    Yes that's what I thought! Never seen anything like that before...
    Left over from another job perhaps?

    We are also having problems with several sockets, there is a lot of resistance even when plugging in brand new appliances, I mentioned this and showed him with my phone charger and he blamed the plug


  • #13
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    meercat wrote: »
    If there is no certificate issued,then what way is the new distribution board connected into the meter.?

    The old mains connection (30+ years old)
    My fault for not checking this out before agreeing to cash job but I wasn't aware of these consequences of going off the books


  • #14
    Suckler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,420 ✭✭✭Suckler


    katie275 wrote: »
    but I wasn't aware of these consequences of going off the books

    No sympathy. "cash job/going off the books" encourages substandard work and puts good tradespeople out of work.


  • #15
    EHP
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 173 ✭✭EHP


    Suckler wrote: »
    No sympathy. "cash job/going off the books" encourages substandard work and puts good tradespeople out of work.

    Have to agree no sympathy for both the op or the sparks that did the job. Cash job or not you can report to safe Electric as he legally has to cert that job no matter what.


  • #16
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    Suckler wrote: »
    No sympathy. "cash job/going off the books" encourages substandard work and puts good tradespeople out of work.

    Fair point, we paid 7k and certainly did not expect sub standard work.


  • #17
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    Mention to him that you'd like to get the work audited by Safe Electric.

    If he panics and offers to fix and certify you might come away good.

    If he freaks and disappears or tries to dissuade you he probably isn't a registered electrician.


  • #18
    Hibernicis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,620 ✭✭✭Hibernicis


    katie275 wrote: »
    The electrician drilled completely through a joist to hang a light bulb

    That’s not a hanging light bulb, it’s a recessed downlighter with no thermal barrier fitter. Some of those can get extremely hot, and in this case it is close to wood which of course is combustible.


  • #19
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    EHP wrote: »
    Have to agree no sympathy for both the op or the sparks that did the job. Cash job or not you can report to safe Electric as he legally has to cert that job no matter what.

    I agree
    A certificate should be provided. It’s a requirement and the new tails should be connected into the esbn meter.
    This needs to be done now and it may lead to problems down the road as it’s not permissible to certify another electricians work.


  • #20
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    katie275 wrote: »
    The old mains connection (30+ years old)
    My fault for not checking this out before agreeing to cash job but I wasn't aware of these consequences of going off the books

    So your new installation is connected to old (and possibly undersized) cables. This is not the way it should be. I’d also wonder about where the neutralised earth is connected. Any photos of cables where they are terminated at meter
    You really do need a certificate.
    To have this job done officially may not have cost you much more tbh.


  • #21
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    What came over you to think that you could just not bother having the work certified?
    You lined youself up for a world of hassle!

    What if there was an electrical fire and the insurance company asks for evidence of the certificaition of the electrics?
    What if you are selling the house in future and the buyer asks for the certification?

    Did you have a temperature when you made this deal?


  • Advertisement
  • #22
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Mod note:
    The OP should have used a REC, but didn’t. Everyone is clear on that now, so let’s take move on. From now on posts should be aimed at assisting the OP with resolving the situation rather than giving the OP a hard time.

    Thank you.


  • #23
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    Ok fair enough.

    Well op if you want the electrician to fix things it really comes down to whether if you have paid them yet?

    If not you have leverage against them.

    You need to demand from them that the brief has changed, you now require the work certified without any exception.
    If he fails to agree to this then you'll be getting on to Safe Electric. You are obliged to do this anyway if you are aware of uncertified or substandard work being carried out.


  • #24
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    We went uncertified because we had another huge unexpected expense and had to review our budget. It's not like we paid buttons, we paid 7k cash and have paid in full.
    At the time the only implication we could think of was house insurance and spark said the way to get around is to say the house was rewired when we bought it.
    Of course in hindsight we would do it all officially.
    Also, he is a registered electrician and is an electrical instructor as his 9-5, we really thought we were in good hands


  • #25
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    katie275 wrote: »
    We went uncertified because we had another huge unexpected expense and had to review our budget. It's not like we paid buttons, we paid 7k cash and have paid in full.
    At the time the only implication we could think of was house insurance and spark said the way to get around is to say the house was rewired when we bought it.
    Of course in hindsight we would do it all officially.
    Also, he is a registered electrician and is an electrical instructor as his 9-5, we really thought we were in good hands

    Tell him you now understand the implications of not having a certificate and require one.
    It may cost extra but that’s the only way to proceed now.


  • #26
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    You can check if he’s on the list of contractors

    https://safeelectric.ie/


  • #27
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    meercat wrote: »
    You can check if he’s on the list of contractors

    https://safeelectric.ie/

    Thanks for that, he's not listed but website says:
    As enrolment on the public website is not required, not all RECs may be searchable.

    Will ask him this evening about getting certs issued now


  • #28
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    TheBoyConor wrote: »
    What came over you to think that you could just not bother having the work certified?
    You lined youself up for a world of hassle!

    What if there was an electrical fire and the insurance company asks for evidence of the certificaition of the electrics?
    What if you are selling the house in future and the buyer asks for the certification?

    Did you have a temperature when you made this deal?
    Its easy to be all knowing in hindsight, from the op point of view


  • #29
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,757 ✭✭✭meercat


    katie275 wrote: »
    Thanks for that, he's not listed but website says:
    As enrolment on the public website is not required, not all RECs may be searchable.

    Will ask him this evening about getting certs issued now

    You can phone them and ask if he’s a member.
    As others have said ,it’s a criminal offence to carry out such work if he’s not registered and to portray himself as a registered contractor.
    Ask him for his registration number and also his qc number
    A quick google search about unregistered electrical contractors will bring up some prosecutions and also a jail sentence


  • #30
    TheBoyConor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,292 ✭✭✭TheBoyConor


    Your only option now is to have it all certified since you know about the requirement to certify. If something goes wrong in future and someone is injured or something then pleasing ignorance is gone because you knowingly and deliberately carried on with an certified installation.


  • Advertisement
  • #31
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Suckler wrote: »
    No sympathy. "cash job/going off the books" encourages substandard work and puts good tradespeople out of work.

    Thankfully, becoming a registered contractor eliminates cowboy work from the cowboy electrician when he registers, and any journeymen he may hire.


  • #32
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    katie275 wrote: »
    Also, he is a registered electrician

    Hold on, the electrician that you employed is a registered electrical contractor? If so that changes everything, please confirm.

    If this is the case it would mean that you are in a much stronger position and can get a proper competition certificate and the REC can be held accountable. The fact that a bit of a tax dodge may have occurred is neither here nor there in terms of enforcing electrical standards.


  • #33
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Regarding the pictures in the 1st post, in my opinion:

    Photo #1 - Unacceptable regardless of whether the ceiling joist is of structural significance or not. I would want the joist properly repaired and the light moved.

    Photo #2 - Looks a bit shoddy. However I don't see anything dangerous.

    Photo #3 - This would be the least of my worries. As already stated he was avoiding the item above the new switch.


  • #34
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    2011 wrote: »
    Regarding the pictures in the 1st post, in my opinion:

    Photo #1 - Unacceptable regardless of whether the ceiling joist is of structural significance or not. I would want the joist properly repaired and the light moved.

    We can't be absolutely certain of what it's for though. Just as an example, if it was originally just a ground for a pendant, it's serving no function if pendant is removed.

    That's the thing with single photos of an installation, assumptions are made.


  • #35
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Bruthal wrote: »
    We can't be absolutely certain of what it's for though.

    It looks like a joist and the OP refers to it a a joist...


  • #36
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    2011 wrote: »
    It looks like a joist and the OP refers to it a a joist...
    Still assumptions though, that it looks like a joist. And that the op is accurately describing what they see.

    To me it looks like a flat piece of wood put in as a ground for a light. Looks about 20mm thick at most.

    But that's not my point. Point was assumptions are being used to claim someone is a cowboy.


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    handlemaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    I am no electrician but that work looks awful


  • #38
    Risteard81
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    I don't agree that the diagonal run is acceptable. It patently isn't. If a switch etc. needed to be avoided then other wiring methods should have been employed, for example earthed steel conduit. There isn't any excuse for what wad done. Second picture is messy but doesn't seem dangerous. First one is appalling.

    With respect, if he is a full-time lecturer then he won't be a REC. That wouldn't remotely make sense.


  • #39
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    First one is appalling.

    Doesn't look great. But if it was existing pendant fitting and a ground to support it, it wouldnt be serving much purpose. But if just drilled through it blindly, not good.
    Fitting itself not great either.

    Not that I know what's going on there.

    If that's a joist, get the carpenter back.


  • #40
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Point was assumptions are being used to claim someone is a cowboy.

    Very true.

    It would be interesting to have it confirmed whether it is a REC or not.
    Certainly sounds like it is a REC.


  • #41
    Risteard81
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    2011 wrote: »
    Bruthal wrote: »
    Point was assumptions are being used to claim someone is a cowboy.

    Very true.

    It would be interesting to have it confirmed whether it is a REC or not.
    Certainly sounds like it is a REC.
    Sounds to me that it's not a REC. We were told that the person in question is a full-time lecturer.


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    Sounds to me that it's not a REC.

    In this post the OP suggests otherwise:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110696931&postcount=24

    It is possible to be an instructor and a REC at the same time.


  • #43
    katie275
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭katie275


    Thanks for the feedback all.
    Just an update and clarifying some points here
    The hole was drilled through the ceiling joist to install spot lights in the kitchen, he had intended to ‘sister’ the joint and forgot, he was extremely apologetic and is coming out tomorrow to rectify this
    He assures the cables in the closet are safe, to quote he ‘could do chin ups on those’ but he’s going to hide them / box them in
    When I challenged him about the horizontal chase he said it was because he had to chase that way after performing a metal detection test, still not convinced on that one but it’s done now
    We are going to get the work certified


  • #44
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 54,091 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Did he explain why he put the light in that position in the first photo? Seems odd to go to the extra effort of having to cut the joist.


  • #45
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    katie275 wrote: »
    The hole was drilled through the ceiling joist to install spot lights in the kitchen, he had intended to ‘sister’ the joint and forgot, he was extremely apologetic and is coming out tomorrow to rectify this

    Fair enough.
    He assures the cables in the closet are safe

    I would believe him.
    When I challenged him about the horizontal chase he said it was because he had to chase that way after performing a metal detection test, still not convinced on that one but it’s done now

    As I said, I wouldn't be particularly worried in this instance.
    We are going to get the work certified

    How? Is the electrician a registered electrical contractor?


  • #46
    olestoepoke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Still assumptions though, that it looks like a joist. And that the op is accurately describing what they see.

    To me it looks like a flat piece of wood put in as a ground for a light. Looks about 20mm thick at most.

    But that's not my point. Point was assumptions are being used to claim someone is a cowboy.

    This post is nonsense


  • #47
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    olestoepoke wrote: »
    This post is nonsense

    Possibly. I'm just not as perfect in UK English as one or 2 others here


  • #48
    olestoepoke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    Bruthal wrote: »
    Possibly. But it would in some cases be easy for someone to take pics of a half finished job and claim anything they want.

    What length width and depth is the joist in that photo?

    Not possibly it was a non-sensical post


  • #49
    gctest50
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    katie275 wrote: »
    .................

    When I challenged him about the horizontal chase he said it was because he had to chase that way after performing a metal detection test, still not convinced on that one but it’s done now
    ............

    katie275 wrote: »
    .................

    after performing a metal detection test,

    That'd be the metal telephone socket just above it ?

    :p

    Did he put "Metal Detection Test" on the invoice ?


    One way was remove to the phone socket & its wiring and run the conduit for light switch up in a straightish line vertically like a civilised human


  • #50
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Mod note:

    Thread cleaned up.
    To avoid further derailing this thread the discussion on testing and verification is continued here.


Advertisement