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Munster Team Talk Thread - Snymans are(n't) Forever

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    #2732
    twinytwo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,168 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    kingofthekong wrote: »
    Agree with this, theres a massive over estimation and overating of Munster players by Munster fans

    If you go through the team there is a lot of out of form and stale older players who are fine for the pro14 but will never bee good enough to compete in Europe no matter what coach you have...

    Fact is your squad isn't that good and the players that used to be world class are no longer world class and there has been no talent developed from the academy and brought in to fill the gaps and push out older under performing players..

    This has been coming for a few seasons now and is starting to roost, the top teams in Europe which munster used to be are: Buying in the highest quality players from elsewhere and/or bringing through and developing high quality players from their academy --- Munster have done neither in the past couple years and this is the result.

    Munster have been heavily reliant on certain players the last number of years and these players are no longer the players they used to be: Murray, POM etc

    Munster can fix this by purchasing players like Snyman, De allende and bringing through talent like O'sullivan, Hodnett, Casey, Healy, Ahern, Flannery, Wren, French -- developing these guys needs to be a priority,

    Munster are already starting to see the fruits of giving Loughman a shout but one or two isnt enough they need more and the above guys can turn things around.

    I mentioned 5 or 6 years ago that it would take Munster getting knocked out of Europe and not qualifying the next season before things would change.

    Not quite there yet but not far off. Same old wishy washy ****e that ruined cork hurling.


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    #2733
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    twinytwo wrote: »
    I mentioned 5 or 6 years ago that it would take Munster getting knocked out of Europe and not qualifying the next season before things would change.

    Not quite there yet but not far off. Same old wishy washy ****e that ruined cork hurling.

    Might not be worst thing in world long-term if that happened in order to reset and plan for seasons ahead. Look at Clermont now after winning Challenge Cup last season say . But don't see us not qualifying for Champions Cup next season unless things go drastically downhill.


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    #2734
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    aloooof wrote: »
    Didn't Sexton miss a number of kicks in the Oz game tho? And ROG came on and took over kicking duties and saw the game out. ROG also started the Italy game after that OZ game.

    I remember criticism at the time that every other country knew who their starting 10 was going in the RWC*, but even so I don't think it's as bad a call as you're making out.

    (*Except for France. Plus ca change...)

    Sexton still scored more points than Oz (9-6) so it's not like ROG bailed us out or anything. And plenty on here were calling the decision a terrible one prior to kick off. Our best performances of the year both came with Reddan and Sexton starting. They were then HEC winning half back pairing. They had steered us to a win over Australia. Starting Murray and ROG played into Welsh hands and plenty of us said so at the time.


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    #2735
    prawnsambo
    Registered Users Posts: 13,228 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    molloyjh wrote: »
    Sexton still scored more points than Oz (9-6) so it's not like ROG bailed us out or anything. And plenty on here were calling the decision a terrible one prior to kick off. Our best performances of the year both came with Reddan and Sexton starting. They were then HEC winning half back pairing. They had steered us to a win over Australia. Starting Murray and ROG played into Welsh hands and plenty of us said so at the time.
    A source of much frustration for many. Me included. It was like watching a guy playing poker, discarding two cards from a straight flush in order to get a pair of kings.


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    #2736
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    twinytwo wrote: »
    I mentioned 5 or 6 years ago that it would take Munster getting knocked out of Europe and not qualifying the next season before things would change.

    Not quite there yet but not far off. Same old wishy washy ****e that ruined cork hurling.

    It very nearly happened in 2016; we had to beat Scarlets on the final day to ensure we got 6th, and qualified.

    I still think this is a season of transition for Munster and JVG and the rest should be given until the end of next season. Having all the internationals for a full pre-season, and the potential additions of De Allende and Snyman, could make all the difference.


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    #2737
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    aloooof wrote: »
    It very nearly happened in 2016; we had to beat Scarlets on the final day to ensure we got 6th, and qualified.

    I still think this is a season of transition for Munster and JVG and the rest should be given until the end of next season. Having all the internationals for a full pre-season, and the potential additions of De Allende and Snyman, could make all the difference.

    Give them until Christmas. If it's still not working Munster will need to start the search for a replacement sooner rather than later. Dont end up in Leinsters situation having to scramble for a coach with a deadline of a few weeks! Let JVG see out the season obviously, but the call needs to be made before that.


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    #2738
    Brief_Lives
    Registered Users Posts: 2,909 ✭✭✭Brief_Lives


    Random thought, but does everyone think ROG will come to Munster?

    Coaches come and go.. Do you think ROG will want to leave? What's the plan there... Before even thinking he might accept a job here..


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    #2739
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    The province’s medical department have issued the following update ahead of the game.

    Tadhg Beirne underwent successful ankle surgery last week and has commenced rehabilitation.

    JJ Hanrahan and Tommy O’Donnell are both rehabbing well from hamstring injuries sustained against Leinster.

    Niall Scannell was removed with cramp against Ulster and has returned to training.

    Fineen Wycherley failed a HIA in Belfast and will follow RTP protocols.

    Andrew Conway was withdrawn as a precaution at half-time on Friday night with a neck complaint and will be reviewed as the week continues.

    In positive news, Kevin O’Byrne, Rhys Marshall and Darren Sweetnam will all be reintroduced to training this week.

    Continuing to rehab: Brian Scott (foot) Tyler Bleyendaal (neck), Ciaran Parker (calf).


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    #2740
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    Beaten to it


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    #2741
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Good news about KOB, Marshall and Sweetnam in fairness


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    #2742
    shootermacg
    Registered Users Posts: 4,834 ✭✭✭shootermacg


    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/636911310533296130/663818718358405141/Screenshot_20200106-185813__01.jpg

    When you thought it couldn't get any worse.


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    #2743
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Indo reporting Carbery has suffered a broken arm in training.

    Stick a fork in the season please.


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    #2744
    Onecoolcookie
    Registered Users Posts: 1,118 ✭✭✭Onecoolcookie


    https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/exclusive-joey-carbery-suffers-suspected-broken-arm-in-munster-training-session-38838546.html

    Can't catch a break (excuse the pun)


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    #2745
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Maybe I spoke too soon, this would be a disaster. https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/exclusive-joey-carbery-suffers-suspected-broken-arm-in-munster-training-session-38838546.html


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    #2746
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    Assuming the above is true, that is an absolute disaster
    Scannell at 10 vs Racing?


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    #2747
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    yerrahbah wrote: »
    Assuming the above is true, that is an absolute disaster
    Scannell at 10 vs Racing?

    Or Ben Healy.


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    #2748
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    Or Ben Healy.

    I thought of him, but hes very green.

    Away vs Racing in a must win game is asking a lot of him.

    I'd opt for Scannell myself


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    #2749
    LuckyGent88
    Registered Users Posts: 14,150 ✭✭✭✭LuckyGent88


    That is one hell of a disaster and just about sums up Munsters season.

    It was a hard enough task on Sunday with a full strength team but our chances are nearly impossible now.

    Anyway, still looking forward to the trip to Paris.


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    #2750
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Carbery not in the update at all but maybe they're waiting to see how bad it is first


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    #2751
    Squidgy Black
    Registered Users Posts: 21,609 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    That's a big blow. Just when there was good news about Scannell/Marshall/O'Byrne returning.

    Would be way too big of a step up for Healy to play in Racing in a pressure game like that. The only thing is, with JJ and Tyler out, who do you stick at 12? Farrell?


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    #2752
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    Confirmed by Munster rugby. Wrist Ligament injury and requires surgery


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    #2753
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Carbery not in the update at all but maybe they're waiting to see how bad it is first

    Scratch that. Updated with this: "After undergoing a scan, it has been confirmed that Joey Carbery sustained a wrist ligament injury in Friday night’s game against Ulster. The number 10 requires surgery and has been ruled out for the immediate future."


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    #2754
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    That’s an absolute killer for him. He has no luck.


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    #2755
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    yerrahbah wrote: »
    I thought of him, but hes very green.

    Away vs Racing in a must win game is asking a lot of him.

    I'd opt for Scannell myself

    I'd go for Healy because at this stage we're on a hiding to nothing. It's not just the injuries at 10 but we're light at hooker and Conway is now potentially out.


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    #2756
    Caranica
    Registered Users Posts: 10,039 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    I'd go for Healy because at this stage we're on a hiding to nothing. It's not just the injuries at 10 but we're light at hooker and Conway is now potentially out.

    Me too. Feck it, he's played there more recently than Scannell and trains at 10. I'd nearly throw Casey in there with him but some might think that reckless :D


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    #2757
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Presume a lbp loss v Racing and a tbp win v Ospreys wouldn't be enough to get 2nd? You'd probably fancy Saracens to beat Racing at home. But if Saracens lost, Munster would be in 2nd. Might not be enough to be in top 3 best runners-up but even if it was would be a tough away draw vs 1st, 2nd or 3rd


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    #2758
    aloooof
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,248 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    That's a sickener for Carbery, having no luck whatsoever with injuries. I'd go with Healy at this stage. The game is now almost (but not quite) a shot to nothing. May as well glean some experience experience from our young and promising 10 out of it. 


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    #2759
    Former Former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,728 ✭✭✭Former Former


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Presume a lbp loss v Racing and a tbp win v Ospreys wouldn't be enough to get 2nd? You'd probably fancy Saracens to beat Racing at home. But if Saracens lost, Munster would be in 2nd. Might not be enough to be in top 3 best runners-up but even if it was would be a tough away draw vs 1st, 2nd or 3rd

    If Racing win at the weekend, they'll have qualified as group winners before they go to Sarries. They're flaky on the road at the best of times but with nothing at stake, they'll be easy pickings for Saracens.

    Have to win this weekend.


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    #2760
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,661 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Former Former wrote: »
    If Racing win at the weekend, they'll have qualified as group winners before they go to Sarries. They're flaky on the road at the best of times but with nothing at stake, they'll be easy pickings for Saracens.

    Have to win this weekend.

    Yeah was thinking that, guess they would have incentive in order to finish best ranking they could but not a huge one. Can't be relying on teams to do us favours either.


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    #2761
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Yeah was thinking that, guess they would have incentive in order to finish best ranking they could but not a huge one. Can't be relying on teams to do us favours either.

    Leinster, Exeter and Toulouse are all on higher points than Racing so top seed is a long shot for them at this stage I reckon. Its win or bust this weekend for Munster.


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