Prime time last night Direct Provision

pearcider · 21-12-2018 1:25pm #1

It was sickening to see the so called debate between the minister Charlie Flanagan and some labour fella last night. Talk about echo chamber. Sums up all immigration debate All pro immigration virtue no questioning of why the hell we should be taking in uneducated men from third world countries when we are struggling to house our own citizens. It’s a joke.

Charlie well knows most of these asylum seekers are as fake as anything. Their stories are lies heaped upon lies. He let his mask slip when challenged by the presenter with the valid concerns of the villagers in the video segment who are just expected to take in hundreds of these uneducated Muslim men. He was basically how dare you question my authority. A bully of a man in charge of a horrible creepy government.

We are building up huge problems for the future and the lack of open debate is quite disturbing.

I also note thee horrendous double murder of two Danish girls in Morroco has been more or less buried by the liberal media in the West.

Video of the decapitation doing the rounds online. Haven’t watched it myself but to suggest they’re still trying to verify it is really pathetic.

https://m.independent.ie/world-news/africa/isil-link-to-tourist-murderers-37646957.html

Notwithstanding my objections to Westerners traveling to poor third world countries (to virtue signal lets be honest) in the first place (equivalent to a fat man sitting down to eat a surf and turf in front of a load of starving children) I feel once again that we are being forced into taking in immigrants who will not integrate and will make ghettoes in Ireland just like they have everywhere else.

Build the wall and build it high.

amcalester · 21-12-2018 1:27pm

pearcider wrote: »

Build the wall and build it high.

What the **** is a wall going to do? We’re on an island ffs.

endacl · 21-12-2018 1:28pm

amcalester wrote: »

What the **** is a wall going to do? We’re on an island ffs.

We could put advertising on it?

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 1:30pm

endacl wrote: »

We could put advertising on it?

Great idea. We could advertise those jobs that Irish people don't want so immigrants take them.

DontThankMe · 21-12-2018 1:32pm

It seems like there's a trend developing for borderline racist threads in after hours at the moment.

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

21-12-2018 1:37pm

pearcider wrote: »

Build the wall and build it high.

I agree, you're in need of an enclosure.

touts · 21-12-2018 1:38pm

There are a lot of Irish I'd **** out of the country before most of the immigrants we have. Being lazy, dangerous and good for nothing has nothing to do with race.

amcalester · 21-12-2018 1:38pm

Hey OP, how can the media simultaneously be burying the story of the murders in Morocco and also reporting on it?

OP: The media are burying this story.

OP posts link to the story in the media

Everyone else:

TheBlock · 21-12-2018 1:39pm

DontThankMe wrote: »

It seems like there's a trend developing for borderline racist threads in after hours at the moment.

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

Nothing borderline line about this one ...

Will I Am Not · 21-12-2018 1:39pm

DontThankMe wrote: »

It seems like there's a trend developing for borderline racist threads in after hours at the moment.

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

It would be great if people could have an adult discussion about the plus and minus points of our immigration situation but it inevitably turns into nazi/lefty mudslinging after a couple of posts.

The political and media echo chamber is a valid point but when you finish off with “build the wall and build it high” you kind of ruin any adult discussion before it even gets going :rolleyes:

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 1:41pm

Option 1. Ignore threads that you don't like.
Option 2. Debate and put your point across in aforementioned threads.
Option 3. Whinge (see below)

DontThankMe wrote: »

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

Deleted User wrote: »

I agree, you're in need of an enclosure.

Some sort of a camp, if you will. A place where people could really concentrate.

enricoh · 21-12-2018 1:57pm

23 months is the average time spent in direct provision now. Full access to social housing and social welfare after that.
Numbers are way up this year since they shortened the time spent in dp. Who could'a guessed that'd happen!

xckjoo · 21-12-2018 1:57pm

DontThankMe wrote: »

It seems like there's a trend developing for borderline racist threads in after hours at the moment.

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

Ya. And the worst of it is most of the extreme views (on either side) are clearly made up of poorly interpreted American sh1t posts that don't translate to this country.

Predictions for this thread:

The Leftie Conspiracy is out to take down the West
Some poster being accused of being a Nazi
Asylum seekers are stealing our jobs
Asylum seekers are sponges that don't work
Something something Leo Vardkars fault
Emotive posts with no factual backing that cry about how the "other side" are unable to see how things really are
Something complaining about Muslims that doesn't tie into anything
A lot of ranting about the "other side"
People assuming everyone that doesn't believe every ludicrous notion they have must be brainwashed or too stupid to see "reality"
These people will also be unable to rationally defend or discuss these "realities" (as they see them)

sk8erboii · 21-12-2018 2:02pm

xckjoo wrote: »

Ya. And the worst of it is most of the extreme views (on either side) are clearly made up of poorly interpreted American sh1t posts that don't translate to this country.

Predictions for this thread:
The Leftie Conspiracy is out to take down the West

Some poster being accused of being a Nazi

Asylum seekers are stealing our jobs

Asylum seekers are sponges that don't work

Something something Leo Vardkars fault

Emotive posts with no factual backing that cry about how the "other side" are unable to see how things really are

Something complaining about Muslims that doesn't tie into anything

A lot of ranting about the "other side"

People assuming everyone that doesn't believe every ludicrous notion they have must be brainwashed or too stupid to see "reality"

These people will also be unable to rationally defend or discuss these "realities" (as they see them)

Lol theres eire/pol/ a discord server based on 4chans political board. They do raids on boards.ie the style of the ‘globalist indoctrination’ (their words)

They aim to subvert leftist politics by playing the same game. According to them

one world order · 21-12-2018 2:03pm

Our lovely government signed up to the international agreements designed by our lucifierian worshiping Zionist controllers. Now we have to take in these economic migrants. Matter of time we will have the same no go zone areas that have sprung up across Western Europe.

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 2:21pm

one world order wrote: »

Our lovely government signed up to the international agreements designed by our lucifierian worshiping Zionist controllers. Now we have to take in these economic migrants. Matter of time we will have the same no go zone areas that have sprung up across Western Europe.

To use a modern turn of phrase, lol.

topper75 · 21-12-2018 3:15pm

I won't try to address the shouldas and couldas.
But I will say: You are only seeing the beginning of immigration in Ireland. Mark my words.

Kivaro · 21-12-2018 3:46pm

Wait a second.
Was someone hoping for a rational, unbiased presentation on Direct Provision in Ireland by RTE?

For the last two weeks, every single evening they had a report on the "homelessness crisis" ................. you know, where we have 200 or so poor souls who actually are living on the streets. RTE classifies those waiting for Forever Homes as homeless.
Then we had the RTE Investigates crack squad spend over an hour telling us the woes of the "accommodation crisis" suffered by our distinct ethnic group, AKA The Travellers.
And to cap it off, we have RTE Prime Time last night doing a masterpiece theatre piece on Direct Provision.

So there we have it. The RTE Trinity: Homelessness, Travellers, and Asylum Seekers.

RTE's sole purpose these days is to try and make the workers and contributors of Ireland feel like it is our personal responsibility for the poor decision making of RTE's Trinity. Anytime they do a report on these topics, they want to make us feel like giving up our homes for those looking for Forever Homes. For Travellers, they want us to feel that we should stop locking our gates and doors and just invite them all in, or get the neighbours to move so that a Traveller family can move next door.
For Aslyum Seekers, RTE wants us to take in economic migrants, end Direct Provision, and provide them with housing immediately.

RTE will be the last bastion of extreme liberalism when it has been totally eradicated from the rest of Europe. They are the worse hypocrites because they demand that we do what they say, but not what they do.

jmayo · 21-12-2018 3:50pm

DontThankMe wrote: »

It seems like there's a trend developing for borderline racist threads in after hours at the moment.

Makes you miss the usual dole & traveller bashing threads.

And there is also a trend that if people question immigration, not the immigration of fellow EU citizens from Eastern, even Central Europe as my Polish colleague lectured me or of skilled employees to the health service or the likes of Google, one is immediately tarred as a racist, right winger and even nazi.
Why does that also happen ?

Funny you also complain of traveller bashing, but probably remain relatively silent when it is the travellers actually physically bashing people, including fellow travellers.
Another taboo subject for lots of people to discuss.

The fact is shouting about trump and building walls is just the other cheek of the same ar** that starts labeling everyone as racists.

And the OP does have a valid point about these discussions on our mainstream media turning into a one sided love in, with rarely a contrary view to be heard or seen.

weldoninhio · 21-12-2018 4:00pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

To use a modern turn of phrase, lol.

Can you explain how Ireland will dodge the issues that every other European country has had with mass non-EU immigration??

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 4:06pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

Can you explain how Ireland will dodge the issues that every other European country has had with mass non-EU immigration??

No, no I can't. I'm not spouting conspiracy theory nonsense either.

Do you agree with the poster I quoted?

weldoninhio · 21-12-2018 4:12pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

No, no I can't. I'm not spouting conspiracy theory nonsense either.

Do you agree with the poster I quoted?

I agree that it is only a matter of time before areas are ghettoized, which will bring the associated problems. I also agree that our govt seem to want to be seen as a good little country by the EU. We have a veto on taking in refugees/non-EU immigrants but you'd never hear Leo or Zappone ask what the Irish citizens think we should do.

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 4:17pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

I agree that it is only a matter of time before areas are ghettoized, which will bring the associated problems. I also agree that our govt seem to want to be seen as a good little country by the EU. We have a veto on taking in refugees/non-EU immigrants but you'd never hear Leo or Zappone ask what the Irish citizens think we should do.

We already have ghettos. You may not see them as that because they don't mainly contain black people.
We need to suck at the EU teat because that's where we get money.
Leo, etc. are the reason we are not self sustaining, of course they won't question anything they are told to do by the EU.

So what's the next option? Burn down anything zoned for immigrant housing? Spout utter sh*te about Luciferian worshipping Zionist controllers?

CrankyHaus · 21-12-2018 4:22pm

While the OP is clearly tapped the coverage that RTE gives this issue is about as balanced.

Immigration provides immense benefit to this country but also poses severe challenges and the poorer you are the less you get of the former and the more you get of the latter. Our asylum system provides help to many who deserve it but is also widely abused by frauds, eagerly assisted by a legal system and NGO clique that shakes down the public purse for all its worth.

The first part of those sentences is shouted from the rooftops but the second part is effectively censored from mainstream debate. This is a problem that prevents proper policymaking and drives those who feel silenced and ignored into the arms of racists.

one world order · 21-12-2018 4:23pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

No, no I can't. I'm not spouting conspiracy theory nonsense either.

Do you agree with the poster I quoted?

What part do you not agree with? Is it the part about the world being controlled by a luciferian worshipping Zionist cult or their intention to destroy the west by mass migration for their plans of a one world government?

imme · 21-12-2018 4:26pm

Charlie Flanagan wasn't on the program last night.

Were you looking at a different program.

If you can't even get that right....

Overall there is no investigation of the issue of 'asyulm seekers', migrants.

It is a free for all, no questions asked.

one world order · 21-12-2018 4:26pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

We already have ghettos. You may not see them as that because they don't mainly contain black people.
We need to suck at the EU teat because that's where we get money.
Leo, etc. are the reason we are not self sustaining, of course they won't question anything they are told to do by the EU.

So what's the next option? Burn down anything zoned for immigrant housing? Spout utter sh*te about Luciferian worshipping Zionist controllers?

Why did Ireland sign up to the international agreements recently of continued intake of economic migrants while the mainstream media refused to cover it?

seamus · 21-12-2018 4:31pm

one world order wrote: »

Why did Ireland sign up to the international agreements recently of continued intake of economic migrants while the mainstream media refused to cover it?

Have they really been far even as decided to use even go want to do more look like?

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 4:35pm

one world order wrote: »

What part do you not agree with? Is it the part about the world being controlled by a luciferian worshipping Zionist cult or their intention to destroy the west by mass migration for their plans of a one world government?

Yes. All of that.

one world order wrote: »

Why did Ireland sign up to the international agreements recently of continued intake of economic migrants while the mainstream media refused to cover it?

I heard about it somehow. So did you obviously. Why Ireland signed up for it would be a question for the government.

Deebles McBeebles · 21-12-2018 4:36pm

seamus wrote: »

Have they really been far even as decided to use even go want to do more look like?

30 solid seconds I spent trying to work that out.

jmayo · 21-12-2018 4:40pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

30 solid seconds I spent trying to work that out.

I am assuming someone had finished early for christmas and was having a few in some hostelry.

jay0109 · 21-12-2018 4:47pm

It wasn't Charlie Flanagan on last night's Primetime propaganda programme, it was David Stanton TD, Jnr Minister for Immigration.
And the Labour rep was the one and only Aodhan O'Riordain. He's all for asylum seekers getting access to houses and not being put into DP centres...as long as those new houses that need to be built for them aren't in his constituency

batgoat · 21-12-2018 4:50pm

one world order wrote: »

Why did Ireland sign up to the international agreements recently of continued intake of economic migrants while the mainstream media refused to cover it?

They did cover it but didn't go the racist conspiracy route on it. Or your extended version which includes anti semitism.

JohnMc1 · 21-12-2018 4:59pm

Isn't it wonderful to be constantly lectured by millionaires [be it politicians, celebrities or media talking heads] that we need to sacrifice "for the greater good" while they continually sacrifice nothing.

batgoat · 21-12-2018 5:02pm

JohnMc1 wrote: »

Isn't it wonderful to be constantly lectured by millionaires [be it politicians, celebrities or media talking heads] that we need to sacrifice "for the greater good" while they continually sacrifice nothing.

So you think it was better when countries refused to take refugees from Germany and other states in world war 2?

JohnMc1 · 21-12-2018 5:07pm

batgoat wrote: »

So you think it was better when countries refused to take refugees from Germany and other states in world war 2?

These aren't refugees we're getting. They're economic migrants. They're only here for the free houses, €5000 "emergency money" and regular welfare payments thereafter. Meanwhile we have to work until we drop dead to support them. Then on top of that we have to change every aspect of our culture because it "offends them" and "makes them feel excluded" yet our welfare programs don't offend them.

batgoat · 21-12-2018 5:15pm

JohnMc1 wrote: »

These aren't refugees we're getting. They're economic migrants. They're only here for the free houses, €5000 "emergency money" and regular welfare payments thereafter. Meanwhile we have to work until we drop dead to support them. Then on top of that we have to change every aspect of our culture because it "offends them" and "makes them feel excluded" yet our welfare programs don't offend them.

Oh and I'm going to say that's bull****. Direct provision doesn't allow you to work, you can potentially end up stuck in the system for years. The tiny bit of money the families get in direct provision isn't anything similar to lucrative and more making ends meet. There have been massive refugee crises in last few years btw. Eg Syria

Our culture hasn't experienced a significant cultural shift btw. Should really have expected the guy who believes there's a plot to wipe out white people to say anything better...

I've also had interactions with a fair few who have gone through direct provision btw. They were generally pretty qualified and as soon as they had opportunity to start working, they jumped at the chance.

JohnMc1 · 21-12-2018 5:21pm

batgoat wrote: »

Oh and I'm going to say that's bull****. Direct provision doesn't allow you to work, you can potentially end up stuck in the system for years. The tiny bit of money the families get in direct provision isn't anything similar to lucrative and more making ends meet. There have been massive refugee crises in last few years btw. Eg Syria

Our culture hasn't experienced a significant cultural shift btw. Should really have expected the guy who believes there's a plot to wipe out white people to say anything better...

I've also had interactions with a fair few who have gone through direct provision btw. They were generally pretty qualified and as soon as they had opportunity to start working, they jumped at the chance.

So have you finally taken them in then? To give us tax payers a break.

Yer Da sells Avon · 21-12-2018 5:22pm

JohnMc1 wrote: »

These aren't refugees we're getting. They're economic migrants. They're only here for the free houses, €5000 "emergency money" and regular welfare payments thereafter. Meanwhile we have to work until we drop dead to support them. Then on top of that we have to change every aspect of our culture because it "offends them" and "makes them feel excluded" yet our welfare programs don't offend them.

Don't forget the free buggy that they can leave at the bus stop because the state'll give 'em another one.

It's worse AH is getting.

batgoat · 21-12-2018 5:27pm

JohnMc1 wrote: »

So have you finally taken them in then? To give us tax payers a break.

Erm, the people I know who went through direct provision are now in full time employment so contribute as much as you or I. So John, you're not going to actually address anything I said? Instead come out with quips that are more suited to a comments section?

Kivaro · 21-12-2018 5:28pm

JohnMc1 wrote: »

These aren't refugees we're getting. They're economic migrants. They're only here for the free houses, €5000 "emergency money" and regular welfare payments thereafter. Meanwhile we have to work until we drop dead to support them. Then on top of that we have to change every aspect of our culture because it "offends them" and "makes them feel excluded" yet our welfare programs don't offend them.

And don't forget the family reunification program.
Even housing charities in Dublin are becoming overwhelmed with that insane policy. It wasn't too long ago that a representative of one of those charities stated publicly that it wasn't just one refugee that they would have to house, but up to nine of that person's family would join them in Dublin, which makes finding homes for the additional refugee's family very difficult for them.

For the life of me, I cannot figure out how Sinn Fein supporters can support the leadership of Sinn Fein. The likes of Mary Lou and previously Gerry Adams would loudly proclaim themselves as advocates for open borders. Now, this isn't open borders for asylum seekers, it is open borders for the whole damn world's needy.

How on earth is that sustainable for such a small country?
It's not. Unless you are looking for a mechanism to collapse the welfare state, and then forcefully bring in nationalisation and collectivism. The dystopian reality of Orwell's 1984 would then come in to play, and finally Sinn Fein would be happy. Mission accomplished.

Kivaro · 21-12-2018 5:31pm

seamus wrote: »

Have they really been far even as decided to use even go want to do more look like?

getSober()

Sonics2k · 21-12-2018 5:35pm

seamus wrote: »

Have they really been far even as decided to use even go want to do more look like?

I salute you for an old and beautiful reference.

Kivaro · 21-12-2018 5:42pm

batgoat wrote: »

Oh and I'm going to say that's bull****. Direct provision doesn't allow you to work, .....

And I call bullshoite on your bull****.
Asylum Seekers in Direct Provision can work under new regulations that kicked in late June/early July 2018. And those who work are expected to pay a contribution towards their accommodation in the direct provision system.

Don't expect your bullshoite to go unchallenged.

batgoat · 21-12-2018 5:47pm

Kivaro wrote: »

And I call bullshoite on your bull****.
Asylum Seekers in Direct Provision can work under new regulations that kicked in late June/early July 2018. And those who work are expected to pay a contribution towards their accommodation in the direct provision system.

Don't expect your bullshoite to go unchallenged.

Yep I'll happily accept that correction... Had not realised what point it had reached. So I think you're getting a tad overexcited...

JohnMc1 · 21-12-2018 6:18pm

Kivaro wrote: »

And don't forget the family reunification program.
Even housing charities in Dublin are becoming overwhelmed with that insane policy. It wasn't too long ago that a representative of one of those charities stated publicly that it wasn't just one refugee that they would have to house, but up to nine of that person's family would join them in Dublin, which makes finding homes for the additional refugee's family very difficult for them.

For the life of me, I cannot figure out how Sinn Fein supporters can support the leadership of Sinn Fein. The likes of Mary Lou and previously Gerry Adams would loudly proclaim themselves as advocates for open borders. Now, this isn't open borders for asylum seekers, it is open borders for the whole damn world's needy.

How on earth is that sustainable for such a small country?
It's not. Unless you are looking for a mechanism to collapse the welfare state, and then forcefully bring in nationalisation and collectivism. The dystopian reality of Orwell's 1984 would then come in to play, and finally Sinn Fein would be happy. Mission accomplished.

Exactly. Ireland will collapse eventually. Africa is 10x the size of Europe and USA combined. Something will have to give eventually.

Kivaro · 21-12-2018 6:42pm

batgoat wrote: »

Yep I'll happily accept that correction... Had not realised what point it had reached. So I think you're getting a tad overexcited...

Will you go away out of it, will ya.
You are trying to project yourself as someone in close contact with asylum seekers in Direct Provision. If you didn't know that asylum seekers in Direct Provision could work for the last 6 months, then some may suspect that you are just full of it.

batgoat wrote: »

Erm, the people I know who went through direct provision are now in full time employment so contribute as much as you or I.

I'm curious on how you know how much the poster you were responding to contributes to Irish society. You seem adamant that the Direct Provision people that you know now working in full time employment contribute as much as him. Do you know the tax contributions of all of these people?

batgoat wrote: »

I've also had interactions with a fair few who have gone through direct provision btw. They were generally pretty qualified and as soon as they had opportunity to start working, they jumped at the chance.

I HATE multi-quotes, but it was necessary to show the inconsistencies here.

Mr. teddywinkles · 21-12-2018 6:53pm

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

Great idea. We could advertise those jobs that Irish people don't want so immigrants take them.

Booooringggg

batgoat · 21-12-2018 7:02pm

Kivaro wrote: »

Will you go away out of it, will ya.
You are trying to project yourself as someone in close contact with asylum seekers in Direct Provision. If you didn't know that asylum seekers in Direct Provision could work for the last 6 months, then some may suspect that you are just full of it.

I'm curious on how you know how much the poster you were responding to contributes to Irish society. You seem adamant that the Direct Provision people that you know now working in full time employment contribute as much as him. Do you know the tax contributions of all of these people?

I HATE multi-quotes, but it was necessary to show the inconsistencies here.

You haven't highlighted any inconsistency. The people I know who were in direct provision exited it years ago, I had already stated that they were no longer in direct provision. In relation to contributions in terms of tax, you're being more pedantic than anything, the poster is portraying refugees as a bunch of scroungers. Frankly, they're not and plenty of refugees do have qualifications. Fleeing a war zone or an oppressive regime does not prevent this.

In addition, the main reason I have problems with posters like John is because he holds incredibly racist views. He has previously stated that he believes there's a plot to wipe out white people and such. His claims that there are no refugees and they're all economic migrants goes back to those views. So your hard hitting expose on my inconsistencies fails somewhat.

Mad_maxx · 21-12-2018 7:09pm

Listen to doctor David thunder ( cool name) who is an Irish academic based in Spain, he writes and occasionally appears on "the right side" podcast.

His thesis is that transporting Africans etc to Ireland is a flawed policy and that it does nothing to tackle the problems in those nations either, he believes we in the west must help developing countries but that the current policy is about dealing with the demographic decline of Western Europe, he also writes about how the echo chamber Irish media cannot fathom the idea that immigration could be anything but a positive, that being pro immigration is an article of faith for Irish liberals and how unconditional belief in any policy is highly dangerous

hill16bhoy · 21-12-2018 7:47pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Listen to doctor David thunder ( cool name) who is an Irish academic based in Spain, he writes and occasionally appears on "the right side" podcast.

His thesis is that transporting Africans etc to Ireland is a flawed policy and that it does nothing to tackle the problems in those nations either, he believes we in the west must help developing countries but that the current policy is about dealing with the demographic decline of Western Europe, he also writes about how the echo chamber Irish media cannot fathom the idea that immigration could be anything but a positive, that being pro immigration is an article of faith for Irish liberals and how unconditional belief in any policy is highly dangerous

I read Mr. Thunder's Irish Times article back in August. Five minutes of my life I'll never get back.

A lazy, lazy article filled with typical right-wing cliches, which amounted to nothing more than a whinge that a majority of people don't think like him.

No analysis of why his worldview has fallen in popularity to such an extent, no solutions for how "conservatism" should evolve or adapt to the modern world, nothing to back up his thesis that "conservatives" are being "silenced", just a whinge.

And that's the right's problem, not just the bat**** crazy, toxic far right but the more bog standard shade of plain old "conservatism". Everything with them is a whinge. They have no positive worldview, only a deeply negative one, and no constructive ideas for society. Turning the clock back 60 or 100 years, as so many of them would love to do, isn't a solution. Their only strategy is to blame others.

Even the moderate wing of the Tories such as Ken Clarke and Anna Soubry have now seen through the complete intellectual void that is at the heart of modern "conservatism" (which is an oxymoron).

Prime time last night Direct Provision

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