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Classic Insurance Q's

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  • 30-06-2013 11:42pm
    #1
    Sobanek
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,354 ✭✭✭


    Hey guys, so I had some encounter with a classic at this stage, the E34 M5 :D

    I was wondering about the insurance though:
    - Would a 1991 M5 qualify for classic insurance
    - Will I as a 20 year old be able to get classic insurance anywhere?!
    - Are there any requirements in terms of driving experience?
    - Will I be able to insure an M5 at all?

    Thanks :D


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    #2
    166man
    Registered Users Posts: 6,575 ✭✭✭166man


    Sobanek wrote: »
    Hey guys, so I had some encounter with a classic at this stage, the E34 M5 :D

    I was wondering about the insurance though:
    - Would a 1991 M5 qualify for classic insurance
    - Will I as a 20 year old be able to get classic insurance anywhere?!
    - Are there any requirements in terms of driving experience?
    - Will I be able to insure an M5 at all?

    Thanks :D

    - Yes
    - No
    - Depends - may have to have another policy in your own name
    - Yes but at the right price of many many Euro's.

    :)


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    #3
    mb1725
    Registered Users Posts: 1,381 ✭✭✭mb1725


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGg7bzW9Dco


    :rolleyes:


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    #4
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Sobanek wrote: »
    Hey guys, so I had some encounter with a classic at this stage, the E34 M5 :D

    I was wondering about the insurance though:
    - Would a 1991 M5 qualify for classic insurance
    - Will I as a 20 year old be able to get classic insurance anywhere?!
    - Are there any requirements in terms of driving experience?
    - Will I be able to insure an M5 at all?

    Thanks :D

    Get yourself a small engined car that gives you driving of other people's cars as well (liberty offer this on their insurance policy). I don't think you can get classic insurance until 25.

    Then buy your dad an E34 M5 and pay the insurance for him (log book in his name).
    As the car is not owned by you, liberty will allow you to drive it under your own policy.
    I'd limit it to weekend driving only.
    These M5s were the last handbuilt ones and are a future classic if minded well.
    All cars over 15 years can get classic.

    Will you be able to insure and m5? How deep are your pockets?


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    #5
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    Check out the Classic Car section.
    This back door to cheap insurance for an under 25 will not work. Insurance companies are wise to it

    The "insure in Dad's name" caper probably wont work either as he probably has his own car, thus no NCB available for this one = expensive premiums (not mention the Motor tax on two cars , two NCTs etc etc.


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    #6
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Scortho wrote: »
    Get yourself a small engined car that gives you driving of other people's cars as well (liberty offer this on their insurance policy). I don't think you can get classic insurance until 25.

    Then buy your dad an E34 M5 and pay the insurance for him (log book in his name).
    As the car is not owned by you, liberty will allow you to drive it under your own policy.
    I'd limit it to weekend driving only.
    These M5s were the last handbuilt ones and are a future classic if minded well.
    All cars over 15 years can get classic.

    Will you be able to insure and m5? How deep are your pockets?

    That won't work. It's been well covered here before too.


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    #7
    Sobanek
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,354 ✭✭✭Sobanek


    Darn! :( I guess I could wait either having it on my driveway or wait an extra few months until I turn 21, and by then buy a mint example and have it insured at XSdirect for "peanuts".

    And then comes the dillemma of the e39 m5, e63 645 or the e31 850csi. LOL.


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    #8
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Think 25 for classic ins. Must be 2nd car, and be garaged, and have limited mileage.


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    #9
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Henry Ford III wrote: »
    That won't work. It's been well covered here before too.

    Why wouldn't it work as a weekend driver car.
    Under my policy I'm allowed driva any car I want so long as I have the owners permission. It's not limited whatsoever to any size engine or the age of the car.


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    #10
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Scortho wrote: »
    Why wouldn't it work as a weekend driver car.
    Under my policy I'm allowed driva any car I want so long as I have the owners permission. It's not limited whatsoever to any size engine or the age of the car.

    1/. Non disclosure. Your Dad would be lying if he untruly said he was the owner and main driver of the M5.
    2/. NCB. There won't be one available so it'll be a huge premium for dodgy cover.

    Dress it up whatever way you wish, but a young lad won't get away with driving a big engined sports saloon on a 3rd party extension.


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    #11
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Motors >> Classics


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    #12
    holdmybeer
    Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭holdmybeer


    Classic cars are over 30yr's old, you need a 5yr no claim, full license and a second car. I tried buying a Datsun 280zr lately and got turned because of the second car thing.


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    #13
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    holdmybeer wrote: »
    Classic cars are over 30yr's old, you need a 5yr no claim, full license and a second car. I tried buying a Datsun 280zr lately and got turned because of the second car thing.

    For insurance purposes they don't need to be 30 years old. Classic cover can be had for some 15 year old cars. Varies insurer to insurer.


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    #14
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Henry Ford III wrote: »
    1/. Non disclosure. Your Dad would be lying if he untruly said he was the owner and main driver of the M5.
    2/. NCB. There won't be one available so it'll be a huge premium for dodgy cover.

    Dress it up whatever way you wish, but a young lad won't get away with driving a big engined sports saloon on a 3rd party extension.

    1. So if I buy my dad a car and its registered in his name how is he not the owner?

    2. While you can't share your NBC between a number of vehicles, it'd be much cheaper for his dad to insure it than it would for him.
    Say sobaneks dad has 30 years driving experience and on his current insurance policy he has 5 years + Ncb, we both know that it's going to be significantly cheaper for his dad to insure it than for him.

    Can't remember exact figures but isn't classic insurance, once you meet the criteria (over 25, 5 years Ncb, limited mileage, 2nd car) only a couple of hundred?


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    #15
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Scortho wrote: »
    1. So if I buy my dad a car and its registered in his name how is he not the owner?

    2. While you can't share your NBC between a number of vehicles, it'd be much cheaper for his dad to insure it than it would for him.
    Say sobaneks dad has 30 years driving experience and on his current insurance policy he has 5 years + Ncb, we both know that it's going to be significantly cheaper for his dad to insure it than for him.

    Can't remember exact figures but isn't classic insurance, once you meet the criteria (over 25, 5 years Ncb, limited mileage, 2nd car) only a couple of hundred?

    Not interested in splitting hairs, but if you gift your Dad a car yes it'd be his on the face of it.

    Now in the event of a claim such a scheme, particularly where the insurer suspects a bit of dishonesty is involved, will be investigated. They'll ask who was the main driver. They'll ask for proof of who paid for the car, tax, servicing etc. They'll ask where the car was kept. It'll be pretty obvious who the real owner is soon enough. If the insurers reckon they are being lied to they'll perform back flips to prove their case.

    Insuring a high performance car without a NCB will be expensive regardless of who does it. Not all cars will be eligible for Classic Car cover either regardless of age.

    In short these ideas don't work in practice. You'd be absolutely mad to even be considering driving a powerful sports saloon regularly on a 3rd party extension.


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    #16
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    holdmybeer wrote: »
    Classic cars are over 30yr's old, you need a 5yr no claim, full license and a second car.

    5 years of NCB is not necessary, I've got a quote with 1 year's NCB.


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    #17
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Henry Ford III wrote: »
    Not interested in splitting hairs, but if you gift your Dad a car yes it'd be his on the face of it.

    Now in the event of a claim such a scheme, particularly where the insurer suspects a bit of dishonesty is involved, will be investigated. They'll ask who was the main driver. They'll ask for proof of who paid for the car, tax, servicing etc. They'll ask where the car was kept. It'll be pretty obvious who the real owner is soon enough. If the insurers reckon they are being lied to they'll perform back flips to prove their case.

    Insuring a high performance car without a NCB will be expensive regardless of who does it. Not all cars will be eligible for Classic Car cover either regardless of age.

    In short these ideas don't work in practice. You'd be absolutely mad to even be considering driving a powerful sports saloon regularly on a 3rd party extension.

    I need insurance if I get stopped by the guards. That's the only reason why I have insurance on my car as its a requirement under Irish law.
    If car insurance was not compulsory I wouldn't have it.

    I'm perfectly happy taking the risk of not crashing into anyone. As it stands even if I do have a crash, I'd be fecked anyway as they'd hammer me in insurance for the next few years. So I keep a safe distance from the car in front of me.

    As per my policy with liberty, I am insured to drive any car, so long as I've the owners permission and its in roadworthy condition.
    Why shouldn't I, or any other driver who has this facility take advantage of it? That said if I was liberty, I would have restricted it to a car of a similar class but they haven't.

    And it'll still be significantly cheaper for a 50 year old man with one main car and this as his second car and a licence for 30 years to insure than a 20 year old with a full licence for maybe only a year or 2. For example My brother just bought my polo. My dad has no Ncb, as its on his commercial vehicle, yet it's 700 euro for the year for him to insure it but 3 k for my brother.


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    #18
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    Scortho wrote: »
    As per my policy with liberty, I am insured to drive any car, so long as I've the owners permission and its in roadworthy condition.

    With one major proviso - the car must be insured in the owner's name.


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    #19
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Mr Benevolent wrote: »
    With one major proviso - the car must be insured in the owner's name.

    Yep and as I mentioned in my previous post, if I buy my dad a car, and register him down on the log book, the car is then his.
    There is no record of that car in my name.
    In fact my policy doesn't require the car that's being drove under 3rd party extension to be insured at all.


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    #20
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    Mr Benevolent wrote: »
    With one major proviso - the car must be insured in the owner's name.

    an old chesnut on here.. I've yet to be shown any insurance company that says this....


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    #21
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    Scortho wrote: »
    Yep and as I mentioned in my previous post, if I buy my dad a car, and register him down on the log book, the car is then his.
    There is no record of that car in my name.
    In fact my policy doesn't require the car that's being drove under 3rd party extension to be insured at all.

    Believe me, if you think you've found a loophole, you haven't.


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    #22
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Mr Benevolent wrote: »
    Believe me, if you think you've found a loophole, you haven't.

    I have confirmed it with liberty.
    It's not a loophole. It's my insurance policy.
    Guard asks am I insured?
    I show him my insurance cert from liberty. I'm not driving without insurance.
    Therefore I'm not breaking the law.

    If you can tell me how I am however please do.


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    #23
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,644 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Scortho wrote: »
    I need insurance if I get stopped by the guards. That's the only reason why I have insurance on my car as its a requirement under Irish law.
    If car insurance was not compulsory I wouldn't have it.

    I'm perfectly happy taking the risk of not crashing into anyone. As it stands even if I do have a crash, I'd be fecked anyway as they'd hammer me in insurance for the next few years. So I keep a safe distance from the car in front of me.

    As per my policy with liberty, I am insured to drive any car, so long as I've the owners permission and its in roadworthy condition.
    Why shouldn't I, or any other driver who has this facility take advantage of it? That said if I was liberty, I would have restricted it to a car of a similar class but they haven't.

    And it'll still be significantly cheaper for a 50 year old man with one main car and this as his second car and a licence for 30 years to insure than a 20 year old with a full licence for maybe only a year or 2. For example My brother just bought my polo. My dad has no Ncb, as its on his commercial vehicle, yet it's 700 euro for the year for him to insure it but 3 k for my brother.

    Ok fair enough, you know better. Go ahead and buy the M5 (or similar). Get your Dad lie on an insurance proposal.

    It's a superb plan and never thought of before. Foolproof actually.

    p.s. The reason Insurance is mandatory isn't mere compliance. It's to protect innocent 3rd parties.


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    #24
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Henry Ford III wrote: »
    Ok fair enough, you know better. Go ahead and buy the M5 (or similar). Get your Dad lie on an insurance proposal.

    It's a superb plan and never thought of before. Foolproof actually.

    No thanks, I just bought an alfa 156 v6 which is insured in my own name.
    If I was in the market for a car that can get classic car insurance I would buy my dad it instead.

    Anyhow It was sobanek who was enquiring about the m5.
    And instead is sarcasm ill be serious, has anyone ever been prosecuted for driving a car under 3rd party extension?


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    #25
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    Scortho wrote: »
    No thanks, I just bought an alfa 156 v6 which is insured in my own name.
    If I was in the market for a car that can get classic car insurance I would buy my dad it instead.

    Anyhow It was sobanek who was enquiring about the m5.
    And instead is sarcasm ill be serious, has anyone ever been prosecuted for driving a car under 3rd party extension?

    You cant be prosecuted if you have valid insurance!


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