Electric SouperCharger

07-10-2018 9:39am #1

Question for the Turbo boffins:

If I inject forced air into my air intake with my new 12V lekytrick SouperCharger...

...will I get more horses coming outtov the rear axle?

07-10-2018 9:41am

I could probably fit 6 of them.

07-10-2018 12:32pm

autumnalcore · 08-10-2018 11:50am

ðŸ˜ Duty cycle is about 15% you might get one go out of it.

08-10-2018 10:55pm

I know right,:o...okay glossing aside it's never gonna cut it. I'm not quite giving up on the notion.

According to the back of my envelope; I can get roughly 0.5L more cooled air per sec down the gullet of my air intake manifold for the lowly cost of about 1hp from the drive belt or 350W from the hab battery, with zero parasitic penalty for the later as optional .

Roughly how many horses is that worth onna 22:1 compression 2.3L naturally aspirated 80hp diesel outtov the rear axle?

Liquid-cooling, electric cooling and intercooling are options. Air intake and compressor sinked heat exchangers or heat pumps.

gctest50 · 08-10-2018 11:21pm

get a few valeo ?

should save a fair amount of fuel

good excuse to go to 48v and be all modern

08-10-2018 11:47pm

What's a valeo do?

How many valeos= how many horses?

ooooOOOh sher why stop at 48v
600V!

Gorshes..loora tall them prudy orange cables! :cool:

autumnalcore · 09-10-2018 8:15am

OM603 would bolt right up to that wouldnt it ðŸ”©

10-10-2018 1:22am

You're right I'm thinking too small.

samih · 17-10-2018 3:35pm

This is an interesting topic. At 2000 rpm with compression ratio of 22:1 you are theoretically looking at the engine sucking 843 litres of air per second. To gain 0.5 bar boost you need to generate just over 420 extra litres per second (a four stroke 2.3 liter engine at 2000 rpm consumes 1.15 * 22 *(2000/60) of air per second).

If the engine is capable of producing 60 hp without smoke say at 2000 rpm with extra half a liter per second you could inject enough extra fuel for a tasty just under 0.04 extra hp.

A turbo is a wicked air pump. I suggest you should get one of them instead ;-) The modern diesel engines typically run with max boost of 1.5-2 bars which even on a 2.0 lump with low comperession ratio of 16:1 means 1500-2000 liters of air needed per second.

Hope my maths check here.

17-10-2018 5:28pm

My envelope has a pretty similar answer.
Yeah turbos are good but if I was to go to that much trouble might as well lash two mechanically coupled induction or pm motors together.

I was thinking about a pair of luas tram wheel motors this morning...but that's a bit insane..

samih · 18-10-2018 11:32am

LUAS motors would be well able for it. You need about 35 kW of power (back of the envelope calc based on some industrial compressors I googled) to produce the required 100000 liters per minute at 2 bars for some proper power. But the 35 kW is about 50 BHP and with a turbo you would get that much power for free instead of generating it using the van engine to turn a pump or generator. Also fitting a turbo is really simple and cheap compared to the alternatives. No wonder they are so popular instead for Roots and other mechanical superchargers.

In a sense with a turbo you automatically get extra power plus the power needed to overcome the compressor load for free.

cdaly_ · 23-10-2018 12:16pm

samih wrote: »

This is an interesting topic. At 2000 rpm with compression ratio of 22:1 you are theoretically looking at the engine sucking 843 litres of air per second. To gain 0.5 bar boost you need to generate just over 420 extra litres per second (a four stroke 2.3 liter engine at 2000 rpm consumes 1.15 * 22 *(2000/60) of air per second).

Hope my maths check here.

Apologies for intruding but I think your maths does not check out here.

Engine capacity is swept volume (ie. how much space the pistons sweep) and has nothing to do with compression ratio. So if you drop the '22' from your formula, you get 1.15*2000/60 = 38 litres/sec. 0.5 bar boost requires 19 litres/sec...

samih · 23-10-2018 2:12pm

cdaly_ wrote: »

Apologies for intruding but I think your maths does not check out here.

Engine capacity is swept volume (ie. how much space the pistons sweep) and has nothing to do with compression ratio. So if you drop the '22' from your formula, you get 1.15*2000/60 = 38 litres/sec. 0.5 bar boost requires 19 litres/sec...

Thanks cdaly, of course you're right as the airflow stops when the inlet valve closes before the compression occurs. My numbers did look unexpectedly high. The exhaust pipe could almost be used to propel the van with the volumes I suggested.

So, maybe there is scope for electric supercharging after all. Some latest engines have electric turbos that are initially spun up to fight turbo lag.

11-04-2019 5:42am

Electric SouperCharger

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